Announcement

Collapse

The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less

West calls out Vogel?

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • #46
    Re: West calls out Vogel?

    If all of us fans are smart enough to see Vogel's flaws, the players do, too.

    It's not all Frank's fault, but he may have been the biggest reason we lost last night.

    Comment


    • #47
      Re: West calls out Vogel?

      Originally posted by Grimp View Post
      ET does fine out there when he's not forced to place alongside Lance.
      Both of these guys play more like Scoring Guards, not Point Guards or Shooting Guards and that's the problem. They can't throttle back from "needing" to have the ball in their hands. Moreover, it doesn't help that there's bad blood between them. So, each (particularly Lance) tends to isolate the other. THAT NEEDS TO STOP!

      If you're going to put either player on the floor, it needs to be made clear what their role is. For example: Is Lance a facilitator (PG)? Is he a scorer (SG)? Is he a playmakers (Scoring Guard)? Same goes for ET. And with that, everyone else around them needs to know what role Lance/ET are fulfilling when they're on the floor. If as a facilitator, you know to be in constant motion, putting yourself in position to accept the pass for the score. If as the playmaker, clear the paint and get out of his way and let him do work. If as the shooter, feed him the ball on the Wing and give him the green light. Just know which role these guys are filling and things can work to your advantage. Any confusion and there's chaos.

      Comment


      • #48
        Re: West calls out Vogel?

        Originally posted by DJVendetta View Post
        I love how Scola has this bad game and they all want him done with, but the first few games he is hitting shots and everyone is on his nuts. We can't expect perfection every game. I agree though there has to be rotational changes.
        The thing about Scola is that you can tell very early if he's going to have a good or bad game.

        Comment


        • #49
          Re: West calls out Vogel?

          Originally posted by Grimp View Post
          Evan was brought here to be a facilitator and a scorer. If the front office follows your advice, and lets him go. Without a full off season to see what the kid can do as our sixth man, coming into next season. You do realize we'll have to seek out another G/F to replace him right? Someone we might have to overpay since they've had a hot season. We could sign and trade Evan though.
          Not really. If he's a 2 you have Hill, Lance, & George. If he's a 3 you have George, Butler, & Copeland can play a 3. Your deep on the wings w/o Turner. Not to mention you have Solo Hill that could earn more time at a 2 or 3. They played over a 120 games w/o Granger & Turner replace d Granger. They wouldn't miss him, unless they lost Lance AND Turner & even in that scenario Lance would be more so missed. Not that Turner is bad but he's a role player. They change in the NBA.

          Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
          1 - 2, Tinsley's coming for you.
          3 - 4, You're not a team no more.
          5 - 6, He's gonna plead the 5th.
          7 - 8, He's gonna stay out late.



          Comment


          • #50
            Re: West calls out Vogel?

            Originally posted by larry View Post
            Atlanta can't adjust to us. Horford is out so they have bigs of Antic, Scott, Brand, & Milsap. They always have 2 of them in the game. It's not like they have a 7 ft 3 guy to bring in if Hibbert were to catch fire. They play allot of zone & collapse 4 guys on Hibbert forcing either a turnover or a pass to get a long shot from us. Then they spread us out & shoot 3's. After they soften us they let Teague drive or Milsap operate down low without much fear of a solid double team due to the spread floor.

            They are winning the series by turning this into a long jump shot contest. They have better shooters, better spacing, better foot speed to contest our jumpers, & are more use to playing this way than us.

            If nothing else they are expertly coached. Coach Bud is getting every bit of talent out of every player on his roster. They have been used properly all series.
            Im sorry but Vogel is quite opposite to that. Driving lanes opened up for Hill & PG with Cope in to spread the floor & they got a taste of their own medicine. BUT the Hawks relaxed being up by 30 & they will have an adjustment ready for Thursday as they have enough tape of Copeland's tendencies against them now.

            Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
            I don't disagree with most of what you say. It's just to late for Frank to implement something that has not been there since he begin coaching the Pacers. The Pacers was successful last year and had the best record in the league for more then half the season and they did it with the starters. The starters are the best in the league by the numbers and now people want to play other lineups and schemes because of the funk they are in. I don't blame that notion, but its raw and not something that can be implemented easily, especially when its not ever been done under Frank. I can't blame Frank for his trust in what got them to the #1 seed. What I can blame is the starters losing the blue collar, gold swagger.

            Copeland on his best day will not win a game for the Pacers unless its a last second shot and he proved he can't do that this series as well.

            I have never cared much for Frank as an x&o guy and that's been known for a long time here. But again, I won't blame him for the play of his players. It all starts with Hibbert and if he can't impose his will and play like an AllStar then its all over anyways. This team will only go as far as the STARTERS can take them.
            Garbage players get 1st round picks, (WTF)! All of the NBA must hate the Pacers! LOL

            Comment


            • #51
              Re: West calls out Vogel?

              Originally posted by larry View Post
              Not really. If he's a 2 you have Hill, Lance, & George. If he's a 3 you have George, Butler, & Copeland can play a 3. Your deep on the wings w/o Turner. Not to mention you have Solo Hill that could earn more time at a 2 or 3. They played over a 120 games w/o Granger & Turner replace d Granger. They wouldn't miss him, unless they lost Lance AND Turner & even in that scenario Lance would be more so missed. Not that Turner is bad but he's a role player. They change in the NBA.

              Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk



              Butler isn't coming back next season. Plus he's a vet. Cope is a 4. Hill? He sucks period. I can't stand to watch him as our PG anymore. Turner was averaging a career best 17ppg before being traded here. And he's averaging above that in 2 starts. Kid needs to stay. We just need a coach who can use him right.

              Comment


              • #52
                Re: West calls out Vogel?

                I agree that it is fun to watch Copeland play, and I expect his shots to go in.

                But based on all the people who seem to be convinced that, based on game 5, he needs to play more to get more shooting on the floor,

                you'd never expect to see that he shot 29% from the field in game 5 (2-7). Better than Roy, but not a lot to shout about.
                The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!).

                Comment


                • #53
                  Re: West calls out Vogel?

                  Originally posted by larry View Post
                  Scola has had a great series until last night. After Scotts 3rd 3 he should have been benched I agree, but he's been huge otherwise this series.
                  that's a little strong...in the series he's had 0,9,7,2, and 0 FGs.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Re: West calls out Vogel?

                    Hill's a natural 2 which means it makes sense to look at point after all our turnovers. That puts Hill at SG at least some. Butler plays for minimum salary. He will be back or a similar type of wing that is positive & makes minimum will be used. The Pacers keep that spot for practice duties & in case of major injuries. Turner would make too much for that role & be unhappy in it. Cope is a small 4. He's a 3 if we go big & a 4 if we go small. He'll be back because of contract & we likely let Scola walk to save money. That means more Copeland & he is capable of logging minutes at the 3. The Pacers have George who is going to be the main wing & play allot of 2 & 3. The Pacers are going to want to develop Solo Hill & he will prob see limited 2 & 3 minutes.
                    Then you have Lance who the Pacers try to resign likely.

                    That's plenty of wing help & they are not spending money they don't have to bring back Turner.

                    Only way I see it is if Lance walks & they can't land a PG. Then maybe but I doubt it. Regardless of what he averaged in Philly. He had a fight here & hasn't translated to wins. I wish him the best. If he did somehow return I hope he does well. I doubt it. The Pacers would probably let Lance walk, slide Hill to 2 guard & start Watson, & then maybe pay Turner to be a 6th man but to them that's probably worst case scenario & they likely avoid that.

                    Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
                    1 - 2, Tinsley's coming for you.
                    3 - 4, You're not a team no more.
                    5 - 6, He's gonna plead the 5th.
                    7 - 8, He's gonna stay out late.



                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Re: West calls out Vogel?

                      bit of context

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Re: West calls out Vogel?

                        Originally posted by Heisenberg View Post
                        bit of context
                        Sounds more like he was calling out Scola on not staying with his man and helping more than one pass away.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Re: West calls out Vogel?

                          Originally posted by dal9 View Post
                          that's a little strong...in the series he's had 0,9,7,2, and 0 FGs.
                          His shots kept us a float in game 2 in the 1st half & he was timely in game 4. He was 1 of few that did well in game 3. His only bad game was 5. I agree if he isn't scoring he isn't helping much. But those numbers aren't bad for our bench imo. & that's just points

                          Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
                          1 - 2, Tinsley's coming for you.
                          3 - 4, You're not a team no more.
                          5 - 6, He's gonna plead the 5th.
                          7 - 8, He's gonna stay out late.



                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Re: West calls out Vogel?

                            Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
                            OK, but I would hardly call that West calling out Vogel.
                            West called out the bench..

                            Comment

                            Working...
                            X