Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

[Hicks]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

It doesn't have to be all or nothing.

Last night Roy's touches were a lot closer to "nothing" than "all."

Do you prefer that, do you think he should get the ball more often than he did last night in the low block, or do you think he should get even less looks down there?

[odeez]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

I think Roy needs to play more, he is our center of the future! He has grown so much this year and will continue to do so... If he is making mistakes now and then, it's ok, it is only his second year in the league. Obviously I am high on Hibbert now, because of his play of late, it seems like JOB pulls him too early sometimes. Leave him in there, and let him continue to grow. He has shown he can pass the ball to open players and is becoming a consistant threat in the post.

I could careless if he is making mistakes, being out of position or what have you. He needs to be on the floor. I know we need to be small sometimes depending on matchups. But when I would prefer he be out there in as many game situations as possible going forward.

[JohnnyBGoode]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

Last night Roy's touches were a lot closer to "nothing" than "all."

Do you prefer that, do you think he should get the ball more often than he did last night in the low block, or do you think he should get even less looks down there?

No I don't believe the Pacers should go into a game with any preconcieved number of looks that Roy should get. Nor do I believe that Danny should be looking to shoot 25 times a game. Each game is different and should be treated that way. If Roy shows that he can score on his man than yes he should get all of the touches he can handle, however if it is obvious he is getting eaten alive than yes the bench is the right place for him.

[odeez]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

No I don't believe the Pacers should go into a game with any preconcieved number of looks that Roy should get. Nor do I believe that Danny should be looking to shoot 25 times a game. Each game is different and should be treated that way. If Roy shows that he can score on his man than yes he should get all of the touches he can handle, however if it is obvious he is getting eaten alive than yes the bench is the right place for him.

Just wondering who has eaten him alive of late? Again remembering that he is only in his second year. Yes, Howard played well against him last game, but Howard is argubly the best center in the league, it's hard for anyone to guard him. Roy has handled himself pretty well against opposing BIGS of late. I actual like that we can throw it to him and count on him making a good decision, whether to pass or shoot.

[McKeyFan]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

OK I feel like I'm being pulled back into the same type of thing as the 5 games in November thing.

Good, because they are related.

In answer to your question, Roy should be getting 30+ minutes a game, every game, regardless of his particular performance that night.

He should be getting lots of touches down low, early and often, every game, all game, regardless of his particular performance that night.

Roy has demonstrated his effectiveness down low. He has earned the right to have a bad night. After, say, five bad nights in a row, then maybe you can start yanking him around and jacking with his confidence.

In a game against the best center in the league where he recently showed him up, it is unconscionable from a basketball perspective and from a human decency perspective not to let him give it a go the entire game to see if he can be effective against him again.

JOS plays favorites, has double standards, talks out of both sides of his mouth, reads stats instead of people, and refuses to bow to common sense.

[Naptown_Seth]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

Best locker room ever. Or one of the best, or one of the best in years.

They told us something like that. Remember that was one point a lot of us brought up when Jack and Ford got into it.

[Naptown_Seth]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

Personally, I think Dunleavy's game is more dependent on the team playing cohesively, and therefore is hurt more than anyone else when things go off the rails. That being said, I also think he tends to deflect - a lot - and when he struggles, he takes it out on those around him. An understandable, but not particularly desirable, trait.

Yes, and I actually think Danny has been the same way.

Maybe they are pointing fingers at each other. I mean Danny looked pretty poor in recent games and Dun has just been a wreck mostly. Neither are exactly burning up the defense.

I do think that DJones does not appear to be playing in sync with either of them right now, and previously he, Danny and Rush did seem to have a connection going.



I wish I could remember, but there was a defensive breakdown where Dun appeared to be upset with someone in the last 2 games. I noticed kinda at the time, but obviously not close enough to remember who it was.


I also agree with Putty, keep it in house. I'm fine with the quotes as they are, but don't go any further. We don't need to know, and frankly some of the problems should be evident on the court.

[90'sNBARocked]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

In our victory over Orlando, Hibbert pwned Howard. In our loss, Howard pwned Hibbert.

Yep

Both owned each other at home

refs favor home teams

[Hicks]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

Best locker room ever. Or one of the best, or one of the best in years.

They told us something like that. Remember that was one point a lot of us brought up when Jack and Ford got into it.

Best locker room in that no one hates each other, no one fights regularly, etc. That's a fair and true statement to the best of my knowledge.

Doesn't mean the basketball chemistry is there.

[BillS]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

Best locker room ever. Or one of the best, or one of the best in years.

They told us something like that. Remember that was one point a lot of us brought up when Jack and Ford got into it.

I think you are still conflating all of the different meanings of "chemistry" and "locker room atmosphere".

Teammates having a heated discussion does not mean they hate each other and can't play together. Similarly, teammates liking each other doesn't mean they are on the same page on the court. Teammates can say what they think without it being a way to get under someone else's skin, but that varies from year to year and person to person.

I get really tired of the idea that the only good locker room is one where all players and coaches respond to reporters with "no comment", because their teammates are too fragile to have anyone talk about it when things are going badly.

[Naptown_Seth]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

My bad, I thought Carsyle was here for 3.

Buck, do you remeber Bird saying something like the players tune out the coach after the 3rd year?

By the way though big difference between obie and RC , RC actually won games and showed promise

Carlisle had an ECF, 2nd round, first round, and then a missed playoffs.

The bad season that got him fired featured the team at .500 and playing well enough to get into the playoffs. This wasn't good enough so management caved to sponsers and did the GSW deal to get Jackson out of here in a panic.

The team finished out the rest of the year well below .500 and Rick was blamed. He couldn't have "lost them after 3 years" because a good portion of the key players hadn't been coached by him for 3 years. Dun and Troy just showed up in fact.

So we were told Rick was to blame and that the GSW deal was sound, yet the W-L since then tells the story, as does the W-L before and after out in Oakland.

If Rick was fired for losing for half a season with a core much like this one, then certainly it's a joke to let JOB lose at a similar rate for 3 of them. Rick had top 5 COY finishes twice in Indy, he had a history that said he just might know what he's doing.

JOB has earned none of that and done nothing more than what Rick did to warrant more tolerance.


BTW, which players can tune JOB out after 3 years: Danny, Dun, Troy, Foster.

The 3 year window was just a cheap excuse for Bird to move back to FLA and get away from coaching. Jerry Sloan, Phil Jackson and Gregg Popovich laugh at the 3 year plan. Lots of coaches have won a lot of games in their 4th or 5th year with a team.

You lose players when they stop buying what you are selling. This is why Tim Floyd could lose a team in 3 months rather than 3 years.

[Anthem]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

Best locker room ever. Or one of the best, or one of the best in years.

They told us something like that.

Oh man, I wish we could go back and pull that thread up.

[Sookie]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

You know what disturbes me.

The three guys who are supposedly the leaders, Danny, Dahntay,and Murphy, are pointing fingers instead of looking at themselves.

Dunleavy was upset about the defense breaking down! Dunleavy was..how often is it him that is responsible for it?

I remember last year, Uconn played Pitt and lost. A.J. came out and said it was his fault. That he should have done more. He took the blame.

And that's what good leaders are supposed to do. You take the blame when your team fails, and you give credit to your teammates when you win.

And we have Dun, Danny, and Dahntay pointing fingers. Great. Maybe if those three showed the effort and intensity (Which to Dahntay's credit, he tries to most of the time) and teamwork that good teams should have, the rest of the players would follow. You know like leaders are supposed to do.

And that goes to the coach too. Maybe he should stop his scapegoat stuff (cough Roy and Rush cough) and take a good look in the mirror. Instead of blaming the team, look at himself first.

[Naptown_Seth]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

Well it sounds like they are not pleased with each other and that there's got to be a little cold shoulder stuff going on somewhere.

If I have a really good friend, I don't say the things that Dun or Danny did. Not only that, but my friendship and comfort level would make me MORE open to name him.

"Bob" really couldn't find his shot tonight, he was struggling and I felt like he and I weren't on the same page. But "Bob" is sharp and I trust him, so we'll get it worked out. We have to if we are going to win, and there's no reason why we can't get on the same page.

That's the kind of criticism a friend might make. I mean how much can you like a guy if you think of him as SELFISH, or unable to follow directions? I've been on a lot of teams and I didn't really like the guys that I thought those kinds of things about. People tend to like people who think a bit like them, follow similar logic and ideals. Different sure, but not radically so in terms of logical thinking. So how can I like a guy who doesn't see the sport anywhere close to how I do?

Maybe I didn't fight with them, but I didn't get along with them. I didn't like their game and I thought they were hurting the team. I would grumble with my teammates when we had a team killer like that playing with us.

That's not the same as playing with guys that just weren't as good. I felt sympathy for them or appreciated their desire to play regardless; I tried to work with them, and trusted them to at least bring what they could to the game. I could adjust my play to accomodate them and it wouldn't bug me too much. I usually wouldn't even think of them as the reason we lost because all teams have different talent levels.

But the dumb a** OF that insists on throwing to the plate with a runner coming to 2nd because he's so great, no use for that guy ever. No respect, and if there are too many of them then the clubhouse sucks because guys don't like dealing with that crap.

[McKeyFan]

Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

As I mull over it, I'm thinking maybe Dun was talking about Danny.

Danny knew it, and he gave some "we" comments about missing assignments on BOTH sides of the floor.

Hmmmmmm.