Announcement

Collapse

The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less

Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

    I know most of you are concentrating on the possible lineup change (those bore me and are discussed to no end). But to me what was most interesting were the comments by Mike Dunleavy. I'll also include the comments by Granger as well.

    http://blogs.indystar.com/pacersinsi..._goes_off.html

    Granger - "He got into our (butts)," Danny Granger said. "We're not always tied together as a team. We make selfish plays on offense and defense. We argue with each other instead of getting mad at the other team. We deserve everything he told us. We can't get down 25 points every game we play."


    Dunleavy - "I think sometimes it can be attributed to effort, other times it can be attributed to understanding what we're trying to do," swingman Mike Dunleavy said. "It seems like we have a hard time following through what we're told to do on a daily and weekly basis.

    "We're always playing catch up. Certainly more effort and desire will help that, but at some point we have to start figuring things out and know where we're supposed to be."



    OK, I'm dying to know who Mike is talking about. what players don't know where they are supposed to be. What players don't follow the game plan

    Danny's comment about that they aren't always tied together as a team is what I see.


    I don't have any answers, but I think I'm going to start looking at these areas, because really I think Mike and Danny both have very valid points.

    Edit: I just realized something, this likely will turn into an anti O'Brien thread, I sure hope not.
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 01-21-2010, 09:21 AM.

  • #2
    Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

    Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
    I know most of you are concentrating on the possible lineup change (those bore me and are discussed to no end). But to me what was most interesting were the comments by Mike Dunleavy. I'll also include the comments by Granger as well.

    http://blogs.indystar.com/pacersinsi..._goes_off.html

    Granger - "He got into our (butts)," Danny Granger said. "We're not always tied together as a team. We make selfish plays on offense and defense. We argue with each other instead of getting mad at the other team. We deserve everything he told us. We can't get down 25 points every game we play."


    Dunleavy - "I think sometimes it can be attributed to effort, other times it can be attributed to understanding what we're trying to do," swingman Mike Dunleavy said. "It seems like we have a hard time following through what we're told to do on a daily and weekly basis.

    "We're always playing catch up. Certainly more effort and desire will help that, but at some point we have to start figuring things out and know where we're supposed to be."



    OK, I'm dying to know who Mike is talking about. what players don't know where they are supposed to be. What players don't follow the game plan

    Danny's comment about that they aren't always tied together as a team is what I see.


    I don't have any answers, but I think I'm going to start looking at these areas, because really I think Mike and Danny both have very valid points.

    Edit: I just realized something, this likely will turn into an anti O'Brien thread, I sure hope not.
    To summarize this team does not have a leader. The coach has lost the team, the captains are not doing their jobs, and they just want to do the playground basketball thing and generate as many points for themselves as possible. I saw it last night. It was non shooters taking jump shots and jump shooters not trying to get the basketball into the low post. From a pacers digest member who watches the games on the tv it is easier for us to see than most. It is so hard for me to just pinpoint one thing that is wrong on the team.
    JOB is a silly man

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

      I would say D.Jones is the main one, I like AJ and Im a big fan but he can play a lil selfish at times also, Solo looks lost out there sometimes, Head appears to play selfish...... and the biggest one of them all Danny.....unless its JOB that is telling him to come down the court and shoot a three without passing or setting up your offense. But hey most of the 3pt shooters do it so maybe it is JOB's telling them to do it. But if not is it Danny pouting because he's having shots taken away from him?.........who knows.
      I'm not perfect and neither are you.

      Romans 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the esteem of Elohim,
      Ephisians 4: 32 And be kind towards one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as Elohim also forgave you in Messiah.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

        Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post

        Granger - "He got into our (butts)," Danny Granger said. "We're not always tied together as a team. We make selfish plays on offense and defense. We argue with each other instead of getting mad at the other team. We deserve everything he told us. We can't get down 25 points every game we play."
        First of all I would have highlighted the part done above, after removal of TJ one would think that few of those players were left.
        Since it is Granger saying it, I am pretty sure he is not thinking of himself, and we can exclude Hibbert and Rush as well I think, that leaves precious few players (in the starting line and on the bench)

        With Head and Watson as unlikely candidates as well, that leaves hmm let me see, Tyler, Dantay, Solo and Murphy.

        Shall I leave it to the reader what to make of that ??
        So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.

        If you've done 6 impossible things today?
        Then why not have Breakfast at Milliways!

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

          Its all about effort, how many times in the last 2 florida games did you see players absolutely quit on defense. Nearly every time down the floor, and Dunleavy and Granger are prime examples of it. They stand there and watch and won't bring the help defense. Dunleavy wouldn't even challenge a layup from OLD white chocolate Jason Williams. Or they just foul instead of actually making a defensive play, aka Troy Murphy.

          I'd start Ford, Tyler, & McRoberts next game. At this point wins don't even matter, just not getting blown out, making a game of it comes first.
          You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

            Originally posted by sportfireman View Post
            I would say D.Jones is the main one, I like AJ and Im a big fan but he can play a lil selfish at times also, Solo looks lost out there sometimes, Head appears to play selfish...... and the biggest one of them all Danny.....unless its JOB that is telling him to come down the court and shoot a three without passing or setting up your offense. But hey most of the 3pt shooters do it so maybe it is JOB's telling them to do it. But if not is it Danny pouting because he's having shots taken away from him?.........who knows.
            I would not say that its Danny, last 2-3 games Danny has rarely seen the ball in the beginning of the game, and almost shut out of the offense.
            You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

              Originally posted by graphic-er View Post
              Its all about effort, how many times in the last 2 florida games did you see players absolutely quit on defense. Nearly every time down the floor, and Dunleavy and Granger are prime examples of it. They stand there and watch and won't bring the help defense. Dunleavy wouldn't even challenge a layup from OLD white chocolate Jason Williams. Or they just foul instead of actually making a defensive play, aka Troy Murphy.

              You are ignoring an important point that maybe Mike is trying to scream from the mountain tops about. Maybe the effort of some of the players is bad (not that is justifies it) because several players don't folow the game plan - that right there can ruin team morale and that is what certainly leads to poor effort.

              If I help off my man and a teammate doesn't help on my man and I get embarassed, that would hurt my effort. If I am Mike Dunleavy and my teammates halfway through the season don't know what offensive play we are running that would hurt my effort. Sure the first time is happens OK, , but it if happens again and again it kills the morale of the team.

              Maybe that is just what is happening

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                Originally posted by sportfireman View Post
                I would say D.Jones is the main one.
                DJones - 6-8 FGs, 5-6 FTs for 17pts.

                Maybe he needs to be more selfish...

                I also think it's ironic we have Danny here talking about players being selfish as he leads the team in shots and shot 7 three pt attempts.

                Dunleavy's comments are starting to sound like the stuff he was saying in GS. The attitude of I know what I am doing but no one else does. News flash for him. He isn't exactly carrying us to victory..

                Uhg, who can fix this mess? I'm just disgusted with the team, mostly the coach.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                  Originally posted by Thingfish View Post
                  DJones - 6-8 FGs, 5-6 FTs for 17pts.

                  Maybe he needs to be more selfish...

                  I also think it's ironic we have Danny here talking about players being selfish as he leads the team in shots and shot 7 three pt attempts.

                  Dunleavy's comments are starting to sound like the stuff he was saying in GS. The attitude of I know what I am doing but no one else does. News flash for him. He isn't exactly carrying us to victory..

                  Uhg, who can fix this mess? I'm just disgusted with the team, mostly the coach.
                  I just think he is a coach's son who grew up watching NBA games. Yes I know the NBA has changed as far as athleticism and things like that, but he still understands the importance of movement and spacing. He is not whining...he is frustrated because he cannot be successful playing one on one. He simply does not have the talent level, but what he can do is move and space well. But that depends on the team being on the same page. I am being dead serious here...our team does not move at all. DJones, Watson, Granger for example last night tried to play one on one and take their man off the dribble and drive. Or they would take a very quick 15 ft jumper. DJones and Watson are our jump shooters...it makes me want to barf. Sorry but I see what Dun is saying on this one. This is night and day from what he was saying in GS.
                  JOB is a silly man

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                    Originally posted by graphic-er View Post
                    I would not say that its Danny, last 2-3 games Danny has rarely seen the ball in the beginning of the game, and almost shut out of the offense.
                    just because its been that way for a game or two, what about the other games. ask yourself why is the teams franchise player, best player and leading scorer being almost shut out of an offense??? thats the question


                    Originally posted by Thingfish View Post
                    DJones - 6-8 FGs, 5-6 FTs for 17pts.

                    Maybe he needs to be more selfish...

                    I also think it's ironic we have Danny here talking about players being selfish as he leads the team in shots and shot 7 three pt attempts.

                    Dunleavy's comments are starting to sound like the stuff he was saying in GS. The attitude of I know what I am doing but no one else does. News flash for him. He isn't exactly carrying us to victory..

                    Uhg, who can fix this mess? I'm just disgusted with the team, mostly the coach.
                    once again that was only 1 game does that erase the rest of the times when he's driven in head down or passed up passing to an open man for a jumper for himself?


                    seriously do you all think these problems developed in 1 or 2 games. this has been going on all season and its coming to the surface.
                    I'm not perfect and neither are you.

                    Romans 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the esteem of Elohim,
                    Ephisians 4: 32 And be kind towards one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as Elohim also forgave you in Messiah.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                      Originally posted by UncleBuck
                      OK, I'm dying to know who Mike is talking about. what players don't know where they are supposed to be. What players don't follow the game plan

                      And this is where we as fans must be content to stay on the outside and in the dark.

                      Dunleavy oughtn't to name names in the press. And maybe he oughtn't to make it evident by calling teammates out on the floor during games.

                      But you have to hope that he is being very, very candid in the locker room. You have to hope that there is discontent and plain anger in the locker room. Where they say, "We" in public, somebody needs to be naming names and pointing fingers and saying "You" where it will do some good.

                      And yet, if we hear there's been a tiff beyond the locker room door, many of us will spin it negatively rather than acknowledging that it is just what is needed.
                      And I won't be here to see the day
                      It all dries up and blows away
                      I'd hang around just to see
                      But they never had much use for me
                      In Levelland. (James McMurtry)

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                        Originally posted by Putnam View Post
                        And this is where we as fans must be content to stay on the outside and in the dark.

                        Dunleavy oughtn't to name names in the press. And maybe he oughtn't to make it evident by calling teammates out on the floor during games.

                        But you have to hope that he is being very, very candid in the locker room. You have to hope that there is discontent and plain anger in the locker room. Where they say, "We" in public, somebody needs to be naming names and pointing fingers and saying "You" where it will do some good.

                        And yet, if we hear there's been a tiff beyond the locker room door, many of us will spin it negatively rather than acknowledging that it is just what is needed.
                        I don't have any inside info. But my hunch is Mike isn't frustrated by players such as Josh, Solo, Price, Diener, Head, Tyler, Foster because these 7 players either aren't playing, are too young to expect anything else, or just aren't vital players to the overall team. My guess is Mike is frustrated with the core players -

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                          If that is the case, this is more of a soap opera cast other than an NBA team.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                            Originally posted by duke dynamite View Post
                            If that is the case, this is more of a soap opera cast other than an NBA team.
                            No, it is pretty common on every NBA team to varying degrees. At the very least it is always bubbling just below the surface, but if a team has good leadership than it is kept below the surface. Pacers don't have any good leadership so it IMO is allowed to flourish and run rampant

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                              Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
                              I don't have any inside info. But my hunch is Mike isn't frustrated by players such as Josh, Solo, Price, Diener, Head, Tyler, Foster because these 7 players either aren't playing, are too young to expect anything else, or just aren't vital players to the overall team. My guess is Mike is frustrated with the core players -
                              Add TJ because he's not playing and that's 8.

                              That leaves Murphy, Rush, Granger, DJones, Watson and Roy.

                              I don't think it's Roy simply because of his personality. You tell him something, where to be, what to do... he'll work on it, no problem.

                              Rush? What's he doing wrong? He rarely looks for his shot, and he's solid on defense.

                              I don't think he's talking about Murph since he's probably Dun's closest friend on the team from their GS days. If it was that big of an issue, they'd handle it privately and work it out.

                              So Watson, DJones or Granger? My money's on Dahntay. Just my hunch...
                              2015, 2016, 2019 IKL Fantasy Basketball Champions - DC Dreamers

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X