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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

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"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

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Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

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  • #46
    Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

    Originally posted by JohnnyBGoode View Post
    People you are acting like a bunch of first graders.

    Here is what I see going on here, Peck says it's Dun, Able says it's Troy, and you name them says it's Obie. Sounds like a playground point the finger at the other guy type of logic. My guy Roy better not get benched, why doesn't OBie play Mcboob, Tyler ear infection must be more thatn what they are telling us, Troy steals rebounds and on and on and on. Geesh people get a grip, this team just doesn't have enough talent to be world beaters and all the finger pointing and player blaming is not going to change the Pacers into anything but bottom feeders.

    Of course it's Troy's fault, problem solved.
    Obviously no one expects them to be world beaters. The rosiest of projections here tended to be 45 wins or less, with an average of about 39 or so during the preseason, and many here being more accurate than the average in expecting less than 35.

    What is alarming is the lack of progress and / or regression of the team overall as well as for the individual players. There are so many different directions to point fingers that it is impossible to figure out where to point them, so the easiest ones to find tend to be the ones that get harped on the most.

    Yes, we are all tired of *****ing and moaning, and we all have our favorites that we either defend or bash.

    I just hope that enough of us continue to care about posting at all that the board doesn't suffer in quality of posting, quantity of pertinent information, as well as the differences of opinion that is so nice to have from everybody here.

    Comment


    • #47
      Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

      Nice Post!

      http://blogs.indystar.com/pacersinsi..._goes_off.html

      "I think sometimes it can be attributed to effort, other times it can be attributed to understanding what we're trying to do,"
      "It seems like we have a hard time following through what we're told to do on a daily and weekly basis.
      "We're always playing catch up. Certainly more effort and desire will help that, but at some point we have to start figuring things out and know where we're supposed to be."
      Sounds to me like Dun is speaking about the team as a whole. It is more dramatic to speculate that he is talking about one player. If he is, hopefully he is addressing it in the locker room or on the court. He should, he is a veteran player, he should have a leading voice on the team. Though I speculate he doesn't get ton of respect, because he hasn't won in NBA, same goes for Troy (again speculation).

      I do like Dun as a player and have been giving him a pass because of his knee. But I view him and his contract has a big road block to us moving forward. I just don't see him as a game changer at this point. He could be a valuable piece to a team competing for a title, but not a young team like ours.

      I like that JOB got in their butts. I would rather him show some fire to motivate than not. Though I still think he's gone at the end of the season. I don't blame him for all the teams problems; the blame can go around to everyone.

      But what I still can't believe is that we have for the second straight season a starting pg sitting on the bench. 8 million dollars going to waste, plus TINS money weighing us down. No wonder we aren't very good.

      Not much we can do till all that money comes off the books so we can bring in new talent and maybe a top 5 player from the draft this year (hope).

      To me all this talk and speculation is just filler, until we either trade or let expire, the deals of Murph, Dun, and Ford. Plus the fact Tins money is still on our books for this year (I believe it isn't next year). Once these things happen I will be able to be emotional involved again.
      Avatar photo credit: Bahram Mark Sobhani - AP

      Comment


      • #48
        Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

        Originally posted by BRushWithDeath View Post
        He's a major part of it Country Boy.
        OK Peck

        Comment


        • #49
          Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

          Originally posted by Hicks View Post
          Making the same points over and over again while being childish enough to label and/or make fun of others? Sounds like a 1st grader to me.
          Not at all, I am responding to the same points being made over and over and over.. Maybe I should have said that many are acting like a bunch of cats on a hot tin roof.

          Comment


          • #50
            Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

            Originally posted by Peck View Post
            I wonder if Mike was thinking and preparing this speech while he was on the floor. That would explain the solid defensive effort he gave as Jason Williams scored an easy unimpeded two off of the fast break. I mean Mike really could not concentrate on both, could he.

            I say this next part in all seriousness. I would rather watch Jermaine O'Neal jack up turn around fade away shots all game than see what Mike Dunleavy did on that defensive play.

            I'm sorry but that was disgusting to me.

            I know that many of you will consider this a stretch but at that point in time I became infuriated with O'Brien. He gets mad at Roy for just about any little thing and has zero problem calling him out, benching him or whatever. But Mike does this and this isn't the first time, and its play on.

            Which just leads me to believe that he can talk about defense all he wants, but until I see an established pattern that shows me he won't allow Murphy or Dunleavy to literally take defensive plays off I will continue to believe that he truly values offense far more.
            the bottom line is their is no stability to anything this guy does.
            he has completely lost the team, and the guys have clearly packed it in
            I dont think even Obie can figure Obie out
            Sittin on top of the world!

            Comment


            • #51
              Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

              I couldn't find a postgame thread so I'll put this here:

              In our victory over Orlando:

              Hibbert: 35 minutes
              Murphy: 0 minutes

              In our blowout loss to Orlando:

              Murphy: 35 minutes
              Hibbert: 18 minutes


              I don't really care if Roy knew where to go on the court or not. I think Obie's decisions are terrible, and I am angry about it.

              Of course the team is in chaos.
              "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

              Comment


              • #52
                Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                Players can point fingers all they want, but the fact of the matter is, is that this team really isn't that good. We have Granger and a bunch of guys who would be good backups, but probably not starters on a contending team. I mean Earl Watson is our starting PG!

                Hibbert and Rush have shown flashes (much more Roy this season), but they aren't quite ready to be consistent key contributors yet. Murphy and Dunleavy are nice players, but when they're called to be your #2 and #3 best players, you're in trouble.

                That being said, Dunleavy, Murphy, and even Granger need to get better defensively or get out of town. Right now, they're largely all one-way players, and you can't really have three players in your lineup who do that. Good defense leads to good offense.

                Comment


                • #53
                  Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                  Originally posted by JohnnyBGoode View Post
                  People you are acting like a bunch of first graders.

                  Here is what I see going on here, Peck says it's Dun, Able says it's Troy, and you name them says it's Obie. Sounds like a playground point the finger at the other guy type of logic. My guy Roy better not get benched, why doesn't OBie play Mcboob, Tyler ear infection must be more thatn what they are telling us, Troy steals rebounds and on and on and on. Geesh people get a grip, this team just doesn't have enough talent to be world beaters and all the finger pointing and player blaming is not going to change the Pacers into anything but bottom feeders.

                  Of course it's Troy's fault, problem solved.
                  [yt][yt]

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                    Originally posted by McKeyFan View Post
                    I couldn't find a postgame thread so I'll put this here:

                    In our victory over Orlando:

                    Hibbert: 35 minutes
                    Murphy: 0 minutes

                    In our blowout loss to Orlando:

                    Murphy: 35 minutes
                    Hibbert: 18 minutes


                    I don't really care if Roy knew where to go on the court or not. I think Obie's decisions are terrible, and I am angry about it.

                    Of course the team is in chaos.
                    In our victory over Orlando, Hibbert pwned Howard. In our loss, Howard pwned Hibbert.
                    BillS

                    A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
                    Or throw in a first-round pick and flip it for a max-level point guard...

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                      Originally posted by BillS View Post
                      In our victory over Orlando, Hibbert pwned Howard. In our loss, Howard pwned Hibbert.
                      We also went to Roy in the post a lot less.

                      Comment


                      • #56
                        Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                        Originally posted by McKeyFan View Post
                        I couldn't find a postgame thread so I'll put this here:

                        In our victory over Orlando:

                        Hibbert: 35 minutes
                        Murphy: 0 minutes

                        In our blowout loss to Orlando:

                        Murphy: 35 minutes
                        Hibbert: 18 minutes


                        I don't really care if Roy knew where to go on the court or not. I think Obie's decisions are terrible, and I am angry about it.

                        Of course the team is in chaos.
                        Simplistic viewpoint.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                          Originally posted by Hicks View Post
                          We also went to Roy in the post a lot less.
                          And if we had it would have been much worse.

                          Comment


                          • #58
                            Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                            Originally posted by McKeyFan View Post
                            I couldn't find a postgame thread so I'll put this here:

                            In our victory over Orlando:

                            Hibbert: 35 minutes
                            Murphy: 0 minutes

                            In our blowout loss to Orlando:

                            Murphy: 35 minutes
                            Hibbert: 18 minutes


                            I don't really care if Roy knew where to go on the court or not. I think Obie's decisions are terrible, and I am angry about it.

                            Of course the team is in chaos.

                            You are going to have to explain in more detail than that. I mean do you really think that was the difference in the game. Might it have soemthing to do with how great Howard played last night. Magic played well in one game bad in the other, the pacers were the exact opposite. OK I feel like I'm being pulled back into the same type of thing as the 5 games in November thing.

                            I mean really, do I need to explain this, really?


                            Seriously though, this is all that I needed to post.
                            Plus/minus for last night
                            Roy - (-22) - the worst on the team
                            Troy - (+1) - the second best on the team

                            .
                            Last edited by Unclebuck; 01-21-2010, 03:53 PM.

                            Comment


                            • #59
                              Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                              Originally posted by JohnnyBGoode View Post
                              And if we had it would have been much worse.
                              Okay? "Roy's inconsistent, so let's not even try going to him very much." Is that what you want?

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Re: Dunleavy: players don't know where they are supposed to be

                                Originally posted by Hicks View Post
                                Okay? "Roy's inconsistent, so let's not even try going to him very much." Is that what you want?
                                It doesn't have to be all or nothing.

                                Comment

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