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Originally posted by Dece
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The Rules of Pacers Digest
Hello everyone,
Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.
A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.
Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.
Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.
Rule #1
Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:
"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"
"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"
"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"
"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"
"He/she is just delusional"
"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"
"I'm going to take a moment to point and
/ laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"
"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good?"
In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.
We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.
Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.
That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.
A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.
There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.
Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.
In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.
Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.
If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!
All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.
Rule #2
If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.
The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.
The right places to do so are:
A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.
B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.
If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.
Rule #3
If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.
When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:
A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.
B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.
To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!
Rule #4
Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.
Rule #5
When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.
An example:
If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:
http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star
Rule #6
We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.
The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.
Rule #7
Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.
It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).
We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).
However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.
Rule #8
We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.
Rule #9
Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.
Rule #10
We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.
Rule #11
Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.
A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.
Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.
Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.
Rule #1
Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:
"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"
"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"
"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"
"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"
"He/she is just delusional"
"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"
"I'm going to take a moment to point and
/ laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*""Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good?
"In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.
We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.
Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.
That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.
A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.
There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.
Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.
In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.
Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.
If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!
All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.
Rule #2
If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.
The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.
The right places to do so are:
A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.
B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.
If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.
Rule #3
If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.
When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:
A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.
B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.
To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!
Rule #4
Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.
Rule #5
When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.
An example:
If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:
http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star
Rule #6
We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.
The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.
Rule #7
Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.
It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).
We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).
However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.
Rule #8
We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.
Rule #9
Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.
Rule #10
We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.
Rule #11
Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Guess it get's out of $5 mill in guaranteed money after this season. Suns probably also attach a second or 2 so Herb can sell them off for another new boat. -
Why not wait till Tuesday and you can trade Myles TJ for Ayton and Payne.Originally posted by LongTimePacerFan View PostComment
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3 second round picks Phoenix got.Originally posted by Dece View Post@WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!
Comment
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Canada National Team Roster--Brissette and CoJo (and Edey) made it over Nemby and Mathurin:
Team Canada's FIBA roster: Luguentz Dort, Jamal Murray, SGA, RJ Barrett, Dillon Brooks, Kyle Alexander, Nickeil Alexander-Walker, Trae Bell-Haynes, Oshae Brissett, Cory Joseph, Kelly Olynyk, Kevin Pangos, Dwight Powell, Zach Edey, Melvin Ejim, Kassius Robertson, Phil et Thomas ScrubbComment
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https://theathletic.com/4683676/2023...a-adam-silver/
NBA summer-league notes: Pacers sing Bruce Brown’s praises; how will Nuggets replace him?
By Mike Vorkunov
4h ago
10
LAS VEGAS — While the NBA world focused on the latest chapters in the league’s long-running series of “As This Unhappy Star Turns,” the Indiana Pacers quietly yet definitively put together a very nice offseason. They did it without much pomp, but after running through the 2022-23 season as one of the league’s up-and-coming surprises, Indiana used the last few weeks to augment a young and emerging roster.
The Pacers moved quickly to give Tyrese Haliburton a designated rookie max extension, cementing him as the centerpiece of their project. They drafted a defensive-minded big in Jarace Walker with the eighth pick and sent two second-round picks to New York for Obi Toppin, an underused but dynamic power forward who went four spots ahead of Haliburton in the 2020 lottery. They recouped those seconds by sending their own 2021 lottery pick, Chris Duarte, to the Kings.
The biggest addition, however, came early into free agency on June 30, when they agreed to terms with Bruce Brown on a two-year, $45 million contract. It was an audacious maneuver. Flush with cap room, the Pacers used it to splash the pot and outspend the rest of the market for the highly sought-after wing. It was, general manager Chad Buchanan concedes, “a very unique way of pursuing him.”
“What other teams are willing to pay him? And what we were willing to pay him is a big, significant gap,” Buchanan told The Athletic. “But we also knew that maybe it’s a little more than maybe the market would say, but it was the way we as an organization and as a team have to approach free agency sometimes. We got to be a little creative. We got to maybe go deeper with a pay to get a guy, but it was the guy we wanted.
“We wanted to do what it took to get him, and working with his agents, right at the strike of free agency and talking about ‘OK, where were the other teams at? Where would we need to come in to get Bruce to turn down some of these other options from other more established teams than us?’ Buchanan added. “We’re a young team, and for Bruce to come in and leave a championship team and some other teams (that) are after him to come to play for a young team, we realize it was gonna probably take a unique way to approach luring him to us.”
Brown had a list of suitors lined up — he was expected to be able to choose from a number of offers at or over the midlevel exception worth a little more than $12 million — but the Pacers wanted Brown and acted aggressively to sign him. Haliburton made his own personal pitch as well, and Brown only spoke to one other team, the Knicks, he said, before taking Indiana’s offer.
The Pacers went after Brown because they envision a scenario where the 26-year-old could be more than just a role player, as he had been in Brooklyn and Denver. Buchanan said he thinks Brown could take another step forward in his career, even after serving as a highly important glue guy for an NBA champion while also setting highs in points and assists per game.
Brown should fit in seamlessly to a roster that has talent but is still young and short on experience. Haliburton is 23, Bennedict Mathurin is entering his second season, Toppin has played in the NBA for three seasons but didn’t get a lot of minutes, and Andrew Nembhard played the third-most minutes on the team last season despite being a rookie second-round pick.
Most of all, the Pacers will need him to lift up their defense.
“We’re a great offensive group,” Buchanan said. “We need to find some guys that can do the dirty work, the guys that were gonna embrace being a great defender, that were gonna relish guarding other teams’ great scorers. … He played so many different positions. He guards so many different positions, and he’s improved his shooting. He’s just very adaptable. I think that’s why he had such strong value on the market.”
The Pacers highlighted their defense as a major spot for improvement and targeted their offseason around it. Brown should help as a jack-of-all-trades defender. Walker came into the draft with a reputation for potentially becoming a defensive ace in the frontcourt. He’ll undoubtedly struggle at times — as all rookies are wont to do — but could become a foundational piece of the defense down the line.
He already has turned some heads during Las Vegas Summer League with not only his rim protection and sly hands on defense but also some deft passing.
“He’s different,” Mathurin said. “His presence is unbelievable. His wingspan is great. I love his energy. That’s the one thing we’re going to need from him. Coming in as a rookie playing defense is really hard.”
They showed signs of potential last season, sitting at 23-18 in early January before a late swoon. Some of that was tied to Haliburton, who injured his knee and elbow Jan. 11 in a loss to the Knicks and missed the next 10 games. Indiana lost all but one of those games, part of a 2-15 stretch heading into the All-Star break. The Pacers went 28-28 in games Haliburton played and 7-19 otherwise.
But the Pacers’ issues went further than occasionally missing their All-Star. They also had the NBA’s worst defensive rebounding rate, turned the ball over too frequently and gave up too many free throws. Indiana also owned the fifth-worst defense in the league last season.
“If we can become a top-20 defense, I think we would make a pretty good jump, have a chance to make a good jump. And competing for a playoff spot, I think we’d love to be in that position this year,” Buchanan said. “If it’s a Play-In, playoff, wherever it is. Maybe we realized we’re not a top-four-type seed roster at this point with as much youth as we have. But I think our guys are motivated to make a run to get into the playoffs, and I think it’s going to take each guy elevating their play, because last year, we had a good stretch to begin the season, and we kind of fell off a little bit the last half of the season. But I think our guys are motivated to try; let’s try to get into the Play-In and see if we can get in the playoffs and really get that experience under our belts for a young team.”
The Pacers also will lean into what worked for them. Indiana played fast last season and trailed only four teams in overall pace, according to NBA.com. The Pacers also owned the fourth-quickest time to shot, via Inpredictable. Only the Thunder took a shot faster, on average, than the Pacers did after a made basket.
Buchanan pointed to Rick Carlisle as the reason. The head coach, Buchanan said, likes to play to the strengths of his best player, and Haliburton likes to get out and push the ball.
The front office also wanted to build around him. Brown can run, and Walker is a spry athlete at his size. Toppin is at his best in transition, which also made him a poor fit with the Knicks.
The Pacers have a runway to build. Buchanan hopes for improvement but did not clearly define what resembles progress. With some small signs of promise already, and a young team, the Pacers have time to see how things develop around Haliburton. There is young talent aboard, and veterans Buddy Hield and Myles Turner are strong complements. They also have contracts that give Indiana flexibility; Hield is a free agent after 2023-24, and Turner has two years left on his deal.
The Pacers have already been linked to potential big moves this summer. SportsNet’s Michael Grange reported that Indiana has reached out to Toronto about Raptors All-Star forward Pascal Siakam, while Marc Stein reported the Pacers are a legitimate contender to trade for him.
Asked if the Pacers were done for the offseason, Buchanan seemed content to let the current roster get settled and grow together, but he also left the door ajar for the franchise to act if it sees fit.
“We still have a little room left,” he said. “But I don’t think a team’s done until you’re done. We’ll always try to be opportunistic when we can on anything. But I don’t think we’re like aggressively pursuing anything right now. But you always think every team in the league is gonna wait till what opportunities are out there. Obviously, some big names out there … could get moved still this offseason, and if that filters down and impacts other teams, if it impacts us, we’ll consider it. But, if it doesn’t, we’re also happy with this group now. We’re not going to rush things to try to jump and go all in right now. I don’t think that’s where we’re at. We don’t have that. We’re not one player away from being a championship-caliber team. I think we realize it takes time and it takes guys developing and growing.”
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Is Watson the next man up?
While the Pacers celebrated Brown’s arrival, his old team, the Denver Nuggets, will surely miss him. Look no further than Michael Malone’s title-parade plea for Brown to return as an example of how much he meant to the champs.
Brown was a key part of the Nuggets’ success this past season, and Denver is now missing two important rotation players as Jeff Green also left in free agency.
Peyton Watson is expected to factor into replacing Brown. He’s a 6-foot-8 wing who spent his rookie year, essentially, in Denver’s development academy after being the final pick of the first round in June 2022. He logged just 200 minutes across the regular season and playoffs, and that was after coming into the NBA after averaging only 12.7 minutes per game in his one year at UCLA.
He called himself “one of the bigger mysteries” in the draft at the 2022 draft combine, but Watson is intriguing. He was a consensus top-10 recruit in the 2021 high school class and has a 7-0 1/2 wingspan. He has the profile of a possibly disruptive defender.
Watson said he has begun to feel more comfortable in his role with the Nuggets.
“It’s just going to be on what the team needs,” he said. “I feel like I can really, really come in and affect the game on defense. I think that’s my niche right now. Just having energy defensively, getting those blocks, getting those steals and giving our team some energy.”
John Beckett, a Nuggets assistant coach and the team’s summer-league head coach, said it will be easier for Denver to trust Watson in a larger role next season because of the growth he’s shown over the past year. That growth, he said, has mostly come in how he’s been off the court.
“Just his professionalism,” Beckett said. “The fact that he’s taking care of his body more, getting his rest, eating the proper things, coming to practice on time, practicing hard and with pace. That’s probably the biggest area where he’s showed it.”
Bruce Brown and Peyton Watson (Isaiah J. Downing / USA Today)Smaller stakes
The NBA has lowered the limit on how small of a stake someone can own in one of its franchises. The minimum threshold in equity someone can take in a team is now down to 0.5 percent, according to league sources. It had been 1 percent.
A little more in players’ pockets
If you want more evidence that business is booming for the NBA right now, you can look at how fast the salary cap is rising — up 10 percent from the 2022-23 season to this upcoming one — or look at where escrow payments ended up this past season for the players.
Just 2.64 percent was taken out of the players’ paychecks for escrow payments for the 2022-23 season after the league finished its annual financial audit, according to league sources. The NBA usually takes out 10 percent of player’s salaries to put into escrow, though this amount was increased after the COVID-19 pandemic to try to make up for expected shortages in basketball related income.
The NBA and its players have a roughly 50/50 split of basketball related income, though it could tilt up to 51 percent for the players or the league, depending on how much BRI the NBA nets compared to the forecast number, and a portion of players’ salaries is put into escrow to make up for any potential shortfalls. If revenues exceed the projections, then money from the pot put into escrow is redistributed to players.
Silver says
The first investment from a sovereign wealth fund into a major North American pro sports team became official Monday, as Monumental Sports announced that it had sold a minority stake in its company to the Qatari Investment Authority. Monumental Sports is the parent company of the Washington Wizards, Capitals and Mystics; the QIA is the sovereign wealth fund of Qatar. It’s the first time a sovereign wealth fund had bought in after the NBA changed its rules late last year to facilitate such a deal.
This investment has raised questions of what could come down the line. Saudi Arabia’s Public Investment Fund has gone on a shopping spree of late, buying Newcastle FC in the English Premier League and recently agreeing to a financial merger with the PGA Tour. Each endeavor has been met with skepticism about the nation using its vast financial resources to sportswash its international reputation, which includes criticisms from other nations regarding human rights violations.
NBA commissioner Adam Silver, speaking in a Q&A this week at the Associated Press Sports Editors conference, didn’t address the PIF specifically, but he did reiterate that sovereign wealth funds cannot buy a controlling interest in an NBA team. Currently, sovereign wealth funds, like private equity firms, are limited to holding no more than a 20 percent stake in a franchise; it must also be a passive investment with no say in operations.
“I don’t want to say what could ever happen, but there’s no contemplation right now,” Silver said. “It’s very important to us — put aside sovereign wealth funds — that individuals are in position to control our teams to be responsible to fans, to be responsible to their partners and to the players.”
Silver was also asked if he could see that limit changing.
“No. Not in the foreseeable future, no,” he said. “It’s very important to us that it’s a person. And this is independent of sovereign wealth funds.”
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Watch and learn
One of the cool things about being at Las Vegas Summer League is just walking around the Thomas & Mack Center because you never know what you’ll run into — like the two large computer screens deployed about two Victor Wembanyamas away from the baseline on one end of the court.
Those two screens belong to the folks at Hawk-Eye Innovations, which will be the league’s tracking data supplier this upcoming season for the first time. Hawk-Eye says it will use its 3D optical tracking tech to provide teams with data captured in three dimensions, including pose data based on some 20-plus points on the body — as opposed to the one-dot center of mass that Second Spectrum relied on — so it can identify extremities and joints on the body and player orientation. That should allow teams to receive more granular information, from things like more accurate shot contest data to possible uses in sports science. Here’s a short video, courtesy of the NBA and Hawk-Eye, that shows what the video on those screens looks like and what the company could possibly provide to teams starting next season.
No draft, no problem?
This summer was more proof that not getting picked in the NBA Draft is not the end of the road for aspiring players. Undrafted players signed contracts this offseason that could be worth as much as roughly $390 million, headlined by the $128 million deal Fred VanVleet received from the Houston Rockets. Max Strus and Gabe Vincent, two alums of the Miami Heat’s Undrafted Development Academy, signed contracts worth over a combined $95 million.
Second-round picks also did well. They signed contracts that could be worth more than $650 million in total. Jerami Grant, a second-round pick in 2014, signed the biggest deal by any player in open free agency at five years and $160 million with the Trail Blazers. Draymond Green re-signed for $100 million with the Warriors. Khris Middleton signed a three-year, $93 million deal with the Bucks that could reach $102 million if he hits certain incentives.
(Top photo of Bruce Brown: Ron Hoskins / NBAE via Getty Images)
What did you think of this story?
MEH
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Good to see them say they're not desperate to go all in right now. Still, this has been an epic failure of an offseason. The draft was pathetic and it sounds like we had to beg Brown to come here. Having to overpay a guy 10 million to come to Indiana for a year is just sad. Before I was meh about the front office, but now I'm fully in the camp that we need a house cleaning and probably new ownership as well. Basically everybody but Rick needs to go.Comment
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Softner went to the Agent 0 podcast, as expected he is full of it.
Enjoy:
@WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!Comment
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True but this one was more important than most. Or at least should've been approached that way. We're still lagging behind the times when it comes to team building.Originally posted by jrwannabe View PostComment
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Isiah Thomas says Pistons fired, then rehired coach Chuck Daly before back-to-back titles
The Detroit News
The Detroit Pistons won back-to-back NBA titles in 1989 and 1990 with legendary coach Chuck Daly. That almost didn't happen, according to Pistons icon Isiah Thomas, who says Daly was fired and then rehired in 1986.
In an interview on the July 18th edition of the "Bad Boys and Beyond" podcast with Mike Payton and Keith Black Trudeau, Thomas revealed the story behind it all: "I'll tell you a story here that not too many people know, that hasn't been told."
Thomas said Pistons GM Jack McCloskey fired Daly after a lengthy losing streak in the 1985-86 season.
After Thomas drove to then-owner Bill Davidson's house and convinced Davidson to reinstate Daly, Thomas said he gave Daly the good news by phone and then they met at the McDonald's on Orchard Lake Road for "two cheeseburgers, a large fry and a vanilla milkshake."
Thomas' description of the lines up with a 4-15 stretch — which dropped the Pistons to 16-21 — and ended with a home game against the Philadelphia 76ers on Jan. 11, 1986. Here's the transcript from the podcast:
"I'll tell you a story here that not too many people know, that hasn't been told," Thomas said on the podcast. "Chuck Daly was fired from the Detroit Pistons. I'll never forget. Jack McCloskey fired him. This was early in the season. We had lost 15 out of 19 games. I'm not sure what year it was. It could've been '86.
"In '86, we had lost 15 out of 19 and Chuck Daly got fired that afternoon. I'll never forget. I drove to Mr. D's (owner Bill Davidson) house and I said, 'We're making a huge mistake.' He goes, 'What do you mean?' I go, 'This is not the coach's fault.' I said, 'We don't have the kind of talent to compete the way everyone thinks we should. If we lose this coach, I don't think we'll ever win here.' He said to me, 'Do you think Chuck Daly is that good?' I go, 'Absolutely. He's the perfect coach for us.'
"And then I called up Chuck and I said, 'Do you want your job back?' And he goes — he was in a (foul) mood — he said, 'Yeah. I want my job back.' So, we met at the McDonald's on Orchard Lake and he and I just talked. And then Mr. D called. I think he called Jack and said, 'Hey, we're hiring him back.' And Chuck Daly got his job back. The next day, we started turning things around."
After that tailspin, the Pistons went 24-6 over their next 30 games and turned their season around.
When asked if he remembered what he ordered at the McDonald's, Thomas said, "Two cheeseburgers, a large fry and a vanilla milkshake. The regular cheeseburgers. Not the Quarter-Pounders."
Thomas went on to talk about the team improving defensively with shot-blockers John Salley, Dennis Rodman, the trade for Adrian Dantley and adding Rick Mahorn.
It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.
Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
Conference Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 2005
NBA Champions 1989, 1990, 2004Comment
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NBA over/under win total projections via
@DKSportsbook
: Nuggets = 54.5 Celtics = 53.5 Bucks = 52.5 Suns = 51.5 Cavaliers = 49.5 Warriors = 49.5 Lakers = 48.5 Grizzlies = 45.5 Mavericks = 45.5 Pelicans = 43.5 Kings = 43.5 Knicks = 43.5 Timberwolves = 43.5 Thunder = 43.5 Hawks = 42.5 Bulls = 37.5 Raptors = 37.5 Magic = 35.5 Pacers = 35.5 Jazz = 34.5 Hornets = 31.5 Spurs = 30.5 Pistons = 27.5 Wizards = 24.5Comment
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The first thing that jumps out at me is how compressed everything is. There were 8 teams in preseason last year with totals above 50. These odds have 4 for this year. Last year there were 7 teams in preseason with totals under 30 wins, 5 of them under 25. Those odds have 2 and 1.Originally posted by Ozys Nepimpis View Post
That follows the actual league results lately where the good teams aren't as good and the bad teams aren't as bad. Whether that's more due to resting players or the depth of the talent in the league, I'm not sure.Comment
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Lmao Ozys not trying to wait. Comment
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