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GET BEN SIMMONS PRITCHARD !!!!

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  • I want nothing to do with Benjamin Simons or that snake Richie Paul. I hope the Sixers don't cave.

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    • Originally posted by OneMoreYear View Post

      Given that one player is almost certainly Malcolm, and they would have zero interest in Turner, that means we'd likely lose Malcolm + Levert or Malcolm + Warren. Either way, that's not "addition by subtraction" since in both cases we'd be left with helluva shooting deficiency in the starting lineup! Simmons, Levert, Sabonis & Turner for instance? That's bad.

      I suppose if Duarte really comes out guns blazing, we could promote him to the 3 and then you've got a fighting chance. And I am partial to a move which pushes him towards starting minutes.

      Otherwise, if that doesn't happen, maaaaan, if you think we're loathe to take 3s as it is now, just WAIT till Simmons comes & youve shipped out your two best shooting starters.
      Am I the only one that thinks that, if we were to somehow land Simmons, we would completely restructure the team?

      I would hope that the FO would think that moving forward with Simmons, Sabonis, Turner, and Warren/LeVert is not a viable option.

      So IF we land Simmons, I think it’s a precursor to many more moves. The question is how quickly those subsequent moves would happen.
      I think KP is a Captain Planet fan. He believes that the collective will of five decent starters can outweigh the power of top-level talent. Too bad Herb won't cut the check for their Planeteer rings.

      Comment


      • If Simmons doesn't like Morey because of a fairly harmless tweet, that's a pretty petty and stupid reason to dislike someone from a business and personal POV.
        Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by BornIndy View Post
          I want nothing to do with Benjamin Simons or that snake Richie Paul. I hope the Sixers don't cave.
          The longer it takes to clear up this mess, the better it will be for any other Team in the East.
          Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

          Comment


          • Originally posted by OneMoreYear View Post

            Given that one player is almost certainly Malcolm, and they would have zero interest in Turner, that means we'd likely lose Malcolm + Levert or Malcolm + Warren. Either way, that's not "addition by subtraction" since in both cases we'd be left with helluva shooting deficiency in the starting lineup! Simmons, Levert, Sabonis & Turner for instance? That's bad.

            I suppose if Duarte really comes out guns blazing, we could promote him to the 3 and then you've got a fighting chance. And I am partial to a move which pushes him towards starting minutes.

            Otherwise, if that doesn't happen, maaaaan, if you think we're loathe to take 3s as it is now, just WAIT till Simmons comes & youve shipped out your two best shooting starters.
            Keep in mind that if there is a scenario where the Pacers are somehow able to acquire Simmons and it costs the Pacers Brogdon and either Levert or Warren, then I'd easily argue that you can't look at it where the Pacers roster is set in stone. It may also translate into a crappy season where floor spacing sucks cuz we have no 3pt shooters, but I would think that KP and the Pacers would be looking to make moves by the trade deadline or ( at worst ) the Summer of 2022 to find the pieces to surround a lineup involving Simmons and Sabonis.

            The current roster isn't built around a Player like Simmons and Sabonis. When you somehow land a likely franchise changing Player like Simmons, you then work on fixing it to better fit him. It may take a season to do it and it may translate into another "lost season"....but by no means would I consider whatever the roster that is leftover would be considered a "finished product".

            This is one of those highly unlikely and improbable scenarios where you do what you need to do to get the Player that is considered to be a franchise changer and then figure it out AFTER how to build around him.

            Spoiler Spoiler:
            Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by CableKC View Post
              Keep in mind that if there is a scenario where the Pacers are somehow able to acquire Simmons and it costs the Pacers Brogdon and either Levert or Warren, then I'd easily argue that you can't look at it where the Pacers roster is set in stone. It may also translate into a crappy season where floor spacing sucks cuz we have no 3pt shooters, but I would think that KP and the Pacers would be looking to make moves by the trade deadline or ( at worst ) the Summer of 2022 to find the pieces to surround a lineup involving Simmons and Sabonis.

              The current roster isn't built around a Player like Simmons and Sabonis. When you somehow land a likely franchise changing Player like Simmons, you then work on fixing it to better fit him. It may take a season to do it and it may translate into another "lost season"....but by no means would I consider whatever the roster that is leftover would be considered a "finished product". No,

              This is one of those highly unlikely and improbable scenarios where you do what you need to do to get the Player that is considered to be a franchise changer and then figure it out AFTER how to build around him.

              Spoiler Spoiler:
              Ordinarily I'd agree that's the way to approach it--your marquee acquisition needs to be the priority--but from what we've seen I have no faith in this office to actually do that. That would therefore involve trading Myles, your most valuable player left after the charges not named Sabonis, in order to get a player to replace Brogdon's efficient scoring. Maybe they'll surprise me but I don't see Myles moving esp if we suffer another "lost season" after which we'll hear hope they don't wanna make moves till they see how our roster REALLY gels after...a few...more... years. No, I'm afraid that if we acquire Simmons, TPTB will simply ride this thing until the wheels fall off. Probably compensate by signing a couple washed vets. Or someone has a tantrum and requests a trade. We've seen this before.
              Last edited by OneMoreYear; 09-22-2021, 10:03 PM.

              Comment


              • Originally posted by CableKC View Post
                If Simmons doesn't like Morey because of a fairly harmless tweet, that's a pretty petty and stupid reason to dislike someone from a business and personal POV.
                I’ll figure out how to embed tweets someday…

                https://twitter.com/hmfaigen/status/...415360012?s=20
                I think KP is a Captain Planet fan. He believes that the collective will of five decent starters can outweigh the power of top-level talent. Too bad Herb won't cut the check for their Planeteer rings.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by OneMoreYear View Post

                  Ordinarily I'd agree that's the way to approach it--your marquee acquisition needs to be the priority--but from what we've seen I have no faith in this office to actually do that. That would therefore involve trading Myles, your most valuable player left after the charges not named Sabonis, in order to get a player to replace Brogdon's efficient scoring. Maybe they'll surprise me but I don't see Myles moving esp if we suffer another "lost season" after which we'll hear hope they don't wanna make moves till they see how our roster REALLY gels after...a few...more... years. No, I'm afraid that if we acquire Simmons, TPTB will simply ride this thing until the wheels fall off. Probably compensate by signing a couple washed vets. Or someone has a tantrum and requests a trade. We've seen this before.
                  If we were to trade for Simmons, I wouldn’t be surprised if Sabonis was traded instead of Turner.

                  The obvious argument against this is that we’d be downgrading our talent significantly. But it’s more about properly constructing a team around your star player(s) instead of collecting mismatched talents and holding onto them for too long.

                  Let’s say it takes two starters to get Ben. My current preference (picks aside) would be to trade Brogdon and LeVert for Simmons.

                  Then you follow that up with trading Sabonis (and maybe someone like Lamb or other filler) for a guard with range. If you can magically find someone who happens to be quick and a competent wing defender, even better. That gives you a core (when healthy) front court of Warren/Simmons/Turner and Guard X.

                  Edit: Someone like Tyrese Haliburton would be a dream if he could continue to progress and stay healthy, but Hield would be a decent backup option if you need to focus specifically on shooting.

                  Depending on how that goes down, you figure out how to fill that other starter spot over the next season and a half.

                  By keeping Turner instead of Sabonis, you’re prioritizing defense - like KP has said they want to get back to - and keeping spacing (if Turner can regain his reliable outside shooting) around Simmons.

                  Its drastically different than any Pacers team we’ve seen recently, but it would be a welcome change in my opinion.
                  Last edited by indyman37; 09-22-2021, 11:42 PM.
                  I think KP is a Captain Planet fan. He believes that the collective will of five decent starters can outweigh the power of top-level talent. Too bad Herb won't cut the check for their Planeteer rings.

                  Comment


                  • I look at trading for Simmons completely different than most people do. I don't view it as a risk because risk would imply we are risking something and IMO this current Pacers team, just like the 5-6 previous ones before it, is not a contender for anything other than maybe the playoffs. We might win a couple of games in the playoffs and that would be a vast improvement over what we have been but still it is nothing in the grand scheme of things.

                    Simmons would go one of two ways, he would either get here and accept being here and thrive out of the bright spotlight of the Philly and E.C. press and we could build around him to eventually become at least EC finals contenders in a couple of years. Or he would pout about being here, not thrive and in a couple of years be forced to trade him and in the mean time we either lose in the first round, play in game or maybe not make the playoffs at all. What really is different about that than the past 6 years?

                    We have got to, IMO, break this cycle of continually getting mid level players and trying to build a team around that and actually with a straight face say we are going to beat Giannis or Durrant or other star driven teams in the playoffs. Simmons would either be a superstar to compete with them or he would not. If he is great, if the cost of getting him is just moving several B level players and a couple of low level picks. If he's not, then again if all you do is move a couple of middling starters and a couple of low level picks what would be different than what it would be right now?

                    Now I wouldn't throw everything at them. But I would put Warren, Brogdan, LaVert, Duarte all on the table and say pick two. I'd give them 2 first round picks. Then yes I would let them choose between Myles and Domas. They would want them not to keep them but to flip them for something better which I would assume would be Sabonis.

                    Yes it would suck to lose Sabonis but like I have been saying, this team as designed is not going anywhere anyway so I would be willing to take a risk.

                    Now what I wouldn't do is give them a ton of unprotected first round picks or even pick swaps. There is every chance Simmons would fail here and we would need those to recover.


                    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by Peck View Post
                      I look at trading for Simmons completely different than most people do. I don't view it as a risk because risk would imply we are risking something and IMO this current Pacers team, just like the 5-6 previous ones before it, is not a contender for anything other than maybe the playoffs. We might win a couple of games in the playoffs and that would be a vast improvement over what we have been but still it is nothing in the grand scheme of things.

                      Simmons would go one of two ways, he would either get here and accept being here and thrive out of the bright spotlight of the Philly and E.C. press and we could build around him to eventually become at least EC finals contenders in a couple of years. Or he would pout about being here, not thrive and in a couple of years be forced to trade him and in the mean time we either lose in the first round, play in game or maybe not make the playoffs at all. What really is different about that than the past 6 years?

                      We have got to, IMO, break this cycle of continually getting mid level players and trying to build a team around that and actually with a straight face say we are going to beat Giannis or Durrant or other star driven teams in the playoffs. Simmons would either be a superstar to compete with them or he would not. If he is great, if the cost of getting him is just moving several B level players and a couple of low level picks. If he's not, then again if all you do is move a couple of middling starters and a couple of low level picks what would be different than what it would be right now?

                      Now I wouldn't throw everything at them. But I would put Warren, Brogdan, LaVert, Duarte all on the table and say pick two. I'd give them 2 first round picks. Then yes I would let them choose between Myles and Domas. They would want them not to keep them but to flip them for something better which I would assume would be Sabonis.

                      Yes it would suck to lose Sabonis but like I have been saying, this team as designed is not going anywhere anyway so I would be willing to take a risk.

                      Now what I wouldn't do is give them a ton of unprotected first round picks or even pick swaps. There is every chance Simmons would fail here and we would need those to recover.
                      I feel the need to ask this, because the wording isn't too clear..
                      You'd give how many of Warren, Brogdon, LeVert, and Duarte? You mean just one of them plus a big and picks, correct?

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by Ichi View Post

                        I feel the need to ask this, because the wording isn't too clear..
                        You'd give how many of Warren, Brogdon, LeVert, and Duarte? You mean just one of them plus a big and picks, correct?
                        No, I would give them two of them, plus a big plus two picks.


                        Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by Peck View Post

                          No, I would give them two of them, plus a big plus two picks.
                          Oof idk. If they chose Brogdon and Duarte, we're a horrible team without the benefit of a first rounder imo. I don't see Ben Simmons/Domas being easy to build around, nor either of them attracting others to Indiana. I think that package can get you more I guess.

                          I don't see how a team can survive having 4 major minute getters being TJ McC, LeVert, Sabonis, and (especially) Simmons. That's a pure offensive disaster waiting to happen. Not even LeBron/Magic level of playmaking can save that group.

                          Bottom Line: If you think Simmons has Superstar or at least 1B on a championship team potential, and willing to play in Indiana, you probably do the deal I guess. I don't think he does though, even if I am interested in him.

                          Comment


                          • Originally posted by Ichi View Post

                            Oof idk. If they chose Brogdon and Duarte, we're a horrible team without the benefit of a first rounder imo. I don't see Ben Simmons/Domas being easy to build around, nor either of them attracting others to Indiana. I think that package can get you more I guess.

                            I don't see how a team can survive having 4 major minute getters being TJ McC, LeVert, Sabonis, and (especially) Simmons. That's a pure offensive disaster waiting to happen. Not even LeBron/Magic level of playmaking can save that group.

                            Bottom Line: If you think Simmons has Superstar or at least 1B on a championship team potential, and willing to play in Indiana, you probably do the deal I guess. I don't think he does though, even if I am interested in him.
                            I don't know if he does or does not. My theory is that the team as it stands is at best and I mean a best a first round exit with maybe a game or two in the win column. Next season, minus some earth shattering trade or star player addition (however either trade or draft) we are at best a first round exit with maybe a win or two. The year after that? Wash, Rinse, Repeat.

                            We are on a treadmill to nowhere and no I am not sure Simmons gets us off of it. However we have got to get rid of some of this middling talent that is not good enough to win anything yet to good to lose enough to get a upper lottery pick.

                            I don't care if we do Simmons or Kat or something else. I am just sick of this 7 year, about to be 8, mediocre merry go round.

                            To clarify. I don't particularly want Ben Simmons, however I do believe he is probably better than any player we currently have minus maybe and I mean maybe Sabonis.
                            I just want to see the direction of the team change. I'm beyond done with being a team who has not upward trajectory.


                            Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

                            Comment


                            • As Peck said you don't do a Simmons deal to get better this year you do it as part of a plan to be legitimately relevant in a couple of years. No matter who is or isn't included in any deal Simmons is better than everyone currently on this team and it isn't even close.

                              Would be great to leverage the situation and keep any 1st rounders included to one. Honestly the most "untouchable" Pacer in this situation might be Duarte. Really feels like he will be the type of player that would thrive playing off of Simmons unique skill set.

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by CableKC View Post
                                If Simmons doesn't like Morey because of a fairly harmless tweet, that's a pretty petty and stupid reason to dislike someone from a business and personal POV.
                                that tweet was from a joke account

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