Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

[speakout4]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

I would take Snyder over Irsay in a heartbeat...... ...

I would still take Luck over RGIII and saw nothing today to change my opinion.

You will never find anything about our team that is better than any other team. You're talking redskins for godsakes. We have outperformed them over the last decade by miles but to listen to you they are perennially in the superbowl with their brilliant owner who is known as a fool. Compare Irsay to Snyder for the decade and the entire redskin fan base would take Irsay. Have you found an expert to say Snyder is a smarter or better owner?

[Swingman]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

I'm with you. I thought he would be a complete afterthought. I'm surprised. He's got a serious case for making it, particularly with the Collie sitch...unless they acquire a WR. Certainly can't feel confident about Avery. Sure he could recapture his short lived Rams success, but that has to be considered a longshot.

huh? I thought Avery looked pretty good.

[Coopdog23]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

The O Line was the reason the offense looked bad.

[Basketball Fan]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

Eagles cut Kevin Thomas today. Bring him back.

It was given he'll come back we like Eagles leftovers

This game didn't tell us anything about either QB to be honest it did tell me the Colts O-Line is terrible though and the Pass D not so great either but what else is new

We need to keep Luck upright if the Colts are going to do anything.

[Sollozzo]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

I don't know what you are watching but RGIII has completely outplayed Luck in this game. He has shown a cannon of an arm although he didn't connect on those passes, he showed it to the Colts and that opens up many things for him.

Luck, playing with a poor line against a good defense: 14/23, 151 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT, 60.8%, 6.6 YPA, 94.7 rating

RGIII playing with a solid line against a soft defense: 11/17, 74 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT, 64.7%, 4.3 YPA, 93.8 rating

I don't see how in the world you can say that "RGIII completely outplayed Luck". Both were good, but the statistical evidence says that Luck played a better game. The only thing RGIII beat Luck in was completion percentage, yet Luck still managed to average two more yards per passing attempt. But I'm supposed to think that RGIII played a better game because he threw some long bombs that were incomplete? Any NFL quarterback can throw some long incomplete passes. The fact that you have to use long incomplete passes to back up your assertion that RGIII was better shows that RGIII didn't beat Luck in the stats that actually matter.

If Luck had RGIII's offensive line then he would have completely outclassed RGIII.

[OlBlu]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

Luck, playing with a poor line against a good defense: 14/23, 151 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT, 60.8%, 6.6 YPA, 98.3 rating

RGIII playing with a solid line against a soft defense: 11/17, 74 yards, 1 TD, 0 INT, 64.7%, 4.3 YPA, 93.7 rating

I don't see how in the world you can say that "RGIII completely outplayed Luck". Both were good, but the statistical evidence says that Luck played a better game. The only thing RGIII beat Luck in was completion percentage, yet Luck still managed to average two more yards per passing attempt. But I'm supposed to think that RGIII played a better game because he threw some long bombs that were incomplete? Any NFL quarterback can throw some long incomplete passes. The fact that you have to use long incomplete passes to back up your assertion that RGIII was better shows that RGIII didn't beat Luck in the stats that actually matter.

If Luck had RGIII's offensive line then he would have completely outclassed RGIII.

That difference in the offensive line is my whole point. Luck has not shown me that he can throw a long ball to keep the defense honest. RGIII has a cannon and he will hit some homeruns with Garcon this year. I was only repeating what Theisman and the other commentators said. I am sure you and many others here just turned the sound off so that they would not be able to hear something they did not want to hear. Luck throws a whole lot of quick 7 to 10 yard passes because he is under pressure. The receivers, as Theisman noted don't even try to get deep. Could that be because Luck just can't make that 50 yard pass like
Sims and Parcells claim or is it because he just doesn't have the time to wait for his receives to get open deep? I think it is the latter but since I have never seen him try to hit a long pass, who knows. Your stats are meaningless. You have one QB running for his life and making short passes before he gets clobbered wile the other QB airs it out once in a while to show the defense what they must fear in the long ball. RGIII was making plays that moved his team down the field much better than Luck did. But, you only look at stats and don't really watch the game. Washington could beat Indy with their second team offense.......

[OlBlu]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

It was given he'll come back we like Eagles leftovers

This game didn't tell us anything about either QB to be honest it did tell me the Colts O-Line is terrible though and the Pass D not so great either but what else is new

We need to keep Luck upright if the Colts are going to do anything.

That is my biggest worry. I know this will catch hell from the home crowd but Luck could have saved himself a lot of pain and aggravation if he has pulled an Eli Manning and just let it be known that he would not play for the Colts. Some team with a good offensive line would have traded up to take him and he might have had a chance to stay upright. That won't happen in Indy and he is risking his career playing behind an awful offensive line. The Giants traded up to get Eli giving San Diego Phillip Rivers and a boat load of goodies. Eli came into the league and played behind a very good offensive line and he has since won two Super Bowls. Luck may never stay healthy long enough to ever get to the playoffs. But, if he has a career ending injury, maybe Jimmy will take care of him... Right...

[Sollozzo]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

But, you only look at stats and don't really watch the game.

I watched the game and Luck looked more impressive when you consider how quickly he had to release the ball. There is nothing wrong with looking at stats to backup an opinion. The stats show what we watched yesterday, which is that Luck was overall a slightly more efficient passer than RGIII. I didn't hear Thiesman because I was in a bar where they didn't have the sound on.

Did you miss the long incomplete bomb that Luck threw to Wayne when the Colts had a free play because of a penalty? It looks to me like he has plenty of arm strength to chuck it far if he wants to.

[OlBlu]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

I would still take Luck over RGIII and saw nothing today to change my opinion.

You will never find anything about our team that is better than any other team. You're talking redskins for godsakes. We have outperformed them over the last decade by miles but to listen to you they are perennially in the superbowl with their brilliant owner who is known as a fool. Compare Irsay to Snyder for the decade and the entire redskin fan base would take Irsay. Have you found an expert to say Snyder is a smarter or better owner?

I think you would find many experts who believe that Irsay, not Snyder is the worst owner in the NFL but I have not read a comparison anywhere to provide you with a quote. I do not believe what you say about the Redskin fan base that is a hard core following not the bandwagon fans the Colts have. So, Snyder goes out and signs expensive free agents, the Colts couldn't begin to afford to play in the toughest division in the NFL.... I don't disagree with you about Luck and RGIII, yet. It is the preseason and so far all we know is that the Colts have no offensive line and a terrible pass defense. Luck is running for his life on just about every play and he will get sacked a lot and hit hard. RGIII took one very hard hit but, in general, he offensive line gave him time to throw.... This is why I believe it will take at least five years of horrible losing before the Colts can even begin to compete with the Redskins. I am sure that Washington could beat the Colts with their backup offense. I'm not so sure they could not beat them with the backup defense too but that isn't completely clear. The Colts are in for a long hard year and a big dose of reality and I really do hope that I am wrong about all of that..... By the way, I looked at some Redskin forums and their fans think they got the best QB in the draft and that Luck will never live up to the hype and his arm does not compare to RGIII. I know, I know, they are just excited about their team just like the Colts are about theirs.....

[xBulletproof]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

I like how he keeps saying over and over that Luck can't throw a 50 yard pass, even though he threw one yesterday. Then he claims that someone else didn't actually watch the game. Of course, we also saw his 70 yard throw into the wind at his workout.

I've never seen someone so hard headed and dense in my life.

[OlBlu]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

I watched the game and Luck looked more impressive when you consider how quickly he had to release the ball. There is nothing wrong with looking at stats to backup an opinion. The stats show what we watched yesterday, which is that Luck was overall a slightly more efficient passer than RGIII. I didn't hear Thiesman because I was in a bar where they didn't have the sound on.

Did you miss the long incomplete bomb that Luck threw to Wayne when the Colts had a free play because of a penalty? It looks to me like he has plenty of arm strength to chuck it far if he wants to.

That was the first throw where he has shown NFL arm strength but he wasn't close with it. RGIII aired it out a couple of times and had it on Garcon's finger tips. I keep pointing out that if you are throwing a bunch of five to seven yard passes, you should have a good percentage. I saw RGIII moving the ball downfield just about at will and hitting passes wherever he wanted. I am not surprised that you didn't hear the call of the game or you might have some different opinions. The commentators clearly thought that RGIII had the best of the matchup and that Luck was merely trying to escape the rush with no attempt to really get the ball downfield. In fact, Theisman said that the Colts receivers were not even trying to get down field. I think that is the result of playing against a good NFL defense and a bad offensive line. The commentators mention that too. I don't think you will have to worry. I don't see any way that Luck plays 16 games behind that line this year without getting severely injured (neither did the commentators). I saw RGIII get hit hard once but I think he has a chance to play all 16 games behind a pretty good veteran line. But when it really comes down to it, I think it is against the odds for most NFL QBs to play the season without injury even with the new rules. I think that percentage goes way up for a rookie QB playing behind what is probably the worst offensive line in the NFL.... But, you have to actually watch the game closely to see that......

[xBulletproof]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

Also, by the way, I'm in general irked at how many people think arm strength, equals a major trait towards being a good QB.

If that's the case, Michael Vick should be twice the QB of Peyton Manning. Vick could probably throw it behind his back harder than Peyton could throw normal. It doesn't mean a thing. Yet, he isn't a better QB and never has been, because arm strength doesn't amount to much if it's not catchable, and on target. A smart QB sees things happen before they do, and is able to start his throwing motion earlier than other QB's so the arm strength advantage is negated by the timing of release.

In the NFL being smart, and accurate trumps arm strength. Even Chad Pennington carved out a decent NFL career on those traits, and he threw like a 12 year old girl throwing a softball.

[Ace E.Anderson]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

That difference in the offensive line is my whole point. Luck has not shown me that he can throw a long ball to keep the defense honest. RGIII has a cannon and he will hit some homeruns with Garcon this year. I was only repeating what Theisman and the other commentators said. I am sure you and many others here just turned the sound off so that they would not be able to hear something they did not want to hear. Luck throws a whole lot of quick 7 to 10 yard passes because he is under pressure. The receivers, as Theisman noted don't even try to get deep. Could that be because Luck just can't make that 50 yard pass like
Sims and Parcells claim or is it because he just doesn't have the time to wait for his receives to get open deep? I think it is the latter but since I have never seen him try to hit a long pass, who knows. Your stats are meaningless. You have one QB running for his life and making short passes before he gets clobbered wile the other QB airs it out once in a while to show the defense what they must fear in the long ball. RGIII was making plays that moved his team down the field much better than Luck did. But, you only look at stats and don't really watch the game. Washington could beat Indy with their second team offense.......

What doesn't make sense is the fact that you continue to say that Luck was dinking and dunking while Griffin was airing it out in spite of the fact that Luck had more yards and yards per attempt! Outside of the 3 bombs that weren't even close, all of Griffins completions were under 15 yards. Luck completed several passes over 15 yards including one over 30 yards for a TD. And that was with the line playing as bad as they did.

[Ace E.Anderson]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

Also, by the way, I'm in general irked at how many people think arm strength, equals a major trait towards being a good QB.

If that's the case, Michael Vick should be twice the QB of Peyton Manning. Vick could probably throw it behind his back harder than Peyton could throw normal. It doesn't mean a thing. Yet, he isn't a better QB and never has been, because arm strength doesn't amount to much if it's not catchable, and on target. A smart QB sees things happen before they do, and is able to start his throwing motion earlier than other QB's so the arm strength advantage is negated by the timing of release.

In the NFL being smart, and accurate trumps arm strength. Even Chad Pennington carved out a decent NFL career on those traits, and he threw like a 12 year old girl throwing a softball.

Arm strength does make things easier. You don't have to be as precise with your timing or accuracy. It's similar to having elite athleticism in basketball. It just makes the game easier.

With that said accuracy and anticipation are two skills that trump arm strength everytime.

[Sollozzo]

Re: Luck vs Griffin - let it begin.

I think you would find many experts who believe that Irsay, not Snyder is the worst owner in the NFL but I have not read a comparison anywhere to provide you with a quote.

There's no quote because no one has ever said that.

I get that you will always be bent at Irsay because he cut Peyton, but calling him the worst owner in the NFL is just silly. Look how the Colts have flourished since 1997 when he took over. Beautiful new stadium in the heart of the city. Brilliant marketing all over the state which built up the fan base. A great on the field product for most of the years that he has been owner. Two Super Bowl appearances, one victory. Having the presence of mind to let football people (Polian, Grigson) do the legwork.

I'm not trying to say he's the best owner in football or anything like that. But he has had a very successful track record since becoming owner in 1997. What about the Dolphins owner? The Panthers? The Jags? The Browns? The Bengals? The Rams? The Seahawks? Give me Irsay any day over whoever owns those Mickey Mouse franchises.

The Colts have had a high payroll for the bulk of the years that Irsay has been owner. He puts his money where his mouth is.