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ESPN: Andrew Luck retiring

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  • Originally posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
    And Jacoby walks right into it.
    And this is a contract year for him. If he's EVER going to take that next step - this would certainly be the time to do it. But something tells me he's simply a good backup to have on the roster.

    Prove me wrong #7.

    Comment


    • Dan Dakich (a huge blowhard, admittedly), was on the Dan Patrick show this morning. He said that the narrative about Luck taking a beating all of these years has to be tempered by the fact (he claims, anyway) that Luck's shoulder injury, that injury caused him to miss a season and was a big part of this 4 year cycle of pain and rehab, was caused by a snowboarding accident. Dan said this was common knowledge in Indy. First I have ever heard of it. If true, does that change anything?

      I respect Luck and don't begrudge anybody the right to step away, millions in your pocket, with your wits about you and the possibility of decent health in the rest of your life. That goes for 29-year-old Gronk retiring or 29-year-old Luck. And the timing was likely delayed by the Colts, not by Luck, trying to convince him to stay and trying to sell season tickets.

      I also think that Jacoby Brissett has more than enough ability, class, character, and worth ethic to be a solid starter. Pro bowler? No. scrub? No. Smart competitor who accepts coaching? Yes. Would I rather have him than a healthy Luck? No. Would I rather have him than Dak Prescott? I say YES. Similar attributes, IMO.

      I am biased, since Jacoby grew up in my neighborhood and I have known him since he was a 9 year old Cub Scout, but I am pulling for him to succeed. like crazy. And that's coming from a Patriots fan.
      The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!).

      Comment


      • Originally posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
        Dan Dakich (a huge blowhard, admittedly), was on the Dan Patrick show this morning. He said that the narrative about Luck taking a beating all of these years has to be tempered by the fact (he claims, anyway) that Luck's shoulder injury, that injury caused him to miss a season and was a big part of this 4 year cycle of pain and rehab, was caused by a snowboarding accident. Dan said this was common knowledge in Indy. First I have ever heard of it. If true, does that change anything?

        I respect Luck and don't begrudge anybody the right to step away, millions in your pocket, with your wits about you and the possibility of decent health in the rest of your life. That goes for 29-year-old Gronk retiring or 29-year-old Luck. And the timing was likely delayed by the Colts, not by Luck, trying to convince him to stay and trying to sell season tickets.

        I also think that Jacoby Brissett has more than enough ability, class, character, and worth ethic to be a solid starter. Pro bowler? No. scrub? No. Smart competitor who accepts coaching? Yes. Would I rather have him than a healthy Luck? No. Would I rather have him than Dak Prescott? I say YES. Similar attributes, IMO.

        I am biased, since Jacoby grew up in my neighborhood and I have known him since he was a 9 year old Cub Scout, but I am pulling for him to succeed. like crazy. And that's coming from a Patriots fan.
        Of course the Colts were going to try to convince their 29 year old QB to not retire. Who wouldnít? But at the end of the day, Luck could have announced this at any time on his own, so he was complicit in the timing.

        JMV had an awesome show yesterday that Iíve listed to in bits and pieces. The podcast is on 1070ís page. Heís very objective. Acknowledges that itís Luckís decision and that none of us know how he feels, but also said that we canít ignore the horrible timing and shocking nature of the decision which has let down a lot of people (teammates, coaches, the franchise, advertisers, fans, etc).

        Kevin Bowen (Colts reporter) was on one of the segments. Said itís just jaw dropping how Luck got taped up on Aug 17 and threw balls (after doing some leg drills - this video is on the the PatsFootballTalk article from August 17), then at the start of the week heís all of the sudden in retirement mode. Bowen said he knew something was up when Luck was back to not doing anything on Tuesday after throwing on Saturday at the stadium. He just questioned why in the world heíd be getting taped up and throwing in front of thousands of people when heís already made the mental decision that heís going to retire because of the physical toll of the sport. I agree - so bizarre.

        It wasnít really a good look for Luck to talk about the enjoyment of throwing balls a week ago at Lucas Oil one more time - as if it was a childís game of catch - in the same press conference where he is retiring because of the physical drain.

        I get that throwing the ball around the field isnít the same as playing a 16 week season, but this was caught on video and Luckís legs looked pretty fluid. It just leads to a giant ďWTF?Ē reaction from fans.

        (The Peter King article this morning which PatsFootballTalk linked to said Luck told Irsay/Reich/Ballard on Monday)

        Iím already tired of the holier-than-thou national media who have gone with the narrative of ďitís his life, donít question any of it and shut upĒ. Golic and Wingo were incredibly obnoxious this morning. Also, The overreaction to the booing has jumped the shark. For starters, it was at most a couple thousand people (I think less than that even) near the tunnel. Itís getting painted out to be the entire stadium of 65,000 people pelting Luck with trash as he left the field. Furthermore, this was a totally shocking and unprecedented way for a retirement news to break....and fans were frustrated at all the BS theyíve been fed. Florioís column on this was spot on.
        Last edited by Sollozzo; 08-26-2019, 04:29 PM.

        Comment


        • Originally posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
          Dan Dakich (a huge blowhard, admittedly), was on the Dan Patrick show this morning. He said that the narrative about Luck taking a beating all of these years has to be tempered by the fact (he claims, anyway) that Luck's shoulder injury, that injury caused him to miss a season and was a big part of this 4 year cycle of pain and rehab, was caused by a snowboarding accident. Dan said this was common knowledge in Indy. First I have ever heard of it. If true, does that change anything?
          I don't think it ever was officially revealed, but it's definitely at least been rumored that the shoulder injury either was initially from snowboarding or he suffered a setback with it from snowboarding that then led to the surgery when surgery wasn't initially on the table.
          Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

          ------

          "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

          -John Wooden

          Comment


          • I don't think it's wrong for fans to be upset. I do think the timing really sucked, because the fans didn't have time to process and they let out their frustrations on the one person they could see while he was walking off. This is a jarring situation. I'd like to believe given a chance to sit on it that they'd not boo, because it's a poor look. And I do think it's only a few fans that have done that.

            Luck is entitled to do what he feels is best. To suggest he was going to retire in March is silly because I don't think he was close to planning that. But once this leg injury persisted, I think it came back to did he want to go through the rehab he suffered through in 2017, and the answer turned out to be a definite no. I don't think he wanted to retire and I think he loves football. But Luck is wired differently than other football players - he doesn't need it like the rest. He's a smart man who has the skills to be successful outside of football. Why suffer longterm damage?
            Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.

            Comment


            • Originally posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
              Dan Dakich (a huge blowhard, admittedly), was on the Dan Patrick show this morning. He said that the narrative about Luck taking a beating all of these years has to be tempered by the fact (he claims, anyway) that Luck's shoulder injury, that injury caused him to miss a season and was a big part of this 4 year cycle of pain and rehab, was caused by a snowboarding accident. Dan said this was common knowledge in Indy. First I have ever heard of it. If true, does that change anything?
              .
              Luck actually made a passing comment about it once in effect saying he was not going to do that again. The other part of this weird situation is the taping up and showing everyone
              he could still function pretty well. That is really strange. What was the purpose? It sure fooled all the fans and most everyone else.
              Bottom line he is not mentally into football and so time to step away.

              {o,o}
              |)__)
              -"-"-

              Comment


              • Originally posted by Suaveness View Post
                I don't think it's wrong for fans to be upset. I do think the timing really sucked, because the fans didn't have time to process and they let out their frustrations on the one person they could see while he was walking off. This is a jarring situation. I'd like to believe given a chance to sit on it that they'd not boo, because it's a poor look. And I do think it's only a few fans that have done that.

                Luck is entitled to do what he feels is best. To suggest he was going to retire in March is silly because I don't think he was close to planning that. But once this leg injury persisted, I think it came back to did he want to go through the rehab he suffered through in 2017, and the answer turned out to be a definite no. I don't think he wanted to retire and I think he loves football. But Luck is wired differently than other football players - he doesn't need it like the rest. He's a smart man who has the skills to be successful outside of football. Why suffer longterm damage?

                The problem is that the Colts and Luck communicate next to nothing to the fans about this situation for months (coming on the heels of poor communication in prior years)......then WHAMO, it breaks during the middle of the game.

                From the fans' perspective, they saw Luck have the best season of his career last year with a complete team. He played every game and we had a great line with a strong head coach/GM combo. Then he plays the pro bowl after the season. All seems well until we hear about the calf issue. Of course we really don't know a single thing about it (when did it happen, what's the latest prognosis, etc), so fans' minds start to wonder. It lingered all off-season and into training camp and pretty much all we ever got from the team and Luck was a bunch of gibberish. I get that there are medical privacy issues, but most players/teams are more forthright in releasing details of an injury, treatments, and timetables. How did the injury happen? What have the doctors been saying? When was the last time a doctor looked at it? What is the prognosis? Could he suit up if he really wanted to? No one knows any of this, so people start jumping to conclusions. Human nature.

                Then just a week after getting taped up and throwing some balls around on film (with his legs moving fluidly), he retires. And he talks about how he knew at the time that it was probably his last time throwing at LOS. So he gets captured looking physically fine on video and talks about how enjoyable that was, as if it was a friendly came of backyard catch....then proceeds to talk about how he's retiring for physical reasons. WTF? But we still really don't have any specifics at all as to what happened. Not that we are necessarily owed any, because as you say, it is his decision. But it's just human nature for people's minds to wander.

                This isn't just any quarterback either. We freaking cut Peyton Manning for this guy. This highly disappointing ending after just 7 years is what we cut Peyton Manning for? This is what we get for cutting Manning so that he could appear in a couple of Super Bowls and win an MVP elsewhere? Cutting Manning now goes down as one of the worst NFL decisions of all time and I'm sure no one is more aware of that than Irsay. So not only are we losing a franchise QB, but we're losing the QB who we cut one of the top 3 all time QB's for. Haunting.

                I'm also sick and tired of the national media acting like the Colts are some garabge NFL franchise who ruined Luck. Yes, Luck came here to a weak roster. Yes, Grigson was terrible. But all of that was finally fixed. He played every game last year behind a solid offensive line. Even though the Colts got a lot of positive press last year for their improved roster, now its fun to go with the narrative that Luck was leaving a franchise that is just total trash and did nothing to surround him with anything. And while the line was awful early on, let's not act like Luck doesn't deserve some blame for not learning early on how to make quick releases or throw the ball away.

                Luck is the main reason Luck retired. Wish obnoxious talking heads would stop acting like all would be fine if he played anywhere but Indy.

                I had PTI on for a few seconds earlier and Kornheiser was going on some pious holier-than-thou rant about how he won't consider Indy if he was an NFL FA because of the booing. What a load of absolute crap. As I said, this was a couple thousand MAX (and maybe more in the hundreds if you really listen to it), and these were fans who had just received retirement news in the most shocking setting ever, AFTER being fed a load of crap by the team and Luck for months about all of this. It was a human reaction by hundreds of people that's being treated as if 65,000 fans were throwing beer and popcorn at Luck like Detroit fans did to the Pacers' players when they were leaving the floor after the brawl.

                I do feel bad for Reich and Ballard. I think they've had to be on pins and needles with what they've been able to say to the media because of what Luck's camp wanted out there.
                Last edited by Sollozzo; 08-26-2019, 06:18 PM.

                Comment


                • Originally posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
                  Alright, so I've had a few days to marinate on this, and here's where I'm at, based on what we know right now.

                  Obviously, y'all know I love this guy as a player and person. I wish to GOD that he was still our QB. It hurts like hell to think that we're going forward without Andrew Luck. Dammit. What could've been. That's what will be the lasting sentiment for me.

                  Heís an incredible quarterback, an incredible person, and we were lucky to have him for 7 years on this team. I could extol his virtues, and have done so, for days and years, I will continue to discuss how great of a quarterback he was forever.

                  I understand and respect that itís his decision and heís entitled to do what he wants with his life. Totally get it. I wish him the best, and Iím real curious to see what he does beyond this.
                  I respect the decision, because he *was* banged around for 4-5 years. I was tooting the "our oline sucks" mantra months before it was the cool topic.

                  But dammit... I'm disappointed. As much as I've supported this guy over the years.... his body language and words while he was going through his shoulder-injury had me concerned not about his physical condition, but his mental. He was mostly being positive, saying strong things, but it sometimes felt forcedÖ. And then he'd sort of validate my concern by sprinkling in stuff like "I was in a dark place" and "thought about retiring" and what-not... my thoughts then were "Woah, that's not the mentality you want to hear from a guy like this". Paul George snapped his leg in half in front of the world, and you never once heard a negative phrase out of his mouth, it was nothing but "I'm going to come back 1000% and kick the world's ***" and that was exactly what I wanted to hear.

                  Look.... I totally understand getting a little down through an injury... and getting married and having a kid, it can put you in a different mental state, make things seem less important --- but we ALL go through that. He's far from the first guy to go through a tough injury, or get married or have a kid.
                  You can do those things, and I mean focus whole-heartedly on them, without completely throwing away other legacies. Now, if your heart just wasn't into football, then I get it, do something else. But this was Andrew Luck, man. He's expressed so much love for the game, and love for playing the game, and appreciation for the history of the game --- Football was not a small part of his life.
                  So to all of a sudden say that the love was no longer there, there's something going on upstairs there that makes me believe there's a bit of depression or something. Because this was just a calf injury, it was going to recover. And he "just started thinking about retirement two weeks ago". I'm sorry, but that's a fairly rushed decision. In the grand scheme of things, you have to let these things shake out longer than 2 weeks, because things can change drastically in a few days.
                  It all seems to me that he just got into a bit of a mental rut and acted pretty rashly, to be honest, and that's also not like Andrew Luck. It almost seems like, "this calf thing is annoying, and I'm recently married, and got a kid, my mind isn't exactly focused on football --- thatís it, I'm walking away." Just seems rushed. Again, this is a scenario that I'm guessing a majority of us mere mortals have all been through, likely more than once.

                  The mysteriousness of how some of his recoveries in years past went was a bit frustrating. He was so damn private, it almost seemed as if even our management wasn't being communicated to throughout his recovery process. They almost seemed as out of the loop as us. That's frustrating.
                  And then this whole "I'm only playing if I'm 100%" thing.... Man, that's life. I wake up 363 days a year basically not feeling 100%. Some days itís more like 40-50% --- Most of us do. If I waited to do anything until I felt 100%, I'd be doing something a total of two days a year. I go through most days of my life getting a **** ton done feeling far less than 100%.

                  So, all that said, I guess I wrap up that vein with this: Itís his life, he can do as he pleasesÖ. But there's a bit of mental fortitude there that I would've liked to see.

                  ---
                  He also just came off a fantastic season. He looked not only like Andrew Luck of old, but a *happy* Andrew Luck.
                  He went into the off-season for the first time with NO injuries, and was quoted as saying for the first time he felt great and could focus on resting and then focusing on football and not rehab.

                  He played in the Pro Bowl, looked fine, and then a month later, his ankle was all jacked up. What happened?

                  Also, there were things that werenít in place his first five years that I whole-heartedly agree were negative factors --- the team wasnít great, the o line wasnít great, our offensive system --- not great. Luck had reasons to be frustrated. I guess I wouldíve understood it more had he retired the last year of Grigsonís tenure, because that was a bad scenario all around.
                  But dammit, weíve fixed all that! This o line is strong now. The team talent is way higher all around. We have receivers. The GM is worlds better. Weíre setup great with draft assets and cap space and our future looked amazing.

                  So to recap... Andrew was fixed... the o-line was fixed... management is fixed... team is fixed...

                  And he walked away.

                  ---
                  The fans boo'd him. They're getting a lot of flack about it. It's been almost the biggest talking point on the entire thing. Here's my take on that --- yes, it wasn't nice.
                  But it also was understandable. This fan base (Indianapolis) has been through more **** than most fan bases in the last 15 years. Starting with The Brawl, and then Manning's injury, and then Paul George's snapped leg, and then PG bailing on us, and then Oladipo shredding his knee, and now Luck ducking out. I canít think of a city that has had so much freakiní trauma/disappointment thrown on them, and most of these events occurring just as a championship window was opening up or we were projected to be a contender.

                  Just like Paul George, this community invested a lot of support to Luck, and patienceÖ. And now both of these guys have walked on us.
                  And then you throw in Luck did this two weeks before the season started! Not only that, but news broke as we watched him on the sidelines, all of us thinking he's almost back. Again, thereís a timing factor to all of this. This was a team that had SB aspirations. Everything was lined up for a great run this year. And we were getting ready to get it started.

                  And poof ---- Gone. Thatís a huge, vital rug being yanked from under our feet. Itís frustrating and disappointing.

                  So it wasnít right, but itís also understandable. A caller on Sirius this morning equated this situation to a guy having a girlfriend dump him out of the blue when there was no problems. The initial reaction may not be a proud one, and they likely regret it, but at the time thereís no time to process anything rationally, itís almost all emotional. It was understandable, not pretty, but itís a human response.

                  This city loves Andrew, and I donít think they were booíing himÖ maybe just the situation, or his decision, and the timing of it. And I donít think itís out of line in that context. Fans are fans, they arenít always rational. Fandom can be more emotional than intellectual, and that sometimes is a reality, things arenít always pretty.
                  I think Andrew should realize that heís loved by the city of Indianapolis, and while weíre not happy with it, we respect the decision and wish him the best. Most of the people slamming the fans of Indiana didn't just have their young, star QB retire 2 weeks before the season. I can guarantee there would've been similar reactions from almost any fan base.

                  Thereís a sliver of hope in me that some point down the line, he realizes maybe he misses the game and gets his mind right and decides to come back and weíd welcome him back with open arms.

                  ---
                  So for now itís the Jacoby Brissett show. Lotta question marks. He could be good, he could not be good, we don't know. He's shown some promise, he's shown that he's not on the same level, but that was two years ago, and it's a contract year for him. I think we may have just enough team around him where we can still be a good playoff team. Itís pretty obvious that weíve stepped downwards a bit at the QB position, but that was reality with anybody replacing Luck. About the only 4 guys we couldíve subbed him for were Brady, Brees, Mahomes, and Rodgers without missing a beat.

                  Itís all we can do now is to support Jacoby. He has a tremendousÖ TREMENDOUSÖ opportunity in front of him, because like I said, Andrew just walked away from a helluva strong situation. And Jacoby walks right into it.
                  Given your support/defense of Luck throughout - something I never disagree with, although nor was I 100% convinced of either - this is a really heartfelt post. It honestly sums up my ambivalence about the Luck situation/announcement quite nicely. I think highly of him as a person an a player. I recognize and respect that he has a unique outlook compared to the average football player. But I can't help but wonder what could've been and why he wouldn't want to ride it out for a chance at a level of success he has never achieved as a professional player and we have never achieved as a franchise outside 2006.
                  I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

                  -Emiliano Zapata

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                  • Honestly, it's really too bad Luck got booed. Clearly, you don't want that for him despite the disappointment and the far from ideal timing of the leak that he was set to retire. But anyone anywhere who's trying to spin this as the classless Indy fans or organization are full of ****. Luck made a decision that was the right thing for him, but also would massively disappoint and shock an entire fan base. If he and/or the media can't accept it would engender some (limited) negative emotions/feedback, then they need a reality check. I wouldn't have booed him personally, but it is what it is. He's a big boy. It's not fair, but you have to hope a grown man knows life isn't always fair.

                    EDIT: And I have great respect for Luck the person. He was composed, professional, intelligent. I was proud to have him as a person represent the team and the city. Ideally, he doesn't deserve the booing. But it's far from unheard of in these sports situation. Burning LeBron jerseys in Cleveland comes to mind.
                    Last edited by D-BONE; 08-26-2019, 06:43 PM.
                    I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

                    -Emiliano Zapata

                    Comment


                    • Hmmm... I get the feeling I'm like Sollozzo with this... It's actually making me angrier/frustrated... I can't really think of the proper word... as this settles in.

                      I was so skeptical of the way this injury was being handled/reported officially that I felt SOMETHING was amiss, but I was expecting 50/50 he suits up and plays game 1 rusty but looking OK otherwise, or ultimately misses games and has a surgery he could've/should've had weeks/months ago that would've allowed him to play game 1 if he would've.
                      Not retirement. Though ultimately, even that would've eventually been more understandable if he would've missed the opener and subsequent games setting up a better idea that all was not progressing normally with this "injury".

                      But I'm also left wondering if there really is an injury. At least one of any note... and whether this as all been a smokescreen for mulling retirement all along.
                      Last edited by Bball; 08-26-2019, 09:40 PM.
                      Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

                      ------

                      "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

                      -John Wooden

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                      • Originally posted by Bball View Post
                        .. I can't really think of the proper word....
                        How about 2 of them ?? F it.

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                        • Originally posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
                          I canít think of a city that has had so much freakiní trauma/disappointment thrown on them, and most of these events occurring just as a championship window was opening up or we were projected to be a contender.
                          Washington, DC sports fans would love to have a chat.

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                          • Cowherd said it best today: He said the media needed to give the fans a break and made the point that people name their pets after players, they wear jerseys of other grown men.....so of course booing like Saturday night is what youíre going to get after you pump 3 beers into people.

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                            • Not going to watch any sports debate shows talking about Luck's retirement. Still sad af. That super bowl was coming!

                              If Luck were to come back, will he be a FA?

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                              • Why the hell was Luck doing drills before the Cleveland game if he had decided to retire? This whole situation was weird. I am glad the drama is over. Go fart around in Amsterdam, Luck.

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