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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

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"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

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Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

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http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

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The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

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Was this season a success?

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  • #46
    Re: Was this season a success?

    I believe in continuous improvement. This team reached the 1st round in '11, the 2nd round in '12 and the ECF in '13. Therefore, I expected this trend to continue with us reaching the Finals in '14.

    It didn't happen. So, I would consider this season a minor step back. It isn't a failure but it isn't a big success either.
    People who try to win arguments are the worst. The point of an argument isn't to find a winner, it is to find the truth.

    Originally posted by IrishPacer
    Empty vessels make the most noise.

    Comment


    • #47
      Re: Was this season a success?

      No, anything less than a finals appearance wasn't a success. At minimum a success should be getting one step further than the previous season. Game 6 of ECF is one step back from Game 7 of ECF.

      Comment


      • #48
        Re: Was this season a success?

        Originally posted by Sookie View Post
        It was a slight regression.

        not the epic fail of a season that some believe it is.

        I don't want to blow up the team. PG, West, and Hill should be back. Lance shouldn't be. Replace him with a smart player that can defend and shoot, or a point guard. Roy's a question mark for me, but I'm apt to say keep him, just because we can't get much for him.

        If we do keep him (roy) we need athletic bigs off the bench. A MAJOR problem with our team is that we start two slow footed posts. A team with a stretch offense like Miami has learned how to eat that alive..although, if our team could execute as it did in the first half, we would punish them for the small lineup we through out there.

        We also need perimeter shooters.
        Should have just quoted you and said ditto instead of making my own post.

        Comment


        • #49
          Re: Was this season a success?

          Originally posted by JEM View Post
          It left with Hansbrough. His style IMO rubbed off on the other players.
          we're in the dark parts of the offseason now

          Comment


          • #50
            Re: Was this season a success?

            Not a success. If we would have played them tough tonight then maybe I would call it a success, but not after this. I'm sick of this team and i want changes. They are way too soft and mentally weak. I definitely want Roy traded for whatever we can get for him. Or just stretch provision him. I'm iffy on if I want GH gone...if there is any way we could get a better option at PG then I'd want it. I want Frank gone. I just think it's time for a change at coach. I'm tired of being terrible on offense and I'm tired of our bench sucking every single year. I definitely want Scola gone. And I want Lance back for anywhere up to 10 mil as long as PG and West are fine with him being on this team. He's too good of a young talent to let go now. He has the chance to be a star and it'd be stupid to let him go. He will mature with time.

            Well here's to next year....just have to wait months and months now. Ugh.

            Comment


            • #51
              Re: Was this season a success?

              Eastern Conference Finals is meaningless. The East is a complete joke. We didn't beat anyone significant to get there this year, and the Knicks weren't that good last year either. Making it to the Eastern Conference Finals is the equivalent of making the playoffs in the West.

              Comment


              • #52
                Re: Was this season a success?

                Wasn't a failure, but I definitely expected more.

                Comment


                • #53
                  Re: Was this season a success?

                  Yes. 56 wins and a trip to the ECF is pretty legit. You're crazy if you think this team could beat Heat, Spurs, and Thunder in a 7 game series. Hell, add the Suns to the list as well.

                  Comment


                  • #54
                    Re: Was this season a success?

                    This season was not a success but that is not because we aren't hanging a championship banner. It's because the team collapsed midseason and never recovered. Even though we had HCA for the playoffs (Eastern) we gave it away every series. Plus we backed into the number 1 seed anyway. To play as well as we did to build that buffer that we needed every bit of wasn't exactly comforting once you look at the fall.

                    Meanwhile, we weren't a force to be reckoned with in the playoffs. We barely escaped each round and with some severe dogs of games mixed in. Finally, when the last excuse was on the table ("The Pacers were a team that was built to beat the Heat and they were solely focused on that goal causing them to have trouble getting up for other games" excuse) we faced the Heat. We played great in game 1. Then we almost got the backdoor sweep pulled on us. And finally in game 6 the Heat put the team and fans out of our collective misery.

                    We were outplayed, out-hustled, and outcoached for most of the playoffs. Our alleged strengths were used against us, both on the court and on the bench. We had no answers. We weren't even as good as we were last year when it mattered. We weren't even as good as we had been this season. There were no injuries to blame. No new rule changes. Perhaps a lack of priorities could be pointed to... but who knows ultimately?

                    We didn't come close to putting a scare in the Heat. We didn't play games that were nail-biting wars. We didn't come up short by a few baskets over the course of the series. There's very little looking back and saying if we'd have gotten this stop, or that basket, or this call, or that call.... No, there was too much going wrong to even consider things that might've made a difference and would have swung the series. No conspiracy necessary for this loss.

                    The goal was to beat the Heat. We didn't even come close. Not only that but we barely even made it there to play them in the first place.

                    How this could be seen as anything but a failure I don't know....
                    Last edited by Bball; 05-31-2014, 01:47 AM. Reason: typo
                    Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

                    ------

                    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

                    -John Wooden

                    Comment


                    • #55
                      Re: Was this season a success?

                      Originally posted by Nuntius View Post
                      I believe in continuous improvement. This team reached the 1st round in '11, the 2nd round in '12 and the ECF in '13. Therefore, I expected this trend to continue with us reaching the Finals in '14.

                      It didn't happen. So, I would consider this season a minor step back. It isn't a failure but it isn't a big success either.
                      It doesn't always work like that. In Danny's first 4 seasons with us he averaged 7.5 ppg to 25.8 ppg. Yes, that was continual. However, he did not continue to improve to average say...30 ppg. At some point there's a ceiling. Given the lack of productivity from certain players (cough Scola Hibbert) and how we've played the second half of the season as well as the playoffs, I'd say it was a success. Hell, we almost lost to the Hawks in the 1st round.
                      follow me @TruenoPanda - lets talk Pacers!

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                      • #56
                        Re: Was this season a success?

                        Originally posted by Bball View Post
                        The goal was to beat the Heat. We didn't even come close. Not only that but we barely even made it there to play them in the first place.

                        How this could be seen as anything but a failure I don't know....
                        Seriously. The team set the goal of making the Finals and they didn't reach it. It is objectively a failed season.

                        Comment


                        • #57
                          Re: Was this season a success?

                          I don't see how anyone could call this year a success, considering we stumbled throughout the whole playoffs. As been posted by others, we got lucky and backed into the #1 seed.

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                          • #58
                            Re: Was this season a success?

                            No it was not. It failed to meet any goals we set besides the #1 seed which we backed in to.

                            A. We gave Miami a tougher series the last 2 years. Not just because last year went 7 but we didn't have a shot. I'm not upset because I was already at the acceptance stage before tonight. That tells me we stepped back.

                            B. Roy Hibbert had high hopes of being the best center in the league. He now puts us in a tough place because he can't guard the 3 & protect the rim at the same time. The Heat killed us because of this & it almost sent us home vs Atlanta.
                            I don't blame Roy because he can't do both. It's hard for someone with speed to cover ground like that. Impossible for a man his size. Still we either have to change our idenity defensively or find a different center.

                            C. No longer together. The team entered the off-season the tightest group in the league. They did post games as a 5 man unit. Now PG/Roy & Lance barely even pass to each other. You could count a PG to Lance pass on 1 hand the whole game.
                            Last year Bird tweeted "The team that plays together, wins together." Or something close to that. Now they split for the off-season & at least some players have obvious rifts.

                            D. Vogel - I thought we had an awesome young coach before the season. I defended him to death for sitting Hibbert in that ECF game 1 last year. I thought it was a mistake, but 1 he had earned a right to be forgiven for. Now this year I don't want him back. He lost the team as he couldn't keep mouths shut & out of the media. He couldn't get players to check personal feelings & at least play together. He failed to adjust to anything. He never figured anything on offense as teams figured us out the offense never improved it digressed. I could have lived with that if that defense survived. BUT our defense dropped, dropped, & dropped more until the Heat just made its look like a D League team on defense. He is a defensive coach, but he put Hibbert in position to fail & never implemented any plan B when we began to crack regular season. Try something, a different look, adjust lineup/personal. This idea that you start the same guys no matter what is dinosaur-ish. Pop changed his line-up last night. The Heat changed starting lineups against us this series at least twice. Even Scott Brooks with limited personal changed his starting 5 last series before Ibaka was hurt. Don't get me wrong I love stability & it needs practiced very often but there is no harm in adjusting & using what's in the tool box when locked into 1 team. Vogel is too rigid. He with a clear head on my part was the biggest disappointment given the body of work. He was bad! I waited until the end & now I can judge the body of work & he has to go. During the highs of some wins I thought he should be safe, but no way should he be now. I appreciate his contributions & say thanks. I love his speeches also. As our coach at this point he's a handicap. He was fine vs the Wiz, but we won in ATL despite him, not because of him. When he has to adjust he hurts us.

                            E. The bench - looking on paper it looked like a huge upgrade & yet they were as bad if not worse than last year. Combined with the fact Green, Plumlee, & DJ had strong years it is apparent you come to our bench to die. When the horn sounded Scola bolted to shake Heat hands alone & bolted off the court alone. It sort of said to me "It's over, get me the hell out of here." Whether it was due to a bad locker room or he just hated being a bench player who knows. We also had hopes of Danny coming back & maybe using him or Lance as an awesome 6th man. Well he didn't pan out so we traded a fan favorite for Turner who failed. I never put much into the whole Danny was huge for us in the locker room but he would have been nice to have in there vs the Heat. I agree with the gamble really as Turner showed promise in Philly & was Lance insurance. To bad he died on the bench as well (or was awful to begin with & I could have averaged 18 on Philly.) Watson critics on other forums told me I'd love him all year until a big Playoff series. Well he was good vs ATL & awful vs MIA so perhaps that was accurate. Also Ian. He was the only guy on the bench I wanted back & the only guy that was back. He was bad until Bynum somehow inspired him to play D by being hurt on our bench. Well he did pretty well until MIA & he vanished with Watson in the series we needed all. Scola just didn't fit our defensive style & was a big fail. Props to him for staying professional. We traded Plumlee/pick to get him & also to move Green's contract based on how bad Green was. Turns out maybe Green isn't that bad, we just can't develop a bench. You could probably blame Vogel for our bench or lack of 1. Either way it was a huge disappointment, even when we were rolling our bench was giving away leads our starters were earning back in the 3rd quarter. Also, Copeland never got a chance. I doubt he would have been a basketball Jesus, but he played 1 regular season game where Vogel used him instead of Ian. Then he never did again until a Hawks game. Putting him in when down 30 or when you are resting starters doesn't count. Copeland deserved better than that, although we as fans probably had a fairy tale in our had for him. He was a great soldier on his part though.

                            Mix in a start with huge potential & the drop off makes it a disappointment as well. This year was our year, because we had success & hunger. We had players making less & knew we'd have to make decisions in the off-season. Just not as many as we thought we would it turns out.

                            I will say that Jordan lost to Detroit 3 years before breaking through. I firmly believe PG is a guy capable of a championship. Media be damned. He just has that championship talent/skill set. He needs his Westbrook, Lillard, or Wade. That could be Lance but I feel like the don't care for each other at all. Try & find a point & keep Lance will be a HUGE challenge. Do you keep Lance? Without him are you talented enough? Interesting.

                            Sent from my HTC One using Tapatalk
                            Last edited by larry; 05-31-2014, 02:09 AM.
                            1 - 2, Tinsley's coming for you.
                            3 - 4, You're not a team no more.
                            5 - 6, He's gonna plead the 5th.
                            7 - 8, He's gonna stay out late.



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                            • #59
                              Re: Was this season a success?

                              Pessimist: not a successful year
                              Optimist: This year was so painful it will provoke serious introspection. The players will recognize what it takes to truly compete and not take things for granted. I am sure the coaching staff has been trying to convey this information - for goodness sake this group did all of this with Bird watching. People may not listen, or understand, but they will remember how they felt. It does not get much worse from an organizational structure standpoint, so there is only up. May be this time they will understand what is takes to be successful.

                              I went for the optimist pov
                              ! Free Rick Sanchez !

                              Comment


                              • #60
                                Re: Was this season a success?

                                Originally posted by BornReady View Post
                                It doesn't always work like that. In Danny's first 4 seasons with us he averaged 7.5 ppg to 25.8 ppg. Yes, that was continual. However, he did not continue to improve to average say...30 ppg. At some point there's a ceiling. Given the lack of productivity from certain players (cough Scola Hibbert) and how we've played the second half of the season as well as the playoffs, I'd say it was a success. Hell, we almost lost to the Hawks in the 1st round.
                                I'm well aware that it doesn't always work like that, my friend. I was expecting it to work that way and that's why I'm calling this a minor step back (since it was a step back from last season and what I was expecting).

                                That said, I also clarified that this wasn't a failure. You are absolutely right to point out that we almost to the Hawks in the 1st round. This would be a clear failure. Losing to Miami in 6 wasn't a failure. It was simply a step back, imo.
                                People who try to win arguments are the worst. The point of an argument isn't to find a winner, it is to find the truth.

                                Originally posted by IrishPacer
                                Empty vessels make the most noise.

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