The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less

Larry and Lance. And Len.

  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Larry and Lance. And Len.

    I wonder if Larry Bird has taken Lance under his wing because he still remembers Len Bias.

    (For you youngsters, the Celtics selected Maryland's Len Bias with the #2 pick in the 1986 draft. He died 2 days later from a cocaine overdose.)

    From what I recall, Bird was devastated when he heard the news.

  • #2
    Re: Larry and Lance. And Len.

    could be on to something here.......
    Being unable to close out a game in which you have a comfortable lead in the 4th Q = Pulling a Frank Vogel


    • #3
      Lance was never known to have any drug issues. Why tie him to this?

      Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Tapatalk 2


      • #4
        Re: Larry and Lance. And Len.

        Originally posted by spazzxb View Post
        Lance was never known to have any drug issues. Why tie him to this?

        Sent from my HTC6435LVW using Tapatalk 2
        According to all accounts from virtually everyone that knew him, neither was Len Bias. If their accounts were correct, Len Bias must have decided that he would try cocaine for the first time as a way of celebrating his recent drafting. For some, once is all it takes.

        Edit: After reading the entire link, I see that the medical examiner was not certain that is was Bias' first episode with cocaine. He apparently had one acquaintance that said it was not. At the time, every account given said that it was his first time.
        Last edited by beast23; 05-20-2013, 03:09 PM.


        • #5
          Re: Larry and Lance. And Len.

          I'm sure Larry's been around long enough to see lots of guys who could have been something great but didn't come even close, due to work ethic, attitude, or drugs. The 1986 draft had many such guys, but there are a few every year.

          Shawne Williams might be a closer example.
          The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!).


          • #6
            Re: Larry and Lance. And Len.

            James White and Shawne Williams are who I would cite as GM Larry's learning point. He got burned on some gambles almost completely due to attitude. He seems hard nosed enough to not want to ever get burned that way again.

            But we also need to give Lance credit for listening and working at it. You can still see that Vogel/Shaw have to "control" him during games, keep him settled when he gets a bit too hyped, etc. This is the cost of young players and why vets have so much value to counter young players "potential".

            Lance seems very open to receiving this guidance and shows no sign of grinding an ax against the coaches or teammates. If anything he seems more emotionally attached to everyone through this process.

            To me the credit Bird deserves is NOT drafting Lance. This means that if you wanted to repeat the success you don't just say "well I'll have the guts to take a chance too". That's like making a bet. To me Larry didn't bet on Lance, Larry FIXED THE RACE from a gambling viewpoint. He took Lance and then got involved to make it as close as possible to certain that it would be a winner.

            And that's where the real credit goes. That's impressive. Larry is key, Lance's response is key, the coaches, the environment... if you are another team and want to replicate this success you better lay out a lot more foundation. The money spent to get West. The trade to get Hill. Drafting Roy and then paying him (and Hill to stay). And some luck to have Vogel's attitude ready to step in, plus getting Shaw in.

            It's like an iceberg. On the surface you see "just draft Lance in round 2, take that gamble" but underneath the water is this giant mass of foundation that allows the franchise to not only take on the risk but to turn it to their favor.

            This is also why I put so much stock in keeping the core together, the value of West, the value of Roy's attitude, and all the other stuff people like to toss aside when they want to chase some #4 pick that's the "next thing". To me that's the gamble, to give up big chunks of foundation for a talent scratch-off ticket (see the Antonio gamble).

            And to add to this you have the prototype example - the Spurs. Just heard on SVG/Russillo today that Green had to make a phone call to Pop and basically apologize and promise to do whatever it took to get the Spurs to bring him back after cutting him. That's where the real power comes from, the guts to insist on an environment and do everything to build toward that even at the risk of losing talent.
            Last edited by Naptown_Seth; 05-20-2013, 04:00 PM.


            • #7
              Re: Larry and Lance. And Len.

              I recognize that Lance gives Larry a lot of credit and that's great, but I also want to give credit to his parents (by all accounts fantastic people) and to Lance himself. You don't mature like he has in 3 years just because of one guy. Lance need to give himself a pat on the back, there are guys who play in this league for their whole careers and never mature the way Lance has on and off the court. Lance comes into Mo's after almost every game and he is the most reserved person in there, almost shy, he goes to his table with his buddies, he eats and he leaves and yeah he probably goes out and parties (I know he does, so does most of the team and NBA for that matter), but as far as I know he does it responsibly. (I've talked about this with people in the know and who are around this group of Pacers a lot, this team seems to move as a group a la the 90's Pacers or at least certainly more than the early 00's Pacers did, plus they seem to have a good support system of friends that sticks with them so that's a good thing, there are certainly no risks of Lance, Paul, or anyone else hopping behind the wheel after too much drinking, etc. they behave like smart 20 somethings should)

              Then you look at how he has matured on the court and it's even more amazing. Lance is about as calm as can be for a 22 year old jsut now getting his first major minutes.

              JR Smith is the perfect example of a guy who will never get it the way Lance has. And Lance dserves credit for that let's not act like JR hasn't been around some strong men in his time in the NBA and he is still an immature dingleberry.


              • #8
                Re: Larry and Lance. And Len.

                Originally posted by Trader Joe View Post
                I recognize that Lance gives Larry a lot of credit and that's great, but I also want to give credit to his parents (by all accounts fantastic people) and to Lance himself. You don't mature like he has in 3 years just because of one guy. Lance need to give himself a pat on the back, there are guys who play in this league for their whole careers and never mature the way Lance has on and off the court. Lance comes into Mo's after almost every game and he is the most reserved person in there, almost shy, he goes to his table with his buddies, he eats and he leaves and yeah he probably goes out and parties (I know he does, so does most of the team and NBA for that matter), but as far as I know he does it responsibly. .
                I've lost count of how many times I've seen Lance at Hooters after a game, he does the same thing there as Mo's, in fact it makes me feel for him everytime somebody sends their kid up to him asking for an autograph. Let the man eat in peace already!
                "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

                "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "


                • #9
                  Re: Larry and Lance. And Len.

                  Originally posted by Sandman21 View Post
                  I've lost count of how many times I've seen Lance at Hooters after a game, he does the same thing there as Mo's, in fact it makes me feel for him everytime somebody sends their kid up to him asking for an autograph. Let the man eat in peace already!
                  That's kind of funny, I feel the same way about celebrities. In fact, since I don't have cable, I've been going to sports bars here in Columbus to watch games. For game 4, I went to Eddie George's 27 Grille. The bartenders remember me(I'm always the only one there wearing Pacers gear and they always make me play the halftime "quiz" game) so the one I had that day said to me, "This is the craziest day I've ever seen. Eddie George has been in here before for Buckeye games but that was nothing, people won't leave him alone and he's even in the VIP room." I'm confused and a little "meh" about what's going on. So I mozy past the VIP room windows on the way to the bathroom just to see what he was talking about. Magic Johnson was in there. Earvin "Magic" Johnson. I left him alone and let him eat, because I feel like that's the right thing to do. Well, halftime comes up and it's time for the quiz game, and it's me. Right before the MC starts the game(How many fingers did Reggie hold up before the infamous choke sign, I got it right can you?) Magic agrees to take pictures for a few minutes. I was bummed for a minute, but I wasn't gonna go up there after they had already cut off the line.

                  Wow, that was tl;dr. Sorry.