The Rules of Pacers Digest

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Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

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"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

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"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

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"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Wells: Lance Stephenson Finds His Way

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  • Wells: Lance Stephenson Finds His Way
    NEW YORK — The stench of urine and feces was unbearable.

    Lance Stephenson
    had to block out the smell and keep his head on a swivel.

    The Pacers swingman — often scared — ran the 15 flights of dark, dreary stairs in the Coney Island, N.Y. apartment building he lived in during the early part of his life to get in shape for basketball. Drug dealers and homeless people often frequented the stairwell for shelter.

    Stephenson ran those steps every morning at 6 a.m. with his father, Lance Stephenson Sr., there to make sure nobody messed with his son.

    “It was very rough,” Stephenson said. “I’d see bullet shots through the window in the lobby, drugs, there would be crackheads around. I used to be scared, but then I got tough and knew I had to be aware while I was running.”

    It was on those stairs, at the beach a couple hundred yards away where he regularly ran 2.5 miles, and the basketball court 20 yards from where he lived, that Stephenson learned to be tough.

    Coney Island is a place where people line the block waiting to get inside food kitchens. Bars are on the windows of most businesses and owners pull gates down at the end of the day to protect their establishments. It’s where outsiders draw the attention of the natives because they know you’re not from the neighborhood.

    “Toughness is what you think of when talking about Lance,” said Gary Charles, one of Stephenson’s AAU coaches. “He was the kid who wanted to be the next Stephon (Marbury), the next Sebastian (Telfair) out of Coney Island. Sometimes kids don’t want to embrace it. He embraced it and wanted to enhance it. You have to be tough to get out of there.”

    But Stephenson wasn’t a first-round pick like Marbury and Telfair. That toughness also manifested itself as an attitude that turned some NBA teams off when he was coming out of the University of Cincinnati and it had Pacers’ teammates wanting to fight him during his rookie season.

    That toughness that got Stephenson to the NBA? It almost ended his career.

    “I’m not going to lie, when Lance first got here, he was a (expletive), put that in the paper,” center Roy Hibbert said. “He’s way better now. He’s a lot more receptive. He’s light years where he was before.”

    Meant to be

    James Black, another of Stephenson’s AAU coaches, couldn’t believe what he was seeing on the court at Rucker Park.

    It’s where the best of the best play in New York City and Stephenson, just 13 years old, was not backing down from anyone. He yelled at Marcus Hatten, a starter at St. John’s at the time, demanding the ball from him.

    Stephenson finished with 12 points and never looked out of place.

    “That’s when I knew,” Black said. “I was like, ‘Wow.’ Lance was in eighth grade playing on my 16-year-old team. He was going all around the city dominating people. He was tough and had no fear of anybody.”

    The announcer first called him “Ice Water” because Stephenson made every shot he attempted. But then changed it to “Born Ready” because of Stephenson’s knack to hold his own against older competition.

    Playing against competition the same age wasn’t an option for Stephenson. His mind frame was, “if you want to be the best, you have to play the best.” He had the physique to match players several years older.

    Stephenson dunked for the first time in an AAU tournament when he was in sixth grade.

    That was the start of things for the cocky player who showed up in the NBA. The better he played, the more he talked.

    “That’s all we do in New York, you trash talk and then you go out and back it up,” Stephenson said. “If you’re not backing it up, you can’t talk. I felt like I was backing it up. I was killing everybody they were putting in front of me.”

    Stephenson spent five minutes going back and forth at O.J. Mayo, three years his senior and one of the premier high school players in the country at the time, during a summer camp. Stephenson played on the same AAU team as future-NBA players Joakim Noah and Danny Green, both older than him.

    Producer Paul Rivera followed Stephenson his entire junior year for an online documentary called “Born Ready.”

    “We had never seen anybody like Lance, and that says a lot considering all the great players to come out of New York,” Rivera said. “There were other good kids, but they weren’t manly like Lance. You had players like Ron Artest and Stephon Marbury going crazy every time they saw Lance play and the things he was able to do.”

    Stephenson originally attended Bishop Loughlin High School in Brooklyn, N.Y., but transferred to Lincoln, which also produced Marbury and Telfair, two days into the school year.

    Stephenson led Lincoln to four city championships, something Marbury and Telfair can’t claim. He left as New York’s all-time leading scorer (2,946 points).

    “Lance was a die-hard Coney Island guy, so he had to go to Lincoln where we bleed blue here,” Stephenson’s high school coach, Dwayne “Tiny” Morton, said, referencing the school color. “He had the desire to be better than the next guy. Every coach wants a player who wants to do better than the guy who went to the NBA before him.

    “That was self motivation for Lance.”

    Avoiding trouble

    Stephenson’s agent, Al Ebanks, had to back his 7 series BMW up and drive it on the sidewalk to get around the ambulance that sat in the center of the one-way street in Coney Island last weekend.

    The medical team was busy trying to revive the person inside the vehicle.

    Trouble was there for Stephenson if he wanted it. Selling drugs on the corner or robbing people at night would have been a quick way for Stephenson to get his hustle on to make money.

    But he had no interest in that. His family wasn’t going to have it, either.

    Lance Stephenson Sr.’s family has lived in Coney Island for more than a hundred years, so having protection wasn’t a problem.

    And if Stephenson did step out of line, his parents were there to discipline him.

    “His parents did a wonderful job raising him,” Morton said of Lance Stephenson Sr., a construction worker, and Bernadette Stephenson, who cleaned apartments.

    “They’re a close-knit family. What his parents really did is if he ever got out of order they would rein him in.”

    Trouble did find Stephenson during his junior year at Lincoln High School in 2008.

    He was suspended five games after getting in a fight with a teammate. Stephenson and a teammate were charged with sexually assaulting a female student near the high school that same year. He pleaded guilty to disorderly conduct.

    Stephenson was also involved in a legal issue in Brooklyn during the summer of 2010. Prosecutors said he pushed his girlfriend, Jasmine Williams, down a flight of stairs during an argument. A criminal complaint said the Stephenson then slammed her head on the bottom step. Williams told police she hit her head during the fall. The case was later dismissed.

    “My mistakes were really bad and I regret it,” Stephenson said. “At the same time, I learned from them. I learned to keep my distance from things that could get me in trouble and sacrifice my career. I just try my best to stay focused and limit all the things that would get me in trouble.”

    Not well liked

    It didn’t take long for many realize why colleges backed off Stephenson and NBA teams passed on him in the first round of the 2010 draft.

    Stephenson never had to listen to anybody on the basketball court because he was the best player out there. He diverted from plays his coaches called and told his teammates what to do.

    That approach did not work when he joined the Pacers, who drafted him with the 40th overall pick.
    “I always felt like I was the man and nobody could tell me anything,” Stephenson said. “Somebody would say, ‘Get in the corner,’ and I was like, ‘No you get in the corner.’ I never had anybody talk to me like that. Everybody was telling what to do and I didn’t like it.”

    Stephenson reached a boiling point with the veterans — particularly Danny Granger and Dahntay Jones — being too hard on him during a game in Houston in March 2011.

    Granger stood up like he was going to go after Stephenson inside the locker room after the game, according to those there at the time. That started a full-fledged team argument that could be heard in the hallways of the Toyota Center.

    “To be honest, I thought some of the vets were too hard on him,” Pacers coach Frank Vogel said. “When you get that type of leadership, human nature kicks in and instincts kick in and you get defensive. I thought that’s what Lance’s issues were. He was taking offense to the vets being overly harsh to him.”

    Whether it was his fault or not that night in Houston, Stephenson didn’t learn his lesson. Vogel made him the fourth point guard after he was caught using his phone on the bench during a game.

    The name “Born Ready” didn’t fit Stephenson’s game any longer. He only appeared in 12 games during his rookie season despite then-team president Larry Bird urging the coaching staff to give Stephenson playing time.

    “Lance was always told that he was the best thing since slice bread growing up,” Stephenson’s uncle, Corey Ridges, said. “It didn’t take long for him to realize he was no longer the best.”

    The light didn’t come on for Stephenson until Jeff Foster, who used a blue-collar mentality to have a 13-year career with the Pacers, sat Stephenson down for what the veteran center called one of the most serious conversations he ever had with a teammate.

    “Lance was a different kind of rookie,” Foster said. “He didn’t have to really work for anything in his basketball life. He really pushed back at first. I took him in a corner and told him he needed to decide very soon what he wants to be. Be a guy who plays 13 or 14 years in the NBA and makes a lot of money. Or be a guy who is 30 years old and regrets not doing things differently.”

    Today, Stephenson is a completely different person.

    He makes eye contact when holding a conversation. He acknowledges people when he walks by them. He’s punctual to places he’s required to be. He even enjoys opening up during a conversation instead of looking like he rather be else where.

    Clark Kellogg, the Pacers vice president of player relations, isn’t one to raise his voice. His approach was to keep a close eye on Young and talk to him like an adult instead of a teenage phenom known strictly for his basketball skills.

    “Lance was rough around the edges when he first came here,” said Clark Kellogg, the Pacers vice-president of player relations, who has worked with Stephenson.

    “It took some work and, at times, (you had) to have a firm stance with him, but he’s turned the corner. He’s turned into a fine young man. Like with every young player, there’s still more work, but he’s headed in the right direction.”

    A knee injury that has caused Granger to miss all but five games this season has provided Stephenson the opportunity to fulfill the potential Bird saw.

    Stephenson still has some streetball in him and a tendency to try to do too much. The Pacers can handle that because the positives he brings to the court — starting with confidence — outweigh the negative.

    “I’m happy for how he has played and how he has matured over the years,” Bird told The Star. “If he continues to work as hard as he has been, he’ll only get better. He still has enormous potential to be fulfilled and if he keeps working at it, keeps maturing, he can be great.”

    Stephenson started 72 of the 78 games he played this season and has transformed the toughness and cockiness he developed growing up in Coney Island into confidence. Many call him the ‘X’ factor during the playoffs for the Pacers, and it also likely has Bird smiling somewhere because, while others wanted to give up on Stephenson, he stuck with him.

    “It’s neat and very rewarding,” Vogel said. “There’s a lot of different areas in this job that are gratifying, but watching a kid that comes in with so many question marks about him and to see him achieve success at this level is very rewarding.”
    Mostly just fluff that's stuff we already know, but the Houston dustup and Jeff sitting him down and setting him straight were news to me. I remembered a team argument in Houston that Wells talked about listening to through the lockerroom door or something like that but I don't think we ever knew the specifics of it, at least I didn't. And Jeff Foster being the guy to get through to this brash young Brooklyn kid says a lot about Foster's interpersonal skills really, that dude's a gem.

    And I'll admit back in 2010 when I saw Lance Stephenson scroll across the screen as our 2nd rounder I rolled my eyes and said "****." Didn't want him, thought he'd kill the image rejuvenation that had to happen. And he came close to doing it. But he's grown up, at least somewhat, and become a man. Never in a million years thought three years later I'd be copying and pasting postive writeups in the Star about him. Even though I didn't have anything to do with it the way the franchise basically broke him down and built him into a better person makes me proud to be a Pacers fan really. There's not many franchises that would even attempt that, let alone actually do it.

  • #2
    Re: Wells: Lance Stephenson Finds His Way

    Originally posted by Heisenberg View Post
    And I'll admit back in 2010 when I saw Lance Stephenson scroll across the screen as our 2nd rounder I rolled my eyes and said "****." Didn't want him, thought he'd kill the image rejuvenation that had to happen. And he came close to doing it. But he's grown up, at least somewhat, and become a man. Never in a million years thought three years later I'd be copying and pasting postive writeups in the Star about him. Even though I didn't have anything to do with it the way the franchise basically broke him down and built him into a better person makes me proud to be a Pacers fan really. There's not many franchises that would even attempt that, let alone actually do it.
    I will freely admit that before the 2012-2013 season, I saw absolutely nothing in him and didn't see what any of you saw.

    I'm glad that Foster sat down and talked to him.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.


    • #3
      Re: Wells: Lance Stephenson Finds His Way

      Not watching any college basketball I had no idea who he was. I just know that the first time I saw him play was in the summer league and I was just blown away. Yes I know it was summer league but this guy already had the body of a full grown man and his ball handling ability and ability to drive to the basket immediately made me think of Tyreke Evans, which at the time was a good thing.

      When the season started and we never saw him again I of course blamed Satan but it became evident when he did play that he was not used to playing within an organized structure.

      But I always knew there was talent there and I know it's probably not popular to say this but ultimately I believe that he has the most potential of anyone on our team. Now I don't know if he has the drive, mentality or desire to work to reach that level but I actually think that he could have an outstanding career and ultimately it's up to him as to how that plays out. There can be no denying that he has the physical tools to be special.

      Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13


      • #4
        Re: Wells: Lance Stephenson Finds His Way

        The light didn’t come on for Stephenson until Jeff Foster, who used a blue-collar mentality to have a 13-year career with the Pacers, sat Stephenson down for what the veteran center called one of the most serious conversations he ever had with a teammate.

        “Lance was a different kind of rookie,” Foster said. “He didn’t have to really work for anything in his basketball life. He really pushed back at first. I took him in a corner and told him he needed to decide very soon what he wants to be. Be a guy who plays 13 or 14 years in the NBA and makes a lot of money. Or be a guy who is 30 years old and regrets not doing things differently.”

        Today, Stephenson is a completely different person.
        Sounds like Jeff may have earned his last contract right there.
        "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference


        • #5
          Re: Wells: Lance Stephenson Finds His Way

          If we ever win a championship with Lance on the team, there'll be a movie in the works.

          "He’s no shrinking violet when it comes to that kind of stuff."

          - Rick Carlisle on how Kevin Pritchard responds to needed roster changes.


          • #6
            Re: Wells: Lance Stephenson Finds His Way

            Lance is the guy that could lead us all the way
            Smothered Chicken!


            • #7
              Re: Wells: Lance Stephenson Finds His Way

              I really like choke sign. If we are going to get out the first or second round he has to do it offensively. I'm not sold on pg's assertiveness
              Impossible Is Nothing


              • #8
                Re: Wells: Lance Stephenson Finds His Way

                At the time I would not have thought this was funny, but I do now:

                “I always felt like I was the man and nobody could tell me anything,” Stephenson said. “Somebody would say, ‘Get in the corner,’ and I was like, ‘No you get in the corner.’ I never had anybody talk to me like that. Everybody was telling what to do and I didn’t like it.”

                I still love how much he's changed as a person. It's crazy how much impact the organization has had on his life. Jeff is the best.