NY Daily News: 'Larry Bird flew the coop in Indiana and the Pacers' billionaire owner is partly to blame'

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  • vnzla81
    Member
    • Jul 2008
    • 68174

    Re: NY Daily News: 'Larry Bird flew the coop in Indiana and the Pacers' billionaire owner is partly to blame'

    Originally posted by BillS
    Because your own FAs are a known quantity. You absolutely know the risks you are taking because they've been in your system,. working with your training staff and coaches, and have a good idea of their role. You are also seldom bidding against tons of other teams (particularly with your own RFAs), and when you are then the market price is good to use to evaluate against what you know to be a fact about your player. Even when you overspend, with your own FA you pretty much KNOW how much of that is a risk and how much of it is value.

    Another team's FA is not as known a quantity. How will they fit? Will they be more than a one-contract rental? Will they accept a role or disrupt a rotation beyond their worth on the floor? An injury history with another team's training staff isn't public or clear - was it a fluke or was it chroinic? How can you evaluate how MUCH you are overpaying when you have so many unanswered questions?

    As I said above, it is a matter of risk assessment, and overspending for high risk isn't at all as easy to justify as overspending for a known quantity.
    So if you were Miami you would have never taken the chance to take on Lebron and Bosh because you didn't know how they were going to match? Or if you were the Lakers you don't sign Nash because you don't know what kind of risk a 38 years old player can have in your team? I could bring more examples, the NBA is a risky business and if you are not willing to take risks you are in the wrong business, unless your business is to be a middle of the pack team that doesn't go over the cap so it can collect some money at the end of the year.
    @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

    Comment

    • Bball
      Jimmy did what Jimmy did
      • Jan 2004
      • 26903

      Re: NY Daily News: 'Larry Bird flew the coop in Indiana and the Pacers' billionaire owner is partly to blame'

      Originally posted by BillS
      Because your own FAs are a known quantity. You absolutely know the risks you are taking because they've been in your system,. working with your training staff and coaches, and have a good idea of their role.
      As I said above, it is a matter of risk assessment, and overspending for high risk isn't at all as easy to justify as overspending for a known quantity.
      You mean like Croshere? Rose? Tinsley? Bender? Foster? Harrington? JO? ....
      Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

      ------

      "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, that’s teamwork."

      -John Wooden

      Comment

      • daschysta
        Member
        • Mar 2009
        • 2049

        Re: NY Daily News: 'Larry Bird flew the coop in Indiana and the Pacers' billionaire owner is partly to blame'

        Originally posted by Bball
        You mean like Croshere? Rose? Tinsley? Bender? Foster? Harrington? JO? ....
        JO was 3rd in MVP voting that year, San Antonio was offering the max too, can't blame him for that.
        Goodbye Captain, My Captain. I wish you had the chance to sink or swim with your ship on its quest for the "ship".

        Comment

        • Wage
          Member
          • May 2008
          • 2583

          Re: NY Daily News: 'Larry Bird flew the coop in Indiana and the Pacers' billionaire owner is partly to blame'

          Wow, this article has turned out to pretty much be a Rorschach test. We have an article where a guy, heard from a guy, that talked to some former Celtics, that Larry Bird said, Simon won't spend money. And it appears many are pretty much seeing any truth they want from that.

          And yet, still no one seems to think the craziest thing in this article, if any of it is true at all, is that the NBA is working behind the scenes to make the Bobcats a better team?

          Comment

          • BillS
            Angry Old Poster
            • Mar 2004
            • 21654

            Re: NY Daily News: 'Larry Bird flew the coop in Indiana and the Pacers' billionaire owner is partly to blame'

            Originally posted by vnzla81
            So if you were Miami you would have never taken the chance to take on Lebron and Bosh because you didn't know how they were going to match? Or if you were the Lakers you don't sign Nash because you don't know what kind of risk a 38 years old player can have in your team? I could bring more examples, the NBA is a risky business and if you are not willing to take risks you are in the wrong business, unless your business is to be a middle of the pack team that doesn't go over the cap so it can collect some money at the end of the year.
            So YOU are saying that signing LeBron is the SAME amount of risk as signing Gordon? If you are, then you need to go back to Risk Analysis 101.

            I'm not saying FAs on other teams are universally bad and therefore never spend money on them. I said the reason it is EASIER to overspend on your own FAs is that you can assess them better. Yes, there are no-brainer players out there you'd drop the max on BECAUSE YOU ACTUALLY DO KNOW SOMETHING ABOUT THEM. THAT'S WHY THEY ARE NO-BRAINERS.

            You cannot tell me that a small market team needs to treat every FA who is potentially better than a player already on the team like they are LeBron or Nash or Bosh. That would be downright foolish.

            You never take a risk simply to take a risk. You take a risk because the upside gets you enough to make the downside worth it if it happens. Usually that's because the risk itself is minimized. It could be because the downside isn't damaging vs. the upside potential (signing West for what we paid - how bad would it really be if his knee didn't make it through the season?). The one to watch out for is where the potential benefit seems so high that you ignore the high probability of the downside. You'd spend a buck to buy a ticket for a $1M lottery. You wouldn't mortgage your house to spend $100K on lottery tickets.

            Originally posted by Bball
            You mean like Croshere? Rose? Tinsley? Bender? Foster? Harrington? JO? ....
            Never said it was somehow foolproof or that mistakes also couldn't be made. Just that you can be more confident in your decision making.

            And I think Rose and JO should really be off that list based on what they were doing at the time they got new contracts. I understand there are a lot of people who think Foster was waaaay overpaid, but I disagree.
            BillS

            A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
            Or throw in a first-round pick and flip it for a max-level point guard...

            Comment

            • Bball
              Jimmy did what Jimmy did
              • Jan 2004
              • 26903

              Re: NY Daily News: 'Larry Bird flew the coop in Indiana and the Pacers' billionaire owner is partly to blame'

              Originally posted by BillS
              And I think Rose and JO should really be off that list based on what they were doing at the time they got new contracts. I understand there are a lot of people who think Foster was waaaay overpaid, but I disagree.
              No real argument that ultimately both of them were way overpaid. You might be able to argue they appeared that they would be worth their contracts as they moved forward, but neither lived up to their contract. JO's contract ended up being one of the worst in the NBA.

              Hindsight is 20-20 and hindsight says those contracts were a mistake. People are paid far more than any of us are paid not to make those kind of evaluation errors. But mistakes do happen.

              Of course I think JO was overrated from the start and was never the most valuable player on the team, let alone never should've been under league MVP consideration. ...So I'm biased
              Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

              ------

              "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, that’s teamwork."

              -John Wooden

              Comment

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