Announcement

Collapse

The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less

Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

    Odd Thoughts: Let's take a breath
    Written by Peck

    Link

    Let’s take care of this right up front, none of us that were ready for Jim O’Brien to be fired (in some of our cases years ago) ever said that him leaving would turn this ball club into a full fledged contender.

    What has happened so far in some ways was to be expected, we are beating sub .500% teams (for the most part Houston playing in the west has probably a worse record than they deserve) and up until recently we were competing with the few above .500% teams that we have played since the change in coaching.

    Also while I am loathe to make excuses for the guys I will say that there are three things that have occurred that have changed the dynamics of the team over the past couple of weeks.

    Mike Dunleavy was injured, yes everybody’s favorite whipping boy (I’ll admit that I join in on this on occasion) has shown that he is more valuable than many of us may have suspected. Frank also injected Brandon Rush into the starting spot even though just a few games prior to that he was getting very limited min. We’ll talk more about this in a minute.

    The O.J. Mayo for Josh McRoberts trade went public. Josh seems to have overcome this although I do believe for the first couple of games he didn’t seem all there, but that could have just been my perception. But at the end of the day a player who thought that he would sign his new contract with his hometown team found out he was going to be dealt, sorry but that might affect chemistry. It might not as well, but we’ll never know.

    Lance Stevenson has been inserted into the lineup. Now while he has done superbly, his min. are not coming at the cost of Mike’s. He is getting some of his time at the point guard spot and thus is taking time away from A.J. & Darren Collison. Again, team chemistry issues might be at play here.

    Any three of these things could be having an impact on the team. However there are other things at play as well.

    First and foremost two of the previous teams that we have played on this trip are actual contenders for the Western Conference finals. In other words there is a chance that one of the two of them might play in the NBA finals (I doubt it but*there is*a chance). So in other words they are just better than us.

    It sucks, nobody likes to admit that but it is the truth.

    So I’m not going to sweat bullets about losing to those teams because at the end of the day you supposed to lose and as long as you competed you really can’t expect much more. *They competed vs. the Mavericks but did not do so swell vs. the Thunder.

    The Houston game is another story though. There certainly was a lack of passion and a lack of organization. Long trip, tough road games, circumstances beyond your control, etc. None of that really matters. You still have to lace them up and compete.

    Look the good Pacers teams of the 90’s would often times lay an egg, it happens. Slick used to say that you could expect 4-5 of these types a game every year from even good teams.

    But this seemed a little different. I can’t tell you exactly what it was I saw but there were some issues that seemed to make me believe that the on court chemistry was disrupted in some fashion.

    From reading Mike Wells tweets from the post game area it sounds like chemistry is being discussed by the players themselves.

    So while they talk amongst themselves let us have our own conversation.

    Let me get all of the clichés out of the way right now.

    We are a young team so inconsistency is going to be an issue.

    We don’t have a batman and at best we might have the substitute Robin (not even good enough to be the real Robin).

    We need a better power forward.

    Lance isn’t a point guard.

    Tyler is better than Josh and should start.

    Josh is better than Tyler and he should be more aggressive with his own shot.

    Brandon Rush is a useless turd.

    Brandon Rush is the best defender on our team and if everyone else would just hit their shots his lack of offense wouldn’t be so noticeable.

    Roy Hibbert is one of the best young centers today.

    Roy Hibbert is a sack of crap.

    I’m sure there are about 100 other things that have been thrown out here on the digest lately but we’ll just go with these for now. The sad thing is that all of the above have a basis in truth, but as always they don’t tell the whole story.

    So instead of clichés let’s see if we can’t pin point some of the problems that our club has been facing lately.

    Let’s just start right at the top. Danny Granger is our best player and that really bothers a lot of people and to a point they are correct in pointing out that if he is your best player you probably overall are not going to be a great team, in particular if he is far and away your best player.

    I think Danny right now is suffering from chronic losing fatigue syndrome. I think he is gassed from playing for two solid years and I think he is suffering from some fans bloated expectations of him.

    Danny is not now*nor will he ever be LeBron James. Danny is not a top tier*level talent in the Association. That doesn’t mean he is a bottom tier one either but I think some fans expect him to take the ball at the top of the key at the end of the game and do some fancy juke move to get to the basket and score at will. That’s not his game nor should it be expected of him. He is basically a decent shooter who can get to the basket but often times lacks the dribbling ability to get there in traffic.

    Now it is not unreasonable though for people to question him about his sometimes lackadaisical defense. He can be a lock down defender when he wants to be and that is what really frustrates many people is the fact that more often than not he does not want to do that.

    However in all fairness to Danny he is doing all of this with basically a new cast all around him. Not a single starter in the game tonight started every game with him last season. Remember Roy was still getting pulled for matchup issues and Josh didn’t even play half of the year, Darren was in N.O. and Brandon split time with Mike.

    Consistency has not been there for him.

    There has been a lot of talk about moving Danny on the Digest*and I just want to add a couple of things about that. Sure if a no brain trade falls in your lap (say Orlando wants to dump Dwight Howard)*you take it. But Danny is still young and most likely whatever you get back for him will not be anywhere near the talent that he is. Why not add talent with him either via trade, free agency or maybe even home grown (Paul, Lance, etc.) and build a team that way.

    Darren Collison has got to remove his cranium from his anal cavity. Frankly over the past three games if you ask me to single out the one giant deficiency in our team I would firmly point the finger or probably give the finger to our starting point guard. He is in a shooting slump, it happens so I’m not going to bag him on that. But his defense has been abysmal, his passing has been lazy and is it my imagination or is he getting worse about ball control? Every minute he has been on the floor usually my blood pressure has spiked. To make matters worse not only is he not scoring now and allowing his man to pretty much score at will his partner in crime has contributed nothing to the offensive cause to help the team either.

    When your starting back court provides you with*8 whole points of offense in a game should it come as a surprise to anyone that your bench is always having to come in try and play catch up?

    I’ll say that again because it merits repeating. Our starting guard combination provided 8 points of offense between the two of them to go along with two assists. Oh by the way the two assists were both Brandon Rush’s.

    If Frank needs to make a change, and frankly (no pun intended) if we suffer a loss to Philly something will need to change, I suggest that instead of doing what I’m sure he will feel pressured to do and start Tyler over Josh. He should bench both guards and start A.J. and Paul, however realistically he won’t bench Collison as they are hoping he is the long term answer at the point (at this*time I am not willing to say that myself) but he needs to move Brandon to the bench and start either Dahntay or Paul. I’d start Paul but if he wants to leave him with the second unit so be it.

    Our starters are pretty much zombies to start off the game and honestly an injection of energy would be a good thing.

    Josh is the only starter right now I feel who is giving you consistent play night in and night out. It’s not spectacular or anything but it is good and consistent. He is usually not the reason we start off slow.

    Roy, Roy, Roy…. I don’t even know what to say about him. About any center that has any form of lower body strength just pushes him off of the blocks and makes it so that he can’t get into position. To top that off teams are coming at him early with the double team and Roy is being very slow in deciding what to do with the ball and often times when he does decide to do something with it he usually ends up throwing up a hook shot that has almost no hope of going in. This is where Dunleavy not being here is hurting. Mike moves without the ball so his man is not able to slack off of him and double Roy and often times Mike is moving towards the basket and Roy hits him for a shot or if nothing else it give him someone to throw the ball to without having to chuck it over two players who are just hovering around him.

    I like Roy’s work ethic, but this off season he has got to work on some form of body strength and control. He did a magnificent job last year of being more agile and faster, now add some strength to the mixture and next year hopefully will be better.

    I’ve changed my mind, I’m not going to do every player. This has already gone longer than I wanted and I’m afraid of jumbling it up even more than I have already.

    I want to end with this.

    While I am not happy with losing, never have been never will be, I will say that I am happy knowing that the players that are losing now are players who I feel will be part of the club for the foreseeable future and the time on the floor (win or lose) is a learning experience. Reggie and company did not play one year and then go to the Eastern Conference finals. No there were many years of struggling and first round exits and frustration that everybody (players and fans alike) had to go through. Well while I am not saying that we have the ingrediants yet to be like that team I think we really are now on the real process of seeing what we have on this team. We may have to change some things, we may have to add some things and at the end we may just have to be patient with some things, but it is important to note that we are now fully in the process of doing this. Which up until slightly more than a month ago we were not.

    Back to Indy to face the 76ers.


    *beeps*

  • #2
    Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

    Excellent post/article!

    If I had the ability to make a post that coherent and express my opinion about our resent troubles the well, it would read like this one.
    "Just look at the flowers ........ BANG" - Carol "The Walking Dead"

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

      I am just going to mention Hibbert. He is a real enigma to me, and I am a doubter lately.

      He shows you that he has NBA skills and great energy... and then some games he will be not just a non factor, but an actual negative factor. Airball hookshots for the fast break... It might as well be a turnover really.

      So that is what I am seeing, the air ball-brick hook shots, and he never passes out of double teams, he forces his shot while being double-triple teamed. He is better on the defensive end, but that is not saying much... He is a really good shot blocker when helping. I give him props on that, but you know he is 7'2"... of course he is a good help-defense shot blocker. His rebounding is so bad though... I feel he is just concentrating on the wrong parts of his game. He needs to get the basics down on how to rebound with his body instead of his hands, among other things. How do you teach a guy in his mid 20s fundamental basketball? I don't know if you can... Maybe 2 more years with Jeff will help?

      Roy in November was considered the future. The untouchable. The guy who was going to be the face of the franchise.

      At this point I am wondering if he is worth the MLE.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

        i dont know if it is just me , but from watching some of the games lately it seems as if the other team always manages to get a player open without any problems for a free shot that always seems to go in.ive noticed that they do attempt to play defense but for some reason the other teams always manage to hit hard shots even though they have a hand in their face or a hand on the ball or even being totally off balance. i have come to the assumption that we are just cursed for some reason, things dont seem to be going right. i think something has to be done in the off season to get another star in here to help granger not only with points but with the leadership this ballclub badly needs, we have enough assets and after this season we should be looking at using them to our advantage. ive been a fan of the pacers since the early 90s and it hurts so much watching this basketball team go through what they are going through. my hope is dwindling , ive always tried to look on the bright side, but that bright side looks very dark for me. the pacers dont look like a team , they look like pretenders and as if they just cant wait for season to end. BIG CHANGES ARE NEEDED MAKE IT HAPPEN lost all my faith
        THIS IS THE LAST TIME YOU HEAR MY VOICE , NEXT TIME YOU WILL SEE MY FACE

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

          I'm taking the JOB philosophy and tell you that this is a load of crap. It's all about confidence and this team is as soft as a baby's butt when it comes to confidence. Simply witness their first 10 games once O'Brien was fired, then look at how they have played the minute things get tough.
          Can't really point any fingers at one or two particular players, as you win or lose as a TEAM, but they certainly have shown when the going gets tough, these Pacers look for the quick out.
          Maybe it's youth...maybe it's that they just don't have the talent. But there's no excuse for not being competitive.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

            Is our team mentally tough? I'm not sure.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

              Originally posted by RoboHicks View Post
              While I am not happy with losing, never have been never will be, I will say that I am happy knowing that the players that are losing now are players who I feel will be part of the club for the foreseeable future and the time on the floor (win or lose) is a learning experience.
              Really? I'm having trouble pointing at any single guy on the roster and saying "That guy will be here when we make the 2nd round of the playoffs."
              "A man with no belly has no appetite for life."

              - Salman Rushdie

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

                ok i took a breath..........................EVERYTHINGS THE SAME!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

                  Originally posted by Thingfish View Post
                  I am just going to mention Hibbert. He is a real enigma to me, and I am a doubter lately.

                  He shows you that he has NBA skills and great energy... and then some games he will be not just a non factor, but an actual negative factor. Airball hookshots for the fast break... It might as well be a turnover really.

                  So that is what I am seeing, the air ball-brick hook shots, and he never passes out of double teams, he forces his shot while being double-triple teamed. He is better on the defensive end, but that is not saying much... He is a really good shot blocker when helping. I give him props on that, but you know he is 7'2"... of course he is a good help-defense shot blocker. His rebounding is so bad though... I feel he is just concentrating on the wrong parts of his game. He needs to get the basics down on how to rebound with his body instead of his hands, among other things. How do you teach a guy in his mid 20s fundamental basketball? I don't know if you can... Maybe 2 more years with Jeff will help?

                  Roy in November was considered the future. The untouchable. The guy who was going to be the face of the franchise.

                  At this point I am wondering if he is worth the MLE.
                  I think unless we find that PF we're talking about - the big, physical, big-minute rebounding machine - Roy will probably never be really effective as a starter. A good backup, yes. We've all talked about the Smits comparison. I think this is one of the strongest similarities.
                  I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

                  -Emiliano Zapata

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

                    Originally posted by flox View Post
                    Is our team mentally tough? I'm not sure.
                    Actually, the current core group hasn't shown any mental toughness. Can't recall much of that since J. Jack. Not saying he's the answer at all. Just saying that's the last time I remember much fight.

                    Here I mean against all teams, too. Not just the cupcakes that coincided with the switch to Vogel. Even in a game like Dallas, where we obviously stayed in striking distance, I thought we looked (as a unit) like in our minds we knew we were defeated.
                    I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

                    -Emiliano Zapata

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

                      Originally posted by flox View Post
                      Is our team mentally tough? I'm not sure.
                      If anything, I'm more sure we're not.
                      "A man with no belly has no appetite for life."

                      - Salman Rushdie

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

                        Originally posted by D-BONE View Post
                        I think unless we find that PF we're talking about - the big, physical, big-minute rebounding machine - Roy will probably never be really effective as a starter. A good backup, yes. We've all talked about the Smits comparison. I think this is one of the strongest similarities.
                        That's exactly right. Roy needs help in the paint. If he had a great rebounder or someone who could provide him space his shortcomings would not be as big a deal. i still like Roy for the immediate future.

                        Not sure why Roy and Tyler can't work together but right now i prefer Tyler with Foster.
                        Last edited by speakout4; 03-06-2011, 10:34 AM.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

                          I definitely would not say this is a tough team, but I believe there is a spectrum of toughness as opposed to a yes/no you are or you are not belief.

                          I'm not sure where they are on that spectrum. I'd guess towards the middle and probably a notch over from the middle towards the soft side. But I also don't feel like I'm watching the Charmin All-Stars.

                          I think our biggest problem is our constantly poor defense. A lot of it is mental breakdowns on team defense, some of it is poor individual play (particularly our guards), and then also the scheme itself IMO needs to be tweaked. I don't like when it encourages unnecessary help, which results in wide open corner threes or otherwise lets the offense have opportunities to burn us that we didn't need to give them automatically.

                          I consider all of that to be more about inexperience and inability moreso than some kind of severe toughness deficit.

                          Next DC has to pull his head out from his ***, and Roy isn't too far behind him. Danny recommitting (permanently would be nice) to his man to man defense would certainly help, too.

                          All of the above would go a long way towards righting the ship. Does mental toughness have something to do with it? Probably, but I think it gets too much play in discussions about the team.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

                            We have beat the teams we should beat. We have lost to some of the top teams in the league and Houston on a road trip and back to back.

                            Calm down. We all know we are a young team learning how to play at the pro level.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Odd Thoughts: Let?s take a breath

                              I can deal with losses, but I'd like to see more equally distributed and consistent intensity. I get that inexperience affects that. Not to mention the new coach honeymoon effect and quality of opponent.

                              Still, I'd really like play together and leave everything out there each night. If you do that and lose, no complaints. If you do that an look sloppy so be it. The most important thing they need to do right now is get everyone back on the same page...team focus, commitment and effort.

                              This includes making lineup changes. If Vogel thinks it will help - and in the case of Rush and Collison I don't think it would a rash decision at this point - he shouldn't have to worry about bruising somebody's ego. Not if he thinks the team could benefit from it in the short term. It doesn't mean it's permanent.
                              I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

                              -Emiliano Zapata

                              Comment

                              Working...
                              X