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Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

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  • #31
    Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

    I do not want to see Rush traded unless it's part of an exceptional deal for Indiana. Rush is our most accurate 3-point shooter, best defender, most athletic player, and played the most minutes. He also has been very healthy, the only guy we have who played in all 82 games. All this and he's just finishing his second season. Wow, total bust!

    I do not give a damn if Rush fits into JOB's system. JOB needs to leave, not Rush. With Murphy and JOB gone (please let this be their last year here), Rush would be much more valuable to us. Our PF should be getting offensive rebounds and blocking shots, not gunning 3's. If we're planning to adjust the team for JOB's preferences, we're planning for abysmal failure. His ridiculous system does not work.

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    • #32
      Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

      Originally posted by wintermute View Post
      yes, they're still there.



      that's funny, i just tried doing that (copy from word to the textbox in the browser), but it just shows plain text without any funny formatting. is there something like a "paste as text" option when you're trying to put it into pd? that might remove the problem.
      On a PC, paste into notepad, copy again, paste into browser.

      On a Mac, copy into Text Edit, select "make plain text" from the format menu, copy text, paste into browser.
      “Success is not final, failure is not fatal: it is the courage to continue that counts.” - Winston Churchill

      “If you can't be a good example, then you'll just have to serve as a horrible warning.” - Catherine Aird

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      • #33
        Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

        Originally posted by pacergod2 View Post
        I am not in disagreement about the need to trade Rush in many of these scenarios. I just don't value Gordon over Rush very much. I think Rush would be much better playing for another team or in another system. I value the things he is capable of at this point since he has only played two years in the league. Gordon is not the home run type of trade I would be willing to come off Rush for. Gordon is a solid scorer and defender. He has a sweet stroke. I don't think his basketball IQ is better than Rush's. His aggressiveness may be, but not his understanding of the game necessarily. Also, I think Rush is better defensively. Gordon is a very good defender for being 6'3" and guarding SG's, but when he starts to lose a step it will really adversely affect him. Rush is long. He has a nice stroke. He is fundamentally sound.

        Our team is SOOOO bad and a terrible fit for many of the things that Rush does well, IMO. Gordon would fit better for us for one year of JOB basketball and then I don't value Gordon much more than Rush. If we had a traditional PG that we didn't rely on to score, then yes give me Gordon. But IMO it is about fit. And at this point I don't want to give up an additional asset just because our team doesn't fit together well. I see Rush Granger and Hibbert being a very nice core. You replace that with Gordon and I don't see some remarkable improvement. You give up #10 that could be used to fill in a PG or PF to get a team with better fit. For me, I don't see Rush as a "hole". Obviously as you stated. I just see our team being a terrible fit for him. He is the fifth option offensively. What do you expect by pushing a more capable player offensively to a lesser role in the offense? Get rid of Troy Murphy and if Brandon doesn't become a better scorer I will concede to your assessment, but not until we quit having a PF attempting to play SG.
        I don't think I said it had to be Gordon but I merely used him as an example. ALso Gordon is not a home run player to me. He is more of a "double" type player that I was referring to in baseball terminology.

        I also don't understand why you think JOB and Murphy are the reason why Rush is not developing. Is JOB telling him to pass up open looks or to defer to Murphy? IMO, Rush is playing much like he did when he was at Kansas for 3 years under a different coach. He just defers to people who are aggressive. I personally want a guy who doesn't need to be "thrusted" into the second option role. A Gordon "like" palyer doesn't need a pf to be removed because he likes to shoot 3's. He also doesn't need a franchise to figure out how his brain is hard wired.

        At the end of this offseason I just would be happy to have 3 pieces in place for the future. Give me Granger, Hibbert, and a pg,sg,pf in any combination.

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        • #34
          Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

          Another point is that when Troy was out w/ injury or illness, Brandon's aggressiveness and ppg really improved as he was much more a focal point in the offence...
          "George's athleticism is bananas!" - Marc J. Spears

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          • #35
            Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

            Troy hovers around the top of the key for his three point shooting. Brandon typically moves from corner to elbow around the three point line, because that is the spacing required in our offense. Since there is little inside-out ball movement, it typically takes two or more passes for Rush to even get the ball. His 3-point percentage was solid because most of his threes were wide open due to being one of the last guys to touch the ball. When Brandon receives a pass on the perimeter, he tends to look to set up Hibbert in the post or pass to a cutter as opposed to putting the ball on the floor and driving to the basket. It takes ball and player movement to open up spacing. I will take a player that looks to initiate others before himself all day every day. Troy takes three point looks away from our perimeter players. JOB likes this because we don't have a PG that can shoot the three. This gives us three players that hit the outside shot. Unfortunately, our PG's aren't capable of getting the offensive rebounds that our PF SHOULD be getting.

            If we had a system where we initiated the offense with three perimeter players on the perimeter and two big men in the post/high post, then we would see more initial passes to Brandon and Danny who could make the appropriate reads to either hit the cutter or the big man in the low post (even the high post in JOB's system). Danny and Brandon would play the wings. I see way too many times that the PG will shovel a hand-off pass to Danny as he approaches the top of the key. That is NOT how to initiate spacing. That is how you get the best player on your team the ball with a short clock. Brandon immediately gets more touches when you use a three man perimeter offense. We essentially use a five man perimeter game since our Big is asked to start at the high post. Brandon is forced into the action more quickly and more often when he plays the legitimate wing. Not the corner. I would rather utilize Brandon in the high post as a PF type if we are going to have Troy roaming the perimeter so much. Give me a traditional offense and you will see Rush be a better player. There is a reason that Charlotte (Brown) and San Antonio (Popovich) have inquired about him. They realize how poorly he is being utilized and how well he would fit their defensive minded philosophies with more traditional inside-out offenses.
            "Your course, your path, is not going to be like mine," West says. "Everybody is not called to be a multimillionaire. Everybody's not called to be the president. Whatever your best work is, you do it. Do it well. … You cease your own greatness when you aspire to be someone else."

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            • #36
              Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

              Originally posted by tadscout View Post
              Another point is that when Troy was out w/ injury or illness, Brandon's aggressiveness and ppg really improved as he was much more a focal point in the offence...
              This is a rhetorical question...

              How did Brandon do when Danny was out? He did much better because he was asked to be a bigger part of the offense. He looked like a different player to me. Yes he wasn't that consistently amazing in the time that Danny missed, but he was still a second year player who was more involved and effective with Danny out.

              Please GOD tell Larry Bird in an epiphany that he needs to trade Troy Murphy!!!
              "Your course, your path, is not going to be like mine," West says. "Everybody is not called to be a multimillionaire. Everybody's not called to be the president. Whatever your best work is, you do it. Do it well. … You cease your own greatness when you aspire to be someone else."

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              • #37
                Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

                Originally posted by Los Angeles View Post
                On a PC, paste into notepad, copy again, paste into browser.

                On a Mac, copy into Text Edit, select "make plain text" from the format menu, copy text, paste into browser.
                Type text in notepad
                Cut and paste into Excel
                Highlight column...hit center.
                Cut and Paste into Word.
                Change Font to Courier Bold 14 point.
                Change paper in printer to Wausau Exact Vellum Bristol Color Paper (67 lb weight).

                Print three copies.

                Crumple the first copy in your right hand, switch to left hand, then use your left hand to throw it backwards over your right shoulder. After completing this, spit on the ground between your feet.

                Take the second copy, fold three times, then put in a standard letter envelope. Seal Envelope, address to Santa Claus, ensuring that at least one of the S's is backwards. Put at least 7 First Class Stamps on it, drop in mailbox.

                Take the third (and most important) copy, tear it up into at least 43 separate pieces. Put the pieces in a plain brown paper lunch sack, along with three Pringles potato chips and a hair plucked from the scalp of your first born child. (If you have no children, then you may substitute three pubic hairs from an adult male llama.)

                Tightly close the sack, going outside on your lawn or front stoop, wait for someone to come by then - and this is crucial - begin twirling the bag over your head in a counterclockwise motion while spinning 5 times in a clockwise motion and clucking like a chicken.

                Once complete, hurl the bag at the bystander and charge them with your arms raised high, yelling, "Booga-Booga-Booga."

                Then, go back inside and type the text directly into the php.

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                • #38
                  Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

                  As I said in another thread a week or two ago, when it comes to
                  Rush's mentality on the court, it's worth remembering that he'll
                  be 25 years old in a few wks. He's not a 20 year old kid who's
                  finding his sea legs. He's an adult, a man. He is what he is and
                  will likely continue to be.

                  In a different system with a bit different group of players around
                  him, that may be just fine. But hoping that he's gonna bust out
                  of his shell at some point from an aggressiveness standpoint is
                  probably a pipedream.

                  I like the guy. I don't necessarily WANT to see him traded. But if
                  he is, it won't bother me much either.

                  Comment


                  • #39
                    Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

                    Originally posted by Speed View Post
                    My point is I don’t want to part with Brush unless it’s really something that provides an answer for the team.
                    Is this in response to the Eric Gordon rumor? I like Brandon, and don't want to move him just for the sake of moving him. But I think Gordon is an overall upgrade from Rush. Can any move be labeled 'the answer' when there are so many question marks?

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

                      Originally posted by count55 View Post
                      Type text in notepad
                      Cut and paste into Excel
                      Highlight column...hit center.
                      Cut and Paste into Word.
                      Change Font to Courier Bold 14 point.
                      Change paper in printer to Wausau Exact Vellum Bristol Color Paper (67 lb weight).

                      Print three copies.

                      Crumple the first copy in your right hand, switch to left hand, then use your left hand to throw it backwards over your right shoulder. After completing this, spit on the ground between your feet.

                      Take the second copy, fold three times, then put in a standard letter envelope. Seal Envelope, address to Santa Claus, ensuring that at least one of the S's is backwards. Put at least 7 First Class Stamps on it, drop in mailbox.

                      Take the third (and most important) copy, tear it up into at least 43 separate pieces. Put the pieces in a plain brown paper lunch sack, along with three Pringles potato chips and a hair plucked from the scalp of your first born child. (If you have no children, then you may substitute three pubic hairs from an adult male llama.)

                      Tightly close the sack, going outside on your lawn or front stoop, wait for someone to come by then - and this is crucial - begin twirling the bag over your head in a counterclockwise motion while spinning 5 times in a clockwise motion and clucking like a chicken.

                      Once complete, hurl the bag at the bystander and charge them with your arms raised high, yelling, "Booga-Booga-Booga."

                      Then, go back inside and type the text directly into the php.
                      Is it too late to change my "Most Humerous" vote?
                      Why do the things that we treasure most, slip away in time
                      Till to the music we grow deaf, to God's beauty blind
                      Why do the things that connect us slowly pull us apart?
                      Till we fall away in our own darkness, a stranger to our own hearts
                      And life itself, rushing over me
                      Life itself, the wind in black elms,
                      Life itself in your heart and in your eyes, I can't make it without you

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

                        If I am Bird I am willing to move BRUSH no question. The catch is who will play the 2? That of course is a factor in any trade or draft pick. RUSH still has value and someone will be willing to make a deal with him involved. I hate to give up on a player, but his demeanor on the court has grown tiresome. It is obvious that he has all the talent you need, just not the fire to be more consistent. I think long term RUSH will be a decent role player on a team, but we need someone at the 2, who can be consistent shooting and driving to the basket. And showing a little passion on court wouldn't hurt either. IMO
                        Avatar photo credit: Bahram Mark Sobhani - AP

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                        • #42
                          Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

                          Originally posted by QuickRelease View Post
                          Is this in response to the Eric Gordon rumor? I like Brandon, and don't want to move him just for the sake of moving him. But I think Gordon is an overall upgrade from Rush. Can any move be labeled 'the answer' when there are so many question marks?
                          No, I actually had the Augustine, Gerald Henderson, Mohammad for TJ Ford and BRush trade in mind when I was writing this. I'm for moving BRush if it brings back an answer to a spot like starting PG, but not if it just creates more questions. It sounds like almost the whole board is thinking the same thing on this one.

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

                            Originally posted by Speed View Post
                            No, I actually had the Augustine, Gerald Henderson, Mohammad for TJ Ford and BRush trade in mind when I was writing this. I'm for moving BRush if it brings back an answer to a spot like starting PG, but not if it just creates more questions. It sounds like almost the whole board is thinking the same thing on this one.
                            Remember, that was pretty much going to happen until Charlotte (or their owner) got cold feet and backed out. Recall that TJ Ford was doing dances and saying his goodbyes because he assumed it was a done deal.

                            Regardless, that tells you Bird is very much open to moving Rush.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

                              An idea I have is to at least keep a defensive player in DJones or Rush to play backup SG and bring in a shooter to play backup SF like Gordon Hayward.

                              I was thinking the only way I would deal Brandon as young value not a throw in.

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                              • #45
                                Re: Why dealing Brush might be a mistake?

                                Rush is a reluctant shooter which is a bit of a problem for a SG. However, like many pacers he is forced to play out of position. I wouldn't mind seeing Brandon play some SF but we already have quite a few guys who like the Sf position. We have Murphy who is allergic to the paint area. We have Dun who I believe is suited to SG but can play SF; and Granger of course.
                                Finally we have TJ who also likes to shoot more than he likes to pass.
                                When you look at the team you find too many guys who just aren't suited for their slots in one way or another.
                                Last edited by speakout4; 06-14-2010, 06:33 PM.

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