Re: Roy and Tyler: Supreme Tag Team Flexing Muscles
The good and the bad of summer league, the things I think we will see for at least the first few months of the regular season from these guys. To end with a happy note I'll start with the bad.
BAD
Roy and Tyler both play below the rim on the glass and are often beat out noticeably on the defensive glass where tip backs and 2nd chances seem to be the norm this summer for opponents. This is exactly the reason people saw Blair as such a nice fit for Indy. Neither player is very good at carving out space for boards.
Roy has gone into the Jeff Foster bad night realm of missed bunnies and putbacks, including missing a bunny that he turned into a dunk when it came right back to him. It was accidental stat padding for Jeff and the same is true for Roy. People are going to get frustrated with this part of his game in a hurry.
Roy also is lost on defense, at least early on. When they first set up he looks awkward and confused about exactly where he needs to be, who he's setting up against, and where the initial attack is going to come from. For example, if it's a transition and he is back first, he will still linger well off the rim while scouting out for where his man is going to setup. Meanwhile behind him a guard beats his man and comes to the rim uncontested. He's gotta learn to see that initial threat unfolding instead of worrying so much about finding his guy when that dude is still at halfcourt and not a threat.
Tyler just plays below the rim A LOT. After all this "boy, you should have seen his hops during tryouts, this kid was surprisingly atheletic" what we have instead seen is exactly the reason he was ranked lower all these years as a prospect. When stopped in the post he absolutely can't score over people. He can't face up and raise up at all without getting stuffed. He can't spin by someone for the dunk. None of this. He works through his series of admittedly nice fundamental post work spins, ducks, etc and if he doesn't get what amounts to an open layup out of that (or the foul) he's basically screwed.
The same applies to his defense, he can be shot over and if he doesn't catch his man off guard early on with a quick swipe it gets pretty uncomfortable. People that wanted a defensive post presence are not going to be happy come JAN. If Blair has a good start himself this will again creep up to haunt Larry.
Both aren't very good at getting post position. Tyler is better IMO, but both can be beat to their spot by moderately capable post defenders. For Tyler this means no post game at that point, whereas Roy can be fed over the top due to his height. Stil Roy is much better when he gets in front of his man and clamps him out since it opens up a lot more options for him.
GOOD
Roy has a fabulous hook shot working and I think he'll get that at will as long as he is fed correctly in the post. At his height this is as lethal as Rik's turn jumper was. It's almost unblockable.
Roy has shown some really nice passing out of the post to all sorts of cutters. He carries great offensive awareness and the ability to make good on it.
Along that same line he looks terrific working the PnR too. He understands the objective and his role in it. With AJ Price as his other half he ran picture perfect NBA PnRs on Boston.
Tyler draws fouls like an elite. There is a trend there in keeping with his NC days. I doubted he could do it, but so far I'm a believer. Part of it is hustle but it's far more than that. Tyler is quicker than you would think. Oh, and since he is a great FT shooter he's going to cash in a lot at the line.
That quickness works best when Tyler can get post position because his first step is ultra-quick. As soon as the ball is on him he goes into a very quick spin with solid footwork that gives him an instant advantage on his man. At that point he's very likely to draw the catch-up foul, and if the help defense isn't there he's going to score the basket too.
Tyler has a similar quick turnaround that gives him a nice bit of space to shoot his low jumper. It will take a pretty quick defender to stuff this shot.
Tyler at times has show the range he had in college. I wish it had been more consistant, but Rush also couldn't buy a bucket in game 1 so who knows. It does seem like Tyler will at least provide the same Foster jumper we saw last season and that will work well in JOB's system.
Roy has limited his fouls a bit and isn't reaching quite as bad. He's closed out on guard pull-up jumpers that resulted in misses thanks to his imposing height/reach. His defense is Smits-like most of the time, but still somewhat effective as a shot blocking deterrent type.
Tyler and Roy both work the transition game well. Tyler especially hustles back and this gives him free chances he normally wouldn't have.
McBob
Having said all that, I think McRoberts looked better than either of them in most ways. He needs to play a little calmer with the ball. He has the handles and I'm fine with him bringing it up and making plays, but he drifted into all-star game offense in his limited time too.
Still it's hard to deny that prior to his injury he was the most exciting player out there for Indy. He gets up the floor faster than the other 2, has better handles, clearly better hops, gets better post position, plays stronger overall, plays above the rim more.
The main thing is that all 3 are DIFFERENT. You can mix up your looks and attack with these 3 and if we cross our fingers and they all pan out to a decent level, the Pacers will be set on the front line. Not all-stars, but perhaps Smits-Dale caliber (talent level, not game) "get the job done enough" types that are good enough to be part of a solid team.
The good and the bad of summer league, the things I think we will see for at least the first few months of the regular season from these guys. To end with a happy note I'll start with the bad.
BAD
Roy and Tyler both play below the rim on the glass and are often beat out noticeably on the defensive glass where tip backs and 2nd chances seem to be the norm this summer for opponents. This is exactly the reason people saw Blair as such a nice fit for Indy. Neither player is very good at carving out space for boards.
Roy has gone into the Jeff Foster bad night realm of missed bunnies and putbacks, including missing a bunny that he turned into a dunk when it came right back to him. It was accidental stat padding for Jeff and the same is true for Roy. People are going to get frustrated with this part of his game in a hurry.
Roy also is lost on defense, at least early on. When they first set up he looks awkward and confused about exactly where he needs to be, who he's setting up against, and where the initial attack is going to come from. For example, if it's a transition and he is back first, he will still linger well off the rim while scouting out for where his man is going to setup. Meanwhile behind him a guard beats his man and comes to the rim uncontested. He's gotta learn to see that initial threat unfolding instead of worrying so much about finding his guy when that dude is still at halfcourt and not a threat.
Tyler just plays below the rim A LOT. After all this "boy, you should have seen his hops during tryouts, this kid was surprisingly atheletic" what we have instead seen is exactly the reason he was ranked lower all these years as a prospect. When stopped in the post he absolutely can't score over people. He can't face up and raise up at all without getting stuffed. He can't spin by someone for the dunk. None of this. He works through his series of admittedly nice fundamental post work spins, ducks, etc and if he doesn't get what amounts to an open layup out of that (or the foul) he's basically screwed.
The same applies to his defense, he can be shot over and if he doesn't catch his man off guard early on with a quick swipe it gets pretty uncomfortable. People that wanted a defensive post presence are not going to be happy come JAN. If Blair has a good start himself this will again creep up to haunt Larry.
Both aren't very good at getting post position. Tyler is better IMO, but both can be beat to their spot by moderately capable post defenders. For Tyler this means no post game at that point, whereas Roy can be fed over the top due to his height. Stil Roy is much better when he gets in front of his man and clamps him out since it opens up a lot more options for him.
GOOD
Roy has a fabulous hook shot working and I think he'll get that at will as long as he is fed correctly in the post. At his height this is as lethal as Rik's turn jumper was. It's almost unblockable.
Roy has shown some really nice passing out of the post to all sorts of cutters. He carries great offensive awareness and the ability to make good on it.
Along that same line he looks terrific working the PnR too. He understands the objective and his role in it. With AJ Price as his other half he ran picture perfect NBA PnRs on Boston.
Tyler draws fouls like an elite. There is a trend there in keeping with his NC days. I doubted he could do it, but so far I'm a believer. Part of it is hustle but it's far more than that. Tyler is quicker than you would think. Oh, and since he is a great FT shooter he's going to cash in a lot at the line.
That quickness works best when Tyler can get post position because his first step is ultra-quick. As soon as the ball is on him he goes into a very quick spin with solid footwork that gives him an instant advantage on his man. At that point he's very likely to draw the catch-up foul, and if the help defense isn't there he's going to score the basket too.
Tyler has a similar quick turnaround that gives him a nice bit of space to shoot his low jumper. It will take a pretty quick defender to stuff this shot.
Tyler at times has show the range he had in college. I wish it had been more consistant, but Rush also couldn't buy a bucket in game 1 so who knows. It does seem like Tyler will at least provide the same Foster jumper we saw last season and that will work well in JOB's system.
Roy has limited his fouls a bit and isn't reaching quite as bad. He's closed out on guard pull-up jumpers that resulted in misses thanks to his imposing height/reach. His defense is Smits-like most of the time, but still somewhat effective as a shot blocking deterrent type.
Tyler and Roy both work the transition game well. Tyler especially hustles back and this gives him free chances he normally wouldn't have.
McBob
Having said all that, I think McRoberts looked better than either of them in most ways. He needs to play a little calmer with the ball. He has the handles and I'm fine with him bringing it up and making plays, but he drifted into all-star game offense in his limited time too.
Still it's hard to deny that prior to his injury he was the most exciting player out there for Indy. He gets up the floor faster than the other 2, has better handles, clearly better hops, gets better post position, plays stronger overall, plays above the rim more.
The main thing is that all 3 are DIFFERENT. You can mix up your looks and attack with these 3 and if we cross our fingers and they all pan out to a decent level, the Pacers will be set on the front line. Not all-stars, but perhaps Smits-Dale caliber (talent level, not game) "get the job done enough" types that are good enough to be part of a solid team.
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