I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

[NPFII]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

UB has become a Euro-lover.

Team-offense??? Passing? Ball movement?! Smart players?????
Are you nuts?!!! It's the NB-f***ing-A - I thought that talent, athleticism & players with larger contracts will always prevail (even if it means losing)...

I wonder what happens to all this when JO returns and "demands" his 20 shots per game...

[quiller]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

Personally I've always believed you have to be able to adapt your offense to match your particular team. Through the past few years all types of offenses have won.... I mean why should the spurs run up and down the court all the time eliminating their best player Duncan... slow the game down let Duncan dominate on both ends.. You think Shaq would have won all those nba tittles if his team ran the ball like the Sun's do... that is why in a way it was better for both Dirk and Nash when Nash left.. Dirk seems better suited to a half court game then a up tempo game which Nash specializes in... if you want your team to run all the time and have a up tempo game with movement then you better have at least four players all comfortable with the ball in their hands who can catch and pass well other wise you will end up turning it over too much...

on the nba vrs college I never could see how the college game was so much better then the pro game... or the idea that pro's can not shoot the ball like they used to....

[MagicRat]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

Does this mean you've had a major metamorphosis in your beliefs about November 3, 2003?...............

[Kegboy]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

Usually I alway say, "The NBA is the best of the NCAA and guys that were good enough to skip the NCAA altogether."

[BlueNGold]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

I liked that quote from JOb. Ball movement and tough defense is the formula. Both the Pistons and Spurs have proven it.

[naptownmenace]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

The college game is for the slow-witted. There. I said it.

The only advantages it has are atmosphere and playoff gambling. If the NBA created the college atmosphere, rather than the celebrity-endorsement loudspeaker atmosphere it embraces currently, then this wouldn't be much of a conversation.

The NBA is like hockey, if you blink, you miss it. Claiming that the slower, tighter-spaced, easier to follow game is better doesn't make any sense. You might as well claim that T-ball is better than MLB or flag football is better than the NFL.

And if anyone wants to claim that the NCAA plays more team ball, it's clear that you only watch the best NCAA teams (like the ones that get into the tourney). The best teams in the NBA have always played great team ball. This includes every dynasty in the history of the sport.

I graduated from NCAA fan to NBA fan because I outgrew the NCAA game. The NBA game commands my attention. It challenges me to understand what I'm seeing. The slower game, while somewhat entertaining, doesn't challenge me the same way.

That's the best explaination of the NBA versus the NCAA I've ever read.

Usually I alway say, "The NBA is the best of the NCAA and guys that were good enough to skip the NCAA altogether."

That shuts up my NCAA luvin' friends everytime.

[Unclebuck]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

Intresting that you mention one on one offense and talk about Kobe and MJ. They both played for Phil in the Triangle. The Triangle is one of my favorite offenses to watch, maybe because it's not to common.

I mentioned those two players very much on purpose. 5-10 years ago everyone was saying that more teams should try to run the triangle offense (afterall look at how successful Phil Jackson was with it) I always argued that sure any offense would be successful with Jordan and then with Shaq (in his prime) and Kobe. Does anyone remember Quinn Buckner's attempt of running it with the Mavs - disaster.

[JayRedd]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

I'd hate college basketball too if all my regional broadcasts were of the Big 10. Come over to the Big East and watch the real ballers get down.





.

[Young]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

Intresting that you mention one on one offense and talk about Kobe and MJ. They both played for Phil in the Triangle. The Triangle is one of my favorite offenses to watch, maybe because it's not to common.

But there is no doubt that a moition/passing offense (basically the Princeton offense) can work in the NBA. And there is no doubt in my mind that it can work well for the Pacers.

Here is my question, has Jim just simply adjusted to a different personnel or did he really change his thinking? I'll say this, Jim never had the depth of talent in Boston or Minnesota. He never had a post player like Jermaine. And he didn't have these good, solid players such as Danny, Jamaal, Mike, and Marquis. In Boston Jim had more role players such as Kenny Anderson and Rodney Rogers. I think that the personnel on this Pacers team gives Jim more flexibility in the type of offense he wants to run.

This should be a great year. Players and fans have wanted a change and here it is.

[Jim R]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

I'd like to think the NBA overseers changed the rules precisely to get this kind of result.

Are they that smart?

There is no question this was the desired result. The ability to play a zone or a defense with zone tendencies, re: help side defenses, almost necessitates ball movement and player movement away from the ball.

You attack that kind of a defense by moving it, by stretching it from side to side, attacking its gaps to contract it. The other way you beat it is to beat it down the floor with early offense. Teams who can play this way will run for a quick, quality shot. If they can't you will likely see them exhaust the shot clock for something called.

The NBA game brought the shot clock to the college game, but the college coaches and international coaches taught the NBA coaches how to attack it. Early offense, offense in the middle of the shot clock, then a go to play or player for the end.

This isn't to say features such as two-man games and three-man games still don't or can't fluidly exist. You'll notice that NBA teams OFTEN ball screen after misses when they don't have numbers. That's for two reasons, early offense and two-man games.

So now you have teams running the floor harder and utilizing a lot more off the ball movement. It's starting to look like regular basketball. No question the old defensive rules of the NBA produced a ton of mis-matching, which really focused on spacing and standing in that space. So your point is valid, you can teach a dog new tricks.

[Major Cold]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

Besides March Madness NCAA basketball is weak. Who wants to watch IU play Western Carolina A&M. Granted when IU plays Purdue and Kentucky it get s exciting. But in large I am more thrilled with non-Pacer NBA than non-IU NCAA basketball. THe conference tourneys are a joke.

But because it is slower than the NBA, it is also more strategic? No. How are teams going to stop Devin Harris and Terry while guarding Dirk. Monta Ellis and Baron Davis with a side order of Jackson.

People who say that the NBA is lesser basketball just haven't watched it lately. They say they travel and palm the ball all the time (Jeff Green anybody). Well they last few years that has been cut back. Wasn't it Butler that was called for palming last night? Granger for traveling?

Now if only the refs become refs and not part of the show. Then I would have more confidence in the NBA.

[Hicks]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

I'm glad to hear it, UB.

However I've grown up believing you should do it at all levels. I understand the logic in what apparently Jim used to do, but my baptism to basketball was:

1) While I was in the middle of elementary school, where the YMCA ball I played was of course about the team instead of a star player

2) When I was taken to a lot of New Castle Trojans basketball games

3) At that time I was just learning about the NBA through videos about Larry Bird and 80's basketball.

All of them were about team basketball and passing. As I got a little older, I started watching other NBA documentaries, and my favorite was always "NBA's 100 Greatest Plays". I'll always remember Magic and his comments about "beautiful basketball". It was about the ball moving, all 5 guys involved. I've always wanted the Pacers to be that way. I'm thrilled with our current offense for this reason.

[Los Angeles]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

No, NEVER. I actually grew up being more of a college fan than an NBA fan - up until about 1990.

I wish the college season ran from June 15th through October 1st - I would be a huge fan if it did. But anytime there is a college game on there is always an NBA game at the same time and I always choose the NBA game.

The college game is for the slow-witted. There. I said it.

The only advantages it has are atmosphere and playoff gambling. If the NBA created the college atmosphere, rather than the celebrity-endorsement loudspeaker atmosphere it embraces currently, then this wouldn't be much of a conversation.

The NBA is like hockey, if you blink, you miss it. Claiming that the slower, tighter-spaced, easier to follow game is better doesn't make any sense. You might as well claim that T-ball is better than MLB or flag football is better than the NFL.

And if anyone wants to claim that the NCAA plays more team ball, it's clear that you only watch the best NCAA teams (like the ones that get into the tourney). The best teams in the NBA have always played great team ball. This includes every dynasty in the history of the sport.

I graduated from NCAA fan to NBA fan because I outgrew the NCAA game. The NBA game commands my attention. It challenges me to understand what I'm seeing. The slower game, while somewhat entertaining, doesn't challenge me the same way.

[Ragnar]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

You do realize you are the antithesis of basketball fans.

I am with UB on this one. If college was when the NBA was not on I would watch it all the time. But I will always pick NBA over college.

[Major Cold]

Re: I've had a major metamorphosis in my beliefs about NBA offenses

Thank you, I consider that a huge compliment.

It was meant to be one.