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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

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  • Naptown_Seth
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    PacerTom, as one of the resident Rick defenders let me point out one thing. Rick's rosters, including Detroit, have typically spread minutes out far more than the NBA norm. Guys do get chances, as we are pointing out with David right here.

    Even the famous Tins doghouse start saw Rick keep him in once he got the chance and did well. Everyone says "well Brown played him when Rick was booted". Fine, but then Rick came back and Tinsley stayed in as the starter the rest of the year...even when Anderson was healthy again.

    Shawne, Danny and David all saw spurts of minutes, would struggle, would lose minutes, then a few weeks later he'd test the water on them again.

    Rick may have put up with bad BEHAVIOR, but clearly he did not take it to the point of letting worse players in the game. Jackson for all his acting up was just an overall better option. IMO that's exactly why Rick did coddle him as a problem child otherwise and let him rant at him.

    The problem there is that Jack was their best SG option, not that Rick played him.

    So if players think that now they are going to get a fair chance, I call BS on that. Maybe bad behavior will get shut down and Tinsley coming late to practice will get him benched, but otherwise nobody is going to see more PT from JOB than they did with Rick.

    Pretty sure JOB actually has a history of focusing his PT around star players and that JO/Tins will likely see high points in MPG under him, rather than this rotation of "now let's see what you can do" competition for PT.

    About 2 weeks into camp it's going to be pretty clear where the talent on this roster is at, and considering the painful lack of starter-quality depth I doubt we are going to see a masssively open rotation.

    If David wants PT he better get his defensive footwork down tight, never set a moving screen, and maybe learn to hit a 3 every once in awhile. There is no way JOB gives him more PT chances than Rick did, barring injury. Remember that Rick had given rookie David decent minutes BEFORE the brawl even.

    Leave a comment:


  • Naptown_Seth
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    Originally posted by Putnam View Post
    He was often taken out of the game with two fouls, when the rules say a player can continue until he gets six fouls. The coach wasn't holding him in reserve or some special purpose. the coach was sitting him because he didn't play well.
    Exactly. It's not like fouls are just independent of the game, just things that keep you from playing.

    Gee David, maybe Rick didn't want the team to set an NBA record for getting into the penalty, maybe he didn't want the other team to be shooting FTs for 10 straight minutes, or to get 40 FTAs in a game.

    He wasn't protecting YOU, he was protecting the Pacers foul position. Not to mention the defense since the fouls were often your options on bad footwork (or just stupid reach-ins) and the LOST POSSESSIONS on your offensive fouls.

    "This is year four of, 'We need a big guy,' " Harrison said Tuesday at the annual Pacers Foundation, Inc., golf outing at Brickyard Crossing. "My mentality going into camp is if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.
    Welcome to the party pal.

    Leave a comment:


  • Slick Pinkham
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    I will be pleasantly stunned if he proves to be a capable 9th/10th/11th man. That should be his first goal, to try to earn a spot maybe just below the regular rotation, but getting solid minutes when JO or Murph is banged up, and also playing lots of 4th quarter minutes in blowouts. If he can handle that, then maybe he can earn a little more trust.

    One on the things that I am encouraged by with Obie, and maybe it's just because I believe some of the Star puff pieces, but he seems to be a coach with a strong philosophy that playing time has to be EARNED and that competition is not a bad thing. Also lazy defense will not be tolerated, and DH's well-chronicled tendency to get into foul trouble has EVERYTHING to do with being lazy on defense.

    Leave a comment:


  • Unclebuck
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    Originally posted by Oneal07 View Post
    The only thing I really remember about Harrison was when he knocked down Eddie House!! House went flying into the camera men and the New Jersey bench wanted for gang beatup Harrison!! House ended up being injured for the rest of the regular season
    I don't remember that. But I do remember many times being embarrassed by harrison's actions on the court and I do remember yelling at the coaches to get him off the floor, which they usually did

    Leave a comment:


  • Oneal07
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    The only thing I really remember about Harrison was when he knocked down Eddie House!! House went flying into the camera men and the New Jersey bench wanted for gang beatup Harrison!! House ended up being injured for the rest of the regular season

    Leave a comment:


  • McKeyFan
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    Harrison maturity = O.J.

    Leave a comment:


  • Major Cold
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    This is a big year for a lot of Pacer players.

    Diogu- He has two more years until a team option comes up. If he plays well and finds a role look for him to get an extension next year. If he plays well and does not find a role look for him to be traded.

    Foster- two years left with the last one being a player option (meaning after this season he can opt out). If he plays well we better trade him. But like many I think that his minutes will not come in bunches. He will be a good expiring contract to trade after this season.

    Graham- This years Rawle? Hopefully injuries will keep him on the inactive list.

    Granger-three years left with a team option and then a restricted FA. Needs to play for an extension. Being the second option will ensure that extension. JO being traded will give him the chance to shine as well.

    Harrison- two years left on his contract. If he provides a contribution then he is tradeable. If he explodes look for him to ask for an extension.

    JO- getting paid as a high franchise player who is not producing what he is getting paid. I can see him opting out if Bird voices similar frustrations about JO's qualities.

    Owens- Greene anyone? I don't see him making a difference, but I hope I am wrong.

    Rush- If anyone needs a big year its Rush. If he is solid look for him to get a long contract by someone. A bad season and it is a sad story indeed

    Williams- He has team options after next season and on. If he begins to slip hard and fast look for the players to cut him loose Eddie Griffin style. If he produces then all is well

    I might be wrong but I think that the above players have something to prove to us the fans, the coaching staff, managment, and themselves.

    Leave a comment:


  • tmhorn15
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    I think that Rick had his favorites and some of the other players began to believe that no matter what they did, good or bad, it wasn't going to make a difference. David did come into camp in good shape, but he also hurt his shoulder. Hopefully JOB will be able to help his maturity. If he played with better control, he may not injure himself so frequently.


    Also, does it seem that management and coaching staffs throughout the NBA are afraid to take the time to teach and help players mature because they don't want to appear to be coddling the players? There were so many young players coming into the NBA in the last decade without a lot of college, or any college, experience that the league seemed obsessed with making sure that they payed their dues and didn't get any special treatment that could be construed as trying to make up for inmaturity due to coming into the league too soon.


    I'm hoping that JOB does everything a coach should be doing for the players without worrying about how everyone else defines his style.

    Leave a comment:


  • Evan_The_Dude
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    Silly David. Hasn't he learned that the best way out of Indy is to break the law in some capacity and make the fans hate you?

    Leave a comment:


  • Shade
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
    I like O'Brien's approach, "if he deserves to be on the court, then he'll be on the court".

    Meaning he won't play any
    Yup.

    Leave a comment:


  • ABADays
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    With a new coach who knows what will happen. O'Brien's comment, however, seemed one of disinterest. At this point I'm for anyone who can, might, possibly elevate the team

    Leave a comment:


  • Speed
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    Originally posted by JayRedd View Post
    To the waiver wire?
    Well typically they do it AFTER the trade where it will come out that the player wanted to be traded. I was thinking like Antonio Davis, but maybe doing it on the front end. Another Example, Al being traded away the first time because Al wanted to start and Bird said almost verbitum well he wasn't gonna start in front of Ron and JO.

    I completely throwing darts in the dark here, but there is a history of them kinda covering themselves/distancing themselves from responsibility on trades. So if Harrison leaves and blows up (in a good way) they could say well he wanted to be traded its not totally our fault.

    Also, I was wondering does Atlanta have sign and trade rights to the Euro that was the Pacers had interest in?
    Last edited by Speed; 09-26-2007, 03:58 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • grace
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    Originally posted by intridcold View Post
    for what?

    Another worthless Euro who won't see the court
    I'm sure that's what Larry is looking for.

    Leave a comment:


  • grace
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    Originally posted by Kegboy View Post
    Did anybody else see the thread title and think it was JO speaking?
    First I thought it was O'Brien, then I thought it was JO. I'm shocked I didn't think it was Larry.

    Leave a comment:


  • JayRedd
    replied
    Re: if I'm not that big guy, I think they should go get him and let me go somewhere else.

    Originally posted by Speed View Post
    Wonder if this all is being put out there because they ARE getting ready to move him.
    To the waiver wire?

    Leave a comment:

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