Tweet
Will be a fascinating offseason - do we add to a near 50 win team because we believe a couple of tweaks means a decent run at being a top Eastern Conference seed, or, do we say that Vic/Domas/Myles is the core and take a longer term view by using our flexibility to add young pieces that will take more time to get to that 50+ won bracket.
The Rules of Pacers Digest
Hello everyone,
Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.
A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.
Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.
Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.
Rule #1
Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:
"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"
"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"
"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"
"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"
"He/she is just delusional"
"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"
"I'm going to take a moment to point and
/ laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"
"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good?"
In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.
We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.
Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.
That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.
A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.
There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.
Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.
In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.
Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.
If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!
All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.
Rule #2
If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.
The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.
The right places to do so are:
A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.
B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.
If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.
Rule #3
If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.
When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:
A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.
B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.
To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!
Rule #4
Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.
Rule #5
When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.
An example:
If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:
http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star
Rule #6
We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.
The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.
Rule #7
Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.
It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).
We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).
However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.
Rule #8
We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.
Rule #9
Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.
Rule #10
We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.
Rule #11
Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.
A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.
Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.
Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.
Rule #1
Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:
"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"
"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"
"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"
"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"
"He/she is just delusional"
"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"
"I'm going to take a moment to point and
/ laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*""Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good?
"In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.
We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.
Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.
That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.
A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.
There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.
Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.
In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.
Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.
If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!
All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.
Rule #2
If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.
The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.
The right places to do so are:
A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.
B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.
If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.
Rule #3
If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.
When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:
A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.
B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.
To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!
Rule #4
Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.
Rule #5
When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.
An example:
If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:
http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star
Rule #6
We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.
The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.
Rule #7
Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.
It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).
We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).
However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.
Rule #8
We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.
Rule #9
Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.
Rule #10
We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.
Rule #11
Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
See more
See less
-
"I’m your favorite player’s favorite player. And it’s not enough for me for him to know that. I want the world to know that." -- Michael Beasley -
I'd look into getting Malik Monk or Charlotte's lottery pick in exchange for taking Batum's contract off their hands.Originally posted by Trader Joe View PostComment
-
The Celtics will likely let Marcus Smart go ( since he's a RFA ) and IMHO will re-sign Rozier in the Summer of 2019. You are correct that Players would want to start. Given that the Celtics are poised to make it to the next level, being on a Playoff Team that can go far with a solid and competitive roster is a good reason to stay. But it's irrelevant since Rozier is a RFA and the Celtics can keep them.Originally posted by Grimp View Post
As for Myles, he's a RFA. He's going to stay if the Pacers want him to stay. On top of that, what more would he want that would convince him to push to leave the Team ( as you suggest )? He's the Pacers starting Center, he's part of the long term core of a young and solid team that isn't crap. Unlike PG13, Myles isn't in the position to dictate whether wants to bolt or not ( especially as a RFA ).
IMHO, KP isn't going to make a move just to make a move. I can see KP making a big Move, but I can also see him be patient enough to ONLY make a huge move ONLY if the right deal comes along. Otherwise, I can also see him stand pat on DC and Bojan and not make a huge splash on the FA market.
The question ( as I mentioned before ) is what to do with CoJo and Thad and whether KP thinks either ( or even both ) are long term keeps or not.Last edited by CableKC; 04-13-2018, 01:40 AM.Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.Comment
-
If KP takes another shot at a distressed asset in a bad environment like Hezonja on like a 2 year pg prove it deal I'll be more than happy. Maybe some sidegrades on players who want to leave.
Patience.Comment
-
It would be helpful if we could get an idea about how much Cap Space that we will likely have at our disposal.
Can someone run the #s for me ( based off of the following assumptions )?
Spoiler:
Assuming that we keep the following Players ( 12 Players )
- Collision ( will keep his 2018-2019 contract cuz he's a bargain ) - $10 mil
- Joseph Young ( pick up Team Option ) - $1.6 mil
- Dipo ( guaranteed ) - $21 mil
- Lance ( pick up Team Option ) - $4.36 mil
- Bojan ( same as DC, will guarantee his 2018-2019 contract cuz he's a bargain ) - $10 mil
- Poythress ( he's cheap and can fill out the bench ) - $1.54 mil
- Sabonis ( guaranteed ) - $2.66 mil
- Leaf ( guaranteed ) - $2.41 mil
- Myles ( guaranteed ) - $3.41 mil
- Ike ( guaranteed ) - $1.38 mil
- AlJeff ( I will assume that KP keeps him as a 4th Big Man option and Locker Room vet ) - $10 mil
- 1st round Pick ( assuming 20 to 23 ) - $1.4 mil
Non-Player Salaries ( to be paid )
- Monta ( stretched ) - $2.25 mil
Cap Holds for Free Agents:
- Thad - $13.764 mil
- CoJo - $7.945 mil
- Booker - $1.54 mil
- GRIII - $1.54 mil
Total Cap Hold - $24.789 mil
Total Salary for 12 Players ( ignoring Cap holds ) - $72.1 mil
Total Salary for 12 Players ( with Cap Holds ) - $96.9 mil
Projected 2018-2019 Salary Cap - $101 mil
I assume that AlJeff guaranteed contract doesn't have to be picked up and that the Pacers can release the Cap holds of every FA to get us down to $66 mil while having $35 mil in Salary Cap space to make a move towards a FA.
Do these numbers look about right ?
I have no clue if we have the Bird Rights or not to Thad or CoJo. Despite being UFAs; can the Pacers re-sign Thad, CoJo ( or even both ) while going over the Salary Cap to re-sign them for the long term?
or
Are we only able to re-sign either using our Salary Cap space?
Spoiler:
If these numbers are correct ( or at least in the ball park ), how big of a splash that the Pacers make in the FA market will depend on what they decide to do with Thad and CoJo.
Given how well the Team has done and how important Team Cehmistry is, I suspect that KP will re-sign one or both of CoJo and Thad while going cheap on the FA market for an upgrade to Booker-like Big Man ( that can complement both Sabonis and Myles ) at a reasonable price. As noted before, I think that KP will be patient and try to keep most of the core together for this season, make a smaller splash in Free Agency ( by looking for more DC/Bojan like FA signings ) and then look to make a huge move in the summer of 2019 when the Team has way more Cap flexibility.
Thoughts?Last edited by CableKC; 04-13-2018, 03:27 AM.Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.Comment
-
Intrigued by the idea of Randle because he does legit work offensively at the basket/in the paint and because of his board work. Don't watch enough Laker games though to know what the Pacers would be giving up on the defensive side of the ball. Could definitely see him & Bogie being problematic as a defensive tandem and suspect the team would really miss Thad's versatility & intangibles on that side of the ball.Comment
-
What I would find ideal would be keeping Collison & Bogdanovic on the team. From there I would talk to Thad about a long-term contract at a yearly discount for us of about $8mil a year over 3 years, maybe a player option in his 3rd. It's not bad money and it'll allow him to settle into Indiana with the family. I try bring CoJo back for similar $ to Thad, but I'm not sure he takes it so look to use our pick on a proven college PG who could come in as an immediate back-up like Aaron Holiday, Brunsen or Lamet. We let Big Al go as valuable as he is, his cap space is too useful to deny (He may not get looks elsewhere and come back on vet minimum). Booker already got money so hopefully stays to help continue build.
So we have:
C. Turner/Sabonis
PF. Young/Leaf/Booker
SF. Bogdanovic
SG. Oladipo/Stephenson
PG. Collison/CoJo or Rookie/Young
All this for around $74mil with CoJo or $68mil with a rookie instead.
My free agent target would be Jabari Parker to move into that starting SF as that 2nd scorer we desperately need to be competitive. No Parker then try Aaron Gordon or a trade for Tobias Harris as or go with Hezonja and see what he can do in our offense.
Hezonja or Haris could come cheap so maybe we go in on Marcus Smart as our starting PG. Would use remaining cap of vets and shooters.
Ranking my fave options:
#1: C. Turner/Sabonis/Anigbogu PF. Young/Leaf/Booker SF. Parker/Bogdanovic/Casspi SG. Oladipo/Stephenson/Young PG. Collison/CoJo/Duval or ZBrown (upside rookie)
#2: C. Turner/Sabonis/Anigbogu PF. Young/Leaf/Booker SF. Hezonja/Bogdanovic/Casspi SG. Oladipo/Stephenson/Young PG. Smart/Collison/Rookie
#3: C. Turner/Sabonis/Anigbogu PF. Young/Leaf/Booker SF. Harris/Bogdanovic/Casspi SG. . Oladipo/Stephenson/Young PG. . Smart/Collison/RookieComment
-
Good layout. Thad and CoJo actually have player options at those prices. So if they decide to exercise those, those amounts would just be added to the salary list and reduce the Pacers cap space available.Originally posted by CableKC;n3347839
[BCap Holds for Free Agents:[/B]
- Thad - $13.764 mil
- CoJo - $7.945 mil
- Booker - $1.54 mil
- GRIII - $1.54 mil
Total Cap Hold - $24.789 mil
Total Salary for 12 Players ( ignoring Cap holds ) - $72.1 mil
Total Salary for 12 Players ( with Cap Holds ) - $96.9 mil
Projected 2018-2019 Salary Cap - $101 mil
I assume that AlJeff guaranteed contract doesn't have to be picked up and that the Pacers can release the Cap holds of every FA to get us down to $66 mil while having $35 mil in Salary Cap space to make a move towards a FA.
Do these numbers look about right ?
I have no clue if we have the Bird Rights or not to Thad or CoJo. Despite being UFAs; can the Pacers re-sign Thad, CoJo ( or even both ) while going over the Salary Cap to re-sign them for the long term?
or
Are we only able to re-sign either using our Salary Cap space?
Spoiler:
If these numbers are correct ( or at least in the ball park ), how big of a splash that the Pacers make in the FA market will depend on what they decide to do with Thad and CoJo.
Given how well the Team has done and how important Team Cehmistry is, I suspect that KP will re-sign one or both of CoJo and Thad while going cheap on the FA market for an upgrade to Booker-like Big Man ( that can complement both Sabonis and Myles ) at a reasonable price. As noted before, I think that KP will be patient and try to keep most of the core together for this season, make a smaller splash in Free Agency ( by looking for more DC/Bojan like FA signings ) and then look to make a huge move in the summer of 2019 when the Team has way more Cap flexibility.
Thoughts?
The Pacers can re-sign both Thad and Cojo while going over the salary cap, but only if they keep their cap holds on the book. That's what the cap hold is supposed to do, it's designed to keep people from abusing Bird Rights. So if the Pacers release all the cap holds as you suggest, they would have to re-sign all of those players with their cap space and cannot go over the cap to sign any of them.
Where cap holds really help you are young players who are about to get paid because the cap hold is based off a percentage of your previous contract. For example, Turner has a cap hold of 4.69 million next year. The Pacers can keep that cap hold until they are done with the rest of free agency, then re-sign him to much more than that going over the cap.
Comment
-
I'm putting out some feelers to see if we have a legitimate shot at signing Khris Middleton in the summer of 2019. If we do, then I am trying to stand pat until then. If not, then I would be looking at trades.
I am convinced that CoJo will walk. I think we will offer him $9-10 million per year but someone will offer him more and possibly a starting job.
Thad will stay. We'll offer about $12 million per year and include some kind of no trade clause.
GRIII will walk. We will offer a "prove it" contract. A short term, low cost contract. He'll get a better offer and leave.
Our starting 5 will be back. The bench will include Lance and Sabonis. We may sign Booker to a short term deal to give Leaf another year or two to develop, but I don't know if Booker would go for that.
We will draft a PG or SF depending on if we think Middleton may come here or we think we can trade for a starting SF.
Parker is not a SF. He does not like playing SF and his defense is terrible. Gordon is good defensively, but his offense at SF is not very good. He has also had 3 concussions in the past 2 years..that's something to be concerned about.
I don't know what trades may be available, but to me the key is finding our about Middleton. In my opinion, if we can add Middleton in the summer of 2019, Turner and Sabonis improve and prove they can play together, then we can be pretty tough.Comment
-
I believe 18-19 are player options, and I think they will opt in.Originally posted by CableKC View Post
Cap Holds for Free Agents:
- Thad - $13.764 mil
- CoJo - $7.945 mil
- Booker - $1.54 mil
- GRIII
I have no clue if we have the Bird Rights or not to Thad or CoJo. Despite being UFAs; can the Pacers re-sign Thad, CoJo ( or even both ) while going over the Salary Cap to re-sign them for the long term?
or
Are we only able to re-sign either using our Salary Cap space?
Spoiler:
we have both of their bird rights, the cap hold represents the rights and are on our cap until we give up the rights or resign them. If we renounce we get the cap space and the holds are removed, and if we resign the hold gets replaced by the actual contract value. We can go over the cap to resign them in this case. Usually we keep the hold on the player, spend the cap space available with the holds, and then sign the player after to go over the cap.
if we renounce and take the cap space we can resign them with cap space but cannot exceed the cap.Last edited by flox; 04-13-2018, 11:10 AM.Comment
-
My nephew is a huge Laker fan. He says that Randle is a black hole on the offensive end and has a tendency to handle and hold the ball a lot longer than he should be holding it. Some Team is going to overpay him to pry him away from the Lakers since he's a RFA. I'd pass on him. IMHO, we need a quality Big Man that can complement both Sabonis and Myles much like how Booker did a good job of replacing AlJeff in the Big Man rotation ( which necessariy doesn't have to be an elite Starter but a quality 1st Big off the bench type Player ). I think we can upgrade the PF/C spot with a better version of Booker at a far more reasonable cost than Randle.Originally posted by Downtown Bang! View Post
Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.Comment
-
JMO also, that you are right about Randle. He is not the kind of player that the Pacers need now. I would be surprised if he is being considered by TPTB. I suspect that they are looking for guys more like Kelly Olynyk than Randle. A stretch 4/5 that can post a smaller guys if necessary and be a real threat from the 3 pt line.Originally posted by CableKC View Post
Speaking of Miami, they have another guy that the Pacers might be looking at. Wayne Ellington or someone like him. Ellington is a guard/wing instead of a SF/wing, so he might not be the actual guy the Pacers want unless they don't pick up Lance's option. Or maybe move Lance to backup SF instead. Still a bit of a size problem, but Lance is strong for his height.
I don't see the Pacers looking for guys that cannot be a legit threat from the 3 pt line. Like every other team in the league, the Pacers should be looking for more shooting and guys that can score if they are not guarded closely by a plus defender.Comment
-
I hope that the Pacers pick the BPA regardless of position. But if we don't and actually go off of "need", I'd hope that if we do draft a Player it will be at the wing rotation where I think we need more depth.Originally posted by festar35 View Post
A High End Backup PGs like Patty Mills was re-signed with the Spurs for $10 to 13 mil a year, But I suspect that CoJo ( IMHO a quality backup PG that can play off the ball while being a quality PG defender ) could be signed somewhere between $7 to 9 mil ( which is the price range for re-signing Shaun Livingston ).
As for Thad? I hope he would give a discount and can be had for $9+ mil a year for 3 years. But I suspect ( again ) that his Market value will be higher given his performance and here in Indy will warrant a higher paycheck. My only hope is that Thad does give a home town discount and sign for $10 to 12 mil a year given the rumor that his Wife doesn't want to move anymore.
I'd prefer that we do move him for some small assets in exchange for some cap relief for some team. But I'd hope that if we do not pick up AlJeff's guaranteed salary for this next season ( thus letting him go ) that we can add him to the Coaching Staff as a Big Man Coach. I think that his presense on this Team is important and helpful. But honestly, I have no problem with keeping him on as our 4th Big Man off the bench behind whoever we pursue to replace Booker in the lineup.Originally posted by festar35 View Post
In terms of the Starting SF position; my preference is to move Bojan to the backup SF spot, let GRIII go, draft a SF ( to eventually replace Bojan in the rotation ) and then sign a young Starting quality SF ( I prefer going after Oubre as a young 3D type Wing or Kyle Anderson with the Spurs ). I don't mind gambling on Hezonja as well given his age. Another Forward that I wouldn't mind pursuing is Kevin Looney ( if you want to gamble on a young Player with upside ) or ( if you want to go with a older but still very solid 3D Wing ) Ariza.Originally posted by festar35 View Post
Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.Comment
-
Given the minor issues that Whiteside has had with the Heat and the performance of an Olynk/Bam Frontcourt rotation, it wouldn't suprise me if the Heat keep Olynk and Bam for the long term and move Whiteside ( who can choose not to pick up his 2019-2020 Player Option ) in the offseason for some assets.Originally posted by xIndyFan View Post
Ellington is a volume 3pt shooter that's a career 38% 3pt shooter. I don't mind having a legit 3pt threat on the Team. But given that the NBA is a 3pt heavy reliant league, it wouldn't surprise me if he's overpaid to fill a Kyle Korver-like role on some Team. I assume that Ellington isn't a complete mess on the defensive end, so I wouldn't mind pursuing him given that it's an Arm's Race when it comes to scoring from the 3pt line.Originally posted by xIndyFan View Post
My preference though is to go after Oubre or even make a run at Ariza ( who I have always wanted on this Team ) as a legit 3D wing ( even if he is going to be 33 years old at the start of the season ).
Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.Comment
Comment