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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Nirvana's place in the world of music....

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  • Constellations
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    Originally posted by Merz View Post
    Ok, that's what I was looking for when I asked what you considered punk. You're on the "Punk is only the sound" side...which if I had to choose a side (like I said in another post I don't like to label) I would be more on the side of "Punk is the attitude of the song".

    Hopefully I'm making sense here, but I would consider a song with the Punk attitude but sung like a normal rock song as closer to punk than a punk "sounding" song sung about rainbows and lollipops (just an example, not saying such a song exist).

    and off topic, you're probably the first person I've come across that acted like a musical elitist and listed bands like breaking benjamin as an influence.
    I think musical elitist is really pushing it. I just consider myself very intelligent on the subject, that's all. And Breaking Benjamin, is a huge influence among young bands today, such as mine.

    Leave a comment:


  • Peck
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    There are times where I think we try and break things down into to many different lables and I just think that it should all fall under the umbrella of Rock & Roll.

    But then I have to remind myself that this would include Billy Joel & Slayer and I can't think of two more different sounds, so is it really fair to call them the same thing?

    But then I remind myself again, well Conway Twitty & Taylor Swift are both just called Country so is that really that much different? I think that is why there is more unity in Country because they truely cast a big tent.

    Either way I've just proven that I have mental issues by arguing with myself over something that means absolutely nothing.

    Leave a comment:


  • ilive4sports
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    Thats an interesting list. They've got a large spectrum of the punk genre on there and I wouldn't have been surprised if Nirvana was on it (not saying they should or shouldn't be).

    Is Nirvana a punk band in my opinion? No, but they were heavily influenced by punk, heavily influenced punk bands (as well as pretty much every other rock band), shared ideals with punk and did open the door for punk in the 90s.

    Leave a comment:


  • Los Angeles
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    I think this is a good time to mention this.

    I have Suicidal Tendencies' old PO Box. So if anyone gets ahold of one of their old records, it says in the notes somewhere to send a card to PO Box 388 in Venice if they want fan updates.

    So here it is, 30 years later and once every week or two, I get mail addressed to Suicidal Tendencies. (I only took it personally the first time).

    Leave a comment:


  • Los Angeles
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    Originally posted by Peck View Post
    That could have been asked by anyone about 30 pages ago.
    Totally.

    Leave a comment:


  • Peck
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    Originally posted by Los Angeles View Post
    OK, I guess I'm lost.

    What are we talking about?
    That could have been asked by anyone about 30 pages ago.

    Leave a comment:


  • Los Angeles
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    OK, I guess I'm lost.

    What are we talking about?

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    Originally posted by Los Angeles View Post
    Well, I think this a really fantastic list, and it even takes my own posts to task. Particularly my not including The Dead Milkmen in punk

    Guess what band isn't on this list?

    Nirvana.


    Top 100 Punk Bands as voted by MusicianForums.com Punk Forum users

    http://rateyourmusic.com/lists/list_...ow=50&start=50
    I never said Bleach made Nirvana one of the best punk bands of all time. I said it was a punk album.

    Leave a comment:


  • Guest's Avatar
    Guest replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    Originally posted by RWB View Post
    Bill I hope you're joking because that is BS.
    i was. It was a joke on their tagline and how dedicated Clash fans are.

    Leave a comment:


  • Los Angeles
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    Well, I think this a really fantastic list, and it even takes my own posts to task. Particularly my not including The Dead Milkmen in punk

    Guess what band isn't on this list?

    Nirvana.


    Top 100 Punk Bands as voted by MusicianForums.com Punk Forum users

    http://rateyourmusic.com/lists/list_...ow=50&start=50


    100
    Atom and His Package

    Possibly the smallest band on the list, Atom & his Package consists of Adam Goren (Atom) and his package (a Yamaha music sequencer) make funny punk songs utilising many of of the package's hundreds of instruments about the metric system, the lead singer of Judas Priest and what Jewish people do on Christmas. Now moved on to other projects, Atom will remain the person who told the world Anarchy Means That I Litter, The Palestinians Are Not the Same Thing as the Rebel Alliance Jackass, and If You Own The Washington Redskins, You're a ****.

    99
    Ghost Mice

    With only two members in this folk/punk band their voices and their music can be heard along with such pride. This band is one of the greatest to come out of the scene because of their abrasive acoustic style. The band consists of a male guitarist (I don't know his name) and Hannah who plays the violin. They are successful and very well should be because it's hard to when you have such little to work with. This band is off Plan It X records and they put on a fantastic
    show. Not only is the band one of the leaders of the new genre called folk/punk but I'm sure there is going to be very big things to come from them and it will always be from the heart.

    98
    Defiance, Ohio

    Defiance, Ohio are perhaps one of the most compassionate and energetic leaders of the "folk/punk" movement. Their clever lyrics accompanied by fast, melodic, acoustic guitars make them very enjoyable to listen to. On the DIY label "Plan-it X" this band exhibits so much stage energy and passion when they perform. They have a very bright future ahead with the release of "Share What Ya Got." If you have never checked out this band I strongly recommend it. They are true to what they say and it shows when they sing and play their music. Defiance, Ohio has a very bright future ahead, so lets sit and wait to see what happens.

    97
    I Farm

    96
    Mad Sin

    German Psychobilly band Mad Sin have been developing their trademark sound since 1987. With their songs rarely dipping below breakneck speed, the distinctive melodic vocals are perfectly complimented by their out-of-control mix of rockabilly and punk. With 8 full lengths under their belt Mad Sin have carved themselves a unique niche in their genre.

    95
    Forgotten Rebels

    Canadian punk band.

    94
    Mojo Nixon

    With a name combining voodoo and bad politics, Mojo Nixon is one of the prime exponents of cow-punk playing rocking country tunes with a punk rock ethic. First with Skid Roper and later with his band the Toadliquors Nixon can be relied on to entertain with his unique mix of country beats, stolen Chuck Berry riffs and hilarious lyrics Mojo Nixon has spread his message across the globe. Done Henley must die, Princess Diana was a drunk divorced floozie and Michael J. Fox is the anti-elvis.

    93
    Good Riddance

    Forming in 1986 as a way for Russ Rankin to vent his political frustration, these vegancore kids rose to punk rock stardom in the early/mid-90's, releasing album after successful album on Fat Wreck Chords. Ambiguously shifting between balls-out hardcore and sing-along pop-punk, Good Riddance never repeats themselves but in one way - they always deliver high-quality punk rock straight from the heart.

    92
    Bigwig

    Bigwig are an amazing band formed in New Jersey about 1995 and since then they've released 3 awesome albums (like wine) getting better with the time. Their first effort "Unmerry Melodies" is a very consistent release with some highlights out there. Their second work "Stay Asleep" is considered by many their best album because of its variety and of course
    because all the songs are great but then they surprised us even more with An Invitation To Tragedy, another masterpiece with technically better (if possible) guitar riffing, great melodies and 13 close to perfection songs. Having gotten through some line-up changes (something that's been happening through their whole career, only keeping an original member: singer/guitarist Tom Petta) they'll be releasing a new album this year hopefully.

    91
    The Adverts

    With their raw, enthusiastic immaturity, the Adverts were a bright, though short-lived, light of the punk era, distinguished by the fact that their bassist, Gaye Advert, was one of the first female stars of punk rock. After they (barely) mastered one chord, the Adverts began playing at London's Roxy Club in 1976, where they quickly came to the attention of the Damned's guitarist Brian James. James offered the band an opening spot on the Damned's tour and directed them toward Stiff Records. Stiff released their self-deprecating debut single, "One Chord Wonders," in 1977, when the band could still barely play, but when they released their second single, the disturbingly funny "Gary Gilmore's Eyes," the group rocketed into the U.K. Top 20 in a storm of controversy. The Adverts' first album, Crossing the Red Sea With the Adverts, fulfilled the single's promise, but the second, 1979's Cast of Thousands, sounded like they poured all of their musical ideas into their first album; the group broke up the following year.

    90
    Rudiments

    Another Asian Man Records band, also from the East Bay, that I like to describe as Fishbone meets Operation Ivy. They are pretty crazy in their songs, and have silly/funny lyrics. Most of their ska can be found on the album Circle Our Empire, but you can also hear some great punk on their album ***** ***** *****

    89
    The Real McKenzies

    Formed in 1992 in Vancouver, BC, Canada, The Real McKenzies broke down punk barriers by mixing their fast paced punk with music from their Scottish heritage. They weren't just a punk band with bagpipes, they were a full out Scottish folk punk band. They would play perfect punk with a scottish flare rendenitions of old Scottish classics such as Scotland the Brave, Flower of Scotland, and Scots Wa'Hae. They also used their own song writing skills and inspirition from old Robbie Burns to make thier own music that could soon enter into Scottish folk tradition. Real McKenzies became famous on Joey ********'s Sudden Death Records, but have since signed to Fat Wreck for a new record that all who love Scotland will love.

    88
    Lars Frederiksen and the *******s

    Punk band formed by Rancid's guitarist which is only slightly better then Rancid, which isn't saying much

    87
    Toy Dolls

    Long-lived British punk band with zany, witty lyrics, and guitar lines that would make a metalhead blush, you cannot help but love the Toy Dolls. They have put out great album after great album, and have recently done a tour that was dubbed their final tour and released an album titled "Our Last Album?" And if this is the last from this band, it will be a sad day.

    86
    Cockney Rejects

    It was the Cockney Rejects song Oi Oi Oi that gave the genre they belong to its name. They were one of most influential oi bands along with Sham 69 and **** Sparrer. They played loud, brash, working class music, and had a irrelevent sense of humour. Their first albums were titled, jokingly, Greatest Hits Volume 1, and Volume 2. Then Their third was entitled Greatest Hits Volume 3 (Live and Loud), which was actually recorded in a studio with an audience. The band are legends in their own right and should be reconized by any true Oi fan.

    85
    D.O.A.

    Canadian punk rock legends DOA formed shortly after the punk explosion moved throughout the world. With scenese sprouting up in New York, LA, and other places, it was only a matter of time before Canada had it's own punk scene going. Lead by Joey ********, DOA set out to revolutiuonlize the scene in their country and their neighbours south of the border. ******** was never afriad to express his political opinions, and it landed him in jail once. DOA later went on to colaporate on one of Jello Biafra's first outings after DK, releasing Last Scream of the Missing Neighbours with Jello on vocals instead of ********. ******** took another cue from Jello, and entered himself into politics, running as a canidate in Canadian provincial and civic elections from the Green Party. ******** has also released his own book, entitled I, ******** and DOA has recently gotten their own day in their home province of British Coloumbia

    84
    Gang of Four

    Formed in 1977 by journalist Andy Gill and college students Dave Allen and Hugo Burnham, gang of Four is considered one of the first post-punk bands. In their 1979 debut Entertainment!, gang of Four fused punk fury with funk rythmns and angular guitars.Their next releases Solid Gold abandoned this approach in favor of slower paced almost dub-like songs and the usually political rantings.The last few release by the band were synthesized dribble, and did not sell well. the band split in 1984.

    83
    Good Clean Fun

    Good Clean Fun are straight outta DC, four vegan straight-edge guys who enjoy a laugh and have listened to Start Today one too many times. Drawing on influences as diverse as Gorilla Biscuits, Youth of Today, Minor Threat, Gorilla Biscuits, 7 Seconds and Gorilla Biscuits, Good Clean Fun know the true meaning of hardcore-punk, singing along and having a good time. They've travelled the world spreading their message of positivity and unity and still retained their sense of humour. How many other vegan bands would ahve a song called "It's Time to Beat the Meat"?

    82
    Agnostic Front

    New York Hardcore legends! These guys from New York help pioneer the hardcore-punk scene in New York City, and helped create the NYHC sub-genre. With heavy influences from 77 punk, oi music, and working class lifestyle, Agnostic Front blends hard hitting hardcore with blue collar lyrics that can be enjoyed by anyone who likes hard-hitting in your face music. Roger Miret's voice is unmistakeable in any song. Released a new album not so long ago, where they moved from their hardcore-punk roots to a more metal influenced style, but they still made a golden album.

    81
    Wire

    Wire was one of the most adventurous bands to be birthed by the English punk explosion. Wire's ever changing sound distanced them from the pack of early punk-rock. Wire was also a eccentric live act, often playing songs that weren't even recorded yet, not ones fans were expecting to hear. By the demise of the band, Wire had been a huge influence on post-punk and indie bands well into the next decade.

    80
    The Casualties

    The Casualties formed in 1990, wanting to bring back the spirit of 80s Punk. In the first year the line up changed often. The Casualties stabilized long enough in the fall of 1991 to put together an EP, 40 Ounce Casualty. By next year the band was touring and their hometown NYC fan base kept growing. A second EP, Drinking Is Our Way of Life. The four-track EP was never issued, but later was added into the band's 1999 release, Early Years 1990 – 1995. With the line up still changing the group put together a third EP, ****in' Way of Life, in 1995. By 1996 the band put out its first full-length album, For the Punx. . Since then they have completed “Underground Army" (1998) “Stay Out Of Order" (2000 EP: "Who's In Control?" (2000) "Die Hards" (2001) "On The Front Line" (2004) "En La Linea Del Frente" (2005) The line up today stands as Rick- Bass, Jorge- Vocals, Meggers- Drums, Jake- Guitar

    79
    The Germs

    Mediocre LA punk band whose lead singer is worshipped by the same morons who worship Sid Vicious, and for similar reasons, for being a dead junkie who was pretty much useless to the music world.

    78
    The Exploited

    Forerunners of the UK82 scene and street punk pioneers, The Exploited were legends to the punk scene. Bred from the oppressive Reagan/Thatcher world era, The Exploited were angry, anti-authority, outspoken punks looking to change something. When everybody thought punk had died after '77, Wattie shouted in his infamous snarl, that Punks Not Dead, and The Exploited proved it. They were fast and hard hitting, their songs could apply to the youth growing up in this era. They were the voice of the common people and the working class youth. Although they no longer play much punk, they still tour, and are still loved by many fans and still gain more and more fans as they age.

    77
    Flux of Pink Indians

    Forming in the very early 80's after the Epileptics' breakup this group a long with Crass commenced the greatest movement in punk history. It was the anarcho-peace punk mentality. This band were known for their passion and genuity within the scene. They never promoted their records because profit wasn't what it was about to them. This band was very powerful and also not very open-minded as many anarcho bands were. There highlight album "Strive to Survive (Causing
    Least Suffering Possible)" was a huge hit. However they experimented more with their other two full lengthed releases. Through such passion and energy this band were the biggest punks around. They weren't about the money they were about the message and the genuity of punk rock. They disbanded in 1987.

    76
    A Global Threat

    Maine Street punks who share members and a sound with the Unseen. A band who puts out many good records such as Until We Die and What the **** Will Change. A good band, along with The Unseen, to get into street punk with. They are planning a tour after not touring for awhile.

    75
    Pennywise

    "Political" punk band that releases albums that usually all sound the same. Recently released a new album. A first punk band for a lot of people.

    74
    Aus-Rotten

    A newer band from Pittsburgh this crust band had some of the most talented lyrics ever. They combine extremely detailed social and political dictions into a rhyming, rhytmic and yet melodic sounding music. How this band does it amazes me. I'm sure they have inspired many of punks to become way more socially and politically aware because there is such corruption going on that we need to stand against. This band has been a very big bang and influence in the crust
    community and despite their disbandment they are continually listened to and respected. The lead singer now sings for "Behind Enemy Lines" and continues his lyrical legacy.

    73
    Less Than Jake

    Amazing third wave ska coming out of the depths of florida. ripping bass lines and amazing horn section make this band an absolute must-know for any modern rude boy. Alo more punk feel than most ska, they really got themselves a unique sound with alternating vocals and sing along choruses. They've started to go down-hill lately with whinier vocals and songs about some chick breaking soon, but they still hold my heart with songs like "Jay Frenzal" and "A.S.A.O.K."

    72
    The Unseen

    With their release of Lower Class Crucifixion the band was immediately on the road of success. This powerful and possibly greatest material proved the band worthy of popularity and well deserved shows. This band carried along with them a great passion for punk rock and it showed with their stage energy. The Unseen truly matured as their records released putting more passion and time into their albums. They are now one of the most prestigous, popular and well liked bands between punk and hardcore fans. They are truly a great band in the scene and will probalby always be within it.

    71
    Fear

    Fear Began at the dawning of the punk in 1977 although their style (along with the Circle Jerks and Black Flag) helped to define LA style hardcore. Led by Lee Ving's destinctive vocals, and their fast agressive music, Fear are remembered as some of the founding fathers of hardcore punk.

    70
    The World/Inferno Friendship Society

    The most original punk band out there today. World/Inferno Friendship Society play a mixture of, well, just about everything wrapped up with in-your-face punk attitude. Filled with horns, pianos and just about any other instrument they can get their hands on. WIFS have quickly build-up a large following with their crazy gypsy/folk/circus/punk music with Jack Terricloth's distinctive vocals singing about every subject under the sun. They are the saviours of punk rock.

    69
    Buzzcocks

    Early punks, the Buzzcocks were known for their poppy lyrics and catchy hooks, and known by some as one of the first pop-punk bands.

    68
    Dag Nasty

    Dag Nasty is a melodic emotionally charged hardcore band from Washington D.C. Dag Nasty formed in 1985 from the ashes of Minor Threat and Bloody Mannequin Orchestra. Brian Baker, Colin Sears, Shawn Brown, and Roger Marbury decided they wanted to push the boundaries of hardcore music. Not being limited to a four chord, one minute speed fest, they released Can I Say in 1986. Just a year later they pumped out another emocore classic, Wig Out at Denko's with a new bassist, Doug Carrion, and singer, Peter Cortner. Dag Nasty will always be, along with Rites of Spring, Embrace, and Gray Matter, The founders of emocore.

    67
    Mission of Burma

    The short lived Mission of Burma was one of the best punk bands to come out of Boston in the late 70's. Mission of Burma's music was ahead of its time, incorporating odd time shifts, tape loops (then, almost unheard of), and played with the fury of such bands as The Stooges and the New York Dolls. When their popularity peaked, the band untimely disband because of Roger Miller's hearing problems. The band unexpectedly re-formed in 2002, delighting fans.

    66
    Citizen Fish

    "Successfully unsuccessful since 1989." This band from the former frontman of Subhumans, Dick Lucas comes. They have been putting out material on their record label from the late 80's and are still to present day. Dick has took his intelligent anarcho lyrics from Subhumans and his ska-punk from Culture Shock and formed them into the ultime band known as Citizen Fish. This band is the leader of ska-punk today and still tours and Dick Lucas shows no sign of giving in. The passion found in this band is truly remarkable. Citizen Fish is one of the best bands to ever come out of the ska and punk scene. Afterall, nothing can beat anarcho lyrics with catchy beats.

    65
    MC5

    Kick Out the Jams mother****er was the call to arms for this early punk rock band. Along side fellow Detroit natives, The Stooges, MC% helped establish the raw hard sound of punk rock, and also helped blend in some of the revolutionary politics of todays modern scene. Backed by the radical "White Panther Party", MC5 set out to give their politics and loud brash music to the world.

    64
    Reagan Youth

    Reagan Youth is the definition of New York Hardcore punk. In the 80's the played all over the state and city of New York spreading their ideas of equality and justice. Reagan Youth proved to be very influential to upcoming bands in the New York HC scene. Dave Insurgent led the band well until his drug addiction got the best of him. His life was a mess, his mother died in a car accident and his wife was sexually abused and killed. He overdosed on heroin and thus was
    the end for Reagan Youth. If anything this is in memory of Dave. It shows that even the best of them can't live on for ever. R.I.P Dave Insurgent, Reagan Youth has inspired many.

    63
    Patti Smith

    Known to many as punk rock's poet laurete. Patti Smith is arguably one of pinoneers of punk. She began as just a girl wanting to do poetry readings, and she turned into a legend in the eyes of many punks. She used her knack for poetry and imagery to write punk songs that were worth remembering, not for their music, but for their lyrics. Patti was one of the first female punks and she pushed boundries for many that followed her. The punk scene would be very different, and lacking a lot, had Patti not come along and gave us her heart and soul in her poetry and punk music.

    62
    Adolescents

    One of Southern California's best-loved hardcore bands, the Adolescents helped establish the blueprint for Orange County punk, along with Agent Orange and Social Distortion. Although their music was the most standard-issue of the three, the Adolescents' blazing energy and quintessential teenage snottiness gave them an instant connection with their audience, and defied their upbringing in California's bastion of staid conservatism.

    61
    T.S.O.L.

    LA Hardcore punks who played with a poppier sound similar to some of the British before them, TSOL (standing for True Sounds of Liberty) became popular in their own local scene, but never caught on anywhere else. Known for their almost gothic imagery and overall image, and their song about necrophilia, Code Blue.

    60
    Richard Hell & The Voidoids

    Richard Hell and The Voidoids formed in 1976 by Richard Hell (formerly of Television, and Johnny Thunders and The Heartbreakers on bass and vocals, Marc Bell on drums, with Robert Quine and Ivan Julian both playing guitar. They released their first album, "Blank Generation" in 1977 and it became an instant classic. Richard Hell was and still is a very talented poet, and these songs best showcase his abilities. The band went on to release two more albums, "Destiny Street" which had a few classic tracks (1978) and "Funhunt" (1979) which was a live album. Neither, however, was close to the level of "Blank Generation". The band broke up soon after the release of "Funhunt". Richard Hell has gone back to writing poetry and Robert Quine committed suicide in March, 2004

    59
    Tiger Army

    One of the many Hellcat Psychobilly bands. And just like the other Hellcat psychobilly bands, they are nothing like any of the early psychobilly bands. They are still good in their own right and have introduced many people to psychobilly who later moved on to the other legends of the genre

    58
    Discharge

    Discharge were formed in Stoke-on-Trent in 1977 by two brothers, Terry (Tez) Roberts (vocals) and Tony (Bones) Roberts (guitar) Roy (Rainy) Wainright and a drummer called Hacko (real name unknown). The band got going properly in 1979 when vocalist Kelvin Morriss (Cal) joined. They scrapped all their old songs and wrote new ones, eventually signing to Clay Records and releasing the single “Realities of War” in March 1980. They went through several line-up changes with longest standing members, Rainy leaving in 1986 and Cal in 2001, although there was little activity in the early to mid nineties. The band reformed for a tour in 2003/4 with Rat from the Varukers on vocals, and may still be going. They play chaotic 80s hardcore, with essential listening being their debut LP “Hear Nothing, See Nothing, Say Nothing”. Mostly stolen from http://www.discharge.co.uk

    57
    New York Dolls

    Cross-dressing, drug using, glam punks, the New York Dolls were punk before punk had a name. Formed shortly after the VU explosion, the New York Dolls were pioneers in their own right. Though the band quickly dissolved, everyone who saw them wanted to what they did, they wanted to be punks, they wanted the drugs, they wanted to dress up like women. Member Johnny Thunders went on to form his own band, also legendary

    56
    Link 80

    Asian Man Records skacore straight out of the famous East Bay. The band is currently on hiatus and has been since 2002, but most fans anxiously await their return. Link 80, although having one name, is basically two bands: Nick Traina Link 80 and Ryan Noble Link 80. Same band, two very different sounds, yet always played that good ol' skacore. Punk vocals and hardcore breakdowns with an occasional ska riff and many catchy horn lines

    55
    U.K. Subs

    Raging from the 70's it's a wonder what this band has accomplished within it's reign that is still accomplishing today. Charlie Harper is old and worn but he still continues to tour and put out records. This band is so old and so talented at what they do. No matter what they continue with what they. Which is playing pure, unbridled punk rock. Their best album in my opinion was "A.W.O.L" but there is so much material by them that it's hard to keep track. Any true punk fan would give credit and respect to UK Subs because they are a great leader in punk rock today and will always be.

    54
    A Wilhelm Scream

    Formerly Smackin' Isiash, this band are legends of melodic hardcore. One of the more popular bands in the genre, and a must-listen for everybody who enjoys punk and hardcore. They currently have released 3 solid albums, all of which have something somebody will like. Melodic hardcore is the saving wave of hardcore and punk, and these guys are ahead of the pack, pathing the way for many other great bands

    53
    Anti-Flag

    This Pittsburgh punk rock band started out as a trio with Justin Sane, Andy Flag, and Pat Thetic (goofy names lolz!). Their first two albums blended their passion for politics with their sense of humor. Soon Chris Head was brought in as lead guitarist and Chris #2 was their new bassist. Justin and #2's vocals compliment each other perfectly, supported by furious bass lines and percussion and powerful guitars. The Terror State, their most recent album, has gotten a whole new generation into punk and pop-punk with Turncoat's music video. Anti-Flag's poppy and political songs have gotten many started on punk.

    52
    Against All Authority

    Against All Authority is a fast-paced, loud, aggressive and hardcore-influenced ska-punk band from Miami, Florida. They are among some of the finest "skacore" bands that third wave ska fans listen to today. Their most recent release was an eight track split with Common Rider back in April 2005. As of now they are recording new music in their hometown, playing a show or two around the Florida area.

    51
    X

    The band 'X' was formed in 1977, and became an early leader in the LA punk scene; fusing an artsy punk style with some mild blues and country influences. The original members were Christine "Exene" Cervenka as vocalist, John Doe on bass and vocals, DJ Bonebreak on drums, and Billy Zoom on guitar. Zoom was later replaced by Tony Gilkyson when he quit the band in '86. The band formed an odd relationship with Ray Manzarek of the Doors, who produced their first album 'Los Angeles' (1980), as well as lending his keyboarding talents to a few songs. The band continued recording through the 80's, and still tours occasionaly with its original lineup.

    50
    Kid Dynamite

    Formed in '97 from ex-members of Lifetime, this Philly hardcore band is one of the most amazing things to be heard. East Coast hardcore punk has never had a better band than Kid Dynamite. With songs topping out at 2 minutes and beginning at 20 seconds they are the epitomy of Short, Loud, Fast. They only stuck around until 2000 and put out three records which all belong in any hardcore fans catalouge.

    49
    Lower Class Brats

    Clockwork punk at it's best, Austin, Texas street punk legends, Lower Class Brats brings a charged Clockwork Orange influence to their hard hitting punk and snotty vocals. LCB started out in Austin, Texas in 1995 in order to eradicte Austin of crappy music and bring back good ole fashioned punk. LCB continues their conquest to bring punk to the world with constant touring and releasing great album after great album. These droogs won't be running away anytime soon, not until they bring their punk sound to everybody

    48
    The Filaments

    The Filaments hailed from essex, UK and played brass heavy punk rock. There debut album "skull and trombones" was released in 2001 on Young Blood Records. They later signed to Household Name records and then went on to release their second album "....What's Next" in July 2004. Unfortunately, the band have now split, playing their last gig at the London leg of the City Invasion tour on 10th July this year. Although probably not the most technical band around, they toured solidly and wrote catchy songs.For fans of bands like the Casualties.

    47
    Conflict

    Dubbed the "kings of punk" conflict rightfully deserves this name. Their notorious release "The Ungovernable Force" is undoubtedly one of the greatest punk albums from this legendary anarcho-peace band. Conflict remain extremely political and socially-aware of demonstrations and protests that they still attend just like they scream in songs. This band has been shooting out material since the very early 80's and doesn't seem to be hinting a sign of letting out. This band will always be together and will always rule the punk planet. They will be in the crowd protesting this unjust government and will be on top of the justice that has been given. Conflict are the kings of punk rock.

    46
    The Damned

    The Damned formed in 1976 by singer Dave Vanian, drummer Rat Scabies, bassist Captain Sensible, and guitarist Brian James. They were the first British band to release a single ("New Rose") and also the first to release and album ("Damned Damned Damned". Since 1976, they've broken up and reformed many times, and released 9 albums. During the mid-eighties, however, they moved away from their punk-sound to more gothic type of music that they continue to play today.

    45
    Television

    Televison formed in 1972 by friends Richard Hell and Tom Veralaine with Billy Ficca on drums under the name The Neon Boys. In 1973, they changed their name to Television. Richard Hell left the band in 1975 before the release of an album. In 1977 with Fred Smith on bass and another guitarist, Richard Lloyd playing, Television released their first album "Marquee Moon". This album is thought by many to be one of the greatest in history. They've released 6 albums, 3 live, the latest being their self-titled release from 1992. Television is one the most innovative bands of al time.

    44
    The Velvet Underground

    Known as the grandfathers of punk rock, these New York rockers were revolutionary for their time. While the world was filled with the flowerchild mindset and lots of bands singing about love, peace, and happiness, Lou Reed, John Cale, and the rest of the Velvet Underground were ready to do something different. Instead of singing about all the hippie stuff, they sang about herion abuse, lives of prostitues and drug dealers, and many other subjects no one else dared the tread on. Backed by Andy Warhol for recording money, show money, and of course drugs, they lead the punk revolution. Their album did not sell very many copies, but every person who picked up a copy, started a band. That is saying something for these legends

    43
    Crass

    "Fight war, not wars." This band is absolutely incredible. I mean honestly they are the creator of a MOVEMENT. They started anarcho-peace which has made an influence on countless numbers of bands. When you think about people in history who made positive movements there has always been a significant change. This band isn't credited enough for all the changes that it has made, but other than that they put out positive, socially and politically aware music. What I love about Crass is they wanted to express themselves so they did it in a complete diverse and unique way. Crass matured so much as a band and had many different looks on things. They believed in peace and equality, yet freedom for all. Their release "The Feeding of 5,000" could go down in the books as one of the greatest punk albums ever. Crass is such a unique band. They didn't even know how to play their instruments, but they didn't care because they had something to say. And look what that started.

    42
    Sham 69

    Oi legends along the same ranks of **** Sparrer, Cockney Rejects, and Angelic Upstarts. Named for grafitti in their hometown of Hersham, Sham 69 formed at the same time as other punk legends Sex Pistols and The Clash. Unlike these other two bands, Sham played charged pub-worthy rock and roll to be enjoyed by the working class and the emerging skinhead culture. Responsible for the oi scene to follow, Sham 69 were true legends

    41
    Suicidal Tendencies

    Thrash influenced so-cal hardcore-punk band Suicidal Tendencies lead a major hand in marrying punk and skateboard culture in the early 80s. The band attracted both punks and metalheads to their shows, bridging a gap between two groups who usually have a dislike for each other

    40
    Hüsker Dü

    Formed in Minneapolis in 1979, Husker Du played a melodic version of hardcore punk, experementing and pushing there sound to new lengths with there unconventional musical and songwriting style. Often cited as the core of the bands style is the songwriting and singing, centered around the angry and agressive lyrics and vocals of guitarist Bob Mould and the melodic songwriting of drummer Grant Hart. In nine years as a band the Husker Du trio of Mould, Hart and the bassist Greg Norton had made a huge impact on the dwindling punk and hardcore scenes and there now over twenty year old records continue to influence alternative bands to this day.

    39
    G.B.H.

    Short for Grevious Bodily Harm, these street punk legends were known for their fast music and perfect blend of punk and a little hardcore, and lots of attitude. Orginally called Charged GBH to distinguish themselves from another band called GBH

    38
    Sonic Youth

    Influnced by New Yorks "no Wave" scence, Sonic Youth got their start by creating records of a slight avant-garde flavor, utilizing alternative guitar tunings, and other things to achevie wild effects. Soon Sonic youth took this approach and combined it with the sounds od such bands as The Stooges and the New York Dolls. With each succending realses Sonic Youth's sound was constantly evolving and are still going strong into the new millienum. Group members include: Lee Ranaldo Kim Gordon,Thurston Moore,Jim O'Rourke, Steve Shelley,and Bob Bert.

    37
    AFI

    AFI started in the summer of 1991. Their first release: Answer that and Stay Fashionable, released on Nitro Records, was a fast paced punk album,as was their second album: Very Proud of Ya!, whilst there next albums would be more rock influenced, and evry change they've made has been good. AFI are still going strong and have a new album coming out soon.

    36
    Catch 22

    In 1996 while Tomas Kalnoky and Chris Greer met Kevin Gunther at a local record store, they discovered a mutual love of music, namely punk & ska. They wanted to make a newer sound that combined their love of both types of music. They played local shows around New Jersey and had a fast growing fan base of this new sound. The band signed on to Victory Records in late 1997. Within a year Keasbey Nights became one of the top-ten selling Victory albums of all time. After Tomas left, and a newer, more energetic line-up. Catch 22 took to the road with Ten Foot Pole, for what became their biggest tour yet.

    35
    Flogging Molly

    The band legendary for their mixing of irish folk and punk music, Flogging Molly. Formed by the only actual Irisih member, Dave King, the band made success for doing something that hadn't been done since The Pogues, and doing it just as well as their Irish counterparts. The band combines Irish folktunes and insturmentation with the speed and energy of punk, making for a fun mix.

    34
    Strike Anywhere

    Richmond, VA, although well renowned for it's great punk/hardcore scene, has never had a finer band than Strike Anywhere come from it. Perfectly blending all the agitation and vigor of old-school hardcore with the melodic sensibilities of new-school punk, these five boys are already on the verge of world-domination with their political melodicore.

    33
    Rise Against

    Rise Against are in in-your-face melodic hardcore band with highly political lyrics. A perfect blend of guitar-driven hardcore with a lot of melody, riffs, and solos, which are rarely seen in hardcore today. A truly unique band, no wonder they are edging ever closer to mainstream success.

    32
    The Dead Milkmen

    The Dead Milkmen,parodying almost everything, from Patti Smith all the way to 80's dance music,were one of the most underrated punk bands of the 80s. Formed in Philadelphia,originally was: Joe Jack Talcum, Dave Blood(RIP), Dean Clean, and Rodney Anonymous. The Dead Milkmen brought in comedy, sometimes with a subtle message, and lasted from 1987-1995. Their first published album Big Lizard in My Backyard is an essential that everyone should own. On March 10, 2004, sadly, Dave Blood chose to end his life.

    31
    Social Distortion

    Social Distortion was formed in 1978 by frontman Mike Ness in Orange County, California. Their first album, Mommy’s Little Monster, debuting in 1983, showed Social Distortion to be a standard melodic punk band, but by the time their self titled album came out in 1990, they started leaning more towards the roots rock and cowpunk genres. Albums subsequent to this, including 1992’s Somewhere Between Heaven and Hell and 2004’s Sex, Love, and Rock’ n’ Roll, proved that Social Distortion can be a very flexible and innovative band, and that Johnny Cash style country and the Clash style punk may look bad on paper, but it sounds great.

    30
    7 Seconds

    One of the longest last California hardcore-punk bands, 7 Seconds are usually a band mentioned in the same breath as other hardcore-punk legends like Minor Threat, and other youth crew bands like Youth Brigade. The band signed to BYO records in 1982, and released 3 LPs, then signed to Side 1 records and released other albums. They still tour today, with Kevin Seconds the only orginal membe

    29
    The Suicide Machines

    The Suicide Machines is a band out of Detroit that plays a variety of punk-related music including: punk, ska, hardcore and often a mix of two or three of the different genres. They are most renown for their first full-length album Destruction by Definition which even had the song New Girl featured on the first Tony Hawk game. They recently released another album titled War Profiteering is Killing Us All that so far has received positive feedback from their fans. They've nearly finished another US tour (West Coast) and plan on playing shows in Australia and Japan in October, so if you live out there check them out.

    28
    **** Sparrer

    Formed in 1975, **** Sparrer were one of the first oi bands, sprouting up even before the British punk wave had flowed through. Their songs were meant for the Cockney working class who frequented the pubs after a hard's day work and were ready to get drunk and have a good time with these fellas. Sparrer helped bring about all the oi bands around today, having nearly every modern oi band cite them as an influence. Them, along with Sham 69, Cockney Rejects, and Angelic Upstarts were the pioneers of the working class music of Oi!

    27
    The Adicts

    The Adicts are on of the catchiest pop-punk bands to ever emerge from the scene. Starting in late 70's England, their music made pop-punk cool for street punks to like. They soon became known for catchy, dark, and funny songs like Mary Whitehouse and Viva La Revolution. They've kept with their original line-up since the beginning, adding 2 new members, and continue to tour play the music they've been playing for almost 30 years. Their simple and catchy (yet still punX!) music is still relevant now.

    26
    The Stooges

    The original Stooges lineup formed in Detroit during 1968 with Ron Asheton on guitar, his brother Scott on drums, David Alexander on bass and Iggy singing. Their first album came in 1969 and had, in my opinion, two classics, "1969" which featured a psychedelic intro that is still unmistakable today and "Now I Wanna Be Your Dog" which is just a cool song. Later they came out with Fun House, their sophomore album. Both albums, however, pale in comparison to their 1973 album "Raw Power" which had Ron Asheton on bass and James Williamson on guitar. Just about every song on the album is a classic, and became a blueprint for a 1000's of bands to come. After that, The Stooges broke up, Iggy went on to do some stuff with David Bowie, most memorably the song, "Lust for Life", but nothing close to what he had with The Stooges.

    25
    Circle Jerks

    Circle Jerks was formed from the joining of former Black Flag frontman, Keith Morris, and former Redd Kross guitarist Greg Hetson in 1979. The band combined the rebellious attitude of 77 punk with the emerging hardcore music to make a mix we all know as hardcore-punk. Their debut album Group Sex, contained 14 tracks, none breaking the 2 minute mark. They played hard and fast and are loved by many.

    24
    Subhumans

    This band commenced in the raging anarcho-punk scene. They gave Flux a demo tape and Colin loved it. They
    released their first couple EP's and demos on Spiderleg (Flux's Label). Then the band created their own label 'Bluurg' and continued to march positively through the scene with amazing feedback. They still tour now however they disbanded in 1985. Dick Lucas, the frontman, is one of the most interesting and definitely innovative person of all the anarcho bands. He went on to other side projects like Citizen Fish and Culture Shock which were both successful. These bands had way more of a ska feel to them. There's more to this band than just a couple of albums or them breaking up in 1985, they have such a magic to the way and what they put on their CD's. This band got me into punk with their great music and intelligent lyrics. And I bet it didn't just get me into punk. Subhumans are one the greatest bands to ever come into the anarcho scene. And they still play shows and still continue to do what they love. How many bands can say that?

    23
    Minutemen

    Formed in San Pedro California by Singer/guitarist D. Boon, bassist Mike Watt, and drummer George Hurley. The Minutemen combined funk, free jazz, and hardcore punk to create an unique blend of punk rock. Most of their songs were a minute or less and lyrics included attacks on right wing politicians.With every new Minutemen releases their musicianship improved and songwriting skills got better. The peak of their life is Double Nikcles on the Dime, a double album.All of this was brought to a halt in 1985 with the tragic death of singer D. Boon in a van accident.

    22
    Refused

    Can I Scream? Refused formed in Umeå, Sweden in 1992 with the original view of incorporating their Marxist ideals into the blueprint of a fast paced hardcore band. After releasing strong LPs "This Just Might Be The Truth" and "Songs To Fan The Flames of Discontent" they released "The Shape Of Punk To Come." It was the most influential hardcore album of the nineties, containing amazing liner notes and "New Noise" One of the best hardcore songs ever written. Whether it truly was the shape of punk to come is debatable but Refused definitely raised the bar for all hardcore bands to follow.

    21
    Fugazi

    Perhaps one of the most important band's of its genre, post hardcore outfit Fugazi released one excellent album after another until their indefinite hiatus in 2001. Although they ventured into the indie genre more on their last release, The Argument, it still showed the extraordinary musicianship of the band, with MacKaye and Picciotto's interlocking guitars and Joe Lally's bass playing bordering on the virtuosic. Fugazi have retained their place in the hearts of many fans who view them as not only the best band in their genre, but as the best band of the decade.

    20
    Stiff Little Fingers

    Known as the Irish Clash, Stiff Little Fingers were plagued by this comparision. While similar in being a punk band from the 70s that played politically charged music and had a love for reggae, while The Clash were trying new styles and were able to do new things, SLF was first and foremost a punk band. Their debut album, Inflammible Material, was a masterpiece for early punk rock and is still considered a great album today.

    19
    The Misfits

    In 1977 a band would change punk forever. This band was the Misfits. Formed by Glenn Danzig and Jerry Only, this band set out to make an impresion...and they did. Although Danzig, the original lead singer, left in 1980, but The Misfits returned in 1997 without Danzig,and with a new member, Doyle Von Frankenstein, and released "American Pshyco. The Misfits have influenced uncountable numbers of bands, all the way from AFI to Marilyn Manson and started the genre we know today as "Horror Punk".

    18
    Gorilla Biscuits

    Rising out of the militant hardcore scene of New York City in the late 1980s, Gorilla Biscuits are often contested as the definitive band of their genre. Their only LP, Start Today, is often contested as hardcore's definitive release. With a positive message in their music opposing the all too evident elitism in the scene, Gorilla Biscuits gained popularity in a number of underground circles. However, as is the case with far too many talented bands, they did not become known on a wider scale until after their untimely demise, only managing to release an LP and a self titled EP.

    17
    NOFX

    I'm not a huge NOFX fan other than "The Decline" but if there is one band that should be comemorated on this list, it is NOFX. This band started what we know as political/social pop-punk today. They created a whole new perspective of punk and for that they are dubbed innovative and true. But aside from making great music this band has contributed so much to the punk scene that they have done their share in the community with flying colors. They have given so many bands a chance to voice their expressions while maintaining respectable albums that they have released. This band is not only extremely influential but they are the fathers of the punk rock scene we know today. All I have to say is, props to NOFX, whom do what they love and help others do what they love just as much. Props, NOFX.

    16
    Dropkick Murphys

    What do you get when you mix in booze, traditional Celtic music, rowdy punk rock, more booze, and a fat guy named Spicy? You get Boston legends Dropkick Murphy’s. Dropkick started in 1996 in a barber shops basement. The band has changed up a bit sense its humble beginnings: a new singer, new pipest, new guitarist and new mandolin/whistle player. But still Dropkick Murphy’s stick to what they do best, playing loud blue collar music with a Celtic kick with lyrics that can hit home. What separates Dropkick Murphy’s from most bands is pride, for their city, friends, family, Bruins, this bands all about pride, alcohol and music.

    15
    Choking Victim

    In ’93 Stza, Erza. Alec, and Skwert formed Choking Victim. Not much happened until ’99 when CV was signed to Epitaph. Soon after they began recording for their debut album. After one day of recording CV broke up, but the material they recorded was good enough to turnout “No Gods, No Managers”, the only major release for the ska-punk/hardcore, atheist, politically charged foursome. Not too long after, Leftover Crack was formed by Stza, Erza, Alec and a new drummer.

    14
    Rancid

    One of the frontrunners for the mid 90s punk revival, Rancid were formed from the ashes of legendary ska band Operation Ivy. They recruited Brett Reed on drums for their first album, then for their 1994 smash hit Let's Go they recruited Lars Frederiksen, which remains their line-up to the present. A highly influential band, Rancid will remain punk legends for years to come.

    13
    Leftöver Crack

    Rising from the depths of Choking Victim comes one of the most innovative and creative ska-core bands to ever be heard. Leftover Crack mix everything from Hardcore, Punk, Ska, Death Metal, and even Classical to create some of the best ska-core albums ever heard. So far, singer Stza, guitarist Ezra, bassist Alec, and drummer Ara, put out two albums (Mediocre Generica in 2001 and fusty walrus! World Trade in 2004.) Both albums bend the rules and hold strong messages about American politics and culture. Ever since the begining Leftover Crack put out some heavy ska-core tracks never leaving their N.Y.C. roots and never selling out. There's the good...the bad...and the Leftover Crack.

    12
    Sex Pistols

    The Sex Pistols, love them or hate them, are what the public eye has equated with punk since in conception. Formed by Wally Nightingale, Steve Jones, and Paul Cook under the name 'The Strand' in 1972, they later added Glen Matlock to the band, but the lineup never achieved any success. In 1975, Malcolm McLaren took over as manager of the band, kicking out Wally, and recruiting Johnny Rotten. The band was renamed the Sex Pistols. While they may not of started punk rock, as some say they did, the Sex Pistols soon brought it into the public eye with a single, 'Anarchy in the UK', and a string of tabloid covers. Glen was kicked out of the band and replaced by the musically talentless Sid Vicious. With another controversial single, 'God Save the Queen', and an album, 'Never Mind the Bollocks...", the Sex Pistols left for a US tour in early '78, during which Rotten quit the band onstage due to his constant feuds with the controlling McLaren. McLaren tried to keep the band alive through gimmicks like recording with Ronnie Biggs, but the band was over. Although some will claim the Pistols were merely a manufactured band being steered by McLaren, their influence on the punk scene of the 70's, as well as the genre as a whole, can not be denied.

    11
    Against Me!

    Fat Wreck favourites Against Me! have been accused of a whole lot of things over the years. People with any sense accuse them of playing some of the best punk music to come out in a while, heavily influenced by the folk and anarcho movements and fueled with anger, irony and pure passion for what they do. Their seminal LP Reinventing Axl Rose exhibits an exciting new take on the genre and remains a favourite release of fans. Their songs range from political satires to poignant ballads, never losing their driving force that has kept them going through the years they have graced the Florida punk scene.

    10
    Bad Brains

    During the late 70's, former jazz fusion artists Dr. Know (Gary Miller), Darryl Jenifer, and Earl Hudson joined with singer H.R. (Paul Hudson) to create one of the most hardcore punk bands to ever hit the face of the earth. Influenced by anything ranging from The Sex Pistols to Led Zepplin, Bad Brains put out some of the most amazing hardcore albums punk fans had ever heard before. After H.R. discovered his roots, converting to the rastafarian religion and slowly converting the rest of the band, the four rasta-punks started putting reggae tracks into their albums, creating an amazing contrast between songs that had never been heard before. Mixing their rastafarian beliefs, and punk ethics Bad Brains put out some revolutionary hardcore tracks that no other band will ever come close to copy.

    9
    Propagandhi

    Three Canadian agit-rockers formed a band in the early 90's and named it Propagandhi. The band has progressed over the years, going from bubble-gum anarchy-skate to inflammatory prog-thrash, always raising the bar of political correctness, songwriting abilities and technical proficiency. One of the most influential acts in the Canadian punk scene, as well as the international arena, thanks to an unrelenting awareness and awe-inspiring live shows.

    8
    Streetlight Manifesto

    Formed by Tomas of Catch 22, along with the sax player and bass player, joining with members of One Cool Guy and a new drummer. Streetlight Manifesto are hailed as one of the greates ska-punk bands of this decade. With Tomas genius songwirting and lyrical skills with the playing ability of all the members, the bands make a ska-punk sound that is to be reckonned with. They even may be pioneers of a 4th wave.

    7
    Minor Threat

    What's there to be said that everyone doesn't know already? Minor Threat helped to form the way hardcore sounds today and influenced an entire generation with their Straight Edge philosophy, although legendary frontman Ian MacKaye first conceived the idea when in the band the Teen Idles. Such classic songs as Out Of Step, In My Eyes, Seeing Red and of course, Straight Edge remain favourites among all fans of the genre even today, with the band's fury and energy still
    attracting listeners today.

    6
    Black Flag

    Black Flag was one of the most influential hardcore bands of the 80's. Black Flag are credited with kick starting the underground movement in the United Staes with the devleopment of SST records. Black Flag toured relentlessly, influencing countless bands where ever they went. Their music filrted with heavy metal, experimental noise, and even free jazz at some points, but are still considered the definitive hardcore band.

    5
    Operation Ivy

    Ska gods Operation Ivy formed around March 1987, when Matt and Lint's (Tim Armstrong) band, Basic Radio broke up. After only being around for two years, and only releasing one album, Energy, Operation Ivy called it a day, playing their final show at the place where it all began, the Gillman Street club, in the home town of Berkeley, San Francisco.

    4
    Ramones

    Starting out in the New York City Underground in 1975, the Ramones played fast, catchy punk rock, taking influence from the New York Dolls and the glue they sniffed. Many consider them the founders of punk and pop-punk. Their 3 chord songs were simple and catchy, everything that punk rock was supposed to be. The Ramones' first album inspired a ton of bands across the Atlantic. They released great album after great album in the 70's and continued to play into the 90's. The Ramones weren't the most talented or political band, but that didn't stop them from making some amazing music.

    3
    Bad Religion

    The most influential band to come out of the 80s Southern California hardcore-punk scene, Bad Religion are, very ironiclly, gods of their genre. They inspired many bands to start up their own bands, playing hardcore-punk and getting a scene started up in there area. And with the founding of Epitaph by Bad Religion's own Brett Gurewitz, these bands were able to be signed to a label that would respect their needs as musicians and would help them get their name out there. Not only were Bad Religion pioneers in their genre, but they were also proof that punks could be intelligent. With many of the members going to college, finishing college, and even getting Master's degrees. And this intelligence shows in their music, provoding points of views on religion and politics that could get any young punk thinking differently about the world around him.

    2
    The Clash

    The Clash were formed in 1976 when Mick Jones and Paul Simonon got Joe Strummer to quit the 101ers and join their band, soon to be known as the Clash. Their first album had Terry Chimes on drums and blended punk with rock 'n' roll and hints of ska and reggae. Topper Headon soon came in as the band's permanent drummer, and in late 1979 London Calling was released and changed punk (and all music for that matter) forever, moving away from their original sound. The Clash scored some pop hits with their fifth and final album, Combat Rock. With Joe Strummer's amazing songwriting, Mick Jones's talent as a guitarist and arranger, Paul Simonon's "screw Sid Vicious I don't want to play root notes" basslines, all supported by Headon's smooth percussion, the Clash defined and perfected punk by playing what they wanted to.

    1
    Dead Kennedys

    The Dead Kennedys formed in 1978 in San Francisco, CA after Jello Biafra and Klaus Flouride answered East Bay Ray's ad to start a band in a local magazine. The 3 joined together with drummer Ted and started playing hardcore-punk together in the every changing SF scene. DK is known by nearly all punk fans because of their revolutionary changes in hardcore-punk, bringing in politically charge lyrics with high quality musicianship. The Dead Kennedys changed hardcore-punk forever.

    Leave a comment:


  • RWB
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    Originally posted by Los Angeles View Post
    If you want to start a real argument, tell my college roommate that the Ramones are the first punk band.
    Holy ***** watch out for the Iggy/Stooges fans and yes we know the Velvet Underground were Gods.

    Leave a comment:


  • Peck
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    I was just having some fun. I have no dog in this fight at all.

    In fact it's somewhat comical that the pro Nirvana side of the argument has all turned on each other and is now having a battle royal over whether or not the band was or was not a punk rock band.

    Leave a comment:


  • Los Angeles
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    Originally posted by Peck View Post
    Well I guess 1980 was not at the beginning.


    If you want to start a real argument, tell my college roommate that the Ramones are the first punk band.

    Leave a comment:


  • RWB
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    Originally posted by billbradley View Post
    None of those bands sound like the Clash, and the Clash are the only punk band that matters. So your only point still means nothing.
    Bill I hope you're joking because that is BS.

    Constellations, love your mention of the Dead Kennedys.

    Leave a comment:


  • Los Angeles
    replied
    Re: Nirvana's place in the world of music....

    Originally posted by avoidingtheclowns View Post
    Indeed, for 'twas the age of Billy Ocean.
    And Belinda Carlyle's solo work.

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