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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

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  • Since86
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by Tom White View Post
    Yeah, and the guy becomes the MVP of the finals. I'll stick to my take on them liking his potential to become this sort player more than they liked what Hill brought to the table. They are a team that has made the right decision time after time after time. This is another example of that.
    In a perfect world, where teams don't have to worry about salary caps, your point would be rock solid. But too bad the NBA is a salary cap driven league, and the Spurs felt the need to cut salary. Had they had not felt that need, they might have never decided to make a trade in the first place.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kstat
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
    He's already been "reigned in" considerably, whether anyone wants to admit that or not. The difference between Lance from a control-perspective between rookie-Lance and this-year-Lance is ginormous.
    That isn't even remotely true.

    His A/TO is actually worse this year than it was last year, and that isn't taking into account his antics on and off the floor. He constantly killed what little flow the offense had by breaking plays and doing his own thing.

    Comparing his numbers to his first couple of years when he barely even saw the floor isn't saying much.

    Lance is a secondary ballhandler, ideally a third or a safety valve. The less he handles the ball the better he will look because he's very good at doing the little things but he's terrible at being a lead guard.
    Last edited by Kstat; 06-16-2014, 03:50 PM.

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  • Kid Minneapolis
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by Kstat View Post
    I don';t think Lance is the kind of player that you "reign in." He's a wild card, which is fine but you under no circumstances want him running your offense.
    He's already been "reigned in" considerably, whether anyone wants to admit that or not. The difference between Lance from a control-perspective between rookie-Lance and this-year-Lance is ginormous.

    Leave a comment:


  • Tom White
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by Since86 View Post
    Spurs liked a rookie contract Leonard better than a second contract Hill.

    Gotta love how people just skip over the cap ramificiations for why SA wanted to move Hill in the first place.
    Yeah, and the guy becomes the MVP of the finals. I'll stick to my take on them liking his potential to become this sort player more than they liked what Hill brought to the table. They are a team that has made the right decision time after time after time. This is another example of that.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kstat
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
    I think it could work wonderfully, as long as Vogel reigns him in on the 1-on-1 ****, or at least teach him to pick-and-choose his spots more wisely and less often.
    I don';t think Lance is the kind of player that you "reign in." He's a wild card, which is fine but you under no circumstances want him running your offense.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kid Minneapolis
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by Kstat View Post
    I think the less Lance is asked to run the offense the better.
    I think it could work wonderfully, as long as Vogel reigns him in on the 1-on-1 ****, or at least teach him to pick-and-choose his spots more wisely and less often. I also think that if Lance could improve his post-game, it could be a devastating development. He could collapse defenses or just take PGs to the hole.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kstat
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    I think the less Lance is asked to run the offense the better.

    Leave a comment:


  • Kid Minneapolis
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Hill is a really good player... he's not showcased much at all here. His percentages are identical the past 3 seasons here, but his usage was way less this past year. The offense just seems to be going away from him, which I find really weird, because Hill is one of our better offensive players on this team. It's like Vogel has some big-time restrictor plates on him for whatever reason. When he's given a green light, he is a problem for defenses. We just don't use him enough.

    This might sound crazy.... but I'd like to try swapping Hill and BornReady role-wise offensively (leave them as-is defensively). Let Stephenson handle the ball and create looks and focus on those dime numbers, and let Hill focus on just scoring. I think the only thing that has held back that idea is decision-making on Stephenson's part, but he's getting better at it. Hill, imo, is just built to score. He doesn't get enough credit in that department, he's always been used weirdly. I know he can get the offense into a set... but I'd love Vogel to just set him loose at the 2 spot offensively, tell him to be aggressive, get in the paint, hit some 3s. He's very effective at it when that's his focus.
    Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 06-16-2014, 03:39 PM.

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  • Kstat
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by Ace E.Anderson View Post
    You're off on a few points here.

    During the 2010 series against DAL Hill averaged 12 ppg, but 20.2 ppg over the last 4. He then averaged 12 ppg against the Suns. He was taken out of the starting lineup after game 2 where he scored 14 points. He was the Spurs leading scorer in game 4 with 17 off the bench.

    He would then play another season with SA where they were the number 1 seed and lost to MEM in 7 games. He started game 1, and came off the bench for the rest of the series, but was still solid in averaging 12 and 5 rebs.
    Granted, I was off a year. But the Spurs also lost to Memphis in 6 games, not 7.

    I was not wrong about his 2010 playoff performance, however.

    He shot 50% from the arc and 50% overall against Dallas.

    At the same time, he shot 37% and 23% against Phoenix and was god awful defensively. They put him in so many PnRs he collapsed.
    Last edited by Kstat; 06-16-2014, 03:36 PM.

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  • Kid Minneapolis
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by doctor-h View Post
    Would you remind us of the MASSIVE playoff games Hill had with San Antonio
    Yea, read the previous responses. Hill basically rescued the Spurs in the 2010 playoffs against the Mavs, when the big 3 were struggling.. he avg'd like 23 pts in that series, just carried them. I wanna say he went even further bazooka in the series clincher.

    Leave a comment:


  • CreekShow
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Put Kawhi on a team like Cleveland or somewhere else that'd he be a #2 option and this thread wouldnt exist

    Leave a comment:


  • immortality
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by Since86 View Post
    Spurs liked a rookie contract Leonard better than a second contract Hill.

    Gotta love how people just skip over the cap ramificiations for why SA wanted to move Hill in the first place.
    Or you know Kwahi is surrounded by two great ball handlers and a am all time post player, so he never had any pressure. Ask Kwahi to become the number one option, next year I wonder what could happen

    Leave a comment:


  • Since86
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by Tom White View Post
    I'll answer the original question with this - The Spurs certainly liked Leonard better than Hill.
    Spurs liked a rookie contract Leonard better than a second contract Hill.

    Gotta love how people just skip over the cap ramificiations for why SA wanted to move Hill in the first place.

    Leave a comment:


  • Ace E.Anderson
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by doctor-h View Post
    Would you remind us of the MASSIVE playoff games Hill had with San Antonio
    Game 3 against DAL in 2010 - 17 and 5
    Game 4 against DAL in 2010 - 29 and 4 - went 5 of 6 from 3
    Game 6 against DAL in 2010 - 21 and 6
    Game 6 against PHX in 2010 - 17 and 3
    Game 1 against MEM in 2011 - 15, 7, 3, 4 steals
    Game 2 against MEM in 2011 - 16, 5 and 4 with 2 steals

    No he wasn't putting up superstar numbers, but these are similar strong/solid numbers to what Leonard had been putting up in the playoffs with the Spurs as well. So maybe not "massive" numbers, but very good numbers on a contending team for sure. Those are just his SA playoff numbers, he's had big games for the Pacers in the playoffs as well

    Leave a comment:


  • Ace E.Anderson
    replied
    Re: Would we be a better team right now if we would have kept K. Leonard?

    Originally posted by Kstat View Post
    Hill had a massive series against Dallas in the playoffs, and was so badly outplayed in the following round against the Suns that he got removed from the starting lineup halfway through and never played another game for the Spurs again.
    You're off on a few points here.

    During the 2010 series against DAL Hill averaged 12 ppg, but 20.2 ppg over the last 4. He then averaged 12 ppg against the Suns. He was taken out of the starting lineup after game 2 where he scored 14 points. He was the Spurs leading scorer in game 4 with 17 off the bench.

    He would then play another season with SA where they were the number 1 seed and lost to MEM in 7 games. He started game 1, and came off the bench for the rest of the series, but was still solid in averaging 12 and 5 rebs.

    Leave a comment:

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