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Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

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Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

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1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

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  • #1

    1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

    http://www.indystar.com/article/2012...ch-lacks-spark

    By Mike Wells

    ORLANDO, Fla. -- The Indiana Pacers' second unit dubbed itself the "Goon Squad" last season for its ability to bring energy off the bench.

    This year, the second unit has been more of a "Missing Squad." It has shown a knack for missing shots, missing energy and missing point production.

    "They're probably a little bit disorganized and they need to come together more and calm down and just continue to try and keep the tempo high and make the other team work," coach Frank Vogel said.

    The Pacers, who conclude a three-game trip today at Orlando, believe they are one of the deepest teams in the league. They bring George Hill and Tyler Hansbrough off the bench. Both have starting experience.

    The problem the Pacers have encountered lately is that the second unit lacks continuity on the court. It's also when opposing teams have made runs on the Pacers.

    The unit features Hill, Hansbrough, Lance Stephenson, Dahntay Jones and Lou Amundson. Vogel has starter Paul George play with that group, too.

    "The offense flowed better last year with the second unit," Jones said. "We had an identity. We knew what we were going to do every game. This year we have to try to get something going on the defensive end so we can try to get something in transition. That's the best shot we've got."

    The Pacers are missing veteran Jeff Foster off the bench. Foster has played in only five games this season because of back issues. He hopes to play Tuesday against the New Jersey Nets at Bankers Life Fieldhouse.

    Amundson is a blue-collar worker like Foster, but he lacks the experience the Pacers need in the second unit.

    The Pacers are 9-1 this season when their bench outscores the opponent. They're 3-4 when they get outscored.

    One of their best stretches came when A.J. Price got some playing time three weeks ago. He was one of the reasons the Pacers beat the Celtics in Boston on Jan. 6.

    Price's presence kept Vogel from worrying about overloading starter Darren Collison's minutes because the Pacers could go with either Price or Hill at point guard.

    Price moved back to the bench once Stephenson returned from a sprained ankle. Stephenson is primarily used at shooting guard.

    Vogel wants to get his bench situation taken care of because the Pacers will go deep into the roster with so many games in a short period of time.

    It doesn't help that Hill and Hansbrough are struggling from the field.

    Hill is 3-of-18 from the field in the past three games.

    The scouting report on Hansbrough has made its way around the league. Teams no longer allow him to catch and shoot the ball in rhythm. They force him to think about his moves.

    That has led to a career-low 36.9 percent shooting.

    "Right now I feel like we're doing different things," Hansbrough said. "We're not moving the ball as well. It's not going to go in every time I shoot it, but anybody who knows me knows I'm still going to shoot it. I've got a lot of confidence that my shot will come around."

    Vogel said he needs to come up with a better way for Hansbrough to get involved in the offense.

    "I don't feel like I'm getting him the shots that he was getting last year in terms of his midrange rhythm catch and shoots," Vogel said. "Guys are on to him. We have to make sure we get him some more shots in the rhythm of the offense that he hasn't been able to get


    ************************************************** ********

    Additional to this I want to share a twitter message from Mike in response to a question I sent him.


    @MikeWellsNBA Any indication of lingering injury to Tyler's eye or head? Any other reason for current prolonged slump?

    @El_Peckbo Got a story about Tyler/2nd unit in tomorrow's paper. Tyler's a catch n shoot rhythm player, teams r not letting him b in...cont

    @El_Peckbo in rhythm when he catches it. Vogel acknowledged he has to find way to get Tyler rhythm shots. Other issue is not alot of...cont

    @El_Peckbo pick and roll or pick n pop plays for Tyler anymore


    Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13
    Tags: None
  • #2
    Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

    Honestly, Price is okay, but he is definitely better than Lance. I would rather have George Hill as the shooting guard and Price as the PG. I don't understand why they are so inclined on giving Lance so many opportunities.....

    Comment

    • #3
      Originally posted by immortality View Post
      Honestly, Price is okay, but he is definitely better than Lance. I would rather have George Hill as the shooting guard and Price as the PG. I don't understand why they are so inclined on giving Lance so many opportunities.....
      Because he is a pretty good player taking advantage of limited opportunity. And they don't agree with you.

      Sent from my Galaxy Nexus
      Last edited by spazzxb; 01-29-2012, 04:34 AM.

      Comment

      • #4
        Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

        I continue to believe Hill's at his best off the ball.
        This space for rent.

        Comment

        • #5
          Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

          Stephenson is playing over Price (who has proven to be an upgrade) because LB wants it.
          So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.

          If you've done 6 impossible things today?
          Then why not have Breakfast at Milliways!

          Comment

          • #6
            Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

            Lance should be sent to the DLeague and Price given some minutes. That will also allow Hill to play off the ball.

            5 minutes a game for Lance isn't going to help him get better. 30+ minutes a game in the DLeague would.
            First time in a long time, I've been happy with the team that was constructed, and now they struggle. I blame the coach.

            Comment

            • #7
              Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

              I'm glad they're sticking with that second unit now and trying to make it work. AJ would probably be more effective right now than Lance, but Lance's raw talent makes the gamble worth it.

              Comment

              • #8
                Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

                Originally posted by Sparhawk View Post
                Lance should be sent to the DLeague and Price given some minutes. That will also allow Hill to play off the ball.

                5 minutes a game for Lance isn't going to help him get better. 30+ minutes a game in the DLeague would.
                I forget the exact quote but LB has said something along the lines that they don't use the D-League because they don't think anyone gets better by playing against inferior competition.

                Comment

                • #9
                  Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

                  Originally posted by Sparhawk View Post
                  5 minutes a game for Lance isn't going to help him get better. 30+ minutes a game in the DLeague would.
                  Practicing against NBA players and being coached by Vogel/Shaw can't huhrt.
                  This space for rent.

                  Comment

                  • #10
                    Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

                    so technically we're still winning while trying to develop young talent which the front office believes can be a vital part of the future.

                    IS THIS NOT WHAT WE WANTED and complained about while JOB was around here and how he was not playing the young guys and going with players who had no future with the Pacers?

                    Comment

                    • #11
                      Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

                      Originally posted by bellisimo View Post
                      so technically we're still winning while trying to develop young talent which the front office believes can be a vital part of the future.

                      IS THIS NOT WHAT WE WANTED and complained about while JOB was around here and how he was not playing the young guys and going with players who had no future with the Pacers?
                      Good point. I do think that Price should become an option if the offensive flow in the 2nd unit continues to struggle. He is also a young player.

                      To me, as much as I like Amudson's energy at times, he seems to be the bottle kneck of offensive possessions for the 2nd unit. If Pendergraph got his minutes and the offense flowed through Dahntay and Tyler in the post as it did last year, rather than through either Tyler or Amudson in the post, I think this would improve things all around.

                      Comment

                      • #12
                        Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

                        Originally posted by Anthem View Post
                        Practicing against NBA players and being coached by Vogel/Shaw can't huhrt.
                        Can't hurt, but have you seen any improvements? To me it seems like he's getting worse. He's getting a TO every game and he's only playing roughly 9 minutes. That's pretty damn terrible.

                        I'm not saying he can't get better, but he plays 1 - 5min stretch in the first and that's it. If he was getting 10-15 min/game then maybe he'd start to improve. He gets in there knowing he has very limited minutes and tries to do to much. I wish he'd play more under control.

                        I just think the D-League could help him get into the flow of the game. Yes, he's playing lesser competition, but Lance is barely an NBA player right now. It would also boost his confidence. He's got talent, but he's still just so out of control.
                        First time in a long time, I've been happy with the team that was constructed, and now they struggle. I blame the coach.

                        Comment

                        • #13
                          Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

                          Originally posted by able View Post
                          Stephenson is playing over Price (who has proven to be an upgrade) because LB wants it.
                          Yep.

                          Price is ALSO YOUNG(ish) and fits more as a PG that will get Hill and Hans the looks they need and keep the floor calm.



                          The team stopped being about youth development when they got rid of everyone accept Foster. Even if they kept Rush and Josh they'd be doing nothing but playing the "kids".

                          So you do not have to go out of your way to develop Lance, and in fact you aren't stable enough to do so normally.


                          And everyone knows how PO'd I remain about not keeping Josh for the Lou/Foster role when you need offensive flow. He runs the court, has good handles for his size and great passing. Josh to Price on an outlet gets you into a quick look for Hill and Hans.

                          Then if you run into defensive issues you can bring Lou in for Josh or Tyler as needed, and if you have a good game going you can slip in Lance and teach him to run the floor as well (or play him at SG with Hill/Price at PG).



                          It's water under the bridge I realize, but it was so pointlessly foolish. I strongly suspect that Bird pushed Josh along and Price to the bench SPECIFICALLY to support "his" projects - Tyler and Price.

                          Comment

                          • #14
                            Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

                            Originally posted by Sparhawk View Post
                            Can't hurt, but have you seen any improvements? To me it seems like he's getting worse.
                            Surely you can't be serious.
                            This space for rent.

                            Comment

                            • #15
                              Re: 1/29/12 Mike Wells article in the star about the bench

                              Originally posted by Anthem View Post
                              Practicing against NBA players and being coached by Vogel/Shaw can't huhrt.
                              This season is very strange... there just isn't any time for practice. At times, when there is a break in the game schedule, Vogel allows the players to take the day for rest. When they do have practice, I doubt there is anything at full speed; Vogel doesn't want to wear out his players.

                              So, I don't think Lance isn't getting much opportunity in practice to play against NBA competition.

                              I agree with sending him to the D-league. And, perhaps one of the assistant coaches should go with him to help out.

                              Comment

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