The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

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  • Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

    Danny had an unbelievable year last year and a great year prior to that. This year he has looked terrible most of the year.

    I don't have the statistic, but I am sure his FG% is terrible. He probably has the worst handles of any starting small forward in the league, it's actually embarassing to watch him dribble.

    So far Dahntay Jones has been the Pacers best player this year, to me that is an undeniable fact! He is the only guy who has given his all every minute on the floor, he makes plays, he makes shots, he plays defense, he gets the team going, he is a leader! This is a guy who is basically a journeyman.

    I hope that Granger is just banged up and that is why his shot isn't falling. Outside of his shooting, my biggest problem is his decision making and attitude. I do not see him getting the players excited and I do not see him consistently putting forth effort on defense. He also needs to realize he is NOT a one on one player, in fact he is probably one of the worst one on one players on our team. He is a jumpshooter with the ability to be an excellent defensive player. Unfortunately, he is acting like he is Lebron James on offense and he is just not that talented.

    Obrien's system leads to inflated statistics....and I think that some of his statistical success from last season has gone to Grangers head. I think he was much better as a guy who was underrated and had something to prove. Now it almost seems like he has an "entitlement complex."

    Please convince me I am wrong and that Granger is the same player I have loved watching progress to the level he is capable of playing at (last year). I have been surprised at how many people are saying Murphy needs to go (i actually agree), all the while Granger is just getting a pass.
    *removed* Just keep politics and religion completely out of it, please.

  • #2
    Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

    I'm in complete agreement. He does seem to carry himself differently. I don't know. His shot selection is terrible, as are his handles.

    I think he gets a pass to an extent because he's injured and people can blame it on that. I see it differently though.

    -- Steve --


    • #3
      Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

      I think it's a problem with the offensive scheme, or lack thereof.

      In fact, you'd think Dunleavy was the coach. No movement unless Dun is on the floor.
      "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference


      • #4
        Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

        This might have something to do with his performance...

        Pacers forward Danny Granger knows he should probably sit out so his sprained left knee and bruised right heel can get better.

        "I have to play through it," Granger said. "We have an opportunity right now where we're in the mix of things. The standings are real close. There's not really one team that's dominating too much."


        • #5
          Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

          I just hate to see Troy jack up 3 pointers that hit hard off the front of the rim. It's all or nothing with his shots, either they hit the front of the rim and bounce out of the arena or they go in and hit the net so hard it looks like NBA Jam when the ball catches fire and the net burns to cinders. Danny has looked rather dull the past few games also, not moving around a lot and just looking all around uninterested other than getting his numbers. I thought TJ Ford looked the most involved in the game last night which is a good thing itself, but bad when nobody else is there to help him.
          I gave him a little bit of hell myself.

          "I've got an idea--an idea so smart that my head would explode if I even began to know what I'm talking about." - Peter Griffin


          • #6
            Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

            Originally posted by AG77 View Post
            This might have something to do with his performance...


            last thing we need is another JO....


            • #7
              Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

              Originally posted by bellisimo View Post
              last thing we need is another JO....
              I was focusing on his toughness not a long term injury lol.


              • #8
                Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

                Originally posted by Jon Theodore View Post

                Obrien's system leads to inflated statistics....and I think that some of his statistical success from last season has gone to Grangers head. I think he was much better as a guy who was underrated and had something to prove. Now it almost seems like he has an "entitlement complex."

                I can't disagree with you. I've said in a couple of threads in the last few days I'm disappointed in Granger and his attitude. Maybe his having been an Allstar last year has led him to a feeling of entitlement and a sour attitude. I have stated b4 his stats look like Stephen Jackson. 41% FGA, 35% 3 pt, and shooting 9 3's per game which is a little less than half the 3 ptrs being shot. I'm not giving Granger a pass whatsoever with his play this year. I'm unimpressed with Granger this season. Is this another case of I got my contract syndrome?


                • #9
                  Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

                  This is another predictable thread of people who like to break their favorite toys.

                  Granger is the Pacers' best player and he's paid a salary that is commensurate with his impact and production.

                  He's an all-star. He's not an elite player, but he's not paid like one either. Don't blame him for not being able to singlehandedly make a bad team into a good one. Granger is playing hurt and giving it all. He's busting his butt out there but now he's being criticized for not being more talented than he is and for not being Magic Johnson in the leadership department.

                  Also don't forget that now that he's an established star, teams are going to hound him more defensively. They're going to start game planning for him more and more, if they hadn't already. This is the life a star in the league faces. You're not some fresh faced kid flying under the radar.

                  I also hope this makes people realize how good someone like Carmelo Anthony is, someone who people in the past said there was no way they'd trade Danny for. Carmelo has been facing scrutiny, criticism, double and triple teams and been the focus of every opposing defense from the moment he entered the league. He's gone through the meat grinder and has emerged as a perennial star. Through all this burden, scrutiny and pressure he produces year after year. He'll probably never be a real MVP candidate (his game just isn't versatile enough), but he'll be close.

                  So now it's Granger's turn to face the burdens that come along with being a star. He's scrutinized more by fans, media and opposing defenses. Flaws that people used to gloss over are now being magnified. As good as he is, he's being criticized for not being even better. It's the same stuff that guys like Dirk, Pierce and Carmelo have faced year after year.


                  • #10
                    Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

                    as i've always stated, granger just is not cut out to be a franchise and the pacers organization need to realize this if the pacers hope to become a contender again. can he be a great #2 option? yes! but not a #1...on this board granger is rarely criticized in posts because doing so labels you as a "troll" and you get ban threats...but maybe that was just me?


                    • #11
                      Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

                      Originally posted by d_c View Post

                      So now it's Granger's turn to face the burdens that come along with being a star. He's scrutinized more by fans, media and opposing defenses. Flaws that people used to gloss over are now being magnified. As good as he is, he's being criticized for not being even better. It's the same stuff that guys like Dirk, Pierce and Carmelo have faced year after year.
                      Not all players can handle the pressure. Lets hope Granger can and improve his game at the same time.


                      • #12
                        Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

                        Originally posted by AG77 View Post
                        This might have something to do with his performance...

                        Yes, I think the injuries go a long way toward explaining why Danny is not driving to the basket or playing good D. We're in for a very long season of compensating injuries if this isn't addressed right away. Probably he'll tough it out for half a season or a little more and then get put on the shelf. I think he should be forced to sit for awhile right now so we have a chance with a healthy DG down the stretch.

                        All that said - part of his new demeanor/attitude might be due to injuries but there's most likely more to it than that. I think he thought the team was significantly better than it has shown itself to be so far and he's letting that frustration get to him. There might also be some overinflated ego in there now that he is "All-Star Danny Granger." I don't know. But I do know that this is an area he can and should work on if he's to be a leader of any sort on this team.

                        He's human, he wants to win, and he's feeling the pressures of being "the man" now - I'm giving him some time to process this and figure out a better way before I throw him completely under the bus. If he seems to have the same attitude/approach a month from now...
                        "Freedom is nothing else but a chance to be better." - Albert Camus

                        "Appreciation is a wonderful thing. It makes what is excellent in others belong to us as well." - Voltaire

                        "Everyone's values are defined by what they will tolerate when it is done to others." - William Greider


                        • #13
                          Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

                          I think one factor in people's opinions here, and I know I see this in myself, is that I think the Pacers can get by with Murphy coming off the bench...maybe even better than we are...whereas I can't conceive of benching Granger. For one thing, his ....mmmm...struggles?...this season haven't reached anywhere near a Troy-like level, and for another, we would be well and genuinely hosed if he did fall off dramatically in his performance this year.

                          Still, he is getting criticism...for shot selection if nothing else. I know some have addressed a perceived lack of leadership, or a pouty attitude. I hope that attitude of his is frustration at the results we're getting lately, and is the kind of frustration that makes you keep trying harder and harder, rather than turn off.

                          Hey, every season needs a little drama, eh?

                          [~]) ... Cheers! Go Pacers!


                          • #14
                            Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

                            Danny has always gotten the fan love here. There has been alot of grumbling about his defense over the past couple years. As in he is not as aware of what is going on as he should be, I think most figured he would catch on and end up being Artest's defensive replacement. That hasn't happened. He also has always had a green light on the offense because he puts up such big numbers and who else really can?

                            You have to wonder how he would fare in a system where he didn't have the green light everytime he touched the ball. Or on a team where he wasn't the best player or first option, say he was on the Nuggets, or Miami, or Cleveland even Dallas. He would be under 15ppg probably.


                            • #15
                              Re: Why does Danny Granger get no criticism?

                              Originally posted by d_c View Post
                              He's busting his butt out there but now he's being criticized for not being more talented than he is and for not being Magic Johnson in the leadership department.
                              People are criticizing him for poor shot selection, terrible ball handling, excessive turnovers, no movement without the ball, mediocre defense, and lack of leadership. Nothing to do with talent.