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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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NY, Cali, and Miami vs the league

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  • #31
    Originally posted by Sollozzo View Post

    Raptors just won the championship.....and then their star player didnít even return for the repeat opportunity - likely sending them into a long period of mediocrity. So that example kind of proves what weíre complaing about. You can do everything right like the Raptors and STILL have nothing to show long term. The banner hangs forever and it was worth it, but it has to feel like it all happened in the blink of an eye for their fans.

    Yes itís increased parity - but itís parity based on which coastal cities these guys decided to team up on. Itís entertaining and they have the right to do it, but if youíre a fan of a flyover franchise (which is most franchises - even the Bulls are flyover nowadays), you have feel like even great GM work wont get your team very far.
    You are proving my point. Raptors could have kept DD who wanted to stay and they CHOSE to get KL and they win chip. So what do you mean by doing everything right?

    Teams can trade loyal guys but if the new guy jets itís a problem? What, when a team ďdoes everything rightĒ which isnít even clearly defined, a player should stay forever?

    Comment


    • #32
      Originally posted by freddielewis14 View Post

      You are proving my point. Raptors could have kept DD who wanted to stay and they CHOSE to get KL and they win chip. So what do you mean by doing everything right?

      Teams can trade loyal guys but if the new guy jets itís a problem? What, when a team ďdoes everything rightĒ which isnít even clearly defined, a player should stay forever?
      Everything right as in you literally build a championship team and canít even retain your best player.

      Comment


      • #33
        Originally posted by Sollozzo View Post

        Everything right as in you literally build a championship team and canít even retain your best player.
        Okay, so what say you on DD doing everything right and getting traded?

        Also, how long does a player have to stay on a well run team? Forever?

        Comment


        • #34
          Originally posted by freddielewis14 View Post

          Okay, so what say you on DD doing everything right and getting traded?

          Also, how long does a player have to stay on a well run team? Forever?
          Iím not saying anyone has to do anything lol. Iím not against a players right to change teams when their contract expires.

          Since youíre so obsessed with the word ďrightĒ, Iíll rephrase it: the Raptors built a championship team and still couldnít even keep their best player. That doesnít exactly inspire confidence for flyover fanbases that their team can ever build up a perennial title contender. Maybe you can catch lightning in a bottle like Toronto did, but good luck keeping it.

          Letís go back to how we got here: you used the Raptors winning a title as an example of parity. Itís a poor example because they were a title team for ONE season and didnít even have the opportunity to defend their title. Somehow this spiraled into a nuanced debate about ďrightĒ.

          Comment


          • #35
            Originally posted by Sollozzo View Post

            Iím not saying anyone has to do anything lol. Iím not against a players right to change teams when their contract expires.

            Since youíre so obsessed with the word ďrightĒ, Iíll rephrase it: the Raptors built a championship team and still couldnít even keep their best player. That doesnít exactly inspire confidence for flyover fanbases that their team can ever build up a perennial title contender. Maybe you can catch lightning in a bottle like Toronto did, but good luck keeping it.

            Letís go back to how we got here: you used the Raptors winning a title as an example of parity. Itís a poor example because they were a title team for ONE season and didnít even have the opportunity to defend their title. Somehow this spiraled into a nuanced debate about ďrightĒ.
            Iím just going off of what is being said to be an issue. GMs try and collect talent to win, how is that any different than players doing that? We just had an unpredictable winner and nobody knows who is winning this coming year. Seems to be exactly what we should want.

            Comment


            • #36
              Originally posted by freddielewis14 View Post

              You familiar with Kareem Abdul Jabaar?
              Jabbar? Yes and that was a very rare example of what we are talking about here. He forced what was known as the worst trade in history screwing the Milwaukee Bucks. The fact it has happened at some point in the past doesn't mean it happened often and doesn't make it help the league.
              Vnzla81: Yep pretty much, they cut him because they were going to get "their guy" they couldn't get option 1,2,3,4,5 then they went to Lance he said "no thanks" and they had no other choice but to get Lance 2.0 for three times the cost.

              Comment


              • #37
                Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post

                Jabbar? Yes and that was a very rare example of what we are talking about here. He forced what was known as the worst trade in history screwing the Milwaukee Bucks. The fact it has happened at some point in the past doesn't mean it happened often and doesn't make it help the league.
                His entire post was about how things used to be. Predictable contenders and trade demands have always been a thing. People just donít see the relativity as they get older imho.

                Comment


                • #38
                  Originally posted by freddielewis14 View Post

                  Iím just going off of what is being said to be an issue. GMs try and collect talent to win, how is that any different than players doing that? We just had an unpredictable winner and nobody knows who is winning this coming year. Seems to be exactly what we should want.
                  How is it any different than players colluding to do that? You have got to be kidding. Do you understand that GM's can't just pick a group of players they want and put them on their team? Do you?

                  That's what these star players can do. They just call up their agent and he arranges a power move to another team.

                  So, the NBA is really just like a pickup up game at the park where there is no GM, no fair trades, and said players just decide they want to play with the best 5 and beat the tar of everyone. And why people pay to watch this stuff is beyond me. I stopped attending games 2 years ago because the product is essentially fake and every year it gets worse. It is a complete joke that Kawhi Leonard and the Raptors are getting blown up right after winning a title. What fan wants to see that? The NBA has absolutely no respect for its fans.
                  Vnzla81: Yep pretty much, they cut him because they were going to get "their guy" they couldn't get option 1,2,3,4,5 then they went to Lance he said "no thanks" and they had no other choice but to get Lance 2.0 for three times the cost.

                  Comment


                  • #39

                    Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post

                    How is it any different than players colluding to do that? You have got to be kidding. Do you understand that GM's can't just pick a group of players they want and put them on their team? Do you?

                    That's what these star players can do. They just call up their agent and he arranges a power move to another team.

                    So, the NBA is really just like a pickup up game at the park where there is no GM, no fair trades, and said players just decide they want to play with the best 5 and beat the tar of everyone. And why people pay to watch this stuff is beyond me. I stopped attending games 2 years ago because the product is essentially fake and every year it gets worse. It is a complete joke that Kawhi Leonard and the Raptors are getting blown up right after winning a title. What fan wants to see that? The NBA has absolutely no respect for its fans.
                    This is way too hyperbolic to really respond much to, but Iíll just say that the NBA was compared to WWF and you said good GMs arenít rewarded for very long and I think Iíve made a pretty good case against both those points.

                    Comment


                    • #40
                      Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post

                      Yes, when he was well past his prime.

                      The issue isn't the ring chaser that's been around for years. The issue are the star players in the league just entering their prime teaming up and destroying competition. It creates essentially a fake league similar to how you might go to a city park and the best 5 guys dominate all summer. Not real interesting unless you like to know the end result.
                      32 is well past his prime??

                      He averaged 45 minutes per game his first year in LA, lol

                      Comment


                      • #41
                        Originally posted by freddielewis14 View Post

                        His entire post was about how things used to be. Predictable contenders and trade demands have always been a thing. People just donít see the relativity as they get older imho.
                        Maybe someone here is talking about predictable contenders but I am not. I am talking about teams having a fair chance to trade for equal value and not being forced to make a fire sale. The fact is, a little of that did happen in the past but very little. You mentioned Jabbar. Shaq also forced his way out of Orlando to LA too. But it is now common place among essentially any top 20 player and that isn't good for the league.

                        As for favorites, I am perfectly fine with that as long as the reason they are a favorite is because of a wise set of moves by a GM (picks and/or trades). The arbitrary shifting of talent is the problem.
                        Vnzla81: Yep pretty much, they cut him because they were going to get "their guy" they couldn't get option 1,2,3,4,5 then they went to Lance he said "no thanks" and they had no other choice but to get Lance 2.0 for three times the cost.

                        Comment


                        • #42
                          Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post

                          Maybe someone here is talking about predictable contenders but I am not. I am talking about teams having a fair chance to trade for equal value and not being forced to make a fire sale. The fact is, a little of that did happen in the past but very little. You mentioned Jabbar. Shaq also forced his way out of Orlando to LA too. But it is now common place among essentially any top 20 player and that isn't good for the league.

                          As for favorites, I am perfectly fine with that as long as the reason they are a favorite is because of a wise set of moves by a GM (picks and/or trades). The arbitrary shifting of talent is the problem.
                          Common place for top 20 stars to demand a trade? Who else besides PG who hasnít won a series since 2013/2014 and frankly Thunder prob were relieved to break that up, and Anthony Davis who had every right to want out of Nola?

                          Comment


                          • #43
                            Originally posted by freddielewis14 View Post


                            This is way too hyperbolic to really respond much to, but Iíll just say that the NBA was compared to WWF and you said good GMs arenít rewarded for very long and I think Iíve made a pretty good case against both those points.
                            In other words you cannot deny the fact that players colluding to form a super team is not like a couple GM's negotiating a trade on the open market. One is anti-competitive. The other is the definition of fair competition.

                            ...and you might be confusing me with Sollozzo. Similar but not the same views.
                            Last edited by BlueNGold; 07-07-2019, 09:56 PM.
                            Vnzla81: Yep pretty much, they cut him because they were going to get "their guy" they couldn't get option 1,2,3,4,5 then they went to Lance he said "no thanks" and they had no other choice but to get Lance 2.0 for three times the cost.

                            Comment


                            • #44
                              Originally posted by freddielewis14 View Post

                              Common place for top 20 stars to demand a trade? Who else besides PG who hasnít won a series since 2013/2014 and frankly Thunder prob were relieved to break that up, and Anthony Davis who had every right to want out of Nola?
                              Kyrie Irving and Jimmy Butler last year. It's not that every player is demanding a trade, it's that more of the very best players in the NBA are demanding trades AND either going to stacked teams or as free agents are arranging to go to the same teams or to stacked teams (e.g. Durant, Leonard, etc).
                              Vnzla81: Yep pretty much, they cut him because they were going to get "their guy" they couldn't get option 1,2,3,4,5 then they went to Lance he said "no thanks" and they had no other choice but to get Lance 2.0 for three times the cost.

                              Comment


                              • #45
                                Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post

                                In other words you cannot deny the fact that players colluding to form a super team is not like a couple GM's negotiating a trade on the open market. One is anti-competitive. The other is the definition of fair competition.
                                No, I think itís a stupid thing to dwell on. Good GMs still put together the best teams. Look what the Lakers did last season putting together a team.

                                Comment

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