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If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

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Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

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The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

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It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

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We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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How should we finish free agency?

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  • #91
    Originally posted by PetPaima View Post

    I don't think anyone ASSUMES Leaf to be a weak link anymore. He has produced abundant evidence for us to KNOW that he can only be a quality starter in Lebanon or Cyprus. A BUM!!!!
    Young fella just turned 22, he would be starting his senior year if he had stayed in college. I think he has shown enough to not be considered a bum. It seems he will be given a chance to be the backup PF, if he doesn’t do well this year, then he will be gone. We’ll see

    Comment


    • #92
      Originally posted by Larry Staverman View Post
      We currently have 12 guaranteed contracts and Johnson's contract is guaranteed on July 15 which would make 13 guaranteed total.

      According to Pritchard in his interview with Dakich on June 21 at the 7:40 mark he says we are only going to sign 13 guaranteed contracts this year and 2 non guaranteed.

      https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YPC7A23BoWs&t=460s
      Thanks for sharing; I hadn't heard that one.

      Maybe we are done???? I'd be ok with it but it feels like we're a player short. I don't know what the team is thinking about Alize either since his guarantee is up, but I'd like to see us give him a try.

      Comment


      • #93
        Originally posted by imawhat View Post

        Thanks for sharing; I hadn't heard that one.

        Maybe we are done???? I'd be ok with it but it feels like we're a player short. I don't know what the team is thinking about Alize either since his guarantee is up, but I'd like to see us give him a try.
        We got enough. They can start Sabonis and Turner but many games we will probably close with Warren at PF.

        Comment


        • #94
          I would like to trade for Andre Iguodala. He's owed $17.2M. If we could manipulate the order in which we sign these players, we could trade McDermott's $7.3M for two years ($14.7M). This actually doesn't hurt Memphis, because their buyout is going to roughly be $14M on his deal anyway. If they spread his deal, they still have a cap hit of $5.7M for three years. They're on the hook for ~$14M in cash regardless. They will actually open up more cap space to add assets at the trade deadline.

          Iguodala could come in and be a combo forward for us and teach our young players about how to defend. He would be a perfect mentor for Lamb and Warren on that side of the ball. He would be a veteran presence that we lost with Thad and Darren. We could resign him for a whole lot less next year to finish out his career as a veteran bench player.

          Vince Carter, from a business standpoint. It will be his retirement tour this year and we will get a lot of money in visitor ticket sales, while getting the benefit of a great veteran presence. The Pacers don't tend to generate as much as other teams from their 50% split of ticket revenue as a road team. Vince Carter would pay for his own salary.

          Pau Gasol would be a great big as our third center on a minimum contract. Veteran presence. Could be signed in conjunction with recruiting Vince. I want to get our young guys in practice court minutes with veterans. Both can retire together.

          Not sure how workable it is, but all of these smaller contracts can be fit within the scope of our Non-Taxpayer MLE.
          Last edited by pacergod2; 07-04-2019, 07:54 PM.
          "Your course, your path, is not going to be like mine," West says. "Everybody is not called to be a multimillionaire. Everybody's not called to be the president. Whatever your best work is, you do it. Do it well. … You cease your own greatness when you aspire to be someone else."

          Comment


          • #95
            Originally posted by pacergod2 View Post
            I would like to trade for Andre Iguodala. He's owed $17.2M. If we could manipulate the order in which we sign these players, we could trade McDermott's $7.3M for two years ($14.7M). This actually doesn't hurt Memphis, because their buyout is going to roughly be $14M on his deal anyway. If they spread his deal, they still have a cap hit of $5.7M for three years. They're on the hook for ~$14M in cash regardless. They will actually open up more cap space to add assets at the trade deadline.

            Iguodala could come in and be a combo forward for us and teach our young players about how to defend. He would be a perfect mentor for Lamb and Warren on that side of the ball. He would be a veteran presence that we lost with Thad and Darren. We could resign him for a whole lot less next year to finish out his career as a veteran bench player.

            Vince Carter, from a business standpoint. It will be his retirement tour this year and we will get a lot of money in visitor ticket sales, while getting the benefit of a great veteran presence. The Pacers don't tend to generate as much as other teams from their 50% split of ticket revenue as a road team. Vince Carter would pay for his own salary.

            Pau Gasol would be a great big as our third center on a minimum contract. Veteran presence. Could be signed in conjunction with recruiting Vince. I want to get our young guys in practice court minutes with veterans. Both can retire together.

            Not sure how workable it is, but all of these smaller contracts can be fit within the scope of our Non-Taxpayer MLE.
            If Victor were healthy I'd be right there with you in wanting Iggy because this team could potentially be one of the top 3 seeds if everybody were healthy and ready to go. But as it is thinking he won't be back till January or so I'm not sure we would be doing Iggy any favors or frankly us any good in bringing him in. But I like the idea more than I don't like it.


            Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

            Comment


            • #96
              So the way I see it Brogdon, Turner & Sabonis are all kind of near that All-Star level, do you think any of them can elevate their game to that level?

              Comment


              • #97
                For some reason, whenever I see or think of Iggy, it always reminds me of Danny Granger. I believe they came into the league the same year together (or, at least, no more than a year apart) and they were always in my mind comparable players in terms of their talent ceiling. Danny was the more gifted offensive player and Iggy a bit better defensively, but very similar in terms of their caliber. Just such a shame that he's still going strong in 2019 and Danny is long since an afterthought. Damn injuries..

                Comment


                • #98
                  Originally posted by pacergod2 View Post
                  I would like to trade for Andre Iguodala. He's owed $17.2M. If we could manipulate the order in which we sign these players, we could trade McDermott's $7.3M for two years ($14.7M). This actually doesn't hurt Memphis, because their buyout is going to roughly be $14M on his deal anyway. If they spread his deal, they still have a cap hit of $5.7M for three years. They're on the hook for ~$14M in cash regardless. They will actually open up more cap space to add assets at the trade deadline.

                  Iguodala could come in and be a combo forward for us and teach our young players about how to defend. He would be a perfect mentor for Lamb and Warren on that side of the ball. He would be a veteran presence that we lost with Thad and Darren. We could resign him for a whole lot less next year to finish out his career as a veteran bench player.

                  Vince Carter, from a business standpoint. It will be his retirement tour this year and we will get a lot of money in visitor ticket sales, while getting the benefit of a great veteran presence. The Pacers don't tend to generate as much as other teams from their 50% split of ticket revenue as a road team. Vince Carter would pay for his own salary.

                  Pau Gasol would be a great big as our third center on a minimum contract. Veteran presence. Could be signed in conjunction with recruiting Vince. I want to get our young guys in practice court minutes with veterans. Both can retire together.

                  Not sure how workable it is, but all of these smaller contracts can be fit within the scope of our Non-Taxpayer MLE.
                  Vince Carter would be awesome just because he's Vince Carter. He's still rotation-worthy as well. But I'd probably have to grab a jersey if he signed here.

                  I actually really like the Pau Gasol idea. I imagine he'd rather sign with someone that has a better shot at a ring, but what a great guy to have practice with Myles and Domas.

                  I don't hate the idea of Iggy, either. Great veteran, champion, and professional with a lot of versatility in what he could bring on the court and in the locker room and practice. Plus, that's a nice expiring contract to have on the books for a number of reasons.

                  Rondae Hollis-Jefferson is the dude I've been hoping for, given his fit with the rest of the team. He'd be a great replacement for Thad on a longer-term deal, as opposed to the 1-year vet minimum guys mentioned above.

                  Whatever happens, I feel like it's going to happen quickly after Kawhi announces his intentions. These guys are probably sitting around waiting like all of us for that news.
                  It's a new day for Pacers Basketball.

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Originally posted by festar35 View Post
                    So the way I see it Brogdon, Turner & Sabonis are all kind of near that All-Star level, do you think any of them can elevate their game to that level?
                    I think the potential is there. If Myles continues to develop, he's definitely knocking on the door. He's gotten a lot of buzz this offseason and I think people around the league have started to take notice. Domas a little less so, but getting the 6th Man nomination definitely helped raise awareness for him. I don't know how much higher his ceiling can get, but there's potential there if the Myles/Domas duo meshes and produces winning results.

                    Brogdon is similar to Domas in this regard. How much higher can his ceiling get? He just posted 50/40/90 and it's gonna be hard to improve upon that. But maybe with Vic out to start this season, Brogdon might have the opportunity to raise his scoring closer to 20ppg. Not predicting that, personally. But if he steps up and carries this team with our bigs, all three of them could have a shot at making the ASG.

                    What I do know is that this team needs another guy at that level. We need another All Star to really round out this roster and be a legitimate threat to the East's best teams. Even if one of those three guys does raise their game to All Star Reserve, I think we'll need one more established star.
                    It's a new day for Pacers Basketball.

                    Comment


                    • Originally posted by pizza guy View Post

                      I think the potential is there. If Myles continues to develop, he's definitely knocking on the door. He's gotten a lot of buzz this offseason and I think people around the league have started to take notice. Domas a little less so, but getting the 6th Man nomination definitely helped raise awareness for him. I don't know how much higher his ceiling can get, but there's potential there if the Myles/Domas duo meshes and produces winning results.

                      Brogdon is similar to Domas in this regard. How much higher can his ceiling get? He just posted 50/40/90 and it's gonna be hard to improve upon that. But maybe with Vic out to start this season, Brogdon might have the opportunity to raise his scoring closer to 20ppg. Not predicting that, personally. But if he steps up and carries this team with our bigs, all three of them could have a shot at making the ASG.

                      What I do know is that this team needs another guy at that level. We need another All Star to really round out this roster and be a legitimate threat to the East's best teams. Even if one of those three guys does raise their game to All Star Reserve, I think we'll need one more established star.
                      I thought I would never see the day when I would say this, but....

                      We don't need another All-Star level player on this team. I think Indiana just needs to ride this season on the backs of these young players until Vic comes back. Another All-Star level player would stifle the progression of the young players, because that means less touches. At this point, I'm just ready to sink or swim with this team, and just let the chips lay where they fall. We have 3 (maybe 4 if you include Holiday) young players with great potential, and it's just time to see what they can do.


                      Remember when we could have gotten 1-2 solid players and a possible Top 3 draft pick in the 2017 NBA Draft by trading away Paul George?

                      Comment


                      • Originally posted by ksuttonjr76 View Post

                        I thought I would never see the day when I would say this, but....

                        We don't need another All-Star level player on this team. I think Indiana just needs to ride this season on the backs of these young players until Vic comes back. Another All-Star level player would stifle the progression of the young players, because that means less touches. At this point, I'm just ready to sink or swim with this team, and just let the chips lay where they fall. We have 3 (maybe 4 if you include Holiday) young players with great potential, and it's just time to see what they can do.
                        Yeah, I'm fine with that this season since I don't think we'll be in serious contention for the ECF or Finals this year. I didn't really specify in my first post, but I meant more for the future when we could potentially be in that conversation. To really contend, I think we'd need another star. But for this year, I'm fully on board with letting the young guys play and learn and see what we have in Holiday, Sumner, Alize, Goga, and even Leaf.
                        It's a new day for Pacers Basketball.

                        Comment


                        • Originally posted by ksuttonjr76 View Post

                          I thought I would never see the day when I would say this, but....

                          We don't need another All-Star level player on this team. I think Indiana just needs to ride this season on the backs of these young players until Vic comes back. Another All-Star level player would stifle the progression of the young players, because that means less touches. At this point, I'm just ready to sink or swim with this team, and just let the chips lay where they fall. We have 3 (maybe 4 if you include Holiday) young players with great potential, and it's just time to see what they can do.
                          I think this is a valid approach if the Pacers organization truly believes Vic will fully return from the injury and one of either Myles, Sabonis, MB, or Holiday will develop into a multiple time AS selection type player. Also need at least a couple of the other three to continue to progress into solid long-term starter level guys.

                          Even if that ultimately plays out this team still needs a big 3 & D wing that can "guard up" against the elite forwards who are dominating the league right now. MB & Vic can handle the Beal's, Tatum's etc.

                          Comment


                          • No surprise that opinions on here vary about the potential of our youngins. I'm also curious, though, about the variation in required time for PDers to form opinions. For those who are down on Holiday and Sumner, for example, what would it take--and how long would it take--for us to change our opinions? Similarly, for those who are high on Leaf and Johnson, how long til we say, "Meh. Okay, I've seen enough. Never mind"?


                            "He’s no shrinking violet when it comes to that kind of stuff."

                            - Rick Carlisle on how Kevin Pritchard responds to needed roster changes.

                            Comment


                            • Originally posted by DrFife View Post
                              No surprise that opinions on here vary about the potential of our youngins. I'm also curious, though, about the variation in required time for PDers to form opinions. For those who are down on Holiday and Sumner, for example, what would it take--and how long would it take--for us to change our opinions? Similarly, for those who are high on Leaf and Johnson, how long til we say, "Meh. Okay, I've seen enough. Never mind"?
                              I can only speak for myself, but I was never for the "Let the young players player and develop" philosophy. To me, it was just lowkey way of saying "tank the season", and hopefully we'll get a high draft pick. When people said it, it was when we had Joe Young, Hakeem Christmas, Alize Johnson, IkeAnigbogu, etc type of players. To me, these players would have NEVER have made even descent backups on a good team, so to me...why waste the season developing players that won't mount to anything. Truthfully, I'm STILL not big on Sumner or Leaf, so I could care less about their development, but they could prove me wrong over time. The only reason why I wouldn't mind it this season, because we have 3 players knocking on the door of an All-Star breakout season in Turner (DYOP candidate - kinda), Sabonis (6th Man candidate), and Brogan (50/40/90 club). Then we have Holiday who seems to be our diamond in the rough pick, and who I think should be given heavy minutes the same way we gave Lance opportunity to shine.

                              These players need to put into a sink or swim situation while Victor is out, so we can see what we got. If we can secure our future at the PG/PF/C spot on cheap contracts, then we only have to worry about one position for the 2020-2021 season where Indiana will have salary cap to get a solid starter at the SF spot. Plus, we need to know what type of value we have in Sabonis who's qualifies for an extension after this season.
                              Last edited by ksuttonjr76; 07-05-2019, 11:51 AM.


                              Remember when we could have gotten 1-2 solid players and a possible Top 3 draft pick in the 2017 NBA Draft by trading away Paul George?

                              Comment


                              • Originally posted by DrFife View Post
                                No surprise that opinions on here vary about the potential of our youngins. I'm also curious, though, about the variation in required time for PDers to form opinions. For those who are down on Holiday and Sumner, for example, what would it take--and how long would it take--for us to change our opinions? Similarly, for those who are high on Leaf and Johnson, how long til we say, "Meh. Okay, I've seen enough. Never mind"?
                                Well, for example, I'm actually a believer in TJ Leaf and I think he is extremely talented offensively. For me, it would require Leaf getting the same opportunity a guy like McDermott gets. McDermott just played an entire season poorly 75% of the time, yet was allowed to continue. And for me, that's the guy that better worry about minutes, not the guy who hasn't been given an opportunity. Let the dude play thru some mistakes. Give him regular rotation minutes for an extended period of time (like half a season) and reevaluate. I guarantee, you will start to see some serious improvement.
                                "Don't get caught watchin' the paint dry"

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