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The Rules of Pacers Digest

Hello everyone,

Whether your are a long standing forum member or whether you have just registered today, it's a good idea to read and review the rules below so that you have a very good idea of what to expect when you come to Pacers Digest.

A quick note to new members: Your posts will not immediately show up when you make them. An administrator has to approve at least your first post before the forum software will later upgrade your account to the status of a fully-registered member. This usually happens within a couple of hours or so after your post(s) is/are approved, so you may need to be a little patient at first.

Why do we do this? So that it's more difficult for spammers (be they human or robot) to post, and so users who are banned cannot immediately re-register and start dousing people with verbal flames.

Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Myles Turner is currently the #1 Block leader of the 2018/2019 Season thus far

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  • #76
    Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post

    I get it. The strawmen always start popping up when debating the facts are hard.

    Myles has come a long way. Right now, I would take Gobert and his 65% FG% and 12.5 boards along with excellent rim protection over Myles. Whiteside? I am less sure of that. Hassan's game has been slipping a bit. I would say Myles and Whiteside are pretty close.
    Gobert sucks defensively this year. There's a reason the Jazz have taken a huge step towards regression and it's not Mitchell. Gobert is horrible in any sort of situation where he has to move his feet.

    Whiteside is a negative.


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    • #77
      Shot blocking is just one thing, but Myles is reducing opponent shooting at the rim by 7% when he's in the game. Simply put he's the single biggest reason the Pacers have climbed to the top of the defensive charts over the past month.

      EDIT: Teams are turning away from Myles at like the free throw line, he moves his feet so well that he just seems to engulf most angles to the rim. It's part of why Thad and Vic and the team have seen an uptick in turnovers lately too, guys are making forced, rushed decisions rather than attemptiong to challenge Myles anywhere within 15 feet.
      Last edited by Trader Joe; 01-04-2019, 11:34 AM.


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      • #78
        Originally posted by Trader Joe View Post
        Shot blocking is just one thing, but Myles is reducing opponent shooting at the rim by 7% when he's in the game. Simply put he's the single biggest reason the Pacers have climbed to the top of the defensive charts over the past month.
        The data is pretty noncontroversial on that front, and when you take his offensive potential into account, you think next level Roy at a discounted price. Itís a pretty exciting haul from the 11th pick.


        Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro

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        • #79
          Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post

          That and his soft game. I get he's a good player...I really do. Just because I don't like his game on offense doesn't mean I don't appreciate that shot-blocking presence on D. But guys used to pump iron and punch bags so they could bang harder in the paint (no twss references please). Stretching with a bunch of females and playing a soft game just doesn't get me amp'ed up to watch him especially when he looks like the least coordinated center in the league.
          As much as I hate the hot yoga crap I know he at least hits the iron. I still think he needs to push himself but he can do a 400 lbs deadlift and at his size that is not great but for an athlete more focused on explosion and endurance it is not bad. Without steroids Myles growth in muscle will take multiple years to get to place where he can dominate. Most guys will only add 3 to 5 lbs of muscle a year naturally so for him he will take some time but he has added some mass in the last two years.

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          • #80
            Originally posted by docpaul View Post

            The data is pretty noncontroversial on that front, and when you take his offensive potential into account, you think next level Roy at a discounted price. Itís a pretty exciting haul from the 11th pick.


            Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
            Roy never covered ground like Myles or had some of the emphatic come from behind blocks Myles can manage. Roy perfected verticality for about a 3 year window and then the league caught up. He's not even in the same athletic universe as Turner if we're being honest. Roy had a more natural low post hook shot til he lost his love of the game. Turner can switch onto a guard and actually hold his own, Roy could not. There is a reason that Goran Dragic remarked that he found Roy one of the easiest defensive big men to score against in the entire league. For as much credit as Roy got, he was well hidden behind Paul George who at the time was the best perimeter defender in the NBA and George Hill.


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            • #81
              Im never tried yoga but i think that is some kind of stretching. If that helps on flexibility im all for it. Robert parish last long because keeps on stretching, a black belt i think in martial arts.

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              • #82
                Originally posted by Nuntius View Post

                So, your difficulties with Myles is that he had gaits issues during college? That's why you call him clumsy (and claimed earlier that he was somehow at fault for having his nose broken)?

                Everyone in this forum knows about the gait issue. It was one of the first thing that people talked about when we drafted him since it was one of the first things that popped up about him on draft night. And as the article that you linked concludes:

                A very correctable issue that he corrected very early on in his career. He doesn't have any gait issues now and if we're being honest he hasn't had any of those issues ever since he came into the league. He fixed the issue so everyone got over it when we first saw him play and saw that the issue was no longer there.
                It's not just that. It's the way he moves on the court...from head to toe...on offense. He does not look coordinated like nearly every other guy on the team and that even includes KOQ. It is surprising to me that he's as effective as he is. But indeed he is effective. Yet I am still not convinced he doesn't hurt our offensive flow.

                I know they are guards and wings, but Myles is like the opposite of Paul George and Aaron Holiday. Smooth and athletic out there. They look like they were born to play basketball. Even Domas is relatively smooth.

                Another part of this is BBall IQ or at least many of us perceive about his BBall IQ. You can almost see his brain struggling to think through the next play he needs to make. He hurries stuff to keep up. I still have doubts that is going to work down the stretch in key games if we ever contend.
                Vnzla81: Yep pretty much, they cut him because they were going to get "their guy" they couldn't get option 1,2,3,4,5 then they went to Lance he said "no thanks" and they had no other choice but to get Lance 2.0 for three times the cost.

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                • #83
                  So, now we're criticizing the way a guy moves.

                  Wow. I'm sure you're as elegant as a gazelle.

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                  • #84
                    Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post
                    Another part of this is BBall IQ or at least many of us perceive about his BBall IQ. You can almost see his brain struggling to think through the next play he needs to make. He hurries stuff to keep up. I still have doubts that is going to work down the stretch in key games if we ever contend.
                    Every time I've challenged anyone who has mentioned his BBIQ explain to me what they mean they were unable to do so. It's also telling that people talk about BBIQ and only mention the offensive end of the floor. The reality is that basketball intelligence (or feel or however you want to call it) is needed on both ends of the court.

                    Yes, Myles doesn't make the quickest choices offensively. He has improved a ton in this ever since he came into the league and he's making reads he wouldn't make as a rookie but there are instances where it takes him, like, half a second to make a read. His progression is a pretty good indicator that this half a second will soon be eliminated.

                    As for his defensive reads, Zach Lowe already mentioned it in his most recent article:

                    Originally posted by Zach Lowe
                    Turner is smarter at what coaches call ignoring the "fluff"-- sussing out when he can take half an eye off his guy to focus on the rim. You can't trick him into caring about Miles freaking Plumlee in the corner.
                    People who try to win arguments are the worst. The point of an argument isn't to find a winner, it is to find the truth.

                    Originally posted by IrishPacer
                    Empty vessels make the most noise.

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                    • #85
                      Originally posted by edc View Post
                      Im never tried yoga but i think that is some kind of stretching. If that helps on flexibility im all for it. Robert parish last long because keeps on stretching, a black belt i think in martial arts.
                      Stretching yes but some of the moves require great strength in you core and upper body. Most criticism comes from people who have never tried it. I think it is a great COMPONENT of his training to get better
                      in movement and strength. I hope he does the exact same thing next offseason. Get stronger and not bigger or more bulky. That would ruin his career in my opinion
                      Last edited by owl; 01-04-2019, 07:23 PM.
                      {o,o}
                      |)__)
                      -"-"-

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                      • #86
                        Originally posted by Nuntius View Post

                        Every time I've challenged anyone who has mentioned his BBIQ explain to me what they mean they were unable to do so. It's also telling that people talk about BBIQ and only mention the offensive end of the floor. The reality is that basketball intelligence (or feel or however you want to call it) is needed on both ends of the court.

                        Yes, Myles doesn't make the quickest choices offensively. He has improved a ton in this ever since he came into the league and he's making reads he wouldn't make as a rookie but there are instances where it takes him, like, half a second to make a read. His progression is a pretty good indicator that this half a second will soon be eliminated.

                        As for his defensive reads, Zach Lowe already mentioned it in his most recent article:
                        Anyone who has played the game knows the difference between offensive and defensive basketball IQ. Some of us are just wired to play defense and others have the gift of offense. I do think Myles has good if not great instincts on defense. He does need to develop further defensively but he shows great talents in that area protecting the rim and moving through the paint well. These are the reasons I am coming around on him.

                        On offense, he's been effective. I don't see natural talent but it's more because of the way he's playing than his actual performance...although he does still make some really bad decisions. But I'm of the mind that you overlook a fair amount of mistakes on the floor if the total package is good. For goodness sakes, I am a Lance fan so of course I overlook some asinine moves. So I'm mixed on his offense. I would have to see him be an important part of a hotly contested series before I am signing off fully.
                        Vnzla81: Yep pretty much, they cut him because they were going to get "their guy" they couldn't get option 1,2,3,4,5 then they went to Lance he said "no thanks" and they had no other choice but to get Lance 2.0 for three times the cost.

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