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Let's hear the good reasons for not starting our best player

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  • Let's hear the good reasons for not starting our best player

    While Dipo is out, Sabonis is our "best player." (I'm quoting the Lakers commentators.)

    He doesn't play the first eight minutes of the games. Last night, we got down by 23 points in the first quarter and effectively lost it then. (We came back, but are basically required to play perfect basketball non-stop for the next three quarters.)

    This isn't the first time our games have gone this way. In what kind of universe do you not start your best player?
    "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." óKevin Pritchard press conference


  • #2
    My guess is fragile egos. I think Domas is mentally tough enough to accept his current role and not complain about it. Other players - not so much. I'd say that it would be a crushing blow to the mentality of Tyreke, DC and Myles if they got moved to the bench.

    If anything - Nate might need to start his substitutions a little earlier if things aren't going well. Other teams use a similar pattern. IE: Golden State (NOT comparing the Pacers to GS . . . ). They start Damian Jones. He averages 17 minutes a game. He's subbed out for whatever that game requires. Iggy, Jerebko Ö. different players for different game situations.

    Now, of course - doing something like that would depend on Nate breaking his iron-clad rotation patterns and actually giving each game, each quarter some thought and consideration.

    The old saying is that it's not who starts, but who finishes. But Nate is pretty stubborn on that too, so . . . . . Not saying that Nate is BAD coach. I just think he could be more pro-active during games.

    Comment


    • #3
      IMO, this is tough to do. But under certain match-ups where O'Quinn can be used in the second unit, than Sabo could start. If the match-up is right, I'd start DC, BB, Thad, Sabo and Turner. But only if we can. Otherwise, earlier substitution if Thad or Turner are struggling is the answer.

      Comment


      • #4
        Fragile egos as somebody else said and some small part of me tells me they don't want to decrease the value of certain players by benching them (wishful thinking).
        @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

        Comment


        • #5
          Maybe Nate isn't convinced Domas can guard most modernday PF's if he were to move Thad to the bench. I think, with a couple of exceptions, he can. I think he considers our interior defence to weak with Myles out. In otherwords, and I'm not saying he's right, I think Nate doesn't like our defensive balance enough if he were to bring in Domas for Myles or Thad.

          I hope that when Vic comes back we get CoJo as the starter to improve our defence with the starters. It's not like Darren is lights out from three anyway this year so far, so I see no reason why not to atleast make this move.
          2012 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

          2011 PD ABA Fantasy Keeper League Champion, sports.ws

          2006 PD ABA Fantasy League runner up, sports.ws

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          • #6
            Not until he starts averaging triple double.Right now the assists are an issue
            You guys are saying in different threads that this or that guy is playing better with the second unit.
            Why? There is a reason There is someone who makes them better.
            Not that i'm happy about it, but that's why Domas will not start this year
            I'm really sorry because of my english (which is my 3-4 language) and I really appreciate Your patience. I hope this board will make me better

            Comment


            • #7
              It has definitely become a weird situation. I've always been a Turner fan, and last year I would've put them fairly even across the board, but for some reason Myles has taken a step back while Sabonis has taken a step (or two) forward.

              About the only thing Turner does better than Sabonis right now is block shots. Not sure if that's enough to warrant the starting nod if Turner's non-progression continues.

              Management might be simply giving things a little more time, because let's face it, 20 games isn't exactly a gigantic sample set to make a fairly drastic lineup change.

              I personally would like to see us move Thad out of the starting lineup and put Sabonis in and we run some sort of 2-center deal with Myles in the paint on defense and Domas in the paint on offense because I personally don't see Thad being better than either Myles or Sabonis at this point and his offense has been fairly atrocious this year. Everyone is on Myles' back, but not sure why Thad and Collison get passes, they are both having fairly unnoticeable seasons.

              You know a line-up I'd be curious to see?

              PG - Holiday
              SG - Oladipo (healthy)
              SF - McBuckets
              PF - Domas
              C - Turner

              Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 12-01-2018, 04:01 PM.
              There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

              Comment


              • #8
                Well, so far I've heard a reason that Myles confidence would be rattled. That's not a good reason (although it may be the actual reason).

                Then I've gotten one more reason: that Nate thinks that we can't defend 4's if Nate is not in. But Domas could replace Myles. But that would affect "defensive balance." Mourning even admitted he doesn't agree, he's just trying to grope for an explanation for what Nate is doing.

                So . . . I still don't think I've been given a "good" reason.
                "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." óKevin Pritchard press conference

                Comment


                • #9
                  Originally posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
                  It has definitely become a weird situation. I've always been a Turner fan, and last year I would've put them fairly even across the board, but for some reason Myles has taken a step back while Sabonis has taken a step (or two) forward.

                  About the only thing Turner does better than Sabonis right now is block shots. Not sure if that's enough to warrant the starting nod if Turner's non-progression continues.

                  Management might be simply giving things a little more time, because let's face it, 20 games isn't exactly a gigantic sample set to make a fairly drastic lineup change.

                  I personally would like to see us move Thad out of the starting lineup and put Sabonis in and we run some sort of 2-center deal with Myles in the paint on defense and Domas in the paint on offense because I personally don't see Thad being better than either Myles or Sabonis at this point and his offense has been fairly atrocious this year. Everyone is on Myles' back, but not sure why Thad and Collison get passes, they are both having fairly unnoticeable seasons.

                  You know a line-up I'd be curious to see?

                  PG - Holiday
                  SG - Oladipo (healthy)
                  SF - McBuckets
                  PF - Domas
                  C - Turner
                  I'm kind of curious why you would bench Bogdanovic?


                  Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    i don't know if the numbers back it up, but i'd say rim protection is the best answer. if anyone is watching the first 5 minutes of the Kings game, I think Myles has already forced four layup misses that go in against domas i think.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Originally posted by Peck View Post

                      I'm kind of curious why you would bench Bogdanovic?
                      I'm not saying I want that lineup permanently. I just want to see it on the court.
                      There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        He doesnít need to replace Myles he needs to replace Thad. If Nate canít figure out a way to make this work maybe heís the one that should be replaced.

                        Good as Domas is the interior defense falls apart when Myles comes out of the game. They may need to be surrounded with better perimeter wing defenders to make it work with both, this is why I still believe the solution is a trade. I donít like this roster as currently constructed.

                        Collison and Thad are guys who get pencilled in as starters by Nate who have underperformed at times and are not part of the future. Iíd like to see these guys flipped for a better starting 3 (who defends better) move Domas to starting 4 and have Bojan fill the prior Sabonis 6th man role backing up 3 and 4. Still Stagger the center rotation so one of Myles or Sabonis are on the floor at all times, and you can finish with a small ball lineup if matchups dictate but not by default.
                        Last edited by Infinite MAN_force; 12-02-2018, 04:43 PM.
                        "As a bearded man, i was very disappointed in Love. I am gathering other bearded men to discuss the status of Kevin Love's beard. I am motioning that it must be shaved."

                        - ilive4sports

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Originally posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post

                          I'm not saying I want that lineup permanently. I just want to see it on the court.
                          Oh okay, that makes sense.


                          Basketball isn't played with computers, spreadsheets, and simulations. ChicagoJ 4/21/13

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Originally posted by Infinite MAN_force View Post
                            He doesnít need to replace Myles he needs to replace Thad. If Nate canít figure out a way to make this work maybe heís the one that should be replaced.

                            Good as Domas is the interior defense falls apart when Myles comes out of the game. They may need to be surrounded with better perimeter wing defenders to make it work with both, this is why I still believe the solution is a trade. I donít like this roster as currently constructed.

                            Collison and Thad are guys who get pencilled in as starters by Nate who have underperformed at times and are not part of the future. Iíd like to see these guys flipped for a better starting 3 (who defends better) move Domas to starting 4 and have Bojan fill the prior Sabonis 6th man role backing up 3 and 4. Still Stagger the center rotation so one of Myles or Sabonis are on the floor at all times, and you can finish with a small ball lineup if matchups dictate but not by default.
                            100% agree with you here. Bojan could be a lethal 6th man for us, I really think Kent Bazemore would be the defensive upgrade on the perimeter that we need.
                            We could flick them Evans expiring deal + O'Quinn to match the salary, maybe chuck in a 2nd round pick as well.

                            C. Sabonis/Turner
                            PF. Turner/Bogdanovic/Young
                            SF. Bazemore/Bogdanovic/McDermott
                            SG. Oladipo/McDermott/Sumner
                            PG. Joseph/Holiday

                            That's my 2k roster anyway haha, I think McDermott/Bogdanovic pairing could work better with Bazemore out there with them.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Originally posted by festar35 View Post

                              100% agree with you here. Bojan could be a lethal 6th man for us, I really think Kent Bazemore would be the defensive upgrade on the perimeter that we need.
                              We could flick them Evans expiring deal + O'Quinn to match the salary, maybe chuck in a 2nd round pick as well.

                              C. Sabonis/Turner
                              PF. Turner/Bogdanovic/Young
                              SF. Bazemore/Bogdanovic/McDermott
                              SG. Oladipo/McDermott/Sumner
                              PG. Joseph/Holiday

                              That's my 2k roster anyway haha, I think McDermott/Bogdanovic pairing could work better with Bazemore out there with them.
                              My target has been Otto Porter Jr. lately but any solid small forward who can defend and space the floor would work, someone starter quality. Bogie/Domas/Myles might be too slow footed overall as a front line but if you get someone quicker at the 3 (not to mention the 1, because replacing Collison with Joseph would also be a big defensive upgrade) I think this would help minimize defensive issues brought on by the 2 big lineup.

                              Realistically we are asking ourselves if starting Sabonis and Turner for the first five minutes of each half is going to work and not be some kind of disaster. We already know the starting unit as currently constructed has not been good and the early return on the 2 big lineup has been mixed, but mostly good. I fail to see the downside. Matchups will still determine the course of the game down the stretch as they should. This would get both guys minutes up and that's what everyone has been asking for.
                              "As a bearded man, i was very disappointed in Love. I am gathering other bearded men to discuss the status of Kevin Love's beard. I am motioning that it must be shaved."

                              - ilive4sports

                              Comment

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