All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

[Peck]

Obviously there are several threads up about Roy and we are going to let them stay active until they die down naturally. However since Roy will no longer be a Pacer as we did with Lance we are going to have an all encompassing thread for Roy so we do not get bogged down in Roy Hibbert posts for the next year or so.

This is the thread to discuss Roy. The good, the bad or the ugly.

Play nice.

[Dr. Awesome]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

I wish Roy nothing but the best in everything he does on and off the court. The dude is a great guy and a class act.

That said, the Lakers are just a horrible spot for him. For one, he has one of the games worst teammates in Kobe, who has been known to clash with guys before. Secondly, he is going to be in LAs spotlight. He couldn't handle the pressure in Indiana, I can't imagine how it will be in LA.

I really hope this offseason lit a fire under his *** and he will come out and shut the haters up.

[wintermute]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

On the plus side, Roy will be coming in with low expectations. The Lakers were 29th in defense last year. Just putting Roy on the court in place of Jordan freaking Hill should get them to mediocre at least.

[larry]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

Lot of Lakers fans are dogging him. It's rough out there. Kobe & Hibbert will be interesting if nothing else.

Sent from my HTC One_M8 using Tapatalk

[CableKC]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

As many have suggested before......we may not miss Hibbert's super high center of gravity, his knack ( last season ) for getting pushed out of the paint and his inconsistent roller coaster ride of a season......but we.are going to miss Hibbert's Rim protection.

The obvious question is what are we going to do when it comes to how the defense will be run. This defense was built solely on Hibbert anchoring the defense. Now that Hibbert is gone....Is Vogel going to continue with running the same type of defense ( using Mahinmi / Turner as the Rim Protector )?

or

Are we going to change the defense to suit whoever is on our roster?

I liked the defense that was designed and hope we stick with it. But I have a feeling that the defense that we ran under Hibbert isn't compatible with the offense that Bird wants to run.

[graphic-er]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

i think Roy is gonna have a career year playing for the Lakers.

I think Roy's fall from grace is just as much Frank Vogel and company as it was Roy though. In the 2013 ECF, we were one competent bench player away from beating that heat team, we were a power post team with a budding superstar at the wing, a solid point guard, lighting in a bottle at shooting guard. Blue Collar - our bigs, Gold Swagger, our Wings . We had the best starting 5 in the league that year. That was a dominant team. It should have been as easy as just fill out the bench with some solid vets and lets go to war. Hibbert hulked out that offseason (the infamous look at me towering next to Duncan photo), probably thinking that it was going to be him in the low post that would anchor the offense next season.

Frank Vogel or Larry Bird or both switched up the game plan. Thought we needed to open up the offense and let Paul and Lance run the show. They essentially abandoned the smash mouth offense that year and didnt' bother to tell Roy Hibbert about it. Hence his complaint about touches and selfish dudes. Maybe they seen something about a power post offense that wasn't going to get us to the final anyways. Hard to argue with the results as we were the best team in the league for the first half of the season, we had a good scoring balance, Hibbert was still pretty effective in his reduced role.

But then Vogel had his biggest failing as a head coach. He failed to keep Lance in check. Lance began gunning for the all-star team. Lance's shots went up, Lance's usuage rate went up. I've got no evidence, but I really do think PG and Lance had identical usage rates for the 2 months leading up to the allstar game. Both of them started chucking shots and all the efficiency and balance we had in the first half of the season vanished, and this team looked one dimensional and predictable. Thats entirely on Frank Vogel in my opinion. Larry Bird went on to then complete the internal fracture by trading Danny Granger and bringing in Bynum and Turner. Probably 2 of his worst moves as the GM. Because he basically told the team that they were not good enough to sort out their own mess.

[docpaul]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

i think Roy is gonna have a career year playing for the Lakers.

I think Roy's fall from grace is just as much Frank Vogel and company as it was Roy though. In the 2013 ECF, we were one competent bench player away from beating that heat team, we were a power post team with a budding superstar at the wing, a solid point guard, lighting in a bottle at shooting guard. Blue Collar - our bigs, Gold Swagger, our Wings . We had the best starting 5 in the league that year. That was a dominant team. It should have been as easy as just fill out the bench with some solid vets and lets go to war. Hibbert hulked out that offseason (the infamous look at me towering next to Duncan photo), probably thinking that it was going to be him in the low post that would anchor the offense next season.

Frank Vogel or Larry Bird or both switched up the game plan. Thought we needed to open up the offense and let Paul and Lance run the show. They essentially abandoned the smash mouth offense that year and didnt' bother to tell Roy Hibbert about it. Hence his complaint about touches and selfish dudes. Maybe they seen something about a power post offense that wasn't going to get us to the final anyways. Hard to argue with the results as we were the best team in the league for the first half of the season, we had a good scoring balance, Hibbert was still pretty effective in his reduced role.

But then Vogel had his biggest failing as a head coach. He failed to keep Lance in check. Lance began gunning for the all-star team. Lance's shots went up, Lance's usuage rate went up. I've got no evidence, but I really do think PG and Lance had identical usage rates for the 2 months leading up to the allstar game. Both of them started chucking shots and all the efficiency and balance we had in the first half of the season vanished, and this team looked one dimensional and predictable. Thats entirely on Frank Vogel in my opinion. Larry Bird went on to then complete the internal fracture by trading Danny Granger and bringing in Bynum and Turner. Probably 2 of his worst moves as the GM. Because he basically told the team that they were not good enough to sort out their own mess.

These are the hard things to work through.

What made Lance the star he was one year, and a dumpster fire the next?

What made Roy the elite rim protector he was one year, full of confidence and joy for the game, and then a sulking, uncomfortable, self-loathing center the next?

Here's what I think: when people like each other, are confident, and "get off" on each other's success... the total is way larger than the sum of the individual parts. The team that competed against the Heat in the 2013 playoffs... they were the real deal. Young and inexperienced, but full of the belief that they could be the national champions. The big ECF semifinal game against the Knicks. Unforgettably awesome game that allowed us to literally witness those young players believe in themselves and each other. They loved playing with each other, and just were ready to take on the world. They actually believed in themselves and each other. There's a whole chapter in the Book of Basketball (Simmons) that talks about this: "The Gift". I think Vogel had a big part in creating this dynamic with that squad.

The next year, they came out of the gates just totally freaking on fire. A joy to watch them beat down teams like the Spurs and others. Then, something happened. They started to dislike each other, and confidence began to erode. Roy has literally never been the same since. He was given a long, long time to recenter himself, and more importantly... to be the tough leader of the franchise, especially after PG went down. But it simply wasn't in him.

This is where you start to recognize that Roy simply doesn't have it in himself anymore to be a leader within this franchise. He wasn't going to bring a positive attitude to the team, to contribute towards that future new winning dynamic that's essential to winning it all. That's why Bird made the move he needed to make. He saw this happening way before it occurred to any of us.

A large part of Roy's value and personal success was his interrelationship as an essential part of a specific team dynamic.

I'm hopeful (because I'm a fan of an underdog), that Roy goes into LA and just turns it all around. Proves that fanbase wrong on every dimension.

[Rogco]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

Good luck Roy. Hopefully you can finally put whatever happened around the all star break a couple years ago behind you, can find your happiness, and return to the person you used to be.

[tadscout]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

Mark Joseph Boyle @Mark_J_Boyle 2h2 hours agoSouth Yarmouth, MA
@1070Bruno with a spot on assessment of soon-to-be-former-Employee #55.http://www.1070thefan.com/blogs/brun...what-they-need

Pacers, Hibbert both get what they need

By: Conrad Brunner

When no one, especially the Pacers, wanted Jermaine O’Neal because of an onerous contract, declining performance and questionable health, Larry Bird somehow turned him into Roy Hibbert.
When no one, especially the Pacers, wanted Hibbert because of an onerous contract, declining performance and questionable (mental) health, Bird somehow turned him into, well, we’ll just have to see about that, won’t we?

Mainly, what Bird turned Hibbert into was an ex-Pacer.

That’s what mattered most, shedding a player who not that long ago was no worse than the second-most important player on the roster; who not that long ago was the foundation of the NBA’s most monolithic defense; who, for reasons we may never know, devolved into a sullen, pouting, disengaged, 7-foot-2, 280-pound problem child.

The biggest boom we heard on the Fourth of July was this: Hibbert will be traded to the Lakers.

Both sides got what they needed from this deal.

Hibbert gets the opportunity for a fresh start, as far away from Indy as the NBA allows. An aside: if Roy thought Jim O’Brien was tough love, wait till he gets a load of Kobe. Another aside: Yo, Kareem, guess who’s in town?

What the Pacers get is a boatload of cap space, while ditching the anchor whose weight threatened to swamp the franchise. Rodney Stuckey, come on down. Luis Scola, maybe think about unpacking.

The only thing sad about the situation is how suddenly and how obvious it was beyond salvage. Any time a franchise has to effectively dump a once-prized asset, it’s a time to reflect on everything and everyone one that contributed to the devaluation, learn from it and try to prevent it from happening again.

This is where I’m supposed to criticize Bird for throwing Hibbert under the bus in that postseason presser, but here’s the thing: he really didn’t.

Bird said he was disappointed in Hibbert’s season, that he was likely to have a diminished role with the team changing offensive styles, and yet he was still considered an important part of the team. That’s not throwing somebody under the bus, that’s offering an honest analysis. Even the line about Hibbert not being able to blame Lance Stephenson for stealing his rebounds was more humorous than pointed.

To harbor any hope Hibbert would suddenly grow up, realize he was in a contract year, play the good citizen and actually help this team – or not hurt it – would be to display an incomprehensible level of naivete.

Hibbert chose to become malignant. The pall he cast over the locker room every … single … night … was palpable. The energy he sapped from the court every … single … night … was singularly destructive.

He was a living, breathing, Joe Bftsplk.

(If you don’t know, Google).

He had to go, which was a lot easier said than done. For that, Bird must be given credit. The Lakers thought they were going to get LaMarcus Aldridge. Strike one. They thought they were going to get Greg Monroe. Strike two. They got Hibbert. Strike three.

That doesn’t make this a home run for the Pacers. But it’s a productive at-bat, a quality start, a save more than a win.

Ian Mahinmi can give them 24 athletic minutes. Myles Turner, some nights he’ll foul out in the first quarter, some nights (or mornings, as in that 20-point, eight-rebound, three-block show in Orlando for openers) he’ll make everybody want to sing. Mix in Lavoy Allen, maybe Scola, and there you go.

If no more moves were made, this would be the unit used most by the Pacers: George Hill, Monta Ellis, C.J. Miles, Paul George and Mahinmi. They’ll probably start with two bigs, depending on their opponents, but Frank Vogel is serious about using George at power forward when it’s time to go small.

And the bench, for those that choose to worry about such things in July: Turner, Allen, Joe Young, Solomon Hill and Damo Rudez. And that’s before they set about investing all that cap space.

They’re not ready to hang any banners, but the Pacers are moving swiftly and comprehensively toward their new, faster-paced, more aggressive identity.

And Bird, once again, found a way to make a move many of us assumed was impossible.

These are probably two of the people around the team/players the most (and by far the longest), so this is probably the best assessment of the Hibbert trade you'll see.

[Rogco]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

"Hibbert chose to become malignant. The pall he cast over the locker room every … single … night … was palpable. The energy he sapped from the court every … single … night … was singularly destructive."

People round here seem to have done their best to ignore the locker room issues surrounding Hibbert. A bit head-in-the-sand. This is the reason he had to go. He was dragging everyone down with him.

[Downtown Bang!]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

I have always suspected that whatever combination of negative things that happened in the 2nd half of last year became unrecoverable with and/or because of Roy. The Brunner piece doesn't outright confirm that fact but the circumstantial evidence seems to grow......

You see it in business all the time. Some can put personal slights, role reductions, occurrences of unequal treatment etc. etc. behind them for the good of the organization and others become intent on "blowing it up". When that person is a key cog in the machine they are usually successful.

[PacersPride]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

These quotes from Conrad Brunner seal the deal for me. All the best but good riddance Roy.

"harbor any hope Hibbert would suddenly grow up"

Hibbert chose to become malignant. The pall he cast over the locker room every … single … night … was palpable. The energy he sapped from the court every … single … night … was singularly destructive.

[PacersPride]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

[tadscout]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

After seeing Doyle's and Kravitz's polar opposite and equally crappy hot takes on the trade I'm thankful as a Pacers fan we have someone like Conrad Brunner to offer some real insight and objective assessment of a trade (that is also backed by Boyle), than an article full of opinions and hot takes.

Bruno please never go anywhere.

[McKeyFan]

Re: All things Roy Hibbert for the next year or so....

Interesting. The "Selfish Dude" and his "energy sapping, pall casting" accuser are both now in ... L.A, land of the selfish. Should be fun to watch.