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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

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We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

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Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

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  • #91
    Originally posted by duke dynamite View Post
    Because you can put Paul at that "shooting guard" position. It doesn't matter. It will not affect one damn thing!
    It affects who's guarding who on defense.

    It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

    Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
    Conference Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 2005
    NBA Champions 1989, 1990, 2004

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    • #92
      Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

      Originally posted by Ace E.Anderson View Post
      How the hell can you regress to something that was better?! Our offense scored 5 more ppg last year when compared to this year. And this is AFTER our recent string of offensive outbursts.
      This. This is key. Our offense was better, last season. Granger takes some pressure off of West and PG that Lance just doesn't do.

      And our team should be better defensively with him too.

      Granger is, at absolute worst, our third best player. Yes. We start him.

      edit: It doesn't effect who is guarding who on defense. PG gets put on the best perimeter player on the other team..unless the matchup doesn't work out in either Granger or PG's favor. (Granger is stronger so sometimes we need him on a stronger "best perimeter" player. Or in the case of the Heat, where Granger just can't guard Wade..) And before anyone says "see, that's why you need positions." At the end of the day, Granger and PG are going to be in the game at the same time..at the end of the game..together. And it's likely West and Roy will be in there with him, so they'll have to learn to play together. (And I have a feeling people are fearing something they don't need to fear.)
      Last edited by Sookie; 02-06-2013, 06:29 PM.

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      • #93
        Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

        Originally posted by Kstat View Post
        What that implies is that every team only has one wing capable of doing damage.

        Using miami or NY as an example, you'd be asking Granger to defend smaller, faster, explosive players, guys Lance has shown to be at least adept at defending thus far.

        The matchups work in Indianas favor with George on lebron and lance on wade. Granger on wade, I think would be a bigger problem, which would force vogel to go granger on lebron and George on wade...and then you have last year's series.
        Except George can win or par his matchup vs. Wade this time around, and David West is far more capable of punishing Miami's smalls. Not to mention having adequate size off the bench now.

        I would take being up 2-1 over Miami again in a heartbeat.
        Goodbye Captain, My Captain. I wish you had the chance to sink or swim with your ship on its quest for the "ship".

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        • #94
          Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

          Originally posted by Kstat View Post
          Using him as a 6th man is probably in the best interest of the team, but I doubt granger would be happy with it.
          Granger has shown that he is willing to step back if it's for the best interest of the team.

          However, I prefer Lance Stephenson as the 6th man. He runs a lot more (and our 2nd unit can run unlike the first) and he can both score and distribute.
          Last edited by Nuntius; 02-06-2013, 07:26 PM. Reason: I wanted to say "step back" but I wrote "step up"
          Originally posted by IrishPacer
          Empty vessels make the most noise.

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          • #95
            Originally posted by daschysta View Post
            Except George can win or par his matchup vs. Wade this time around, and David West is far more capable of punishing Miami's smalls. Not to mention having adequate size off the bench now.

            I would take being up 2-1 over Miami again in a heartbeat.
            ...so you're comfortable taking your best defender off the league MVP and letting granger guard him for a full playoff series...

            Even if I agreed that George would be any more effective against Wade (which I don't), the logic here still fails me. You're going to entrust the defensive assignment of the NBA's undisputed best player to the second best defensive small forward on your own team?
            Last edited by Kstat; 02-06-2013, 06:46 PM.

            It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

            Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
            Conference Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 2005
            NBA Champions 1989, 1990, 2004

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            • #96
              Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

              Originally posted by Kstat View Post
              ...so you're comfortable taking your best defender off the league's best player and letting granger guard him for a full playoff series...

              Even if I agreed that George would be any more effective against Wade (which I dont'), the logic here fails me.
              It's arguable that Danny is a better defensive matchup against Lebron than PG is.

              Not only that, but Lebron can't beat us by himself. If Wade doesn't play like an MVP with him, the Heat won't win. Wade's got a much smaller chance of playing like an MVP with PG on him than with Lance on him. (not because Lance was bad on him...but because Paul George is Paul George.)

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              • #97
                Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

                Originally posted by Sookie View Post
                It's arguable that Danny is a better defensive matchup against Lebron than PG is.
                I'm not sure about that, remind me who was guarding Lebron when he got his career numbers?

                Not only that, but Lebron can't beat us by himself.
                I'm pretty sure I saw him winning one or two games by himself.

                If Wade doesn't play like an MVP with him, the Heat won't win. Wade's got a much smaller chance of playing like an MVP with PG on him than with Lance on him. (not because Lance was bad on him...but because Paul George is Paul George.)
                Lance has done a pretty good job on Wade in this last two games against Miami, what makes you think that he can't do the same thing later?
                @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

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                • #98
                  Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

                  Originally posted by Sookie View Post
                  It's arguable that Danny is a better defensive matchup against Lebron than PG is.


                  I give up. I have nothing to add to this....I can't even respond with anything substantial. I give up.

                  Maybe subconsciously, those three similies are what I believe represents the beginning, middle and end of what would happen to the Pacer fan collective if Vogel announced Granger and not George would be guarding LeBron in a 7 game playoff series.
                  Last edited by Kstat; 02-06-2013, 06:54 PM.

                  It wasn't about being the team everyone loved, it was about beating the teams everyone else loved.

                  Division Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 1989, 1990, 2002, 2003, 2005, 2006, 2007, 2008
                  Conference Champions 1955, 1956, 1988, 2005
                  NBA Champions 1989, 1990, 2004

                  Comment


                  • #99
                    Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

                    Yea, sorry guys but Danny is definitely our starter.

                    I love Lance, and am very happy with his progression. Now just imagine what he will be able to do against the second string guards in the league after seeing him toy with DWade and the like the past few weeks!

                    I am not saying it's a 100% slam dunk, no questions asked kind of proposition. But Danny Granger is a starter on the Indiana Pacers, that's just common sense.

                    Comment


                    • Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

                      Originally posted by TMJ31 View Post
                      Yea, sorry guys but Danny is definitely our starter.

                      I love Lance, and am very happy with his progression. Now just imagine what he will be able to do against the second string guards in the league after seeing him toy with DWade and the like the past few weeks!

                      I am not saying it's a 100% slam dunk, no questions asked kind of proposition. But Danny Granger is a starter on the Indiana Pacers, that's just common sense.
                      If they move Granger in as a starter immediately, I think the Pacers will slide back to fourth or fifth in the East. Granger's replacement is already here, let him play SF. I don't want to see Lance lose any minutes with the first team. Granger can't or won't defend his position and he slides back a little more every year. Put him on the bench and bring him in and perhaps even give him some PF minutes. ...

                      Comment


                      • Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

                        I find the whole argument almost useless. No wait I take that back, it is completely useless. Lets just trust Vogel to make the right call and if he doesn't, lets trust him to fix it. We won't know what Paul and Granger are like together until we see it with them both in top form and until then no one here really knows, so what is the use of getting all worked up? I want Granger to come back, be in form, and fit in real quick (whether its in the bench, or the starting line up) so everyone will stfu about the topic of, bench him, dont bench him, trade him, or don't trade him. That being said, I can't wait for Granger to come back to this team!

                        Comment


                        • Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

                          Originally posted by Sookie View Post
                          It's arguable that Danny is a better defensive matchup against Lebron than PG is.

                          No it isn't, it isn't even close to being true.....

                          Not only that, but Lebron can't beat us by himself. If Wade doesn't play like an MVP with him, the Heat won't win. Wade's got a much smaller chance of playing like an MVP with PG on him than with Lance on him. (not because Lance was bad on him...but because Paul George is Paul George.)
                          Uhhh, I think Lebron already beat this team by himself last year...... ...

                          Comment


                          • Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

                            Originally posted by duke dynamite View Post
                            Why wouldn't you want a guy that is playing like Lance... wait, ACTUALLY LANCE coming off the bench to help where we really need help?

                            If you guys say Danny is this decrepit old piece of dirt then hey, wouldn't he do much better in a unit that is actually producing?

                            And if Lance throws a fit because his starting spot was taken away to a player vastly superior to him, then he really didn't deserve the spot in the first place.

                            It's sorta a unwritten rule a player doesn't lose his starting job do to an injury. Well, DC after starting 50 plus games with the Pacers playing well lost his job to Hill. IMO, I personally feel Lance has a case if he didn't want to go to the bench for Granger. Granger hasn't attributed 1 minute to the success of where the Pacers are right now. Lance has. Let Granger win his job back... if he can. If Granger can't beat out Lance and is unhappy with the situation of coming off the bench, then ask for a trade. One thing about Walsh is he's willing to accommodate players who want to be traded.

                            Comment


                            • Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

                              Originally posted by Justin Tyme View Post
                              It's sorta a unwritten rule a player doesn't lose his starting job do to an injury.


                              Comment


                              • Re: Maybe Granger should go to the bench when healthy

                                Originally posted by Kstat View Post
                                ...so you're comfortable taking your best defender off the league MVP and letting granger guard him for a full playoff series...

                                Even if I agreed that George would be any more effective against Wade (which I don't), the logic here still fails me. You're going to entrust the defensive assignment of the NBA's undisputed best player to the second best defensive small forward on your own team?
                                I wasn't arguing for Danny guarding James necessarily, just that we'd have a better shot at finishing them off this season were we up 2-1 like last year simply by virtue of George's own improvement, West's health and a more well equipped bench (including stephenson).


                                In fact against Miami in particular Granger can pick up some minutes on Bosh at the 4 position. The fact is that it's unlikely that Vogel would even ask Granger to come of the bench in the first place, thus we'll make due, and I think we're a better team overall with him as a starter, so that Lance can create for the guys off the bench, who are lessa adept at creating their own offense than the starters. Plus, he'll have the ball in his hands more often and can look for his own shot more than he can as a starter.
                                Goodbye Captain, My Captain. I wish you had the chance to sink or swim with your ship on its quest for the "ship".

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