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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

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We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

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To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

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The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

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We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

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We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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Rule #10

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Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

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  • #46
    Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

    Originally posted by PacersPride View Post
    I agree with you on PG but Im not okay with "letting him roll" with it. Somone else mentioned it but we do miss Shaw in that regard. I don't think Kobe ever plays loose or overconfidently he just plays to win game in and game out. I realize Paul is only 23 but it is time he stop playing so "loose" and non chalent.

    Reggie showboated but he never played loose. He scrapped. I would like to see more scrapp and fundamental basketball.


    I do not want Lance bringing it up everytime until he stops caring about triple doubles to get paid begins making solid fundamental passes. Love Lance but this is not an and 1 video at rucker park.

    I love DWEST for busting Lances *** for the sloppy careless passes. Same with PG... PG you cannot make a bounce pass to Roy Hibbert between two players and it be at Big Dawgs knees.

    When these 2 kids hit their prime they are gonna be damn good but I guess until then we gotta take it in stride with the showboating.

    Hope Pacers resolve the turnover issues by the Postseason.
    Vogel is a bit hands-off rather than micro-managing the players so we are going to have to live with it. It would be worse if the coach imposed their will on the players. I don't think you can have it both ways. Yes, they can be advised to tone it down and I'm sure they are getting some of that. But there is a point where you sit back and realize that nothing is going to be perfect. The players are in the right environment to mature and I doubt you can force these guys to grow up. If they weren't 29-7, I'd be more likely to want intervention. As it is, these show-boaters are helping this team to the best record in the NBA. Even more, the show-boaters tone it down against Miami and the other contenders...so I'm not concerned. Let the boys play and become men.

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    • #47
      Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

      Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post
      Vogel is a bit hands-off rather than micro-managing the players so we are going to have to live with it. It would be worse if the coach imposed their will on the players. I don't think you can have it both ways. Yes, they can be advised to tone it down and I'm sure they are getting some of that. But there is a point where you sit back and realize that nothing is going to be perfect. The players are in the right environment to mature and I doubt you can force these guys to grow up. If they weren't 29-7, I'd be more likely to want intervention. As it is, these show-boaters are helping this team to the best record in the NBA. Even more, the show-boaters tone it down against Miami and the other contenders...so I'm not concerned. Let the boys play and become men.
      I'll be a little more concerned when it's not a 20 point blow out.

      Meanwhile, the awesome pass from Lance was missed by PG. It should have been a dunk.
      "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

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      • #48
        Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

        BTW, anyone else genuinely surprised at how good of a back up Butler has been? His FG% is great.
        https://twitter.com/DrogsNavan

        Change is neither good or bad, it simply is.

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        • #49
          Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

          Originally posted by IrishPacer View Post
          BTW, anyone else genuinely surprised at how good of a back up Butler has been? His FG% is great.
          I wish we could get him a few more minutes. He's not too bad.

          Comment


          • #50
            Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

            Originally posted by McKeyFan View Post
            I'll be a little more concerned when it's not a 20 point blow out.

            Meanwhile, the awesome pass from Lance was missed by PG. It should have been a dunk.
            Yes, and people keep saying Lance needs to stop throwing the ball away yet he has the second best assist/turnover ratio of all starters. He blows away Paul, Roy and even DWest on turnovers. Yes, that is the fact of the matter. Sure, George Hill protects the ball better but what does George do to break down a defense and get guys easy baskets...against tougher defenses? Well, not that much. I like all of our starters but to direct the angst of the turnover problem...which is a real one on this team....at Lance Stephenson is misdirected. The problem is more than that and it may have to do with our offense and how it works. Too much hero ball is going on and not enough passing. At the same time, hard to complain about that record...so I'm going to live with it as-is and hope they shore up the turnovers.

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            • #51
              Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

              Originally posted by IrishPacer View Post
              BTW, anyone else genuinely surprised at how good of a back up Butler has been? His FG% is great.
              I always liked Butler. He's stuck around the league for a reason. But given the fact he's bounced around so much, I thought my perception must have been off.

              Comment


              • #52
                Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

                Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post
                I like all of our starters but to direct the angst of the turnover problem...which is a real one on this team....at Lance Stephenson is misdirected. The problem is more than that and it may have to do with our offense and how it works.
                Lance isn't the cause of the turnover problem. That much is obvious. The cause of this problem is the increased motion that our offense has. Simply put, the sets are more complex and they involve more options and sometimes the players read their teammate's movement wrong.

                Lance's turnovers are just easier for people to remember because they tend to be flashy.
                Originally posted by IrishPacer
                Empty vessels make the most noise.

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                • #53
                  Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

                  Originally posted by Nuntius View Post
                  Lance isn't the cause of the turnover problem. That much is obvious. The cause of this problem is the increased motion that our offense has. Simply put, the sets are more complex and they involve more options and sometimes the players read their teammate's movement wrong.

                  Lance's turnovers are just easier for people to remember because they tend to be flashy.
                  Or they remember because he has the second highest TO% on the team of those who get regular minutes, and it is up by 4% from last year which combined with his usage being up by 3.7% is a large increase in TOs. He is currently 16 TOs shy of his season total from last year.

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                  • #54
                    Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

                    Originally posted by Eleazar View Post
                    Or they remember because he has the second highest TO% on the team of those who get regular minutes, and it is up by 4% from last year which combined with his usage being up by 3.7% is a large increase in TOs. He is currently 16 TOs shy of his season total from last year.
                    TOs come hand in hand with assists for perimeter players who act as PnR handlers. It's true that Lance has the second highest TO% on the team but he also has the second best Assist to Turnover ratio of our team after George Hill (who is great at taking care of the ball).

                    Lance and Hill really compliment each other in this regard. Lance will make the tough pass that carries the risk of being stolen but that same pass can also open up the defense. Hill will make the solid pass that may not open up the defense but will carry minimal risk of being stolen. If Hill was paired with another player that wouldn't make the risky pass then our offense would become too predictable and thus become stagnant. If Lance was paired with another player that would make the risky pass then our offense would be extremely turnover prone. It's great that we have both of them and can achieve the right balance between risky and safe passing.
                    Originally posted by IrishPacer
                    Empty vessels make the most noise.

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                    • #55
                      Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

                      The thing about our Magic (Senator, I knew Magic Johnson, he was a friend of mine, sir, you are no Magic Johnson) is his BB IQ still isn't high enough to put the ball in his hands full time. He is getting better, but there are moments where his 1 on 3 fast breaks smack of grade school basketball. High risk, high reward. We need the easy baskets his style provides (which the Pacers as an organization have never really had) but not at the expense of lots of lost possessions.

                      And this becomes even more pronounced on the road and in the playoffs. Everyone plays with a higher intensity and turns the screwer tighter on the defensive end. Sometimes you just want to take care of the ball, run the offense and just get a shot (think Jax), not an over the head bullet from 25 feet to Ian (50-50 he catches it) under the basket for an O-My moment.

                      At this point, I (IMHO) do not believe we can afford to put our fate exclusively in his hands. Just keeping tuning to find the right mix, right %, the right recognition. Or by analogy, my brother was lucky to get 3 really quick kids who could handle on the the same 8th grade team. They loved to run. But until he got them to understand the concept, "if it ain't there, pull it out and run the offense" they were a high octane mess.

                      The real Magic knew that instinctively. Not there? Back it out, wait for Kareem, dump it in and watch the sky hook go in. Include everyone in your show. Win titles not ESPN air time (or triple double records). Plus Magic Johnson had people to run with him and more often than not, the trailer scored. Lance, not as much.

                      Hopefully, Lance will become so good we will have have to upgrade from Born Ready to Magic to The Second Coming.

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                      • #56
                        Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

                        Originally posted by seeker80 View Post
                        The thing about our Magic (Senator, I knew Magic Johnson, he was a friend of mine, sir, you are no Magic Johnson) is his BB IQ still isn't high enough to put the ball in his hands full time. He is getting better, but there are moments where his 1 on 3 fast breaks smack of grade school basketball. High risk, high reward. We need the easy baskets his style provides (which the Pacers as an organization have never really had) but not at the expense of lots of lost possessions.

                        And this becomes even more pronounced on the road and in the playoffs. Everyone plays with a higher intensity and turns the screwer tighter on the defensive end. Sometimes you just want to take care of the ball, run the offense and just get a shot (think Jax), not an over the head bullet from 25 feet to Ian (50-50 he catches it) under the basket for an O-My moment.

                        At this point, I (IMHO) do not believe we can afford to put our fate exclusively in his hands. Just keeping tuning to find the right mix, right %, the right recognition. Or by analogy, my brother was lucky to get 3 really quick kids who could handle on the the same 8th grade team. They loved to run. But until he got them to understand the concept, "if it ain't there, pull it out and run the offense" they were a high octane mess.

                        The real Magic knew that instinctively. Not there? Back it out, wait for Kareem, dump it in and watch the sky hook go in. Include everyone in your show. Win titles not ESPN air time (or triple double records). Plus Magic Johnson had people to run with him and more often than not, the trailer scored. Lance, not as much.

                        Hopefully, Lance will become so good we will have have to upgrade from Born Ready to Magic to The Second Coming.
                        You get at THANKS for referencing this.....
                        Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

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                        • #57
                          Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

                          Originally posted by Nuntius View Post
                          TOs come hand in hand with assists for perimeter players who act as PnR handlers. It's true that Lance has the second highest TO% on the team but he also has the second best Assist to Turnover ratio of our team after George Hill (who is great at taking care of the ball).

                          Lance and Hill really compliment each other in this regard. Lance will make the tough pass that carries the risk of being stolen but that same pass can also open up the defense. Hill will make the solid pass that may not open up the defense but will carry minimal risk of being stolen. If Hill was paired with another player that wouldn't make the risky pass then our offense would become too predictable and thus become stagnant. If Lance was paired with another player that would make the risky pass then our offense would be extremely turnover prone. It's great that we have both of them and can achieve the right balance between risky and safe passing.
                          Excellent post, but let me clarify something further. When Lance is not on the floor, teams can pressure the perimeter and make it harder to get open looks. They can take more risk because they are far less likely to get burned. Hill protects the ball well and isn't so weak physically (like Augustin) that teams just take the ball away...but Hill is mediocre at ball movement. His game indeed can lead to a stagnant offense unless others are creating. He's not going to excel at driving and dishing because it's not his game. With that said, he is still a very, very good player and as you say fits well in the lineup with Stephenson.

                          So, what I'm saying is that Lance's ability to create and assist opens the floor up for other players to get open looks...even if Lance isn't getting the assist.

                          With Miami it can get tough. Augustin wasn't big enough to handle Chalmers and Cole. Hill is barely able to handle it and there pressure has gotten the best of him on occasion. Lance can hold the ball away from those clowns, see over them to pass and can drive and power through them for an And-One. They physical pressure isn't going to shut down Lance and if anything it will motivate him.

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                          • #58
                            Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

                            Originally posted by BlueNGold View Post
                            Excellent post, but let me clarify something further. When Lance is not on the floor, teams can pressure the perimeter and make it harder to get open looks. They can take more risk because they are far less likely to get burned. Hill protects the ball well and isn't so weak physically (like Augustin) that teams just take the ball away...but Hill is mediocre at ball movement. His game indeed can lead to a stagnant offense unless others are creating. He's not going to excel at driving and dishing because it's not his game. With that said, he is still a very, very good player and as you say fits well in the lineup with Stephenson.

                            So, what I'm saying is that Lance's ability to create and assist opens the floor up for other players to get open looks...even if Lance isn't getting the assist.

                            With Miami it can get tough. Augustin wasn't big enough to handle Chalmers and Cole. Hill is barely able to handle it and there pressure has gotten the best of him on occasion. Lance can hold the ball away from those clowns, see over them to pass and can drive and power through them for an And-One. They physical pressure isn't going to shut down Lance and if anything it will motivate him.
                            I don't know if driving and dishing is Hill's game or not. We never ask it from him and thus I don't know if he can do it or not. I'm pretty sure that our players can do more things than they are asked to (heck, Roy hit a corner 3 yesterday) but there's no reason to attempt it most of the time.

                            I'd also say that Hill is very beneficial to our ball movement. Take a look at this -> http://stats.nba.com/playerTrackingP...&sortOrder=DES

                            Hill averages 55.6 passes per game which is a team high for the Pacers even though his USG% is 9th for the team (only Ian has a lower USG% out of the players that receive regular minutes). In other words, he is actively moving the ball every game.

                            Lance obviously helps us a lot but so does Hill. As I said, it's a nice balance between those two.
                            Originally posted by IrishPacer
                            Empty vessels make the most noise.

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                            • #59
                              Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

                              Originally posted by Nuntius View Post

                              Hill averages 55.6 passes per game which is a team high for the Pacers even though his USG% is 9th for the team (only Ian has a lower USG% out of the players that receive regular minutes). In other words, he is actively moving the ball every game.
                              The reason he has so many passes is that he almost always touches the ball. He either brings it up or a player hands it to him to "initiate". There are times where Lance and Paul initiate and it doesn't touch Hill, but those are the exceptions. So, the fact Hill passes a lot often doesn't mean much in terms of quality of pass. He often pounds the ball a few times and drops it off to DWest or Paul to create. That doesn't amount to much and his assist totals reflect it.

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                              • #60
                                Re: Pacers Vs. Wizards Post-Game Thread - 1/10

                                Originally posted by Anthem View Post
                                I watched the Wizards feed, and by the end of the night the announcers had stopped being reluctant about admitting it; they basically treated it as a clinic in good defense. Very complimentary.
                                Living in DC, I catch a lot of Wiz games when the Pacers aren't playing at the same time. Steve Buckhantz and Phil Chenier are two of the best in the business. Very enjoyable to watch.
                                2015, 2016, 2019 IKL Fantasy Basketball Champions - DC Dreamers

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