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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

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"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

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  • Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

    Or they're trying to become the Hawks. Humphries for Smith works but after signing Smith to a max deal that would put them at 96 mil next year with 4 players yet to sign. I don't know if this makes them a true elite team but it might. With the upcoming tax penalties they'll be one of the very few teams willing to go that far into the L.T. They could have a base payroll of 120 mil in a short time with the multi year LT penalty kicking in. I don't think Cuban or Buss would go that far, Cuban has already shown signs of changing his spending ways. It sucks seeing the playing field that uneven for the Pacers although I do think the new tax will make it better then before. Brooklyn could soon be the most hated team in the nba.

    http://espn.go.com/new-york/nba/story/_/id/8934969/


    The Brooklyn Nets are aggressively pursuing a trade for Atlanta Hawks star forward Josh Smith, league sources told ESPN.
    The two teams are engaged in discussions, but one source said while "there has been lots of talk, nothing is close yet."
    As the NBA's Feb. 21 trade deadline nears, Brooklyn is proving to be one of the most active teams in the league. As reported by ESPN.com on Friday, sources said the Nets also are talking with the Charlotte Bobcats about a Kris Humphries-for-Ben Gordon trade.

    Nets Blog

    Looking for more Nets news? ESPNNewYork.com has you covered. Blog ยป


    While the Nets certainly want Gordon, sources said acquiring Smith is their higher priority. A trade for Smith would seemingly kill a deal for Gordon, because Humphries is one of the players being discussed with Atlanta.
    The Nets are willing to give up Humphries and second-year shooting guard MarShon Brooks for Smith. But it almost certainly will take more than a Humphries-Brooks combination to pry Smith away from Atlanta, and one source said the Hawks want Brooklyn's first-round pick.
    Some scenarios that have been discussed include the Hawks' Anthony Morrow, who played the past two seasons with the Nets, returning to the club.
    ESPN.com's Marc Stein reported Saturday that the Hawks want a young center in return for Smith.
    The Nets may have to get a third team involved to pull off a trade for Smith.
    Smith will become a free agent this summer, and Atlanta is deciding whether to trade him before the deadline. One source close to the situation estimated there is a 60 percent chance the Hawks will move him.
    If the Hawks don't trade Smith, they risk losing him for nothing as a free agent. Atlanta could re-sign Smith, but he wants close to maximum-salary money, if not the max.
    One school of thought has the Hawks keeping Smith in order to make themselves more attractive to Smith's longtime friend and fellow Atlanta native, Dwight Howard.
    Howard, who is struggling through a nightmarish season with the Los Angeles Lakers, will become a free agent this summer, and Atlanta will join Dallas and Houston in offering him a max-salary contract. Sources have said Howard has little interest in playing in Atlanta.
    Why do teams tank? Ask a Spurs fan.

  • #2
    Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

    As long as the Pacers can get in on that deal and get Korver with Green going back to the Nets. That would be terrific.
    First time in a long time, I've been happy with the team that was constructed, and now they struggle. I blame the coach.

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

      Then if they can find a way to get Horford from the Hawks they will be all set. Horford, Smith and Johnson from the Hawks along with Lopes and D. Williams. Like a two-team merger into one super team.
      The Most Common Cause of Stress is Dealing with Idiots

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      • #4
        Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

        The thread is about the Nets trying to gain Josh Smith, not what we may be able to trade in the meantime, or whatever, if this goes on that course, it will be in the trade forum faster than you can count your socks.
        So Long And Thanks For All The Fish.

        If you've done 6 impossible things today?
        Then why not have Breakfast at Milliways!

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        • #5
          Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

          It sucks to see a team be able to just buy a championship but that's what Cuban did and when L.A. ran the payrolls they did during the past 10 years it's kind of what they did as well. Now fewer teams will be able to do it but it looks like the Nets are willing. I don't feel like computing it but what would be the multi year penalty for a team with a base payroll of 120 mil? I'll bet it's over a 100 mil penalty.
          220 million versus the Pacers at 70.
          Why do teams tank? Ask a Spurs fan.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

            Originally posted by Pacerized View Post
            It sucks to see a team be able to just buy a championship but that's what Cuban did and when L.A. ran the payrolls they did during the past 10 years it's kind of what they did as well. Now fewer teams will be able to do it but it looks like the Nets are willing. I don't feel like computing it but what would be the multi year penalty for a team with a base payroll of 120 mil? I'll bet it's over a 100 mil penalty.
            220 million versus the Pacers at 70.
            Starting next season, the tax burden gets significantly heavier. NBA teams must pay a $1.50-to-$1 ratio for the first $4.99 million they are over the luxury-tax threshold, a $1.75-to-$1 ratio for being $5 million to $9.99 million above the threshold, a $2.50 ratio for $10 million to $14.99 million over, and a $3.25 ratio for $15 million to $19.99 million beyond the threshold.

            Teams that are $20 million or more over the tax level accrue additional penalties, increasing by 50 cents per dollar for every $5 million.
            Source: http://articles.latimes.com/2012/sep/18/sports/la-sp-lakers-luxury-tax-20120918

            So, lets see, if Brooklyn went to $120M, and the luxury tax kicks in at $70, that's $50M. In years past, that would be a $50M penalty.

            Now, they'd need to pay $6.25 for every $1 over the LT. That's $337.5M. I...I...I don't know what to say...

            My math: $3.25 to $1 for $20M, increasing by $.50 for every $5M. BKN would be $30M over the base, which equals out to an additional $3.50 per $1 ON TOP of the $3.25. So, they'd pay $6.75 for every $1 over the LT, and $6.75 * $50M is $337.5M

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

              Originally posted by Derek2k3 View Post
              Source: http://articles.latimes.com/2012/sep/18/sports/la-sp-lakers-luxury-tax-20120918

              So, lets see, if Brooklyn went to $120M, and the luxury tax kicks in at $70, that's $50M. In years past, that would be a $50M penalty.

              Now, they'd need to pay $6.25 for every $1 over the LT. That's $337.5M. I...I...I don't know what to say...

              My math: $3.25 to $1 for $20M, increasing by $.50 for every $5M. BKN would be $30M over the base, which equals out to an additional $3.50 per $1 ON TOP of the $3.25. So, they'd pay $6.75 for every $1 over the LT, and $6.75 * $50M is $337.5M
              This can't be right, by the way. I'm missing something.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

                Originally posted by Derek2k3 View Post
                This can't be right, by the way. I'm missing something.
                I calculated roughly $193.75m in tax for a $120m payroll, assuming $70m tax line. I think what's off in your calculation is that you're applying the highest tax rate on all money above the tax, but if I read Larry Coon's example right, it should be incremental. That is, the the highest tax rate only applies to the final $5m, while for the next $5m, the tax rate is $0.50 lower, and so forth. And that's not considering possible repeater tax penalties.

                But let's just agree that the rapidly escalating multipliers would make any payroll significantly above $100m impractical, even for a Russian oligarch Currently the Lakers are around $100m team salary (assuming they keep Howard), and the Nets are around $90m. We'll see if either team is willing to add to that next year.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

                  As for the Hawks trading Josh Smith, I don't see what Brooklyn can offer that will tempt Hawks away from their cap space plan next summer.

                  I still think Hawks end up hanging on to Smoove, and even possibly re-signing him.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

                    Originally posted by wintermute View Post
                    I calculated roughly $193.75m in tax for a $120m payroll, assuming $70m tax line. I think what's off in your calculation is that you're applying the highest tax rate on all money above the tax, but if I read Larry Coon's example right, it should be incremental. That is, the the highest tax rate only applies to the final $5m, while for the next $5m, the tax rate is $0.50 lower, and so forth. And that's not considering possible repeater tax penalties.

                    But let's just agree that the rapidly escalating multipliers would make any payroll significantly above $100m impractical, even for a Russian oligarch Currently the Lakers are around $100m team salary (assuming they keep Howard), and the Nets are around $90m. We'll see if either team is willing to add to that next year.
                    Ah, that's right. So, because I'm now extremely interested, I ran those numbers:



                    That look right? $195M, not counting the repeater penalties and so on?

                    Un. Freaking. Real.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

                      Originally posted by able View Post


                      it will be in the trade forum faster than you can count your socks.

                      LOL! Never heard that one before!

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

                        Originally posted by wintermute View Post
                        As for the Hawks trading Josh Smith, I don't see what Brooklyn can offer that will tempt Hawks away from their cap space plan next summer.

                        I still think Hawks end up hanging on to Smoove, and even possibly re-signing him.
                        Maybe Brooks, Blatch, Hump, 1st? Money works...and that Russian is just crazy enough to do something like that

                        You'd start:
                        D-Will
                        Joe
                        Wallace
                        Smoove
                        Lopez

                        Bench would be the issue, again/still. My goodness that bench is bad.

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

                          Originally posted by Derek2k3 View Post
                          Maybe Brooks, Blatch, Hump, 1st? Money works...and that Russian is just crazy enough to do something like that

                          You'd start:
                          D-Will
                          Joe
                          Wallace
                          Smoove
                          Lopez

                          Bench would be the issue, again/still. My goodness that bench is bad.
                          Why would either team do that deal lol. Nets won't get Smith without giving up Lopez IMO and I don't think Brooklyn would do that so I just don't think it's gonna happen.


                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

                            Originally posted by Trader Joe View Post
                            Why would either team do that deal lol. Nets won't get Smith without giving up Lopez IMO and I don't think Brooklyn would do that so I just don't think it's gonna happen.
                            Atlanta does it if they think Smoove is gone regardless.

                            Don't think it's a good deal, but Atlanta isn't going anywhere as is. I'd imagine they're tiring of the yearly "Josh Smith wants out" storyline put out there by his agent.

                            EDIT: Don't forget, Atlanta was so desperate to get rid of Joe Johnsons $20M that they literally gave him up for expirings and a pick (I think 2 guys from that deal are still on the roster, Morrow and DeShawn.)

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Brooklyn trying to land Josh Smith

                              I don't think Josh Smith matches with that Brooklyn team, it looks like they are trying to put as many good players as possible in one team but they don't care how they match.
                              @WhatTheFFacts: Studies show that sarcasm enhances the ability of the human mind to solve complex problems!

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