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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

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The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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Rule #10

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Rule #11

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Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

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  • #16
    Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

    Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
    I don't know, have not seen any of the last two games. Judging by the last few games I've seen, Magic, Celtics, Spurs, I would say no, but the past two games the final score appears bad, but without seeing the games, I don't know
    The last two games have been significantly and substantively worse.

    To me, the biggest difference has been Dunleavy. Making bad passes, stupid turnovers, along with bad shooting and driving and apparent fatigue. Only Head and Hansbrough have been able to provide anything that resembles strong offense.

    As I said in another post, without Granger we barely have a chance. Without Dunleavy and Granger we have no chance.

    But I still think we need to replace JOB.
    "Look, it's up to me to put a team around ... Lance right now." —Kevin Pritchard press conference

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    • #17
      Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

      ok i understand losing its normal a team loses some games, but its not about losing is about the type of basketball being played. in the last couple of games they have looked worse and worse and they seem to give up before they even start, certainly this was the case tonight

      it certainly looks like there is no one in charge and no leadership from either the players or the coaches

      never in the past 2 to 3 years have i seen this team more disorganized, confused and not competing in games

      Comment


      • #18
        Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

        I don't think this team ever had wheels.

        Comment


        • #19
          Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

          Originally posted by Hicks View Post
          I fully understand not blaming the coach for losing a lot of games when the best guy goes down (though Houston this year makes you wonder), but I also expect the players available to play a lot better than this as a group, even in a loss. They aren't just losing, they're getting their asses kicked for reasons under their control. This goes a step or two beyond missing Danny Granger.
          Houston has been a great example this year, as have the Kings without Kevin Martin have played close to .500 ball this year as well.

          Detroit has played most of the year without Prince and Hamilton, they haven't been great, but they're better then us by a few games.

          I think Portland is a good example as well, even though they have Roy and Alridge, they've been playing without keys guys for a lot of the year, and it keeps getting worse for them but they're still maintaining and playing solid basketball without Outlaw, Fernandez, Oden and Pryzbilla

          Had it not been for the 2 win Nets, a couple breaks and bounces against the Wiz, and holding on at home against the Bobcats, we'd be a 6 win team, which would be 2nd worse team in the league record wise. Dunleavy was also playing well then, and he's not anymore.

          I was actually encouraged by the fight against the Magic, Spurs and Celtics, but when I look back at those now, I'm curious if that has done more harm then good when it comes to hoping for changes!

          Comment


          • #20
            Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

            Originally posted by Hicks View Post
            I fully understand not blaming the coach for losing a lot of games when the best guy goes down (though Houston this year makes you wonder), but I also expect the players available to play a lot better than this as a group, even in a loss. They aren't just losing, they're getting their asses kicked for reasons under their control. This goes a step or two beyond missing Danny Granger.
            True, but its the easiest decision to hold off on because they don't have Danny. Its the easiest "Yeah, but" excuse for Bird to justify, having to go through with such a hard decision the difficulty that follows. Sometimes status quo is just easier than change.

            Also JOB isn't getting fired anytime soon because you haven't heard of any chatter about it. Its pretty formulaic how teams go about firing coaches in the NBA. A Rumor is thrown out there that JOB is on the hot seat. Newspaper and the media types start talking about it. Bird releases a statement saying that they are sticking with JOB and they support him fully right now. Inorder to quell overwhelming media attention from distracting the team while they secretly look for a new coach. Then in the next two weeks it actually happens. They won't be able to find a new coach and Lester Conner takes over for for the rest of the season. But again you haven't heard the JOB on the hot seat rumor pop up in the media. It happened that way with Frank, its happening this way right now with Del Negro in Chicago.
            Last edited by theboyjwo; 12-28-2009, 12:26 AM.

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            • #21
              Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

              Yes, change will come. I believe JOB will be fired. The question is will Bird give him time to have Granger, to prove he can win with him. But I think things have gotten so bad that he will have to do it sooner. The team looked so out of it tonight, regardless of having Granger or not, there is simply no excuse for the way this team has been playing.

              I know talent has been brought up as a reason for the teams play. This is factor with Granger being out. Dunleavy's knee is an obvious excuse. But I think the teams problems run deeper. JOB is not completely at fault, but he is the coach, it's his job to get the team up for games and to coach a style that works. Last year we had some luck with his style, but not enough to make the playoffs. This year is going much worse than last, with no hope, IMO. Some brought up Houston as an example of a team without it's top players. This is a great example, they don't really have an All Star, but will most likely make the playoffs. Adelman has them competing every night, and winning, maybe due to the players mixing with his style better, I am not sure, but the point being we should be competing every night and that is just not happening.

              Firing JOB and bringing in someone else in isn't any guarantee that things will instantly get better. But I do think we need the change. If we were showing more fight on the court, I would say give him more time, but that is just not happening, with really no sign of anything changing. The look on Bird's face says a lot. Many have said on here that they have seen him with his head down, shaking his head, etc... This leads me to think he will do something soon. He has to do something.

              The change at the player level might take longer due to the contracts we have. But it to will change. I hope that we can at least move one of those contracts this season. But that is a hope, that I am not so sure will happen. It seems Murphs value is at a low. Dun's value is low due to the knee factor. Ford might have value, just not sure anyone would want him to be there point guard.

              Let's hope something happens soon, the season is still young and it pains me to think things will continue this way.
              Avatar photo credit: Bahram Mark Sobhani - AP

              Comment


              • #22
                Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

                You never know with the Pacers. Like Hicks has said in other threads it is possible we pick up more wins late in the year like we always seem to. Now, I don't see that happening this year because this team has very, very little talent, but recent history dictates that this is indeed possible.

                I'd say if this team goes on any sort of losing streak of some substance immediately after the ASB, it is over. I know that is sort of a gutless prediction, but recent history with the Pacers shows that they are a relatively strong finishing team.

                Comment


                • #23
                  Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

                  Originally posted by theboyjwo View Post
                  True, but its the easiest decision to hold off on because they don't have Danny. Its the easiest "Yeah, but" excuse for Bird to justify, having to go through with such a hard decision the difficulty that follows. Sometimes status quo is just easier than change.

                  Also JOB isn't getting fired anytime soon because you haven't heard of any chatter about it. Its pretty formulaic how teams go about firing coaches in the NBA. A Rumor is thrown out there that JOB is on the hot seat. Newspaper and the media types start talking about it. Bird releases a statement saying that they are sticking with JOB and they support him fully right now. Inorder to quell overwhelming media attention from distracting the team while they secretly look for a new coach. Then in the next two weeks it actually happens. They won't be able to find a new coach and Lester Conner takes over for for the rest of the season. But again you haven't heard the JOB on the hot seat rumor pop up in the media. It happened that way with Frank, its happening this way right now with Del Negro in Chicago.
                  Good point, but I think we will start hearing those rumors soon.
                  Avatar photo credit: Bahram Mark Sobhani - AP

                  Comment


                  • #24
                    Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

                    I will be shocked if JOB makes it past the All Star break. In fact, I predict right now he's gone real soon.
                    "Just look at the flowers ........ BANG" - Carol "The Walking Dead"

                    Comment


                    • #25
                      Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

                      I told y'all the Rush/Bayless trade was a mistake.

                      I told y'all we would lose Jarret Jack and be a much worse team for it.

                      I told y'all I feared JOB was losing the team back when we were 5-4.

                      I saw this coming. And this is why I'm a pessimist.

                      Comment


                      • #26
                        Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

                        The coach won't get fired to get a new coach and turn things around (immediately), he'd get fired to appease the fans if they start tuning out in droves.

                        O'Brien's expiration date passed quite some time ago. IMHO, the only reason he's still here is he gives us the ability to tank without actually tanking. OTOH, if fans give up hope in the coach and start questioning players (unfairly), and follow that with major declining ticket sales and apathy then O'Brien is finished sooner rather than later. The team won't be able to afford to take these losses, even if the scoreboard losses mean a higher draft pick. TPTB will need fans to have SOME faith in the existing players and not turn on them.

                        Right now, O'Brien's 'coaching' is causing fans to lose too much faith and respect with existing players. That can't happen. Not to this degree.

                        IMHO....
                        Nuntius was right for a while. I was wrong for a while. But ultimately I was right and Frank Vogel has been let go.

                        ------

                        "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, that’s teamwork."

                        -John Wooden

                        Comment


                        • #27
                          Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

                          Originally posted by Shade View Post
                          I told y'all the Rush/Bayless trade was a mistake.

                          I told y'all we would lose Jarret Jack and be a much worse team for it.

                          I told y'all I feared JOB was losing the team back when we were 5-4.

                          I saw this coming. And this is why I'm a pessimist.
                          Well, the Bayless/Rush trade got us Jack in the 1st place.


                          Remember when we could have gotten 1-2 solid players and a possible Top 3 draft pick in the 2017 NBA Draft by trading away Paul George?

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

                            Originally posted by Shade View Post
                            I told y'all the Rush/Bayless trade was a mistake.

                            I told y'all we would lose Jarret Jack and be a much worse team for it.

                            I told y'all I feared JOB was losing the team back when we were 5-4.

                            I saw this coming. And this is why I'm a pessimist.
                            You're way to young to be a pessimist. I'm old It's my job.

                            "There is no sadder sight than a young pessimist, except an old optimist" - Mark Twain
                            "Just look at the flowers ........ BANG" - Carol "The Walking Dead"

                            Comment


                            • #29
                              Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

                              If anything, we'll probably wait until the offseason with a decision if O'Brien will stay or not. An interim for the rest of the season won't do us much more than O'Brien would.

                              Jarrett Jack should be traded back.
                              Last edited by Trophy; 12-28-2009, 01:35 AM.

                              Comment


                              • #30
                                Re: Have the wheels fallen off of the wagon for this team?

                                How about we keep Jim but make him never play Murphy Hibbert and Dunleavy together at the same time.
                                In fact how about they make him never play Murphy ever again until he is traded, this team would be win many more games. Problem solved

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