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Below are the rules of Pacers Digest. After you have read them, you will have a very good sense of where we are coming from, what we expect, what we don't want to see, and how we react to things.

Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

"People with intelligence will agree with me when I say that __________"

"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

"I can't wait to hear something from PosterX when he/she sees that **insert a given incident or current event that will have probably upset or disappointed PosterX here**"

"He/she is just delusional"

"This thread is stupid / worthless / embarrassing"

"I'm going to take a moment to point and / laugh at PosterX / GroupOfPeopleY who thought / believed *insert though/belief here*"

"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

Rule #2

If the actions of an administrator inspire you to make a comment, criticism, or express a concern about it, there is a wrong place and a couple of right places to do so.

The wrong place is to do so in the original thread in which the administrator took action. For example, if a post gets an infraction, or a post gets deleted, or a comment within a larger post gets clipped out, in a thread discussing Paul George, the wrong thing to do is to distract from the discussion of Paul George by adding your off topic thoughts on what the administrator did.

The right places to do so are:

A) Start a thread about the specific incident you want to talk about on the Feedback board. This way you are able to express yourself in an area that doesn't throw another thread off topic, and this way others can add their two cents as well if they wish, and additionally if there's something that needs to be said by the administrators, that is where they will respond to it.

B) Send a private message to the administrators, and they can respond to you that way.

If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

If a poster is bothering you, and an administrator has not or will not deal with that poster to the extent that you would prefer, you have a powerful tool at your disposal, one that has recently been upgraded and is now better than ever: The ability to ignore a user.

When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

A) Any post they make will be completely invisible as you scroll through a thread.

B) The new addition to this feature: If someone QUOTES a user you are ignoring, you do not have to read who it was, or what that poster said, unless you go out of your way to click on a link to find out who it is and what they said.

To utilize this feature, from any page on Pacers Digest, scroll to the top of the page, look to the top right where it says 'Settings' and click that. From the settings page, look to the left side of the page where it says 'My Settings', and look down from there until you see 'Edit Ignore List' and click that. From here, it will say 'Add a Member to Your List...' Beneath that, click in the text box to the right of 'User Name', type in or copy & paste the username of the poster you are ignoring, and once their name is in the box, look over to the far right and click the 'Okay' button. All done!

Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

An example:

If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

Rule #6

We cannot tolerate illegal videos on Pacers Digest. This means do not share any links to them, do not mention any websites that host them or link to them, do not describe how to find them in any way, and do not ask about them. Posts doing anything of the sort will be removed, the offenders will be contacted privately, and if the problem becomes habitual, you will be suspended, and if it still persists, you will probably be banned.

The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

Rule #7

Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

Rule #8

We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

Rule #9

Generally speaking, we try to be a "PG-13" rated board, and we don't want to see sexual content or similarly suggestive content. Vulgarity is a more muddled issue, though again we prefer things to lean more towards "PG-13" than "R". If we feel things have gone too far, we will step in.

Rule #10

We like small signatures, not big signatures. The bigger the signature, the more likely it is an annoying or distracting signature.

Rule #11

Do not advertise anything without talking about it with the administrators first. This includes advertising with your signature, with your avatar, through private messaging, and/or by making a thread or post.
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From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

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  • From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    Maybe I am crazy here, but it seems like people are WAY overvaluing Rush on the trade market viewing him as some valuable trade asset. I see him more as a filler or complimentary piece in a deal.

    The positives about Rush is his three ball and his defensive ability. Those two things are the highlights which you would try to sell other teams on. Other than that what does Rush have going for him?

    The negatives about Rush: He is a TERRIBLE free throw shooter. Under65% as a two is beyond awful. He is also below 43% from the field for his career, which might not be terrible, but it isn't too great as well. Rush also can not create for others at all as his 1:1 assist to turnover ratio would indicate.

    Looking at Rush through stats brings me to why I am thoroughly confused. Why are some of you so hesitant to move this guy? I mean he will be 25 before next season, meaning he isn't exactly that young anymore. Some of you wouldn't move him for a Darren Collison type, which to me is mind boggeling. Where is all this hope and promise that some of you show in Rush coming from? I sure don't know.

    While I wouldn't give Rush away for a pack of M&M's, I would not hesitate to give him up either. I mean if Rush is what could land us or keep us from landing a guy like Darren Collison or Tony Parker I would think you have to do that. I mean Rush has not shown me anything to think he is too valuable for that.

  • #2
    Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

    I think they keep Brandon and try to use one of the expiring players for any trade. Brandon is just too good to trade and he is undervalued by other teams. He is not a star or will ever be one, but he is a good role player who plays awesome D and can nail the 3.

    I think he is the perfect 6th man - rotation player for the future. Plus, when it comes time to sign him he won't cost very much. I think he would get a deal similar to or less than DJones.

    Those are the kind of people you want on your team, glue guys who don't demand huge contracts.
    Last edited by PaceBalls; 06-27-2010, 02:20 PM.

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    • #3
      Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

      I agree completely Joe.

      Thingfish what makes you say he is "too good to trade"? Sure he has some talent and looks to be a good role-player in the future, but why is that too good to trade for a starting PG?

      The problem I have with keeping Rush is that he is not the answer at SG for a team looking to put together a legitimate PO roster... He looks great off the bench for a win-now team but with George (hopefully) on the rise and holes in the starting roster, the Pacers don't have the luxury of holding onto role players who have the ability to bring back starting talent in a trade.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

        Within the O'B offense, the job of a wing is to either attack the paint with dribble penetration or shoot 3's. Otherwise, they pass to someone else who does the same. Rush makes fewer mistakes and has better judgement on when to drive and pass than pretty much anyone else who has been on our roster since he came here. His only rub is that he isn't agressive enough to finish well, and he passes up too many shots.

        Defensively, he is a potential beast if he is put on a team that values defense enough to have everybody playing it.

        It was obvious that the Bobcats wanted him to be the primary acquisition in the proposed trade for Felton, while being willing to pay TJ as a backup for them. I am sure that other teams have wanted him, also, but Bird doesn't want to trade him because he realizes both how good he actually is, as well as recognizing that he can be quite a bit better down the road.

        Rush is valuable as a trading piece, but it depends on who the Pacers are trying to get rid of at a given time as to whather they are willing to include Rush, or if he is too valuable to include at that particular time.

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        • #5
          Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

          Originally posted by Thingfish View Post
          Those are the kind of people you want on your team, glue guys who don't demand huge contracts.

          You also don't want a whole team of those kind of players...

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

            Originally posted by Thingfish View Post
            I think they keep Brandon and try to use one of the expiring players for any trade. Brandon is just too good to trade and he is undervalued by other teams. He is not a star or will ever be one, but he is a good role player who plays awesome D and can nail the 3.

            I think he is the perfect 6th man - rotation player for the future. Plus, when it comes time to sign him he won't cost very much. I think he would get a deal similar to or less than DJones.

            Those are the kind of people you want on your team, glue guys who don't demand huge contracts.
            I am still trying to understand how other teams could undervalue any Pacer player. THe NBA sets the value of any player and right now Rush's value is leveled off to maybe even declining.

            IF thats the case then I would trade him before his contract is up because I think you are dead wrong on what his next contract will be. The Djones comparison is a bit flawed becuase he doesn't spread the floor with his 3 pnt shooting. Guys like Ariza and Posey are better comparisons IMO and if that is the case Rushes next contract will be more like 4-6 million per year.

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            • #7
              Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

              I agree with Joew8302 completey. I would trade Rush for almost any of the PG's selected in the first round last year. If Bird thought he was the answer than George would not have been drafted. Sure most people think George was dratfed because he was the BPA, but if we were set at the wings our BPA would have been Davis or Patterson.
              If some othe GM is willing to take Rush and we get back a starting caliber young PG, you jump all over it. I would have traded him for Hill, if that was on the table last week.

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              • #8
                Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

                Value?

                I'd say something in the range of a dishwasher and a Lunchable.

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                • #9
                  Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

                  Oh, alright. The Lunchable was a reach.

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                  • #10
                    Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

                    Are people just not getting the idea that if we trade away Rush we won't have a starting SG anymore? Neither George or Stephenson are ready to start at SG right now. We trade a 1st round pick (which we could eventually use to get a PG) and our starting SG and then we have a hole at SG instead of PG plus we lost a pick.

                    I'd much rather trade an expiring for a decent PG this summer and upgrade the position later instead of give up any of our young guys right now.

                    I realize that many of you would just like to upgrade every position with above average players all at once, but that's just not reality.

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                    • #11
                      Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

                      Originally posted by Bridge View Post
                      You also don't want a whole team of those kind of players...
                      Perhaps not, but I wouldn't mind having a whole team that plays defense.

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                      • #12
                        Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

                        Originally posted by IndyPacer View Post
                        Are people just not getting the idea that if we trade away Rush we won't have a starting SG anymore? Neither George or Stephenson are ready to start at SG right now. We trade a 1st round pick (which we could eventually use to get a PG) and our starting SG and then we have a hole at SG instead of PG plus we lost a pick.

                        I'd much rather trade an expiring for a decent PG this summer and upgrade the position later instead of give up any of our young guys right now.

                        I realize that many of you would just like to upgrade every position with above average players all at once, but that's just not reality.

                        Jones would be a competent stopgap before George steps up. Also, I'd rather fill the PG hole then the SG hole any day... it's much harder to do

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

                          I see Rush as a player who in combination with an expirer could net us a good proven PG. His skill set of having good defense and the ability to knock down shots would bode well for a good team needing depth for both the 2 and the three spots. Maybe being traded could help him get more of a scorer mentality. I am not living in a pipe dream though. We're not landing a top PG with Rush, but we could get a promising guy like Collison, Maynor or Flynn. I'd be happy with those trade scenarios.

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                          • #14
                            Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

                            Originally posted by IndyPacer View Post
                            Are people just not getting the idea that if we trade away Rush we won't have a starting SG anymore? Neither George or Stephenson are ready to start at SG right now. We trade a 1st round pick (which we could eventually use to get a PG) and our starting SG and then we have a hole at SG instead of PG plus we lost a pick.

                            I'd much rather trade an expiring for a decent PG this summer and upgrade the position later instead of give up any of our young guys right now.

                            I realize that many of you would just like to upgrade every position with above average players all at once, but that's just not reality.
                            I think people are getting the idea that with Rush we will not have a starting caliber 2 guard anyways.

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                            • #15
                              Re: From a trading perspective, what is Rush's value?

                              my personal opinion is to keep brandon rush and trade him at all. give him another year to prove him self. i see him as having more positives than negatives and the negatives are not necessarily things that are really hurting the team, they can be fixed give him another year and see what happens. otherwise it will be a big mistake
                              THIS IS THE LAST TIME YOU HEAR MY VOICE , NEXT TIME YOU WILL SEE MY FACE

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