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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

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We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

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In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

Rule #3

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When you ignore a user, you will unfortunately still see some hints of their existence (nothing we can do about that), however, it does the following key things:

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Rule #4

Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

Rule #5

When you share or paste content or articles from another website, you must include the URL/link back to where you found it, who wrote it, and what website it's from. Said content will be removed if this doesn't happen.

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If I copy and paste an article from the Indianapolis Star website, I would post something like this:

http://www.linktothearticlegoeshere.com/article
Title of the Article
Author's Name
Indianapolis Star

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The legal means of watching or listening to NBA games are NBA League Pass Broadband (for US, or for International; both cost money) and NBA Audio League Pass (which is free). Look for them on NBA.com.

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Provocative statements in a signature, or as an avatar, or as the 'tagline' beneath a poster's username (where it says 'Member' or 'Administrator' by default, if it is not altered) are an unwanted distraction that will more than likely be removed on sight. There can be shades of gray to this, but in general this could be something political or religious that is likely going to provoke or upset people, or otherwise something that is mean-spirited at the expense of a poster, a group of people, or a population.

It may or may not go without saying, but this goes for threads and posts as well, particularly when it's not made on the off-topic board (Market Square).

We do make exceptions if we feel the content is both innocuous and unlikely to cause social problems on the forum (such as wishing someone a Merry Christmas or a Happy Easter), and we also also make exceptions if such topics come up with regards to a sports figure (such as the Lance Stephenson situation bringing up discussions of domestic abuse and the law, or when Jason Collins came out as gay and how that lead to some discussion about gay rights).

However, once the discussion seems to be more/mostly about the political issues instead of the sports figure or his specific situation, the thread is usually closed.

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We prefer self-restraint and/or modesty when making jokes or off topic comments in a sports discussion thread. They can be fun, but sometimes they derail or distract from a topic, and we don't want to see that happen. If we feel it is a problem, we will either delete or move those posts from the thread.

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Rule #10

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Blow it up....

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  • Blow it up....

    I know we are stuck for the rest of the season, but it is time to finish it and start all over. We have many very good young pieces in place. Its time to rebuild around them. We need to move JO and package Tins with him. Get the last of the old blood out of here.

    The the dark cloud this team plays under will never go away until JO and Tinsley are gone. We have 10 guys on the roster that this is their first year as a Pacer. Did you guys realize that? 10 players in their first year in a Pacer uniform. Granger in his second year, Harrison his third. Thats 12 of 15 that have been here less than 3 years. Finish it. Get rid of the last of the old blood.

    Package JO and Tins and start developing and building around these kids we got. It cant be any worse. This team just has issues. And they are not going away. And I aint talking about off the court issues. This team just doesnt consistently BRING IT every night. And it hasnt since the brawl.

    And as much as it pains me to say it, Rick needs to go to. I think Rick is a great coach, but this team needs a complete change. The last of the old blood needs to be gone. All of it. Then maybe this dark cloud will move on as well.

  • #2
    Re: Blow it up....

    Well you said it yourself, it's not the personnel that's really the problem. Fire Carlisle. It doesn't matter who we get unless I guess it's LbJ or Jordan (even at that I have my fears that RC might find a way to restrict their game) RC has to go. I'd like to keep JO and see him under a different system. Tinsley and DunDun are expendable. We all know about DunDun's shooting struggles but most of all the dude is soft. He gets pushed around by guys like Sam Cassell. If we can get a PG that can shoot and defend, and the new coach develops Ike and DH into banging Dale Davis post guys then we can still make something out of what we have. Carlisle is a big reason why most of our players perform as poor as they have been. He claims he puts players in a position to succeed, but he frustrates almost every single one of them in the process and put them in situations they are not comfortable with. At some point you got to question the man's megalomaniacal stance. He will not bend nor adjust to cater to his players even if it means a disgruntled locker room.
    http://Twitter.com/dRealSource

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    • #3
      Re: Blow it up....

      I've had this same feeling at times about just start fresh. Eliminate all ties with the brawl era guys, including RC. It's tough though b/c JO's played hard and played well for the most part. Definitely our best player and our best comodity. It's got its attractive points. Since nothing's going down until the summer anyway, I'm kind of reserving final judgment. Another 1st round exit or worse and I'll start weighing the option more seriously.

      On a related note, I wish we could just ship out Murph and Dun just like we shipped em in. Now we have them and Tins. What would we have to add in to get rid of any one ? Frightening thought. And with the two GS guys, even though I don't think that highly of their games-very mediocre IMO, I could get beyond that if I got the impression they brought energy, toughness, a little something extra. But the only sense I get is sleepwalking or deer in the headlights. The same sense I got watching them play in GS.
      I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

      -Emiliano Zapata

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      • #4
        Re: Blow it up....

        Originally posted by naptown View Post

        Package JO and Tins and start developing and building around these kids we got. It cant be any worse. This team just has issues. And they are not going away. And I aint talking about off the court issues. This team just doesnt consistently BRING IT every night. And it hasnt since the brawl.

        I'm not really sure what you mean, "it can't get any worse". But as far as fielding a competitive team - believe me it can get a whole lot worse. Ask fans in Atlanta, Charlotte, New York, Boston, Philadelphia, Milwaukee, Golden State, Seattle, Portland, Sacramento, and Memphis. You could also ask fans in cities like Chicago, Washington, Clippers fans, Minneapolis, Orlando, Cleveland, Toronto, New jersey - ask those fans how fun it is to re-build and ask them how long it takes to get back.

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        • #5
          Re: Blow it up....

          im not sure what "blowing this team up" truly means. usually that phrase goes along with the Florida Marlins when they have a fire sale and trade expensive players for near nothing just to eliminate payroll.

          i think we need to start a true rebuilding process and that begins with trading JO. im not a 'hater' or even a 'disliker' but i think that this team has gone as far as it can with JO as the leader. he just doesn't fit that role for this team. which is fine, i can't fault him for that. some players just were never meant to be in that role and i don't think JO is really comfortable doing that. so without a true leader we've got a team of a few role players and then just spare parts. and that doesn't lead to long-term, even short term success. i also think JO would be anxious to go somewhere else. and in the right situation he may be able to earn his massive contract but i dont think he can when he's in a place where he is the face and the voice of the team.

          i believe what needs to be blown up is the asst. coaching staff. bring back dick harter or another defensive mind, bring in a true big man coach; who that is exactly im not sure (my ideas have included hakeem [not sure he's actually interested in coaching but he's helped emecka okafor], popeye jones [has been working with the dallas big men]). and then the final piece to that coaching puzzle whatever that would be. but i believe with all of our young players we desperately need a coach to teach defense and to develop our bigs. that is going to be essential for the long term success of this team.
          This is the darkest timeline.

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          • #6
            Re: Blow it up....

            Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
            I'm not really sure what you mean, "it can't get any worse". But as far as fielding a competitive team - believe me it can get a whole lot worse. Ask fans in Atlanta, Charlotte, New York, Boston, Philadelphia, Milwaukee, Golden State, Seattle, Portland, Sacramento, and Memphis. You could also ask fans in cities like Chicago, Washington, Clippers fans, Minneapolis, Orlando, Cleveland, Toronto, New jersey - ask those fans how fun it is to re-build and ask them how long it takes to get back.
            Yeah, people think that rebuilding is a one-shot process. In almost every case, teams have to have a few iterations before the rebuilding process begins to even be moderately successful. For example, Chicago went through two sets of young players until they fell into on the current group. Remember how every year they would amass whole bunches of cap space and then not be able to attract free agents? If we tried the same path, we would have an even harder time getting free agents (small, cold markets are not magnets for NBA players). I don't see a way out, but a complete rebuild without free-agent signings would take 5-7 seasons at least, by which time the Oklahoma City Pacers would be a first-round playoff team.
            Slug 'em Sabres!!!!!
            http://youtube.com/watch?v=cj1SUF4wzu0

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            • #7
              Re: Blow it up....

              Originally posted by Unclebuck View Post
              I'm not really sure what you mean, "it can't get any worse". But as far as fielding a competitive team - believe me it can get a whole lot worse. Ask fans in Atlanta, Charlotte, New York, Boston, Philadelphia, Milwaukee, Golden State, Seattle, Portland, Sacramento, and Memphis. You could also ask fans in cities like Chicago, Washington, Clippers fans, Minneapolis, Orlando, Cleveland, Toronto, New jersey - ask those fans how fun it is to re-build and ask them how long it takes to get back.
              And while we are busy removing "all ties" to the brawl, let's change the team name, colors, remove Detroit trips from the schedule, get rid of Bird/Walsh/the Simons, take down Reggie's jersey number so I don't have to picture him holding Ron down on the scorer's table, and eliminate all beer sales at games.

              Oh, and move the team back to the Fairgrounds.

              And let's not forget to remove all dustpans from around the arena.


              Get rid of JO but keep Dun, Murph, Greene, Baston, Rawle, etc? Um, I would like to see the team get back to a state where they are competitive, and that USUALLY starts with an AS/DPOY/MVP caliber player on the team.


              Yeah, people think that rebuilding is a one-shot process. In almost every case, teams have to have a few iterations before the rebuilding process begins to even be moderately successful.
              And at some point I even question if it's the same process anymore. I mean isn't THIS the rebuild still from 2000? At what point does the NEW process start?

              IMO Chicago FAILED to rebuild using the blow-up/cap space route the first time out. Then they kept trying to rebuild over and over. They got better with a good draft, but then bailed on some of that talent with a big trade, followed by chasing down a top FA for big money (which worked this time around).

              That's NOT part of the same plan from 1999. Heck, I don't even see it as the same plan as 2004 for them. They had to give up on some approaches and roster situations, not just "tweek" them.


              So it DID NOT WORK for them. A couple of times. Their improvement last year and this year WAS NOT a natural progression of things. Lots of teams get to where they were and stay there.

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              • #8
                Re: Blow it up....

                There should just be one "blow it up thread" that RoboHicks bumps after every loss, so melodramatic people can chime in on it.

                That's not to say that there aren't sensible people that want changes in the team, but in my opinion: Ground zero is an terribly low point to start from.

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                • #9
                  Re: Blow it up....

                  My house is dirty and we need new carpet. Time to BLOW IT UP baby!

                  Car's out of gas too, you know what that means...

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                  • #10
                    Re: Blow it up....

                    Originally posted by Naptown_Seth View Post
                    And while we are busy removing "all ties" to the brawl, let's change the team name, colors, remove Detroit trips from the schedule, get rid of Bird/Walsh/the Simons, take down Reggie's jersey number so I don't have to picture him holding Ron down on the scorer's table, and eliminate all beer sales at games.

                    Oh, and move the team back to the Fairgrounds.

                    And let's not forget to remove all dustpans from around the arena.

                    OK, Seth. The dust bin part is hilarious. On the other hand, you know the rest is not what anybody is suggesting.
                    I'd rather die standing up than live on my knees.

                    -Emiliano Zapata

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                    • #11
                      Re: Blow it up....

                      Sorry JO. It's time now.

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                      Last edited by BlueNGold; 07-02-2007, 10:22 PM.

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                      • #12
                        Re: Blow it up....

                        I don't want to get rid of JO, but I certainly want to get rid of Carlisle. He wore out his welcome 2 years ago.

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                        • #13
                          Re: Blow it up....

                          I thought this was going to be another really bad thread but thanks to Seath and BlueNGold its actually been quite entertaining.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Blow it up....

                            Not surprising for this board, that ridiculing people for their opinions is what most of you find entertaining.

                            Now back to my original point. This team is a joke. You cant even call it a team. No one is on the same page, no one acts like they care. Tinsley, Oneal and Rick are the root of the problems. Tins and JO are supposed to be the leaders. They are far from anything resembling a leader and Rick has just plain lost this team. Get rid of those three and lets start building around the other guys on this team.

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