12/18/2009 Game Thread #24: Pacers at Grizzlies

[theboyjwo]

Originally Posted by BlueNGold

Most players in the NBA don't even attempt to do the things he's trying to do...because they know they would get blocked.

That is one of the most unqualified statements I've ever read on this board.
I honestly dont' get why the majority of regulars on this board always seem to want to pigeon hole him and define his ceiling 20 something games into his first season. Get real!

[NuffSaid]

Originally Posted by tora tora

I didn't catch the game, but why did Roy only take 3 shots?

Early foul troubles...road the bench most of the game...played btwn 12-15 minutes.

[Mr_Smith]

I am really tired of this team....I'm not calling out individual players like most people do on here. I'm calling out the TEAM and this TEAM is just not good at all. San Antonio is gonna take the pacers behind the woodshed and abuse them.

[Brad8888]

Live occasionally by the three, die frequently by the three. Whoopee...

[Thesterovic]

I hate how our coach looks like a genius when we're hitting, then he looks stupid otherwise.

[BlueNGold]

Originally Posted by theboyjwo

That is one of the most unqualified statements I've ever read on this board.
I honestly dont' get why the majority of regulars on this board always seem to want to pigeon hole him and define his ceiling 20 something games into his first season. Get real!

Woh, I'm a Hans supporter here.

I expect him to improve and do well. He simply will not be that effective in the post due to physical limitations. He's not long enough, tall enough, nor does he have the hops to do it. That doesn't mean he won't be a good player. His game will have to be midrange and the occasional crash of the boards...and yes, he will get some post-ups, but it cannot possibly be his bread and butter. I look forward to him averaging in the teens with 8 boards in a couple years.

[Hicks]

Tonight is one of those nights where all I can do is pray 2011 is worth the wait when it gets here.

[Brad8888]

Originally Posted by theboyjwo

That is one of the most unqualified statements I've ever read on this board.
I honestly dont' get why the majority of regulars on this board always seem to want to pigeon hole him and define his ceiling 20 something games into his first season. Get real!

If the Pacers end up with a physical post presence to put beside Hansbrough, he will be a double double machine due to his awareness, hustle, agressiveness, and ability to draw fouls and get to the line. That would put him in pretty good company in the league, and I would guess his scoring average might then be in the high teens with about 10 boards. Lofty, indeed!

However, if he does not end up paired with a physical post presence, he will not do nearly as well because of the ability of other teams to key on him until he develops a mid range jumper, which has not been his game very much.

[Peck]

Would someone please explain to me what Troy Murphy did on the floor tonight to merit playing 34 (almost 35) min. on the floor? If JOB had not given up the game at the end he certainly would have played 38 or 39 min.

[pacergod2]

Originally Posted by Peck

Would someone please explain to me what Troy Murphy did on the floor tonight to merit playing 34 (almost 35) min. on the floor? If JOB had not given up the game at the end he certainly would have played 38 or 39 min.

I wonder this myself every single night. I would love to see him only play 20 minutes a night. But our team is not good enough to have him only playing 20 minutes. I still think him playing 35+ minutes a night is atrocious for any team. I like Murphy, just not on our team. I think he is everything WE don't need in a PF... RIGHT NOW. He would be perfect in Orlando, Houston, Boston, Minnesota, or Philly.

[d_c]

Originally Posted by pacergod2

I think he is everything WE don't need in a PF... RIGHT NOW. He would be perfect in Orlando, Houston, Boston, Minnesota, or Philly.

Murphy will probably sign with Orlando for around $4M a year when his current deal is up. Right now, neither Orlando or Boston can afford his current contract, with the salaries they already have.

Murphy does nothing for teams like Minni or Philly who are tanking/rebuilding.

[Psycho T]

Originally Posted by McKeyFan

Well, you had to see it. He came off like he really did like him. Nothing like the Jax/Gerald Wallace comments.

It looked like he enjoyed playing against him.. Both guys were playing physical and Zach finally got him on two straight possessions.

[imawhat]

Originally Posted by Peck

Would someone please explain to me what Troy Murphy did on the floor tonight to merit playing 34 (almost 35) min. on the floor? If JOB had not given up the game at the end he certainly would have played 38 or 39 min.

He spreads the floor.

[kester99]

Same old stuff...unfortunately.

When TJ and Troy's offensive game is on, we hold our own or take a lead.

When TJ's out and Watson's in, we gain.

When TJ and Troy's shots don't fall, we're hosed. Dunleavy's influence can't extend to making them hit their shots. Maybe he increases the likelihood, because they get better opportunities within the flow of a moving offense, but if Troy's going to miss his 3s, and TJ's game is going to go cold....that's that.

It was nice to see Dahntay starting to return to form a bit. Maybe his 'lower back' is starting to feel better.

[Kemo]

Troy should really only shoot "trailing threes" in all honesty.

[D-BONE]

They pounded us on the boards, dominated us inside, and I'd replace pretty much anybody in our starting lineup with his counterpart from theirs. So I don't think our expectations could be that high going in outside of the Griz self destructing.

Add to that our long ball hoisting at 3/21 and the fact that they seemed to win all the loose ball scrums with the possible exception of our one spurt in the second quarter. Our top assist man at 3?

As poorly as we were playing I would have prefered to see a Hibbert-Hansbrough comobo getting extended run in the fourth qtr. I mean we had nothing to lose, outside of Roy fouling out, given Murphy's offense was MIA.

Speaking of RH, his fouling issues and sometimes related lack of minutes keep me from forming a more concrete opinion, but I'm just not as sold/optimistic as some here about him long-term. First, there is the whole foul magnet problem. Second is the rather slow gathering, jumping, finishing in traffic process. Third, his post moves need refinement and diversification. The last point being something that's more open to improvement. I just don't know that he can ever be a consistent starter.

[Unclebuck]

Originally Posted by Peck

Would someone please explain to me what Troy Murphy did on the floor tonight to merit playing 34 (almost 35) min. on the floor? If JOB had not given up the game at the end he certainly would have played 38 or 39 min.

He's just one shot away from hitting four straight. I'm sure that is what O'Brien is banking on. And really that makes some sense, lets not discuss Murphy, but if you have a good point shooter on your team and you are the coach, you never know when he is going to hit 4 straight, so you keep playing him thinking the next make will get him off.

[Brad8888]

Originally Posted by imawhat

He spreads the floor.

He spreads the floor in the area that he is shooting from at this point. Once it is apparent he is cold, defenses stay away from his area of the floor, leaving a large, spread out gap. Otherwise, defenses have to decide if they are going to have one of their players, regardless of who, stay within about two to three steps of him, so that when he receives a pass for his catch and shoot they can step in front of him and prevent a wide open shot.

His ability to spread the floor is difficult to put into words. It is an asset that, like the elusive "good will" that accountants use in valuations of businesses, is extremely difficult to quantify.

It (or possibly just shooting threes in general) may be a power like that of the one ring to rule them all was to Saruman, with O'B as Saruman.

[McKeyFan]

This team needs a lot more ying, and a bunch more yang.

[Anthem]

Originally Posted by Kemo

Troy should really only shoot "trailing threes" in all honesty.

I could go with that.

[Brad8888]

Originally Posted by D-BONE

Speaking of RH, his fouling issues and sometimes related lack of minutes keep me from forming a more concrete opinion, but I'm just not as sold/optimistic as some here about him long-term. First, there is the whole foul magnet problem. Second is the rather slow gathering, jumping, finishing in traffic process. Third, his post moves need refinement and diversification. The last point being something that's more open to improvement. I just don't know that he can ever be a consistent starter.

Hibbert continues to be in desperate need of a big man coach who understands footwork and positioning on both ends of the floor, as well as the value of verticality on defense. Hopefully Bird and Morway will get him one someday. Otherwise, he will continue to linger on the edge of effectiveness with glimpses of really good play, followed inevitably by stretches of ineptitude, which really stinks for such a good person as Roy who tries as hard as he does.

[Anthem]

Originally Posted by Naptown_Seth

In a bizarre twist TJ Ford went Mel Mel the Abuser in the first game Tinsley's ever played against the Pacers. Just when we thought we were out, he pulled us back in.

Dude, I'm not sure what's so odd about that. We've been seeing it since he got here. I became convinced last year that this is what Obie wants from a PG, just like Troy is what Obie wants from a PF.

[Anthem]

Originally Posted by GrangeRusHibbert

Randolph's production...

Tyler on court: 20 minutes, 4-8, 10 points
Tyler off court: 21 minutes, 7-12, 16 points

So basically Tyler defended Randolph no better than Murphy. Great.

I didn't watch the game, so maybe there were some great plays that I missed. I'm open to that. But those stats say that Tyler couldn't stop the guy any better than anyone else.

[McKeyFan]

Originally Posted by Anthem

So basically Tyler defended Randolph no better than Murphy. Great.

I didn't watch the game, so maybe there were some great plays that I missed. I'm open to that. But those stats say that Tyler couldn't stop the guy any better than anyone else.

They say to me that Tyler kept him from getting as many shots. Better defense.

[BlueNGold]

Originally Posted by McKeyFan

They say to me that Tyler kept him from getting as many shots. Better defense.

There was a significant difference.

Against Murph, Zach scored 60% more points shooting a better percentage in about the same amount of time.

It should be no surprise that with Tyler on the floor, we beat them by 7. With Murphy on the floor, we lost by 20. Huge, huge difference.

Give McBob and Solomon more seasoning, and we might start competing....because it's unbelievably clear we need more athleticism in the front court to stop a guy like Zach.

Gotta look in your toolbox Jim...