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Thread: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

  1. #51
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by Stryder View Post
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    Here is something new: http://powernationtv.com/post/fellow...lOrDt.facebook

    Embedded in the comments is the slow-mo video.around the 11 second mark, it seems like Ward jumped up and grabbed onto the car's wing. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1XvhrPu64Co
    Looks like it could be a last gasp at avoidance and trying to pull himself up and away from the tire. Dunno.

    Also in the 'dunno' category initially I read someone saying Tony had a GoPro camera mounted on the car. Later I read a comment saying Tony always has a GoPro camera mounted on the car. Then I read the police saying Tony told the police he didn't have a camera.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Just read that the investigators now have a 2nd video from another angle

    Edit: Here's the link:

    http://deadspin.com/investigators-ha...%28Deadspin%29

  3. #53

    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Anyone else think this is getting ugly ??

    http://espn.go.com/racing/nascar/sto...-kevin-ward-jr

    No charges have been filed against Stewart, but they are still possible.

    Ward Sr. also addressed that in his interview with the newspaper, saying: "The one person that knows what happened that night is possibly facing 10 years in prison. Is he going to say what he done?"

  4. #54
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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...nce-stephenson
    "But, first, let us now praise famous moments, because something happened Tuesday night in Indianapolis that you can watch a lifetimeís worth of professional basketball and never see again. There was a brief, and very decisive, and altogether unprecedented, outburst of genuine officiating, and it was directed at the best player in the world, and that, my dear young person, simply is not done."

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    I still maintain there will be no criminal charges, but Tony Stewart, the race track, and others are in for a world of hurt in the civil litigation world...

  7. #56
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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    If this somehow does go to some sort of trial. I doubt there would be any race car driver out there willing to testify as an expert witness against Tony Stewart. If you were a race car driver would you want your actions on the track in the middle of a race open for legal interpretation because of the ruling in this case? Slipper slopes!
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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  9. #57
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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by Stryder View Post
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    I still maintain there will be no criminal charges, but Tony Stewart, the race track, and others are in for a world of hurt in the civil litigation world...
    The burden of proof is going to be lower, but now that another driver has come out and said he thought Tony did everything he could to avoid hitting Ward, I still think Tony is found not guilty. Now the track on the other hand......
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

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  10. #58
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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by Stryder View Post
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    I still maintain there will be no criminal charges, but Tony Stewart, the race track, and others are in for a world of hurt in the civil litigation world...
    Stewart will get sued, no doubt. And he will settle for a number of reasons, not the least of which will be to not risk saying anything that would ultimately lead to criminal charges or simply be used for someone's agenda in the future. Doesn't matter what he'd say, someone could twist it for an agenda and the risk would far outweigh the reward IMO.

    I'm not sure about the track being sued. The most likely thing I could see the track sued for in this case, lighting, would go against the lawsuit against the bigger fish (Stewart). How could you sue Stewart for a wrongful death type charge and then sue the track saying the lighting wasn't sufficient for the safety of the competitors and track crew? You'd be admitting or arguing that Stewart couldn't see him which would be counter to any suit against Stewart. I can think of a couple of other angles for a lawsuit against the track but I think they'd be non-starters and not get past the motion phase considering Ward left his vehicle.

    What Stewart did and did not say immediately after the accident will determine criminal charges. How those line up with the videos will be important. As a hypothetical, if Stewart told investigators he didn't see Ward and a video shows him flipping him off as he approached Ward then everything else Stewart has said in his defense would go into an entirely different place. OTOH, if he says he didn't see him, was taken by surprise and quickly turned the wheel and instinctively blipped the throttle... and the video (or witnesses) have nothing to contradict that, then he's pretty much in the clear criminally. And there are several other scenarios that I can't see how anyone could dispute them if there's nothing on video to contradict it.

    But that said, I've seen plenty of people saying the drivers sign waivers so that overrides anything else.... or Stewart tried to intimidate him but he had no intent to hit him so without intent there can be no criminal charges. Anyone believing that is living in fantasyland. Intent is not necessary and the waivers can't override the law.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    For me I don't care how dumb this kid was for venturing on the track. There is no doubt that Tony made no effort to miss this kid. Regardless of intent, Tony Stewart hit Ward. Ward did not walk into the car.

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Although I just heard on the radio that Ward attempted to grab the fin of Stewart's car as Stewart was driving by. Maybe this isn't as cut and dry as I first thought. No matter what this is tragic.

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Cold View Post
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    Although I just heard on the radio that Ward attempted to grab the fin of Stewart's car as Stewart was driving by. Maybe this isn't as cut and dry as I first thought. No matter what this is tragic.
    It's far, far, far from cut and dried IMO. At least criminally. Civilly, I think it's cut and dried....
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Civilly, I think it's cut and dried....
    If the goal is to judge the kid for being a stupid idiot, I'd agree.

    Or maybe it's negligent of his parents for not having ever told him not to play in traffic.

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Cold View Post
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    Although I just heard on the radio that Ward attempted to grab the fin of Stewart's car as Stewart was driving by. Maybe this isn't as cut and dry as I first thought. No matter what this is tragic.
    I think grabbing at the fin might have been a last ditch effort to pull himself up and avoid the wheel once he realized he was in a bad spot. Angry or not, it doesn't make any kind of sense that someone would try to grab onto a car that is doing 30 MPH or more.

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by presto123 View Post
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    I think grabbing at the fin might have been a last ditch effort to pull himself up and avoid the wheel once he realized he was in a bad spot. Angry or not, it doesn't make any kind of sense that someone would try to grab onto a car that is doing 30 MPH or more.
    it makes as much sense as walking out on the track and challenging a man in a 900hp race car that can't steer worth a crap.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    it makes as much sense as walking out on the track and challenging a man in a 900hp race car that can't steer worth a crap.

    I've seen drivers walk onto a track to challenge other drivers before(Tony Stewart even), but I've never seen a driver try to grab onto a car as it's going by. Sure it's more dangerous to walk out there on a dirt track with these cars, but it's not unheard of as far as drivers walking onto a track.
    Last edited by presto123; 08-14-2014 at 01:59 PM.

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by presto123 View Post
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    .............but it's not unheard of as far as drivers walking onto a track.
    True. But it doesn't remove stupidity or ignorance from the equation. This one ended ugly. All the other drivers that walked on the track to confront another driver could have had the same thing happen to them.

    If the unfortunate chain of events starts somewhere, I'll say it started with the kid walking away from his wreck and towards Tony's car. The accident itself is common. It's part of "that's racin' ". Flipping off another driver as he goes by or a similar action - yeah - that's OK, that's normal enough.

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerDude View Post
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    True. But it doesn't remove stupidity or ignorance from the equation. This one ended ugly. All the other drivers that walked on the track to confront another driver could have had the same thing happen to them.

    If the unfortunate chain of events starts somewhere, I'll say it started with the kid walking away from his wreck and towards Tony's car. The accident itself is common. It's part of "that's racin' ". Flipping off another driver as he goes by or a similar action - yeah - that's OK, that's normal enough.

    Didn't say it removed any stupidity. My original post was just trying to rationalize why it looked like Ward was trying to grab the fin in the slow motion video. I said it was because it was a last ditch effort to avoid the wheel. My point is that grabbing onto a race car as it is moving is not a common thing compared to walking on a track.

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  21. #68
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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by presto123 View Post
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    I think grabbing at the fin might have been a last ditch effort to pull himself up and avoid the wheel once he realized he was in a bad spot. Angry or not, it doesn't make any kind of sense that someone would try to grab onto a car that is doing 30 MPH or more.
    No way in hell. The RR tire sticks out too far, it's too tall and the wing is down too far. Maybe he was hella pissed. Who knows for sure.
    http://www.grantland.com/blog/the-tr...nce-stephenson
    "But, first, let us now praise famous moments, because something happened Tuesday night in Indianapolis that you can watch a lifetimeís worth of professional basketball and never see again. There was a brief, and very decisive, and altogether unprecedented, outburst of genuine officiating, and it was directed at the best player in the world, and that, my dear young person, simply is not done."

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by DaveP63 View Post
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    No way in hell. The RR tire sticks out too far, it's too tall and the wing is down too far. Maybe he was hella pissed. Who knows for sure.
    Contradicting yourself there. You are right the second time. Nobody knows for sure at this point. So the no way in hell is a useless comment. Especially in circumstances where people might panic.

  23. #70
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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    If this somehow does go to some sort of trial. I doubt there would be any race car driver out there willing to testify as an expert witness against Tony Stewart. If you were a race car driver would you want your actions on the track in the middle of a race open for legal interpretation because of the ruling in this case? Slipper slopes!
    Oh... there would be a line a mile long of race car drivers (former and current), as well as other vehicle experts, willing to testify against Stewart. You and I may never have heard of them, but there will be plenty willing to take some money from the prosecution to make a case against Stewart. Which is not to say you won't have plenty willing to argue for him as well for the defense. Money talks... as does fame. Even 15 minutes of fame. There would be no problem finding 'experts' to make whatever conclusion the person hiring them needs them to make in a case like this.

    Like I said, there's no doubt in my mind Tony will be paying handsomely on the civil side of things. It's such a no-brainer that I wouldn't even be surprised if Tony's attorney mad the first overture with an offer before the suit is even filed. With the question marks as they are, the risks of a civil trial and what that info could mean to a potential criminal trial, PR damage, let alone the lower threshold of "a preponderance of the evidence" in a civil trial it all just makes this a total slam dunk for some attorney taking up Ward's cause.

    IMO...
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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  24. #71

    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    I can drive better than all these fools. NASCAR is a joke

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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by LeRyan07 View Post
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    I can drive better than all these fools. NASCAR is a joke
    Strap into a sprint car on a dirt track and lets see about that....
    "Nobody wants to play against Tyler Hansbrough NO BODY!" ~ Frank Vogel

    "And David put his hand in the bag and took out a stone and slung it. And it struck the Philistine on the head and he fell to the ground. Amen. "
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  27. #73
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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Quote Originally Posted by LeRyan07 View Post
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    I can drive better than all these fools. NASCAR is a joke
    That is an idiotic thing to say. And you are full of them.

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  29. #74
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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    I doubt you can drive better than the Nascar drivers.... but Nascar is a joke!
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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  31. #75
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    Default Re: Tony Stewart kills another driver (Kevin Ward jr.) with his car. Police involved

    Investigation is complete and prosecutor has the work product of the investigation. A decision to be made next week apparently on whether there will be charges or not....

    http://www.wthr.com/story/26510158/2...crash-complete

    CANANDAIGUA, N.Y. -
    An upstate New York sheriff says he has completed his investigation into the death of a driver struck by NASCAR champion Tony Stewart during a sprint car race last month. The district attorney will announce late next week whether Stewart will face any charges.

    Ontario County Sheriff Philip Povero said Thursday he has submitted the investigation, including enhanced video, to prosecutors for review. The statement said neither Povero nor District Attorney R. Michael Tantillo would comment further.

    Stewart's car struck and killed 20-year-old Kevin Ward Jr. on the dirt track at Canandaigua Motorsports Park on Aug. 9. Ward had climbed out of his car and walked onto the track to confront Stewart after he spun out while racing alongside the three-time NASCAR champion.
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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    "A player who makes a team great is more valuable than a great player. Losing yourself in the group, for the good of the group, thatís teamwork."

    -John Wooden

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