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Thread: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

  1. #51
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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by sav View Post
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    What makes you think GHill and CJ Miles will be our starting back court? Rodney Stuckey was the starting PG in Detroit for several years. We could just as easily have a starting back court of Stuckey and GHill.
    Their salaries. The Pacers threw some cash at CJ Miles. I think they clearly are looking for a perimeter threat to add to the starting lineup...to help Roy Hibbert of course. I just disagree that he will come in and shoot 38-39% as a starter on a contender. He has never played more than 25 minutes a game and only played 19 minutes a game last year. He was only a full time starter in 2008. Since that time, he has come off the bench and averaged under 20mpg. He did start in 34 games last year as a starter and went down to an injury after 51 games. All I am saying is that his resume' is that of a journeyman backup. I know people want him to come in and be the savior but I don't think that's what we will see.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite MAN_force View Post
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    If this is true, it seems to put more of the blame on Vogel and his ability to adjust. I hope this is an area where he can grow as a coach.
    Ding, ding, DING! Frank has issues but Roy needs to shoulder his woes on his own. He's mentally and physically soft with a side of casperisim. When he's good he's good but when he'd bad, well you know. He is what he is, at this point I just don't see him changing all that much

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  5. #53
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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Their salaries. The Pacers threw some cash at CJ Miles.
    I agree the Pacers paid Miles more, but 4.5 million per year is usually not a starter's salary. Barring any more moves, I think the 5th starting spot is pretty much up for grabs between, Miles, Stuckey and maybe even Solo.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by sav View Post
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    I agree the Pacers paid Miles more, but 4.5 million per year is usually not a starter's salary. Barring any more moves, I think the 5th starting spot is pretty much up for grabs between, Miles, Stuckey and maybe even Solo.
    Agreed. We might find that Stuckey is the better starter with George Hill playing SG. Also, as you say, we could see Solo starting and we can only hope he has mastered the 3. He would be a huge relief to Paul George on the wing!

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  8. #55

    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Agreed. We might find that Stuckey is the better starter with George Hill playing SG. Also, as you say, we could see Solo starting and we can only hope he has mastered the 3. He would be a huge relief to Paul George on the wing!
    Solo did work with a shooting coach that many other NBA players have worked with, so there is that. Though a Stuckey/Hill/George/West/Hibbert line-up would be interesting for sure... Though I think I prefer Miles starting for his range.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    I will repeat myself only once. Shoot while playing on a contender against stout defense.
    I just don't understand the reasoning, if anything, a spot up shooter should have an easier time playing on a contender because better talent helps create more shot opportunities. Miles doing it on a bad team is more impressive.

    This isn't a guy who was dominating the ball and scoring because nobody else on the team could, he's just a role player who performed his role extremely well.
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  11. #57

    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite MAN_force View Post
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    I just don't understand the reasoning, if anything, a spot up shooter should have an easier time playing on a contender because better talent helps create more shot opportunities. Miles doing it on a bad team is more impressive.

    This isn't a guy who was dominating the ball and scoring because nobody else on the team could, he's just a role player who performed his role extremely well.
    Not only would having more talent help a role player like you said, Allen was playing with LeBron James, there isn't a better talent anywhere in the world than him, he instantly makes his team mates better.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by Infinite MAN_force View Post
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    I just don't understand the reasoning, if anything, a spot up shooter should have an easier time playing on a contender because better talent helps create more shot opportunities. Miles doing it on a bad team is more impressive.

    This isn't a guy who was dominating the ball and scoring because nobody else on the team could, he's just a role player who performed his role extremely well.
    This may sound silly, but I feel some teams play down to their competition throughout the season. For example, the Bucks. Do you honestly believe every team put 100% effort every time they played them?

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by Kstat View Post
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    They started out the season 33-7. Nobody was pointing out flaws in the structure of the roster then. Let's not revise history and pretend that the team badly needed a role playing floor spacer instead of the league leader in triple doubles and they would have been fine. A lot of guys quit, for whatever reason. Obviously Lance played a role in the downfall of team chemistry, but how he functioned as a player was not really a factor as much as the other players rolling their eyes and pouting over it.
    Paul George and Lance Stephenson were playing out of their minds before the all star break, though. Lance especially started off very hot from 3. So part of the reason that we were playing so well in the beginning of the season was that we had Lance's ballhandling along with good floor spacing.

    I'm not going to get into the chemistry aspect of it, but in the first half of the season we had three guys playing like all stars (PG, Lance, Hibbert). Post all star break we had 1 borderline all-star level player and nobody on the team was shooting as well.
    My prediction: Solomon Hill is going to lead the team in Surprisingly Good Plays for the year. -10/29/2014

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by pogi View Post
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    This may sound silly, but I feel some teams play down to their competition throughout the season. For example, the Bucks. Do you honestly believe every team put 100% effort every time they played them?
    Yes, it's an 82 game season. Just think back a few years when Mike Dunleavy and Troy Murphy used to launch 3's for the lowly Pacers hitting close to 40%. If you recall, teams would clamp down in the 4th quarter and things would quickly fall apart. The fact is, teams were playing down to us 75% of the time on a regular basis, inflating the heck out of our offensive numbers.

    No offense to the players. They simply cannot be up AND focused for so many games so they will take a night off against bad teams. But you can bet that Miami got some of the best efforts because otherwise teams could get embarrassed and guys have pride in their game.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueCollarColts View Post
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    How was our defense "figured out"? It remained one of the best defenses through-out the season.
    You serious? The key cog to the entire defense was benched in several important games, specifically because he was worse than useless, he was actually detrimental. I don't know why I'm even explaining this, but there's something called a stretch 4 or 5. You force Hibbert to cover that guy and the defense falls apart, because he is incapable of guarding anyone outside of the paint, and he's far too slow to recover once he's out there. That's it in a nutshell; any team with perimeter bigs can do it, and most of them will until the Pacers prove they can adjust (which would require some strategic growth on Vogel's part). Toward the end of last season, Phoenix, Atlanta and Miami tore the Pacers defense up with ease. Teague said they provided the blueprint, but really they just rode Phoenix's coattails.

  18. #62

    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by 3rdStrike View Post
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    You serious? The key cog to the entire defense was benched in several important games, specifically because he was worse than useless, he was actually detrimental. I don't know why I'm even explaining this, but there's something called a stretch 4 or 5. You force Hibbert to cover that guy and the defense falls apart, because he is incapable of guarding anyone outside of the paint, and he's far too slow to recover once he's out there. That's it in a nutshell; any team with perimeter bigs can do it, and most of them will until the Pacers prove they can adjust (which would require some strategic growth on Vogel's part). Toward the end of last season, Phoenix, Atlanta and Miami tore the Pacers defense up with ease. Teague said they provided the blueprint, but really they just rode Phoenix's coattails.
    What perimeter big killed Hibbert other than Bosh in like one game?

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  20. #63

    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Yes, it's an 82 game season. Just think back a few years when Mike Dunleavy and Troy Murphy used to launch 3's for the lowly Pacers hitting close to 40%. If you recall, teams would clamp down in the 4th quarter and things would quickly fall apart. The fact is, teams were playing down to us 75% of the time on a regular basis, inflating the heck out of our offensive numbers.

    No offense to the players. They simply cannot be up AND focused for so many games so they will take a night off against bad teams. But you can bet that Miami got some of the best efforts because otherwise teams could get embarrassed and guys have pride in their game.
    Ok I understand that, but on the flip side, wouldn't playing with LeBron also make Allen look better than he is? Similar to how you are saying bad teams make Miles look better than he is?

  21. #64

    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    What's Kareem going to teach Roy in 3-4 days that he couldn't learn from Walton or Tim Duncan?

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Shoot while playing on a contender against stout defense. Ray Allen shot over 40% from 3, 3 of the last 4 years...on great teams where the pressure was on. He's also no slouch on defense and he's good around the basket. His usage was low in Miami because of their roster but at 38 he is still better than prime CJ Miles.
    Not sure about the pressure was on part, he should have had a bunch of easy shots with all the guys that got attention on that team and how they were able to draw in defenders... I would think he had less pressure than most on him, especially when Miami was blowing people out.
    Why so SERIOUS

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    What's Kareem going to teach Roy in 3-4 days that he couldn't learn from Walton or Tim Duncan?
    I would hope it's more then 3 or 4 days. If Roy wants to work hard to improve his game then I think he's capable of it.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
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    I would hope it's more then 3 or 4 days. If Roy wants to work hard to improve his game then I think he's capable of it.
    You think the amount of time working with Kareem is solely up to Roy and when he decides not to work hard any more?
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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    What's Kareem going to teach Roy in 3-4 days that he couldn't learn from Walton or Tim Duncan?
    How do you know it's 4 days? Kareem worked with Bynum for 5 years.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    You think the amount of time working with Kareem is solely up to Roy and when he decides not to work hard any more?
    Maybe. Kareem quit working with Bynum because Bynum wasn't working hard enough.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by freddielewis14 View Post
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    Maybe. Kareem quit working with Bynum because Bynum wasn't working hard enough.
    Umm... OK. Little early to me not only to be making a prediction of how the workouts will end but to be determining the reason is yet another fault of Roy's, but whatever.
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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
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    Umm... OK. Little early to me not only to be making a prediction of how the workouts will end but to be determining the reason is yet another fault of Roy's, but whatever.
    Ha, nobody blamed Roy for anything. The quote you commented on said "Roy is capable of it." I don't think anyone questions Roy's willingness to work hard in the off-season.

    You questioned if how long Kareem worked with Roy depended on Roy. I hope it does because I think that means Kareem will be here longer.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by freddielewis14 View Post
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    How do you know it's 4 days? Kareem worked with Bynum for 5 years.
    It was LA. Bynum was a Laker, and Kareem a Laker alum. Plus, I would imagine the Lakers had a lot more money to throw at him.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by Tom White View Post
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    It was LA. Bynum was a Laker, and Kareem a Laker alum. Plus, I would imagine the Lakers had a lot more money to throw at him.
    I'm not saying Kareem will be here for 5 years, just how do we know it's less than a week?

    Also, Kareem has an interest in this now. His development skills will be on display. Seems he would take that more seriously than working with Roy for only 40 hours.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Aminu for that price is a very good signing by the Mavericks in my opinion.

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    Default Re: Lets talk about Roy Hibbert

    Quote Originally Posted by PR07 View Post
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    Aminu for that price is a very good signing by the Mavericks in my opinion.
    Maybe. While I realize it wasn't for a ton of money, I can't help but think Aminu is destined to be one of those guys who fills the end of bench's for teams then quietly fades away. I mean, with all the injuries New Orleans had last year you would think he would make more of an imprint if he had anything to give but it just never happened.

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