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Thread: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

  1. #51
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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by McKeyFan View Post
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    This is close, but in my opinion not exactly right.

    Lance left because he wanted to play better basketball on the offensive end. I think he has a solid chance to do so with Charlotte.

    He will be able to pass to Jefferson in the post, and he will be working with another playmaker in Kemba Walker. In Indiana, he had two laughable centers to pass to, his point guard wasn't very good at being a point guard, and the main go-to guy (Paul George) is not very efficient as the key scorer. Because of contracts, that wasn't going to change. Then you have the head scratchingly bad offensive coaching we've watched from Vogel the past several years.

    Because of his two five year offers from the Pacers Lance was going to be chained to that dreadful offensive system for a long time. (I don't believe this supposed three year offer. Dal9 pretty much exposed this article as attempted damage control. But even if true, it's still a few more years of exasperating offense.)

    I don't think it's all that hard to figure out. At his press conference, I thought Lance looked pretty darn excited about playing some real offense.
    And in spite of all those issues we somehow lucked into back to back ECF. Luckiest team in league history with these types of personnel issues.

    Edit: I do believe Lance thought he would be in a better position for his skills elsewhere however.

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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    I honestly think that Lance wanted to leave and in his mind get to a team where he could be the man. I don't think that's going to happen in Charlotte, in fact I think he's going to create an implosion and prove that Larry was right about this being the best environment for him. After this happens I doubt if Lance ever gets an offer as generous as what Larry put on the table. With the way Lance left this team after the offer Larry put on the table I can't understand why so many want to excuse what he did. How many thought if the offer was close that Lance would stay? Lance does not care about the Pacers.
    Beyond that I simply think that Lance isn't very smart. He has to trust his agent to lead him in the right direction and he's not smart enough to look at the big picture of what he was giving up. The year one contract difference was probably what Lance was looking at more then the overall package.

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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    The funny thing about people thinking lance will see a better offense in Charlotte is that Charlotte was one of the few teams that had a worse offense than the pacers.
    My prediction: Solomon Hill is going to lead the team in Surprisingly Good Plays for the year. -10/29/2014

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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    As I assumed, Alberto Ebanks probably can't be trusted. And if you don't think that he wasn't acting under Lance's direction well that's pretty goofy. Lance never intended to come back. That is clear as day. Took less money on a worse team. He'll regret this decision. Hope he doesn't for his sake, but I think he will

    He decided he would rather be some other team's back-up, back-up plan instead of our option A this offseason. If I was Bird I would be beyond pissed.
    Last edited by Trader Joe; 07-20-2014 at 09:26 PM.

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  9. #55
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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
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    I honestly think that Lance wanted to leave and in his mind get to a team where he could be the man. I don't think that's going to happen in Charlotte, in fact I think he's going to create an implosion and prove that Larry was right about this being the best environment for him. After this happens I doubt if Lance ever gets an offer as generous as what Larry put on the table. With the way Lance left this team after the offer Larry put on the table I can't understand why so many want to excuse what he did. How many thought if the offer was close that Lance would stay? Lance does not care about the Pacers.
    Beyond that I simply think that Lance isn't very smart. He has to trust his agent to lead him in the right direction and he's not smart enough to look at the big picture of what he was giving up. The year one contract difference was probably what Lance was looking at more then the overall package.
    I couldn't agree more. Lance mad a huge mistake. How will his new teammates take his ego and attitude? He was here since day 1 so he kind of grew on people. Book it now - this will be one of the biggest mistakes of his career and we'll hear Lance admit to it 10 years later (like Artest did)
    "So, which one of you guys is going to come in second?" - Larry Bird before the 3 point contest. He won.



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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by aamcguy View Post
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    The funny thing about people thinking lance will see a better offense in Charlotte is that Charlotte was one of the few teams that had a worse offense than the pacers.
    Yes, this concept is laughable. They have zero shooters and will be predictable and super easy to defend by collapsing. I also think they will miss Mcbob's passing game, I expect them to be really bad offensively, actually.
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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by Natston View Post
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    The thing that I keep coming back to is that it would have been in his agent's best interest for Lance to take the Pacers offer. Maybe he will still be Lance's agent in two or three years when the new contract is up but still...
    Yeah this is the main point. Alberto Ebanks would have gotten himself a fatter commission now. This was Lance's decision. Ebanks just spun it afterward into "The Pacers didn't want to do what we wanted"

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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerPenguins View Post
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    Lance wanted to be the star on the team.
    Well then he picked the wrong team.

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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    There is no way to compare the highs and lows of each player because Lance (nor any of the other players for that matter) have had the lows that Roy has produced. Not one time since he has been a starter has Lance had a game like game 3 vs. Atlanta that Roy had.

    I know this, we've won games in particular playoff games, in spite of Roy at times. We've won because of him as well to be fair but nobody has the highs and lows he does.

    So his high's and low's by all rights should balance out to a more modest contract, however again I know that is not the way of the NBA. Big's get paid.
    The point is players who are that important to a team being a successful team tend to get paid more than players whose play has relatively little affect on the team.


    As far as Roy's down's go. While Roy's play at the end of this season was epic in how bad it was, to this point it is the exception with Roy while playing for Vogel. Until proven otherwise that is how I am treating it. I do not consider what was going on at the beginning of 12-13 as relevant as it was caused by an injury.

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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    As I assumed, Alberto Ebanks probably can't be trusted. And if you don't think that he wasn't acting under Lance's direction well that's pretty goofy. Lance never intended to come back. That is clear as day. Took less money on a worse team. He'll regret this decision. Hope he doesn't for his sake, but I think he will

    He decided he would rather be some other team's back-up, back-up plan instead of our option A this offseason. If I was Bird I would be beyond pissed.
    Honestly, he probably did Bird a favor.

  17. #61

    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Lance left because he wasn't fitting in, in the locker room. I think it's quite obvious that Hill, PG24, and Hibbert weren't seeing eye to eye with him. He also has a heck of an ego and wants to be the ball dominant star and he won't be that with us.
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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by P_George View Post
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    Lance left because he wasn't fitting in, in the locker room. I think it's quite obvious that Hill, PG24, and Hibbert weren't seeing eye to eye with him. He also has a heck of an ego and wants to be the ball dominant star and he won't be that with us.
    I am not sure how it was that obvious. I personally feel his teammates wanted him back.

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  20. #63

    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    I wouldn't be surprised if Lance has been offered or is under the impression that Jordan will give him a shoe deal to supplement his salary.

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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by eldubious View Post
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    I wouldn't be surprised if Lance has been offered or is under the impression that Jordan will give him a shoe deal to supplement his salary.
    He would truly be an idiot if this were true (I'm sure it's not)
    "So, which one of you guys is going to come in second?" - Larry Bird before the 3 point contest. He won.



  23. #65

    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    I don't know if he wanted to be the star he chose the Hornets he won't be the star.

    I could see him wanting to leave so people would stop blaming him for the Pacers woes and if the Pacers falter without Lance then we know he's not to blame (mostly)

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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by joew8302 View Post
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    I am not sure how it was that obvious. I personally feel his teammates wanted him back.
    I'm not sure whether or not his teammates wanted him back or not, but I always felt that the trio of George Hill, Paul George, and Roy Hibbert were really close to one another.

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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
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    As I assumed, Alberto Ebanks probably can't be trusted. And if you don't think that he wasn't acting under Lance's direction well that's pretty goofy. Lance never intended to come back. That is clear as day. Took less money on a worse team. He'll regret this decision. Hope he doesn't for his sake, but I think he will

    He decided he would rather be some other team's back-up, back-up plan instead of our option A this offseason. If I was Bird I would be beyond pissed.

    I really, really don't believe that.

    While Lance was meeting with Charlotte in Vegas, Simon was quoted saying "We made him a wonderful offer and they didn't think it was enough...so it's as simple as that".

    It was simple in Simon's mind. That offer was off the table because the up-to-the-minute belief was that Lance wanted more money. He took less.

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  29. #68
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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Meh whatever. This is a past Pacers problem now. Lets deal with current and future Pacers problems.
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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by Eleazar View Post
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    The point is players who are that important to a team being a successful team tend to get paid more than players whose play has relatively little affect on the team.


    As far as Roy's down's go. While Roy's play at the end of this season was epic in how bad it was, to this point it is the exception with Roy while playing for Vogel. Until proven otherwise that is how I am treating it. I do not consider what was going on at the beginning of 12-13 as relevant as it was caused by an injury.
    Roy's weaknesses have been exposed. That's what happened in the playoffs and there is nothing he's going to be able to do to change that. Teams now know how they must play the Pacers to beat them. We will try to adapt and will be good enough to still beat many teams, but Roy's always going to be up and down because his game has a fatal flaw. He cannot guard the stretch 5 and stay effective on defense. He never has been that effective on offense.

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  33. #70
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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Not that I'm terribly torn up over it... but the entire scenario smacks of stupidity on the part of Lance's party. The contract he signed is just asinine. He turned town a better offer, with a team that is better, and an organization that has done nothing but guide and keep him on a good path. Not a single ounce of it makes any sense. Now he's absolutely forced to perform at 125% capacity, on a team that will be harder to display his talents on, with way less guaranteed, and nowhere near the support structure around him that he had in place. Dumb, dumb, dumb.

    Not been a good couple of months for Sir Lancelot. All the ear-blowing and bullsh*t knocked down his market value, and then when he was presented with a group of contract scenarios, he didn't choose the right one. Which makes it hard not to think we probably are good moving forward without him. You gotta get people in place around you who don't make these kinds of stupid life decisions. It's unfortunate, but you just gotta cut the fat sometimes.
    Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 07-20-2014 at 10:43 PM.
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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by BornReady View Post
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    Meh whatever. This is a past Pacers problem now. Lets deal with current and future Pacers problems.
    no more problems. problems all gone.


    no money, no problems. like the man said, right?

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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    I am sure Lance wasn't happy with the offer and thinks he will be able to cash in big-time in a few years. He's also comparing himself to other Pacer players and his production vs. theirs. He clearly produced more than everyone on the team except possibly Paul George. So, he definitely expected an 8 figure offer from the Pacers.

    So I think it was either: 1) He was offended and took another offer to spite the Pacers or 2) He wanted to leave because of the same reasons his team mates wanted him gone: chemistry. It might have been a combination.

    I have not heard of anyone on the team upset about him being gone. Have there been any reports of that?

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  39. #73

    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by BlueNGold View Post
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    Roy's weaknesses have been exposed. That's what happened in the playoffs and there is nothing he's going to be able to do to change that. Teams now know how they must play the Pacers to beat them. We will try to adapt and will be good enough to still beat many teams, but Roy's always going to be up and down because his game has a fatal flaw. He cannot guard the stretch 5 and stay effective on defense. He never has been that effective on offense.
    But the thing is, stretch 5's can't guard him. So what The Pacers need to do and what Roy needs to do is two fold. Number one, figure out a way to hide this issue on defense. Number two, figure out a way to punish teams for playing their stretch five. Roy was playing too poorly to do the second, and really to do the first.

    Honestly, I think Roy's collapse has far more to do with Roy's collapse than it has to do with the rest of the league. Dwight Howard can't guard stretch 5's either, but he makes teams pay for playing that way.

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  41. #74

    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    I'm not believing any of this when Kravitz doesn't know that you can't have opt out more than a year before the contract expires. He made that up. What else did he make up? The family remark was also entirely inappropriate and unprofessional. Kravitz is trash.

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    Default Re: Larry Bird stunned Lance left

    Quote Originally Posted by imawhat View Post
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    I really, really don't believe that.

    While Lance was meeting with Charlotte in Vegas, Simon was quoted saying "We made him a wonderful offer and they didn't think it was enough...so it's as simple as that".

    It was simple in Simon's mind. That offer was off the table because the up-to-the-minute belief was that Lance wanted more money. He took less.
    It wasn't enough to get Lance to commit 5 years. That's all that means.

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