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Thread: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

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    Administrator Peck's Avatar
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    Default Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    The one statistic I want to focus on is simply this.

    14-15

    LeBron James shot 15 free throws, he hit 14 of them, we won by 1.

    I only take great joy in this because had the referee’s not given LeBron 10 first half free throws we would have had a lead going into the half.

    I will give the Pacers credit for this, even though the referee’s set the tone very early in the game on how they were going to allow us to guard LeBron we kept at him the entire game and every player on the floor made it so that he never had a free look or a free pass to the lane.

    Thank God for the instant replay because prior to this I can assure you that both of our brutes (sarcasm) Mahinmi & Scola would have had flagrant fouls and Scola would possibly have been given a flagrant 2. But technology triumphed over anticipated whistles in this one.

    The referee’s cleaned up their act a little bit in the second half (although David Jones apparently receives his instructions from Heat players as was witnessed in the Lance Stephenson fiasco). But I’m telling you that first half was so bad that I am going to break my normal rule about blaming the referee’s and say that we were playing 8 on 5 for the first 24 minutes. But since they did a decent job in the second half I’ll just let it go.

    Normally I use this space to pay our respect to our foes however I will forgo that tradition tonight because I honestly have no respect for them.

    Yes LeBron is great and yes Wade used to be great and is still very talented but their pre and post game comments are childish and the fact that they depend on officiating to play their game just makes me have zero respect for them. I acknowledge the talent but that is all.

    Moving on.

    We can’t lie, it was a huge win. Because I can assure you had they come out here and laid an egg and gotten blown out we all would have been lining up to jump off of the bank one building downtown. But they didn’t lay an egg and whether they won by one or by fifty one it was still a win.

    A huge colossal giant win against a team that had every bit as much to lose as we did.

    Now of course if we go to Washington and get smoked it will hurt but this win gave us some cushion and some breathing room as we have a three game lead but in reality it’s a four game lead because we own all of the tie breakers.

    Why did we win? Well first and foremost our defense may have been as good tonight as its been at any point in time this season and this is without a single player on our team blocking a shot. We actually got up 20 more shots than they did and it wasn’t because of offensive rebounds alone. We did out battle them 11-5 on the offensive glass but that was only part of it. We force 18 turnovers and only had 10 ourselves which for us has to be one of the lowest totals of the year.

    But on offense there was a very real and concerted effort to move and advance the ball. Yes we went to Roy early and he went nuts but if you watch that starting unit started passing the ball to each other early in the first. I don’t know at what point it occurred but there was a very specific play where Lance had an open three point shot from the top of the three point line and nobody really could have faulted him for taking it instead he passed to a wide open Paul George who had a wide open 3 pointer from closer in the corner. George sunk the three and we were off. Paul later hit Lance for an open 3 of his own so at the very least maybe they understand to beat the Heat (or anyone for that matter) they have to find a way to move the ball for a better shot.

    Just so that we don’t blow over any negatives I do want to say this, our bench once again failed to produce against the Heat in any meaningful way. We had a whopping 10 points from our bench and Evan Turner had 8 of them. He had 4 of his 8 while playing with the starters so our bench produced 6 points when together on the floor.

    I know we are not supposed to get to up or to down after a win or loss but I am just going to reiterate what I said above, this was big.

    This game has been analyzed to death by everyone so there is no need for me to keep beating on this so let’s just give some grades.

    Paul George: A

    Once again went toe to toe with the best player in the world and did not get abused. The fact that the referee’s were calling it tight in the first half in regard to James was troubling but Paul never backed down from the challenge and flat stole the ball straight up from James was just joyous to watch. I’m still trying to figure out though why when Paul made that monster jam that wasn’t an and 1, I can assure you had that been the other way it would have. But if nothing else we got some competitive fire from Paul tonight and that is really what I’ve wanted to see for awhile.

    David West: B+

    That three was huge, that’s really not a big enough word for it. It won the game that is for certain. However even though he did a good job on the glass and made some excellent passes and hit all 6 of his free throw attempts the reason I’m giving him this grade is that he has got to start hitting his damned shots at a higher %. Between him and Scola I am wondering if we wouldn’t have a better chance of Dale Davis and Jeff Foster hitting their shots. He also botched up a couple of plays by not taking it up immediately for the shot. But don’t be confused, he had a great overall game.

    Roy Hibbert: A+

    Here is the thing about Roy. On the one hand he is one of the softest players in the league. He strikes physical fear into no one. However on the other hand this guy might be one of the toughest players ever. This guy gets hammered over and over by James who is a big physical player and Roy steps up to take it every single time and never backs away. Everybody saw the jaw blow but did everybody see later in the 4th the elbow to his sternum? I’m not sure which would hurt more. I hate the fact that he can’t grab 12 rebounds every game or that his offense comes and goes with the tides but I will say this. Night and night out he will put his body on the line and take a beating, now if we could just teach him to give one.

    Lance Stephenson: A

    I know I’m in the minority here but I’m glad that Lance doesn’t like or bow to the Heat. He bothers them, he really truly gets under their skins and I love it. I fail to see how him yelling “what” at Wade was any more of a taunt than earlier in the game when James drew a foul on him and followed Lance around showing him the and 1 sign. Also let’s not forget that first “T” was total B.S. as Wade pushed him. Was it dumb? Probably but I don’t care all that much, no other team in the NBA would have gotten that to be a “T” but the Heat are such drama queens that they literally were able to convince Jones to call a “T” while they had him surrounded. Now here is the part that bothers me about that. Jones did not have a clear view of everything and Monty McCutchen was looking right at Lance and never raised an arm or blew a whistle, this was manipulation pure and simple. Credit to the Heat for having the refs on a string like that though, sure as hell must be nice.

    George Hill: C

    Was there a single person really surprised by those misses? George can and has hit clutch huge game saving/winning three point shots, mid range jumpers and even layups but the guy simply put is the least clutch free throw shooter on our team. I honestly would have rather had any other single player on the floor get the ball in that instance. Other than that he just kind of took up space most of the night however while he didn’t get many assists he did do a good job of keeping the ball moving.


    Evan Turner: C+

    Made up for horrible first half play by being a big time player in the 4th filling in for Lance. He hit 2 shots and got a solid board to help secure the win. He obviously plays better when he has better talent around him. Still not sure if he fits in the long run but at least for this game he did finally contribute.

    Ian Mahinmi: C

    Did a decent job of attacking the offensive glass. Gave a good foul to LeBron, which Bosh later said was a cloths line. I never really expect offense out of him and I wasn’t disappointed.

    Donald Sloan: D

    Out of his league to play in a game like this. Did C.J. Watson break his femur or something? My God this guy has been gone forever. We really need to get him back

    Luis Scola: D-

    The only thing saving him from an F is the fact that he popped James in the nose. Other than that he fed all of us that old Spinal Tap album called Shark sandwich or it’s more popular name **** sandwich. It might be time to give LaVoy Allen a few min. a game.

    We still have a horribly tough few games to get through here with the Spurs and the Thunder coming to town (the Wizards won’t be easy by any means either) but if we can just match the Heat the rest of the way or even stay close we have a very good chance to wrap up the first seed and that last Heat game won’t matter.

    But let’s hope for more than that, let’s hope that this was the game that turned around the season. When I came back I said that we would have a couple of bad games before this game and that this potentially could wake us up, well the thing I got wrong was that I didn’t think we would beat the Bulls here. I had that backwards but let’s hope I’m right about the rest.

    If we can build on this then we will be far better off going into the post season than backing in.

    Also on a side note, in today’s game article by the Star Candace Buckner addresses the loss of Danny Granger as a leadership voice in the locker room. I know we were all wondering about that. Looks like there was something to it and I just hope that we can now overcome it.

    Enough sullen talk, we won. We beat the Heat and I think this deserves some form of Rock Anthem.

    Last edited by Peck; 03-27-2014 at 03:02 AM.


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    Honorary Area 55'er TMJ31's Avatar
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Thanks Peck, I can go to bed now


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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Now of course if we go to Washington and get smoked it will hurt but this win gave us some cushion and some breathing room as we have a three game lead but in reality it’s a four game lead because we own all of the tie breakers.
    This time of year the rule of thumb is look at the loss column to see where your team stands. The Heat have two more loses then we do, so if we would both win out we would win by two games. Thus that's our actual lead until something changes in the loss column.

    We lead 2-1 in head to head games, so if they win at their place we will be 2-2. The good thing is we now control our own destiny. Even if they beat us, if we win the rest of our games there is nothing they can do, we will win by one game even if they win all their remaining games.

    If they catch us, here's the tiebreakers. We are ahead at the moment. The #4 tiebreaker is higher winning percentage in conference games [We are 35-9, .795 with 8 to play. Heat are 28-14, .666 with 10 to play]

    In the event two or more teams are tied in the standings, a series of tiebreakers are applied to determine which team receives the higher seeding.
    Two-team tiebreaker:


    1. Division winner (this criterion is applied regardless of whether the tied teams are in the same division) [Both will win their division]
    2. Better record in head-to-head games [only applies if they catch us]
    3. Higher winning percentage within division (if teams are in the same division) [Does not apply]
    4. Higher winning percentage in conference games [We are 35-9, .795 with 8 to play. Heat are 28-14, .666 with 10 to play]
    5. Higher winning percentage against playoff teams in own conference (including tied teams)
    6. Higher winning percentage against playoff teams in opposite conference (including tied teams)

    Three-team tiebreaker:

    1. Division winner (this criterion is applied regardless of whether the tied teams are in the same division)
    2. Best head-to-head winning percentage among all teams tied
    3. Highest winning percentage within division (if all tied teams are in the same division)
    4. Highest winning percentage in conference games
    5. Highest winning percentage against playoff teams in own conference (including tied teams)
    6. Highest point differential between points scored and points allowed
    Last edited by Will Galen; 03-27-2014 at 04:19 AM.

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    All Hail CJ Watson! Nuntius's Avatar
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Great post, Peck. Allow me to answer the Roy question. He absolutely is one of the toughest players in the league. I don't consider a player tough for dunking on other people (and thus strike physical fear into them). The ability to dunk on others has a lot to do with genetics and that's not something that a player himself can control. Conversely, stepping up and defending the rim against heavyweights that are gonna ram into your chest, kick you with their foot, elbow you with your elbow or knee you in the balls is something that a player can control. It's a choice. That's why I have a hard time criticizing Roy even when he plays bad. It's exactly due to this very fact. He's the only player in the team (Mahinmi does it too at times but not as well as Roy) that is going to put his *** on the line for this team. He will sacrifice his body for this team and that's extremely important. If this is isn't toughness then I don't know what is. It's either that or extreme sense of duty (that still indicates a pretty tough mindset).

    About GH now. Honestly, I was surprised when he missed both. I thought that he'd make at least 1 of them. Thankfully, it didn't cost us.

    This was a big win indeed. The guys had fun tonight and that's big for their confidence as a unit. But the biggest thing is that the team remembered its identity tonight. I don't want to pat myself on the back but it's exactly like I said in the UB has spoken thread. Our players know that the only way to beat Miami is to play inside out and that's exactly what they did. I'm very relieved that our players realize that and hope to see more of it in the future
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    Let PG Fly Again Soon! ECKrueger's Avatar
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    While we saw the Bulls game showed a win doesn't fix the team, I think this win was a textbook Pacers win. It looked like early season again. It's a little more inspiring.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    You are totally right about Hill. I've watched too many games where he misses FTs in the last few min of the game. But he does have the ability to hit big shots.
    Lance + Starting SG = Awesome

    Now really free Lance!

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    You honestly think Lebron got too many FTs? Just watch his play style when he is in attack mode like he was last night he gets to the line. He earned his FT attempts last night. I don't know why people ***** about the official's so much. I thought it was a well reffed game. Both Pacer fans and Heat fans sound like Dwade or Paul George *****ing about every call. Just play. Saying we were playing 8 on 5 is just crazy.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    You honestly think Lebron got too many FTs? Just watch his play style when he is in attack mode like he was last night he gets to the line. He earned his FT attempts last night. I don't know why people ***** about the official's so much. I thought it was a well reffed game. Both Pacer fans and Heat fans sound like Dwade or Paul George *****ing about every call. Just play. Saying we were playing 8 on 5 is just crazy.
    Sorry, I just have to disagree with this. Yes, he earned some of them, but other times it seemed like Lebron went to the line everytime someone brushed up against him.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Lance Stephenson: A

    I know I’m in the minority here but I’m glad that Lance doesn’t like or bow to the Heat. He bothers them, he really truly gets under their skins and I love it. I fail to see how him yelling “what” at Wade was any more of a taunt than earlier in the game when James drew a foul on him and followed Lance around showing him the and 1 sign. Also let’s not forget that first “T” was total B.S. as Wade pushed him. Was it dumb? Probably but I don’t care all that much, no other team in the NBA would have gotten that to be a “T” but the Heat are such drama queens that they literally were able to convince Jones to call a “T” while they had him surrounded. Now here is the part that bothers me about that. Jones did not have a clear view of everything and Monty McCutchen was looking right at Lance and never raised an arm or blew a whistle, this was manipulation pure and simple. Credit to the Heat for having the refs on a string like that though, sure as hell must be nice.

    Very nicely put. I hope going forward that Lance continues showing swagger and
    disrespect for the Heat, so long as he's a bit more careful about not picking up “T”s
    (especially a 2nd one).

    EDIT: Just saw that Lance has 14 Ts on the season and if he gets 1 more
    will get a 5K fine and 1 game suspension. NO MORE Ts LANCE, WE NEED YOU!
    Last edited by RamBo_Lamar; 03-27-2014 at 07:43 AM.
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    The Doctor's In The House TheDon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    I've been saying since our skid against charlotte, dallas, houston, that this game couldn't come soon enough for our team. The heat get our attention and get us to focus like no other team is capable of doing. The relationship the Pacers have to the Heat is a lot like pardon my nerdiness that way that Batman and Joker interact with each other specifically the "unstoppable force meets the immovable object speech" towards the end and when batman asks the joker earlier in the movie "why do you wanna kill me?" and the joker says "I don't wanna kill you? what would I do without you? you complete me."


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    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    I have come to the conclusion that how well Roy does on offense is dependent upon who is guarding him. With Oden guarding him Roy looked like Combination of Shag and Hakeem. When Haslem was guarding him, Roy looked like Roy. As JVG pointed out Roy has more trouble against smaller players who can push him out of the lane and keep Roy off balance. UD can do that, Oden cannot.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Damn I hate Miami

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    You honestly think Lebron got too many FTs? Just watch his play style when he is in attack mode like he was last night he gets to the line. He earned his FT attempts last night. I don't know why people ***** about the official's so much. I thought it was a well reffed game. Both Pacer fans and Heat fans sound like Dwade or Paul George *****ing about every call. Just play. Saying we were playing 8 on 5 is just crazy.
    Sure you can say he earned the calls on his drives, but there fouls out on the perimeter that should have never of be called. Lance got pinched between the Lebron and Screener on one drive. Foul on Lance. That should be a no call because Lance never laid a hand on Lebron. Lebron created the contact. Lance had successfully fought over the screen, picked up a foul for it.
    There was the call out on the wing involving Lebron, PG , and GH. I don't even understand what the ref saw there.
    Turner got called for foul on Wades shot at the top of the key, where they said Turner smacked him his leg? Wade got that call because he stumbled, had nothing to do with Turner.

    Pacer fans are mad that 2 guys on the other team can essentially give instructions to the ref on how to whistle a foul.
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I have come to the conclusion that how well Roy does on offense is dependent upon who is guarding him. With Oden guarding him Roy looked like Combination of Shag and Hakeem. When Haslem was guarding him, Roy looked like Roy. As JVG pointed out Roy has more trouble against smaller players who can push him out of the lane and keep Roy off balance. UD can do that, Oden cannot.
    I don't think UD can guard Hibbert. He did a good job, but last years playoffs UD couldn't do it. In short stretches I think he can, but not over the course of a 7 game series

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Lance Stephenson: A

    I know I’m in the minority here but I’m glad that Lance doesn’t like or bow to the Heat. He bothers them, he really truly gets under their skins and I love it. I fail to see how him yelling “what” at Wade was any more of a taunt than earlier in the game when James drew a foul on him and followed Lance around showing him the and 1 sign. Also let’s not forget that first “T” was total B.S. as Wade pushed him. Was it dumb? Probably but I don’t care all that much, no other team in the NBA would have gotten that to be a “T” but the Heat are such drama queens that they literally were able to convince Jones to call a “T” while they had him surrounded. Now here is the part that bothers me about that. Jones did not have a clear view of everything and Monty McCutchen was looking right at Lance and never raised an arm or blew a whistle, this was manipulation pure and simple. Credit to the Heat for having the refs on a string like that though, sure as hell must be nice.
    This is why I love Lance. The Heat expect all of their opponents to bow down to them and kiss the ring. They think that everyone should be in awe of their greatness and treat them like the kings of the world. PG is amicable with them when he does stuff like give Lebron dap last year in the Conference Finals, and he just generally doesn't talk a lot of smack to them. Nothing wrong with that. But I just love that Lance gives them absolutely no respect whatsoever. He hates them, wants to beat them, and is going to taunt them in the most disrespectful ways imaginable. It's awesome because it clearly elevates his play. He always comes to play against the Heat. You can tell that a clown like Wade is just befuddled by what Lance does. He's used to opponents brown nosing Miami and acting scared against them, but there's this guy on the Pacers who sets out to mock them 100% of the time. It gives us an edge. This Pacers team would lose a ton of spark without Ready.

    I don't see how anyone can say with a straight face that the NBA refs aren't a big problem at times. Everyone is talking about the tech that got Lance thrown out, which was indeed awful, but that double tech was just as bad. Lance had walked up to Chalmers and it looked pretty tame. I think the refs would have just let it go, but then Wade flies in like an a-hole and pushes Lance. The refs don't have the balls to give Wade a sole tech in that situation even though it was well deserved, so they instead do the cowardly politically correct thing by giving a double tech since Lance has a hot head image. Unreal. Then that tech that got Born thrown out was one of the lamest things I've ever seen. There's no way Lebron or Wade get thrown out for that. Hell, you'd have most players on teams thrown out every night if they got techs for that stuff. It was downright pathetic that Wade was able to goad that ref into throwing him out. A new low for NBA refs, and everything that's wrong with NBA officiating in a nutshell.

    I just can't wait until Lebron and Wade get old. That whole team is just so douchey and unlikable. Their mannerisms on the court and quotes before/after games are just so unbecoming of a team that has won multiple championships. Jordan's Chicago teams would have NEVER whined around like that. Can you imagine 45 trying to goad a ref until giving someone a tech? No, he would have just served Lance up with some trash and embarrassed him on the court. Dirk Nowitzki will forever be one of my favorite NBA players ever for that epic beating he laid on those clowns in 2011.
    Last edited by Sollozzo; 03-27-2014 at 08:01 AM.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    You honestly think Lebron got too many FTs? Just watch his play style when he is in attack mode like he was last night he gets to the line. He earned his FT attempts last night. I don't know why people ***** about the official's so much. I thought it was a well reffed game. Both Pacer fans and Heat fans sound like Dwade or Paul George *****ing about every call. Just play. Saying we were playing 8 on 5 is just crazy.
    Totally agree with you. There were some missed calls, especially in the first half, but most of those seemed to be floppers getting away with flopping. Guess that they looked at some of the plays at half time and stopped calling the flops. For the most part, the officials just stood there and watched the game and let the players play. That is all you can really ask a guy to do.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I have come to the conclusion that how well Roy does on offense is dependent upon who is guarding him. With Oden guarding him Roy looked like Combination of Shag and Hakeem. When Haslem was guarding him, Roy looked like Roy. As JVG pointed out Roy has more trouble against smaller players who can push him out of the lane and keep Roy off balance. UD can do that, Oden cannot.
    I was disappointed that the Pacers never looked to seriously re-establish Roy in the post in that 2nd half. UD did a good job, but I don't think the team actually tried to force the match up all. Dude had 17 pts at the half. I would expect another 10 in the 2nd half if they use the match up right. Roy had a few post ups in the 2nd half and he rushed the shot and had terrible positioning, but he probably felt like he had to do something with it because they actually threw it to him.
    Last edited by graphic-er; 03-27-2014 at 08:06 AM.
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    I just wish that the Heat would have waited until the playoffs to try the Oden on Roy experiment. There's no way they make that mistake again.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
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    This is why I love Lance. The Heat expect all of their opponents to bow down to them and kiss the ring. They think that everyone should be in awe of their greatness and treat them like the kings of the world. PG is amicable with them when he does stuff like give Lebron dap last year in the Conference Finals, and he just generally doesn't talk a lot of smack to them. Nothing wrong with that. But I just love that Lance gives them absolutely no respect whatsoever. He hates them, wants to beat them, and is going to taunt them in the most disrespectful ways imaginable. It's awesome because it clearly elevates his play. He always comes to play against the Heat. You can tell that a clown like Wade is just befuddled by what Lance does. He's used to opponents brown nosing Miami and acting scared against them, but there's this guy on the Pacers who sets out to mock them 100% of the time. It gives us an edge. This Pacers team would lose a ton of spark without Ready.

    I don't see how anyone can say with a straight face that the NBA refs aren't a big problem at times. Everyone is talking about the tech that got Lance thrown out, which was indeed awful, but that double tech was just as bad. Lance had walked up to Chalmers and it looked pretty tame. I think the refs would have just let it go, but then Wade flies in like an a-hole and pushes Lance. The refs don't have the balls to give Wade a sole tech in that situation even though it was well deserved, so they instead do the politically correct thing and give a double tech since Lance has a hot head image. Unreal. Then that tech that got Born thrown out was one of the lamest things I've ever seen. There's no way Lebron or Wade get thrown out for that. Hell, you'd have most players on teams thrown out every night if they got techs for that stuff. It was downright pathetic that Wade was able to goad that ref into throwing him out. A new low for NBA refs, and everything that's wrong with NBA officiating in a nutshell.

    I just can't wait until Lebron and Wade get old. That whole team is just so douchey and unlikable. Their mannerisms on the court and quotes before/after games are just so unbecoming of a team that has won multiple championships. Jordan's Chicago teams would have NEVER whined around like that. Can you imagine 45 trying to goad a ref until giving someone a tech? No, he would have just served Lance up with some trash and embarrassed him on the court.
    I have to say, Lebron stare opponents down after a big dunk every single night. No official in this league will dare call a taunting Tech on him.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by graphic-er View Post
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    I have to say, Lebron stare opponents down after a big dunk every single night. No official in this league will dare call a taunting Tech on him.
    And it's not just the stare downs. Like Peck said, there was that obnoxious and one motion he made to taunt Lance on that and one. In the abstract, I don't have any problem with him doing that because I'm generally in favor of letting these guys show their emotions as long as they're kept in control. HOWEVER, if you're going to throw Lance out for saying "what", then you better be consistent. If Lance ever taunts the Heat by giving an and one motion repeatedly, then he'll be t'd up.

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  38. #21
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
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    I just wish that the Heat would have waited until the playoffs to try the Oden on Roy experiment. There's no way they make that mistake again.
    I'm actually surprised that they did not try him out against Mahinmi to see if they could anything out of him against our back ups. But man did Roy put the hurtin on him tonight.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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  40. #22
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    I dunno how much of the post game comments from Lebron any of you were able to see, but I think he took a shot at Wade sitting out the final minute. There was some mention ( I don't know the real quote) of "I was out on the court" When he was talking about the final minutes of the game.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by Peck View Post
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    Roy Hibbert: A+

    Here is the thing about Roy. On the one hand he is one of the softest players in the league. He strikes physical fear into no one. However on the other hand this guy might be one of the toughest players ever. This guy gets hammered over and over by James who is a big physical player and Roy steps up to take it every single time and never backs away. Everybody saw the jaw blow but did everybody see later in the 4th the elbow to his sternum? Iím not sure which would hurt more. I hate the fact that he canít grab 12 rebounds every game or that his offense comes and goes with the tides but I will say this. Night and night out he will put his body on the line and take a beating, now if we could just teach him to give one.
    So True!!

  42. #24
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    I thought we got mostly Good Lance tonight. It's because he not only played with energy, he played as if he had teammates on the court instead of as if he was the Great One Sent To Single-Handedly Save Us All (coming soon to a theater near you).

    I think he didn't help his case later in the game by starting very early on to yap at the refs about being fouled. Now, PG may have done the same - though I really felt he did a good job avoiding that - but I noticed Lance in particular because he often finishes the play on the left side of the court and that's a straight shot for me to see him in the first half going straight to the ref at that sideline.

    I believe the taunting tech was particularly bogus because of the way LBJ was getting in everyone's faces when he did something particularly special (not just the "and-1" gestures). I could understand the double tech - refs pretty much are in the "I don't care who started it" mode in recent years, and double techs are pretty much always the result of a heated issue between players.

    The one thing this whole team has to learn - and they were definitely better at it last night, but it still showed - is to play as if you will never, ever, ever get the call. Let the foul be bonus to your play, not the purpose of your play.

    And, though I haven't seen the Heat whining, all I have to say is when you can draw a foul by having a big man brush past you - and it's a shooting foul because you are LeBron James and any dribble toward the basket is clearly a shot attempt - you got nothing to whine about.
    BillS

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    Default Re: Odd Thoughts: Beating the Heat & the refs

    Quote Originally Posted by pacer4ever View Post
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    You honestly think Lebron got too many FTs? Just watch his play style when he is in attack mode like he was last night he gets to the line. He earned his FT attempts last night. I don't know why people ***** about the official's so much. I thought it was a well reffed game. Both Pacer fans and Heat fans sound like Dwade or Paul George *****ing about every call. Just play. Saying we were playing 8 on 5 is just crazy.
    The problem is not so much his free throws its that when PG attacks the rim and Lebron is hitting him on the shoulder PG does not get the call but Lebron does. When I see a play where the Heat would go to the line but the Pacers don't that's what ticks me off. Add in that Lebron can elbow Hibbert in the jaw on purpose and just get a flagrant 1 but Lance flexes and he gets tossed that's playing 8 on 5.

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