Page 2 of 2 FirstFirst 12
Results 26 to 41 of 41

Thread: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

  1. #26
    DIET COKE! Trader Joe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Troll Hunting
    Age
    26
    Posts
    30,944

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    The article from Bob feels forced considering all the times he absolutely murdered JO and the Pacers in his columns.

    “WE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKING”- Frank Vogel
    momentarygodsblog.com https://twitter.com/momentarygods

  2. The Following User Says Thank You to Trader Joe For This Useful Post:


  3. #27
    Member Sollozzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    16,827

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    I don't think that the 05 team would have made it past Detroit if the brawl didn't happen. That Detroit team just had superior mental strength.

  4. The Following User Says Thank You to Sollozzo For This Useful Post:


  5. #28
    Custom User Titleist
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Pacer Purgatory Praying for Paul
    Posts
    3,561
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    JO has a career in marketing if he wants it after he retires. He has always "dominated the paint" when it comes to saying all the right things to the media.

    Do I feel somewhat sorry for him? Yes. He was a lean, extremely athletic power forward who was asked to bulk up to play center and that ended up breaking him down prematurely. Also, he was basically forced into a leadership role after Reggie retired, which he was never suited for, and that put even more pressure on him. If those two things had not happened, I feel that he would have ended up with a rafter-worthy career here.

    However, he really didn't feel a huge loyalty toward the Pacers like the picture he paints, particularly after he had gone to San Antonio looking to join Duncan right as Larry Bird joined the front office. What made him decide to come back here? An assurance from somebody in our front office that, despite an abysmal coaching performance, Isiah Thomas would be retained as head coach. I am sure that would not have been Larry Bird who had been quoted in the media at the end of the prior season about how the Pacers would have won a lot more games if they had been properly coached. It was assumed by many, and openly rooted for by a lot of fans, that Bird would bring Carlisle in to coach as soon as he came in, which he did. Supposedly Larry never spoke to JO prior to firing Isiah and hiring Rick, but hired Rick only AFTER JO committed to his max deal here, and that really honked JO off. I don't think he ever got over that as long as he was still here, and I would venture to guess that the feeling was mutual.

    Also, don't forget the summer rumblings that JO and Kobe had tried to privately orchestrate JO going to the Lakers, probably ironically in exchange for Bynum and pieces. I'm sure that did not sit well in the Pacers front office, and I would say that damaged the relationship between JO and the front office even more. Eventually, when the Pacers finally were able to do the trade with Toronto, I am sure that both JO and the front office were thrilled that JO's time as a Pacer was mercifully at an end.

    So, I can say that while I appreciated JO's service and agree that without the brawl the Pacers would have won the title, likely more than one, IMO he did not ever "bleed Blue and Gold" and I believe he was a primary contributor to the "me first" culture of the massively talented yet fatally flawed team that nearly drove the Pacers out of Indy.

  6. #29
    Formerly PacerFanInAZ Cactus Jax's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Tucson AZ
    Age
    30
    Posts
    4,151
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    I still don't think that 04/05 team would've came up big when it needed to. I remember I think it was the 02 playoffs, when JO had become "the man" and that 5 game series against the 1 seed Nets, he destroyed them in game 1, then was dominated by Kenyon Martin the rest of the series, and Reggie had to pull off his set of miracles in game 5 to make that a classic game.

    If it weren't the brawl it probably would've been something else.
    "It's just unfortunate that we've been penalized so much this year and nothing has happened to the Pistons, the Palace or the city of Detroit," he said. "It's almost like it's always our fault. The league knows it. They should be ashamed of themselves to let the security be as lax as it is around here."

    ----------------- Reggie Miller

  7. The Following User Says Thank You to Cactus Jax For This Useful Post:


  8. #30
    Member Speed's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Brownsburg
    Posts
    8,535

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    I always partially blame management for putting JO in a leadership position that he wasn't equipped to do or handle. Then surround him with knucklesheads. Its almost the exact opposite as it was before him and as it is now again. That said, I can't not associate him with the darkest time in my favorite teams history, as unfair as that is.

  9. #31
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,782

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    Everyone talks about JO throwing the punch at the fan who wondered onto the court. But what is rarely discussed because there is not a video of it is when he threw the elderly usher over the scorers table during the brawl.

  10. The Following User Says Thank You to Unclebuck For This Useful Post:


  11. #32
    Member aamcguy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2012
    Location
    West Lafayette
    Age
    23
    Posts
    2,541

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Everyone talks about JO throwing the punch at the fan who wondered onto the court. But what is rarely discussed because there is not a video of it is when he threw the elderly usher over the scorers table during the brawl.
    An offense for which he was charged and sentenced for. He's already been punished for it, so I don't see why it is required that we talk about it. Two bad decisions instead of one doesn't really paint a bigger picture.
    “The good thing about science is that it's true whether or not you believe in it.”
    ― Neil deGrasse Tyson

  12. The Following User Says Thank You to aamcguy For This Useful Post:


  13. #33
    Member naptownmenace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Posts
    4,636

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Everyone talks about JO throwing the punch at the fan who wondered onto the court. But what is rarely discussed because there is not a video of it is when he threw the elderly usher over the scorers table during the brawl.
    There is video of it or at least there used to be on Youtube and the usher was 49 years old, not exactly elderly. A man in a red jacket grabs JO who is in the middle of trying to grab his teammates and get them off the court and away out of the riot. He grabs him and tosses him like a lawn chair. However, by the time JO tossed the usher it was complete bedlam on the court.

    But you have to remember what had just happened prior to all of this. People were throwing drinks down from the stands, poor Fred Jones is getting punched in the back of the head by Ben Wallace's obese brother, fans were rushing the court, even Anthony Johnson, who already had one broken hand and was dressed in a suit, was punching a fan who ran onto the court. A fan thrown bottle blasts one of the referees in the head and knocks him cold. JO punches the same drunk fan that AJ punched. Austin Croshere and Ron Artest are having their jerseys ripped off. Fans are hurling debris and dropping drinks on future hall-of-famer Reggie Miller and former Pacers great Chuck Person's heads as they finally escort Artest out of the arena. David Harrison punches a fan that he thinks grabs his arm when he's trying to get through the vomitorium. Someone throws a chair from the stands (I can't remember if it was at Harrison or someone else). Tinsley tries to come out of the tunnel with a dustpan before being grabbed and dragged away.

    It was all Ron's fault. Anything JO did pales in comparison and at least he never went into the stands. If you ever want to relive the exact craziness of the Malice in the Palace, Grantland has the best article ever. It has quotes from the Tim Donaghy (ironic that he was one of the refs that night), the coaches, players, and even security guards. The best quote from the article was this one:

    “After we calmed down, [Artest] looked at me like, ‘Jack, you think we going to get in trouble?’ Jamaal Tinsley fell out laughing. I said, ‘Are you serious, bro? Trouble? Ron, we’ll be lucky if we have a freaking job.’ That lets me know he wasn’t in his right mind, to ask that question.” —Stephen Jackson

    http://grantland.com/features/an-ora...malice-palace/
    Last edited by naptownmenace; 03-05-2014 at 04:20 PM.
    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Larry is not coming back, he didn't have a meeting with Orlando for not reason, yeah he is coming back to the NBA but not to the Pacers, the notion that he is a taking a year off and then come back is absurd.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    GOOD GOD THAT'S LARRY BIRD'S MUSIC!

  14. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to naptownmenace For This Useful Post:


  15. #34
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,782

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    Whenever I need a really good laugh pull up the video of the brawl and just watch the part of Tinsley waving around the dustpan. As many of you know Tinsley might be my alltime least favorite Pacers player, but I'll always remember him for the dustpan

  16. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Unclebuck For This Useful Post:


  17. #35
    Member naptownmenace's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Cincinnati, Ohio
    Posts
    4,636

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    O’Neal: I don’t know if I could ever apologize to the city of Indianapolis and the state of Indiana for that enough. I don’t know if there’s enough apologies in the world to give to that city. That city meant a lot to me. It still means a lot to me. For them to go through what they went through on a national scene and the embarrassment it brought to the city and my community and my organization, I apologize for. If there’s anything you can get across, please get that across. I don’t know if people understand that the people that were there from that regime, from the brawl, could not shake it. We couldn’t shake that whole thing. It seemed like the team was fractured.
    http://grantland.com/features/an-ora...malice-palace/

    I forgive you, JO. I wish everyone else could.
    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Larry is not coming back, he didn't have a meeting with Orlando for not reason, yeah he is coming back to the NBA but not to the Pacers, the notion that he is a taking a year off and then come back is absurd.
    Quote Originally Posted by Trader Joe View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    GOOD GOD THAT'S LARRY BIRD'S MUSIC!

  18. The Following User Says Thank You to naptownmenace For This Useful Post:


  19. #36
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Everyone talks about JO throwing the punch at the fan who wondered onto the court. But what is rarely discussed because there is not a video of it is when he threw the elderly usher over the scorers table during the brawl.
    I think there is video of it, but it's rare. I may actually have it in my old, old PD files, actually.

  20. #37
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    Actually, not only did I find it, but back in the day I put it on youtube for preservation purposes, and the videos were always acting weird (they still do; they skip around for some reason), but you can see the relevant moment for JO pushing/throwing the security guy here:

    http://youtu.be/YymJGOr9njc?t=4m32s

  21. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Hicks For This Useful Post:


  22. #38
    Pacers Fan For Life J7F's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Seymour, IN
    Age
    32
    Posts
    1,060

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Actually, not only did I find it, but back in the day I put it on youtube for preservation purposes, and the videos were always acting weird (they still do; they skip around for some reason), but you can see the relevant moment for JO pushing/throwing the security guy here:

    http://youtu.be/YymJGOr9njc?t=4m32s
    I don't remember ever seeing that with the security guard...
    Nothing in life worth having comes easy.

  23. #39
    Droppin' knowledge, yo. Mackey_Rose's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    The Dragon's Lair
    Posts
    4,102

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    Ron Artest is the only Pacer who I blame for that night. I'll argue to my death that Ben Wallace was nearly an equal instigator, but the blame for the brawl belongs to Ron, pure and simple.

    JO, Jackson, Tinsley, everybody else in Blue and Gold was merely acting out of self (or in Jack's case, his teammate's) preservation after Ron went into the stands. I can't fault JO for trying to knock those fools that went out on the floor out. If they went out on the floor, they were looking to start trouble, just as Ron was looking to start trouble when he went into the bleachers.

  24. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Mackey_Rose For This Useful Post:


  25. #40
    Member Since86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Muncie
    Posts
    21,122

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    If the stories are true about Ron and JO getting in fistfights in the lockerroom, then I don't know how it would be out of character for JO.

    Jackson was far worse than Ron. Had he simply went to the bench, and didn't stand around trying to fight the world, I think the situation is completely different. The cup being thrown might have been the spark, but Jackson's actions was akin to someone dumping gasoline all over the walls and floor. Considering the guy hangs (or atleast hung) his gang colors in his locker, I don't see how those things are out of character for him either. Especially when you think about the strip club brawl. And then there's Tinsley who gets in a shoot out through downtown. Those things just don't happen to professional athletes. They might not be the instigator of those situations, but clearly, how they handled them wasn't how other athletes have or they would be similiar stories out there. Really the only other one I can think of like those two is PacMan Jones in LV during the NBA All-Star weekend, and I think that gives me a little more firm standing ground on that opinion.

    I can chalk JO's stupidity up to immaturity, but Tinsley and Jackson? Just who those guys are.
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right.” ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

    Larry Bird: Yeah, patience.

  26. The Following User Says Thank You to Since86 For This Useful Post:


  27. #41
    Custom User Titleist
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Location
    Pacer Purgatory Praying for Paul
    Posts
    3,561
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Jermaine O'Neal going for a championship. Some of his comments on the brawl in Detroit

    Quote Originally Posted by Mackey_Rose View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Ron Artest is the only Pacer who I blame for that night. I'll argue to my death that Ben Wallace was nearly an equal instigator, but the blame for the brawl belongs to Ron, pure and simple.

    JO, Jackson, Tinsley, everybody else in Blue and Gold was merely acting out of self (or in Jack's case, his teammate's) preservation after Ron went into the stands. I can't fault JO for trying to knock those fools that went out on the floor out. If they went out on the floor, they were looking to start trouble, just as Ron was looking to start trouble when he went into the bleachers.
    Actually, if there would be considered to be a single instigator, the blame probably belongs to Ben Wallace, pure and simple. However, Ben was, at the time, playing in a game that he probably should have skipped. His brother Sam had died of brain cancer in Alabama on November 9, 2004. Ben was to be out indefinitely to deal with it. http://articles.philly.com/2004-11-0...allace-brother. That may have caused an emotional overreaction to Ron's hard foul by Ben (which was likely taken into account in only suspending Ben for a measly 2 games IIRC) as well as his brother David who was also at the brawl game and allegedly was also on the court and involved in the brawl as well, probably acting to "preserve" Ben somehow.

    Maybe 10 days was not enough to process the loss emotionally. I have lost both my mother and father to longterm cancer battles, and I definitely would not have been able to play against Ron without him getting in my head severely either. I can actually understand Ben's reaction with the game basically over, though it does not excuse it. An extended suspension probably would have allowed Ben to fully process his loss.

    If Jackson were merely acting to "preserve" Ron, wouldn't you think he would have been holding Ron back up in the stands as opposed to swinging at other fans that Ron was not "engaged" with? To my eyes, SJax actually both attempted and landed more punches than Ron did, and further escalated the situation as if he were the one who was drenched in beer.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •