Don't ask Marvin Harrison what he did during the bye week. "Batman never told where the Bat Cave is," he explained.
I say get a young guy with potential Decker is not bad, but if you get him you are stuck with a guy who is not a #1 for a long time because the contract you will have to give him. He is a really good player but somewhere in between a #1 and #2.
Also just throwing this out there, pretty sure most will sign long term contracts but man the 2015 class of unrestricted free agents is packed Marshall, White, Welker, AJ Green, Dez, Jordy, Demarius, Torrey, Cobb. I know I would love atleast one of those guys on my team(Excluding Marshall, White Welker, Torrey and Dez, so I guess that only really leaves 4 but that is a dynamic 4)...
Why so SERIOUS
It's nice to see the Colts are still pursuing skill position players they don't need instead of improving actual weaknesses. I guess all that talk about "building the monster" was typical rah-rah coach-speak.
Guys, WR is absolutely a weakness going forward. Reggie's 35 and coming off the ACL. The only surefire NFL player moving forward we have at WR is Hilton and he's just too small to be a real #1. I don't want to chase Decker because he'll probably get overpaid (FAs worth a crap almost always do, which is why free agency sucks as a way to build a team), but we 100% need to acquire a Reggie replacement ASAP, it's part of why I hated the TRich trade so much, I'd have had no problem going WR in the 1st this year, still wouldn't mind it in the 2nd. There's a chance Da'Rick's that guy, but I'm not gonna jump to any sorta conclusions off of one good game, definitely need to have him getting a big amount of snaps next year though.
OL certainly sucks, but I don't really care that much, get just a league average OL (which we're well below right now) and that's more than good enough to win. Thomas and Thornton get healthy, dump Satele's bum ***, play McGlynn at C or hope Holmes shows something, that's good enough for me. Getting a linebacker not named Freeman worth a damn is priority 1, then safety and WR are 2 depending on the draft/market. A rush end's up there too but hopefully Werner'll be that, gotta at least give him a chance.
I disagree with this. If you look at last years signings, all those guys were paid as solid/good starters, those weren't huge deals with a bunch of guaranteed money. None of them got huge deals and just about all of them did exactly what they were expected to do. Landry and Toler got hurt midseason but up until then, our secondary looked very good. Donald Thomas also looked good up until he got hurt. RJF was probably the most disappointing but I would still consider him an upgrade over what we had before. And that's all Grigson was trying to do. We can cut all of those guys right now except Landry and save money, and even cutting Landry would only cost 500k in dead money this year. To me, overpaying usually means throwing a big bonus at a guy who flops, like Mike Wallace in Miami.
I viewed most of those signings as stop gaps, not long term solutions. And I felt like his draft picks showed that as well. He drafted Thornton to play behind Thomas, Werner to play behind Walden, and Montori Hughes to play behind RJF. I think those guys were brought in to groom the rookies and be solid contributors, and for the most part they were.
I think Grigs liked this years FA crop much better and decided to not invest long term in anybody last year. There is a reason he was so willing to trade this years draft picks, and I expect a few more high profile signings this year.
That's the thing, Rogers to me looked like a great option. He was thought of as a 2nd round pick going into the draft last year so I'm confident what I saw wasn't a fluke. He joined the team mid season and did pretty well, so I'd like to see us give him a chance to have an off season program working with Reggie and the coaches and use this year to build up the defense instead. Maybe we try to find a diamond in the rough or a low level FA signing that could be an asset, but we still have some pretty descent receivers and a great group of TE's, and I don't think you need anymore than that. If we get our running game going that will do wonders for the guys we already have. You don't need a high powered offense necessarily, you just need a capable one. And I think with Ty, Rogers and Fleener we don't really have a shortage of weapons going forward.
I personally like the TRich trade and think he'll easily wind up being our best back since Edge, he just needs some time and a better online.
I am not a fan of Decker personally but he would be a big upgrade. I'm just hoping for a more balanced approach over the Manning era.
Over paying means paying someone more than what they are worth, it does not mean they have to get huge contracts, and Grigson definitely over paid. Your numbers are off as far as saving money if we cut guys, all besides I think maybe one still has guaranteed money that would take away from the cap, but what Grigson did was make is so that we could cut those guys and wouldn't have to pay out big bucks to if they did not workout which was smart. But I would like to add they did not do what they were expected to do, no one brings in a player and says hey here is some money and we expect you to get hurt half way through the season, or we expect you not to fit our system. When you sign free agents you expect them to come in and contribute and fit into your team.
Also the reason the contracts were bad is because as you said he paid pretty much good starter type money to a bunch of guys who really have never been good starters, many who never played a full year as a starter, and the worst thing about it is by signing all these guys with question marks we now have a bunch of guys people are ready to cut one year after. We could have targeted more quality guys that fit our system so that in year two they could really mesh with the rest of the team but now we might have to start over with some of the positions because ALL we signed was guys with questions marks.
Also if you want me to direct you in a direction for the cost cutting savings I can.
But point being Grigson definitely overpaid guys last year.
Why so SERIOUS
Yeah I think for this year we are okay without getting a "big named" WR, maybe a vet to come in incase Wayne takes a while to get back to for so that we won't have to fall solely on Rogers in some situations. I would like to add that we have a guy coming back that if healthy will be another weapon ind the passing game named Dwayne Allen, he can really help.
I also like Richardson and hope he gets his stuff together I think his problem was confidence, he played like he did not trust his abilities, but in hindsight RB's are a dime a dozen and we probably shouldn't have made the trade but oh well we will see how it works out.
Why so SERIOUS
I liked most of the signings last year, but have to say quite a few ended up disappointing... that said, I was never under the impression that Grigs signed them to bad contracts. Seemed like he signed a bunch of smart contracts that gives the team options and didn't strap us going forward.
There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.
Maybe not trusting the line possibly, but more not knowing how to run off their blocks. Key word you said about Richardson is prospect, the problem is RB careers are so short that being a RB that is a prospect but also carrying the ball as much as he has is not a good combination. I think he has massive potential, saw him in the JW when he got traded here and told him we were excited to have him. I think as far as the value it is not far off, RB value has went down a bunch in the recent years so his actual draft position should have been closer to the late teens but that is all judgement.
As far as the 2nd-3rd compared to 5th-6th if you look at which rounds pro bowlers come from it is dominated by 1st rounders 2nd rounders are next 3rd and on I think typically it is hit and miss. But there is definitely a trend that as you get further and further into the draft the chances of players become a contributor is less and less, you can have a guy that turns out good but if you look at some of the stuff pff puts out then you will get a better idea of the trends I am talking about.
Why so SERIOUS
Why so SERIOUS
Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 03-04-2014 at 12:02 PM.
I mean he hesitated in the backfield a lot.... A LOT, my thinking is that maybe this goes along with what you said about trust, not knowing how to run off this group of lineman, can he trust that they will drive a guy back or open the hole correctly, but that comes with practice and getting used to the guys. But the thing is when you don't have that trust then you have to trust your abilities even more, if you look at the tape there are many times where he just didn't hit the hole or hesitated or ran into a group of guys while the hole was a few steps over.
Honestly Brown used to run just like that until the past 2 season, not sure what happened to him but he has gotten a lot better at it. Also I will say the way those two guys were used was totally different, a lot of Browns runs came from draw plays where the holes were more defined and easier to hit, but he also ran way harder that Richardson this year.
I still have hope in Richardson and think a offseason will be really good for him.
Why so SERIOUS
Who would you have suggested he sign?
It's pretty easy to sit back and criticize without knowing who was a realistic possibility in the first place.
He paid what it cost to get the guys he did. I seriously doubt he threw money at them without negotiating and finding out what they were worth on the open market.
Again he didn't hurt our cap position going forward at all. So what's the gripe? The Colts paid Gary Brackett 5 million in dead money last year alone. That is overpaying for someone JMO
The only guy who would count dead money if we cut him this year is Laron Landry, and he would only count 500k in dead money.
"Don't get caught watchin' the paint dry"
Except Hilton is already putting up #1 statistics. Steve Smith, is the same height as Hilton, and only 10lbs heavier. Harrison may have been taller, but his height was not much of a factor in how great he was. Sure height can help, but it is ignorant to say a player can't be a number 1 WR just because he is a few inches shorter. It took Harrison until his fourth season to put up more receptions and yards than Hilton did in his second season. It took Wayne until his 4th season for yards, and 5th season for receptions. Hilton is statistically ahead of the curve.
There is legitimate reasons to be concerned about Wayne's ability to come back. Hilton has been inconsistent so far, but that is not unexpected from a young WR. There is absolutely no reason why he shouldn't be able to be a number one WR. He is statistically extremely close already. I can understand why some might question Brazill and Rogers, I'm not sure about Rogers myself, but I am hopeful. I made it a point to pay attention to how Brazill played when he got a chance, and he looked good more times than not. He didn't get a lot of throws his way, but that often had to do more with the OL and to a lesser degree Luck still learning to be patient.
Also offenses with great OLs tend to be a lot more consistent, and good, than offenses with great skill players and average OLs, especially in the playoffs. If you have a great OL and a great QB you usually can throw just about any group of half decent WRs in there and have a top passing offense.
I agree, Hilton is #1 material, but I still think that we need another consistent WR who defenses are forced to respect. Defenses succeeded in taking Hilton out of the game quite a few times last year, but thankfully we finally figured away around it. I just want to add one more WR who can grow up with Luck and Hilton. I hope Wayne has a great bounce back season, but he is in his twilight regardless of what happens this year.
I'm not necessarily in agreement that Hilton is supposed to be a #1. He's really good... not taking from him. He's a very good #2, who when put in as a #1, will put up numbers. I think your overall offense will work better with someone opposite Hilton. Wayne pre-injury was exactly that. Wayne could beat doubles and triples. I'm not as confident in Hilton to do that, unless he gets behind them.
dude here you go, you're ridiculous:
All of them pretty much have a decent amount of dead money if we cut them... Landry however not only has dead money but it will actually cost us 500K extra on top of the dead money to cut him.
As far as the other point true not sure who we had a realistic chance in signing, but like I said you build the team around a bunch of guys who have done nothing and have question marks, dude RJF didn't even start and got a 4 year contract worth like 4 million a year... Cherlius had one really good year and you decide to make him the 2nd highest paid RT in the league that was ridiculous, to me atleast it seems like he made a lot of moves that were bad. Landry never looked like a good fit next to Bethea.
Also as far as Brackett he was not overpaid but paid for his production... he earned that contract and how the Colts worked is that they rewarded their players who played well and he was consistently good in our system for many years, but honestly he did not fit the new system and his game started to decline also, but still he was not overpaid he worked hard and earned his contract.
Please checkout the article it will help you with your facts.
Last edited by Really?; 03-05-2014 at 03:54 PM.
Why so SERIOUS
We would SAVE 4 million by cutting Toler after 1 year.
We would SAVE 3.25 million by cutting RJF after 1 year.
We paid Gary Brackett over 5 last year, and he hasn't played for us since 2010-11.
We are not building around any of those guys.
"Don't get caught watchin' the paint dry"