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Thread: what is our new lineup and rotation?

  1. #26
    Whale Shepherd cdash's Avatar
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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Truth be told, I think there's a better chance that Lavoy Allen joins Solomon Hill in street clothes than there is of him joining the rotation.

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  3. #27
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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Any interest in Richard Jefferson, Caron Butler or Ben Gordon if they're bought out?

    I haven't seen them play this year but Jefferson and Butler have both been money from 3. It looks like Caron Butler doesn't shut anything but 3's. And Ben Gordon's numbers are terrible but I remember that dude being able to shoot when he was on the Bulls. Maybe catch lightning in a bottle with him and use Turner at the 3?



    As far as what we have now, I'm kind of hoping Turner plays some with the starters in place of Lance since Stephenson already runs the 2nd unit a lot anyways. Continue starting Stephenson so he's credited as a starter but end up running him a lot with the 2nd unit while Turner plays some with the 1st unit.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Ben Gordon and Caron Butler are intriguing to me out of that group, but I don't see how they come here and play in front of any of the current rotation. There's always healthy issues, however. I do think that maybe Miami would choose one of those folks over a bought out DG, which I'd be glad about if it worked out that way.

  5. #29
    Whale Shepherd cdash's Avatar
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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    We don't have any open roster spots. So if we sign a buyout guy, we have to waive someone on the team currently.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    We don't have any open roster spots. So if we sign a buyout guy, we have to waive someone on the team currently.
    Done.

    Rasual Butler is gone.

    Jk.


    But if we're not going to play him or Solomon Hill, at the 2 or 3, I don't think it would hurt to pick up another 2 or 3 that can shoot and play more than a couple minutes a night. I don't really want Copeland at the 3.

    Watson
    Turner
    Jefferson or Caron

    or

    Watson
    Gordon
    Turner


    I always thought OJ would fill out the one of the 5 back up slots but that didn't happen. I don't think it would be a bad thing to have another shooter off the bench. Again, that's if we're not going to actually use Rasual. Jeffeson is averaging 26.8 minutes in 53 games and Caron is averaging 24.1 minutes in 31 games. I wouldn't mind having one of those guys for 10 minutes off the bench.

  7. #31
    Member Downtown Bang!'s Avatar
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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Playoff rotation is already nine deep and that is not counting Mahinmi or Copeland. Don't see where it makes sense to put someone else in the mix unless they are clear upgrade over Watson or Turner who would then have to sit IMO.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Downtown Bang! View Post
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    Playoff rotation is already nine deep and that is not counting Mahinmi or Copeland. Don't see where it makes sense to put someone else in the mix unless they are clear upgrade over Watson or Turner who would then have to sit IMO.
    That's assuming everyone is healthy though. The same could be said for foul trouble. Depth is never a bad thing.

    What if George, Lance or Turner get hurt? Now you're looking to Rasual, Solomon or Copeland to contribute.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOP View Post
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    That's assuming everyone is healthy though. The same could be said for foul trouble. Depth is never a bad thing.

    What if George, Lance or Turner get hurt? Now you're looking to Rasual, Solomon or Copeland to contribute.
    George Hill would play some 2 guard with Watson, I'd guess if one of those 3 go down.

  10. #34

    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Ben Gordon can no longer elevate or move well enough to get his shot off in NBA. Who knows, maybe he is still good shooter in practice... But NOT in game, not while being defended. That's why he is riding the pine in Bobcats.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimp View Post
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    Lavoy was brought over to give the backup PF spot a shot of youth. Scola's elbow or loss of confidence make him an offensive liability. And his slow-footedness and age - a defensive liability. Lavoy takes care of that. Lavoy will probably play backup center for now (yes Ian is that bad). Bynum isn't ready yet. Which means Scola will be backup PF. When Bynum is ready, Lavoy slides to backup PF. But Cope will backup PG unless he blows it somehow and just plays horrendously.
    To quote James Harden, "I disagree." The only real changes in the rotation will be Evan Turner takes over Danny Granger's slot and at some point Andrew Bynum takes over Ian's. That's it unless someone gets hurt. It will be tricky enough getting two guys acclimated to the Pacer Way of Doing Things in the twenty-something games left in the regular season.

    Hopefully LaVoy will stick with the team and get some significant playing time going forward, but absent injury, I expect only spot minutes.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Truth be told, I think there's a better chance that Lavoy Allen joins Solomon Hill in street clothes than there is of him joining the rotation.
    I hope you're wrong. Scola is just too slow to guard most active PF's. Kevin Love sliced him up. Putting LaVoy out there with Cope, Bynum (Ian for now), Turner, and CJ gives our team more offense and quickness. Scola is a defensive liability. Now that his shot has fallen off, he looks lost out there. And without his jumper, Scola offensively is also a liability. Not his fault though if the elbow is bothering him. But defensively, I wouldn't roll with Luis. Maybe if we're up on a team by 20 in the 3rd quarter? I'd give him a few minutes at backup PF. But if said team starts to make a run, it's LaVoy all the way.
    Last edited by Grimp; 02-21-2014 at 01:36 PM.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by xIndyFan View Post
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    To quote James Harden, "I disagree." The only real changes in the rotation will be Evan Turner takes over Danny Granger's slot and at some point Andrew Bynum takes over Ian's. That's it unless someone gets hurt. It will be tricky enough getting two guys acclimated to the Pacer Way of Doing Things in the twenty-something games left in the regular season.

    Hopefully LaVoy will stick with the team and get some significant playing time going forward, but absent injury, I expect only spot minutes.


    I could be wrong...........but I believe Evan was brought it to back up Lance. If he backs up PG, that means Lance will still be playing with our bench. And the whole point of the trade, was to solidify Lance with our starters as a facilitator, and playmaker. And have Evan be that for the 2nd unit. Separate responsibility, as opposed to shared.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    I don't think the interesting thing is who will be in the rotation. But what interests me is replacing Danny with Turner brings another ball handler/creator into the rotation. Likely will see less of Lance with the bench - that might be on purpose.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by TOP View Post
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    Any interest in Richard Jefferson, Caron Butler or Ben Gordon if they're bought out?

    I haven't seen them play this year but Jefferson and Butler have both been money from 3. It looks like Caron Butler doesn't shut anything but 3's. And Ben Gordon's numbers are terrible but I remember that dude being able to shoot when he was on the Bulls. Maybe catch lightning in a bottle with him and use Turner at the 3?



    As far as what we have now, I'm kind of hoping Turner plays some with the starters in place of Lance since Stephenson already runs the 2nd unit a lot anyways. Continue starting Stephenson so he's credited as a starter but end up running him a lot with the 2nd unit while Turner plays some with the 1st unit.





    Caron? Sure. Ben Gordon? No, and Richard Jefferson? HELL NO.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I don't think the interesting thing is who will be in the rotation. But what interests me is replacing Danny with Turner brings another ball handler/creator into the rotation. Likely will see less of Lance with the bench - that might be on purpose.
    EXACTLY! Lance will take a seat when most of the other starters go out. As opposed to pulling double duty. This trade was to make us more versatile, give us an offensive punch....and keep Lance fresh for playoff time. Pulling double duty all season is gonna wear him down too much.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimp View Post
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    Caron? Sure. Ben Gordon? No, and Richard Jefferson? HELL NO.
    Richard Jefferson has actually been pretty good this season, all things considered. Especially his outside shooting.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Vogel tried Cope at the 3. Or Butler. I wouldn't be surprised to see a 10 man rotation. Cope/Butler would bring that outside threat that Turner doesn't and would give someone for him to create good looks for. He attacks the basket and needs shooters out around him. I think we see a little less Lance, which is probably a good thing right now. Just a gut feeling.

  21. #43

    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by BenR1990 View Post
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    Richard Jefferson has actually been pretty good this season, all things considered. Especially his outside shooting.
    I trust Butler more though based on that 40+ point game he had earlier in the season before he got hurt.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by ilive4sports View Post
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    I honestly wouldn't be surprised if Vogel tried Cope at the 3. Or Butler. I wouldn't be surprised to see a 10 man rotation. Cope/Butler would bring that outside threat that Turner doesn't and would give someone for him to create good looks for. He attacks the basket and needs shooters out around him. I think we see a little less Lance, which is probably a good thing right now. Just a gut feeling.

    I hope he plays Allen at the four or the five. Lavoy needs to be on the floor to off-set Scola's slowness and or Ian's lack of offensive game.

  23. #45
    Wasting Light Hicks's Avatar
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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    I'll be curious to see how many minutes Turner gets. He's still young and healthy, so if Frank wanted to he could easily divided the wing minutes 36/36/36 between Paul, Lance, and Evan. It'd be great if Evan played well enough to deserve that. Otherwise, you can fill time there with Lance at the 3 with Hill and Watson playing together, playing Butler or Solomon, or some would say play Cope but I still think he's viewed as a PF by this coaching staff, so I'd be surprised if he played there.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimp View Post
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    I hope he plays Allen at the four or the five. Lavoy needs to be on the floor to off-set Scola's slowness and or Ian's lack of offensive game.
    Ian won't be playing because of Bynum. Only way Allen gets time is if we bench Scola.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
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    I don't think the interesting thing is who will be in the rotation. But what interests me is replacing Danny with Turner brings another ball handler/creator into the rotation. Likely will see less of Lance with the bench - that might be on purpose.
    I really hope you're right but I seriously doubt it.Vogel should have been doing that all along. Lance with the bench makes himself the #1 option which IMO has been bad for the bench. I can't see Vogel changing that much when he couldn't see this all along.

  26. #48
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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
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    I'll be curious to see how many minutes Turner gets. He's still young and healthy, so if Frank wanted to he could easily divided the wing minutes 36/36/36 between Paul, Lance, and Evan. It'd be great if Evan played well enough to deserve that. Otherwise, you can fill time there with Lance at the 3 with Hill and Watson playing together, playing Butler or Solomon, or some would say play Cope but I still think he's viewed as a PF by this coaching staff, so I'd be surprised if he played there.
    I would be shocked if Evan only played the 20-22mpg that Danny was getting. He should get more. 28mpg seems about right to me. Cut back on Lance's minutes mostly, a bit of PG's.

    I know the staff says they view Cope as a PF, but if he is our best shooter off the bench, and clearly can play the three, I see no reason not to play him there. Not like we are asking him to guard LeBron. Just hit threes.

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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by ilive4sports View Post
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    I know the staff says they view Cope as a PF, but if he is our best shooter off the bench, and clearly can play the three, I see no reason not to play him there. Not like we are asking him to guard LeBron. Just hit threes.
    Actually that is Butler not Cope, and so far this season it hasn't really been all that close.

  28. #50
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    Default Re: what is our new lineup and rotation?

    Quote Originally Posted by ilive4sports View Post
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    I would be shocked if Evan only played the 20-22mpg that Danny was getting. He should get more. 28mpg seems about right to me. Cut back on Lance's minutes mostly, a bit of PG's.

    I know the staff says they view Cope as a PF, but if he is our best shooter off the bench, and clearly can play the three, I see no reason not to play him there. Not like we are asking him to guard LeBron. Just hit threes.
    The thing is... he's that bad defensively on the perimeter. Bigger/slower AND gets lost. Deadly combination. At the 4, less movement (less chance of getting lost), slower guys, and he's not bad at guarding on the block. That's where he needs to be.

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