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Thread: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    I am guessing Bird saw this coming, at least to a certain extent. This team, while publicly beating the drum of wanting the #1 seed, is in title or bust mode. I think Bird wants Danny to work through his kinks in the regular season and be a contributor in the playoffs--when we really need him.
    Can Danny get better as the year goes on, or is this as good as Danny will be? This is the question that could decide our championship
    David "And One" West

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacergeek View Post
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    Scola is good in the post whenever its ISO. Luis has only one guy near him, and everybody else gets out of the way. He does have issues when he dribbles in traffic though.
    That I will agree with.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacergeek View Post
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    Can Danny get better as the year goes on, or is this as good as Danny will be? This is the question that could decide our championship
    And it's a fair question; one I certainly don't have the answer to. I, personally, believe he will improve.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Ah its that time of year again I see. Pacers trying to trade Granger according to "sources" What is this, the 4th straight year of this? Each year seeming more far fetched than the previous.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacergeek View Post
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    Can Danny get better as the year goes on, or is this as good as Danny will be? This is the question that could decide our championship
    I think that he gets better as the year goes on, but how much better is to be determined... And at this point, there are other questions that will determine if we meet our championship asperations...

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by lolwuttermelons View Post
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    Lowe is a hack, so I wouldn't read too much into it. ESPN pays anyone to say anything, as long as they say it ignorantly with confidence
    This is just a poor attempt at sarcasm, right? Right!?!? Are you confusing Zach Lowe with someone else by chance? You are entitled to your opinion, but in my opinion Zach Lowe is probably the best sports writer there is. Basketball for sure. I bet he gets hired for a front office gig sooner rather than later.
    @qandrews9428

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by Nuntius View Post
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    Butler has given us some really good minutes. He certainly deserves credit for that.

    However, I think that you (and not only you, several others do that as well) are letting the last few games to heavily influence your opinion about our bench.
    Recent bench struggles? Are you implying our bench has been productive at any point during this season? They struggled early in the year we were the worst 2nd quarter team in the league the first few months of the season and why we were always down at half. Our bench effeciency rate is 25th, our bench def. efficiency is 16th, our bench FG percent is 25th in the league. I am not harping on recent struggles I am harping on season long struggles. I was willing to forgive the 2nd unit early in the season and chalk it up to chemistry issues and that the unit would work itself out, but we are now almost at the all-star break and the bench is still a bottom 5 bench in the league in statistically it simply is not producing.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    I don't buy it. Nothing we could get for Danny without taking back long term salary makes any sense. If the Pacers could get a player like Deng without giving up anything else then I might see it but that won't happen. If a deal came up that was to good to be true then I could see Larry doing it but other then that I think there's a certain degree of loyalty from the Pacers franchise to Danny.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
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    I don't buy it. Nothing we could get for Danny without taking back long term salary makes any sense. If the Pacers could get a player like Deng without giving up anything else then I might see it but that won't happen. If a deal came up that was to good to be true then I could see Larry doing it but other then that I think there's a certain degree of loyalty from the Pacers franchise to Danny.
    Everything boils down to what the motivation that Bird has if they are considering moving Granger.

    Is it to get back a better Player and/or prospects ( irregardless of the affect such Players would have on the long-term Salary Cap implications and/or dumping Copeland )?

    or

    Is it to dump Copeland to improve the 2014-2015 Salary Cap situation ( while hopefully getting back a Wingman that can help the Team in the short term )?

    If it is the former ( see if we can improve the bench somehow by getting a better Player than Granger ), than I agree....it would be hard to get a better Player than Granger.

    If it is the latter ( pure Salary Dump that includes Copeland ), if such a deal exists.........and the purpose is to clear 2014-2015 Salary.....then I can see Bird making such a move.
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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    I dont see how Larry will simply trade Danny right now to clear a little more cap space next year... The only way that he would do that is if he gets back someone who is servicable, and I dont see anything that would make sense and be realistic... I think that if you dont get a clear upgrade, than trading Danny is a gamble that more than likely wont end in with a net plus for the Pacers...

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by lolwuttermelons View Post
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    Lowe is a hack, so I wouldn't read too much into it. ESPN pays anyone to say anything, as long as they say it ignorantly with confidence
    So wrong it's not even funny.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by VideoVandal View Post
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    Recent bench struggles? Are you implying our bench has been productive at any point during this season? They struggled early in the year we were the worst 2nd quarter team in the league the first few months of the season and why we were always down at half. Our bench effeciency rate is 25th, our bench def. efficiency is 16th, our bench FG percent is 25th in the league. I am not harping on recent struggles I am harping on season long struggles. I was willing to forgive the 2nd unit early in the season and chalk it up to chemistry issues and that the unit would work itself out, but we are now almost at the all-star break and the bench is still a bottom 5 bench in the league in statistically it simply is not producing.
    Shortly after Granger came back, he had a period of I think 10 games where he scored in double figures efficiently in all but one game, during which the bench looked like the best bench in the league. The bench has been inconsistent this year, usually coinciding with how well Orlando and Granger are shooting. When they shot well, and Orlando did start off fairly decently, the bench looked decent or even great. When they don't it looks bad.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Why don't the Pacer try and go for a trade with the Wizards for Ariza? They are worried that they can't afford him anyways. Maybe add a third team in the deal that could get Wizards a back up PG.
    “This was just a taste,” George said. “I want to be here every year until I can’t go no more.”

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by VideoVandal View Post
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    Recent bench struggles? Are you implying our bench has been productive at any point during this season? They struggled early in the year we were the worst 2nd quarter team in the league the first few months of the season and why we were always down at half. Our bench effeciency rate is 25th, our bench def. efficiency is 16th, our bench FG percent is 25th in the league. I am not harping on recent struggles I am harping on season long struggles. I was willing to forgive the 2nd unit early in the season and chalk it up to chemistry issues and that the unit would work itself out, but we are now almost at the all-star break and the bench is still a bottom 5 bench in the league in statistically it simply is not producing.
    just curious, where are you getting your bench stats from? how are you comparing our bench with that of other teams?

    i can compare our most-played bench lineup (watson-stephenson-granger-scola-mahinmi), with say, OKC's most-played bench (jackson-fisher-lamb-collison-adams), which would be considered an above average bench in the nba. (if you disagree, please feel free to substitute that of another team here.)

    all stats from 82games.

    http://www.82games.com/1314/1314IND2.HTM
    http://www.82games.com/1314/1314OKC2.HTM

    IND: 117 min, 1.03 off rating, 0.97 def rating, +10, 0.448 eFG, 0.458 eFGa, -2 FT differential, 54.5% reb rate, +1% T/O differential
    OKC: 110 min, 1.03 off rating, 1.00 def rating, +8, 0.386 eFG, 0.409 eFGa, -13 FT differential, 52.5% reb rate, +3 T/O differential

    the stats seem to show at the very least our bench is just as good or better than OKC's in quite a few areas.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    I think it would be a pretty low and crappy backhanded move for the Pacer's FO to do Danny like that....
    As much as DG33 has been loyal and stuck with us through thick and thin, and been given all assurances he's been given by the organization that they would stick by him......... IF they jettisoned him out before he got a chance to play for and get a ring with us, in the middle of possibly what is going to be the best season this organization has EVER had, I would lose ALL respect for Herb Simon and Bird .. and how they conduct business... And that is saying ALOT, considering I look up to Larry Bird as a basketball god in all facets of the game.. Plus he was my favorite player of all time...

    You just don't do someone like that....Business or not.....

    Now after this season is done, if a very reasonable contract can't be agreed upon when DG33 becomes a free agent, or if either/both parties decided to part ways..... then so be it... I would be sad to see him go ...
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    Plumlee reminds me of a young Dale Davis. Good rebounding and he contests shots well on defense and his offensive game is very raw just like DD's was coming out of college.
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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by Cousy47 View Post
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    The only team I saw in this thread that I think would even consider a trade for Danny, would maybe be the Lakers. They are really hurting for warm bodies at this point in the season. If Larry really wants to change the team(which I doubt seriously) we might do Granger and Scola for Pau Gasol. Pau could backup David and maybe Roy if needed. He can score and still has some defense. Lakers get 2 for one, both of which they can unload at the end of the season. Pacers get $19m in expiring and a better PF for scoring and size. However, unless Frank and Larry know something we haven't seen yet, Butler and Cope for the backup 3 is a little scary? These guys haven't even seen the floor for very much mop up duty this season. We might offer Ian as part of that trade if the Lakers would go for it. That just might leave enough Cap next year to retain Lance. IIRC we have 7.7 million in cap space after we let Danny walk at the end of the year if we keep Luis? That's not enough money for next year, but Larry has said over and over he's not worried about next year.
    I think this trade fits the immediate needs of both franchises, establishes flexibility for this summer for some retooling, and strengthens the Pacers on the interior.

    As Captain Piccard would say "Make it so."

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by boombaby1987 View Post
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    This is just a poor attempt at sarcasm, right? Right!?!? Are you confusing Zach Lowe with someone else by chance? You are entitled to your opinion, but in my opinion Zach Lowe is probably the best sports writer there is. Basketball for sure. I bet he gets hired for a front office gig sooner rather than later.
    Lowe is an X's and O's guy first and foremost. And that makes for a refreshing and interesting take on NBA journalism. He is probably the best in that regard, but the last thing I'd expect of him is an in-tune pulse of the league's trade scenarios. Maybe he got too big for his britches. "The Pacers have been actively shopping Danny Granger" is a recurrent and sadly safe topic in the shallow world of sports journalism.

    But sports journalist to front office? Surely you jest.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by Frostwolf View Post
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    just curious, where are you getting your bench stats from? how are you comparing our bench with that of other teams?

    i can compare our most-played bench lineup (watson-stephenson-granger-scola-mahinmi), with say, OKC's most-played bench (jackson-fisher-lamb-collison-adams), which would be considered an above average bench in the nba. (if you disagree, please feel free to substitute that of another team here.)

    all stats from 82games.

    http://www.82games.com/1314/1314IND2.HTM
    http://www.82games.com/1314/1314OKC2.HTM

    IND: 117 min, 1.03 off rating, 0.97 def rating, +10, 0.448 eFG, 0.458 eFGa, -2 FT differential, 54.5% reb rate, +1% T/O differential
    OKC: 110 min, 1.03 off rating, 1.00 def rating, +8, 0.386 eFG, 0.409 eFGa, -13 FT differential, 52.5% reb rate, +3 T/O differential

    the stats seem to show at the very least our bench is just as good or better than OKC's in quite a few areas.
    Excellent, thank you. Those numbers seemed fishy to me, but I hadn't decided how to fact-check them. Good work.
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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by PacersPride View Post
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    Upgrade or Depth? I don't understand all the Mahnimi hate overall on this board. What do we expect from a center who makes about the league average for backups. Not directed at this post per se but see it consistently.

    Bynum should have to earn those minutes. Mahnimni was never brought here to be an offensive weapon but his defense and rebounding has been very appreciated.

    Bynum is here for depth, the upgrade part has yet TBD.

    Sure Bynum will have to earn the spot, and if he plays like crap then it will go to Mahinmi. But Bynum's comments about backing up Roy make it pretty clear, IMO, that Bird and Vogel strongly implied to him that the backup spot is basically his to lose. I seriously doubt that Bynum would have come here to be a third stringer behind Ian Mahinmi when he could have gone a couple of other places and made an impact. He won't get paid by third stringer.

    Bynum is a very good rebounder. His per-36 rebounding rate with the Cavs was higher than Mahinmi's this season (9.5 vs. 7.3), and that's when he was playing his first games back from injury. Bird brought Bynum in because even a 50% Bynum is likely going to be a much better player than Mahinmi. Mahinmi simply cannot play offense and that will always hamper the second unit to an extent. Bynum's ability to score near the basket will add more options for our second unit. As long as Bynum is reasonably healthy, I think we can coach his defense to an acceptable level.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by Kemo View Post
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    I think it would be a pretty low and crappy backhanded move for the Pacer's FO to do Danny like that....
    As much as DG33 has been loyal and stuck with us through thick and thin, and been given all assurances he's been given by the organization that they would stick by him......... IF they jettisoned him out before he got a chance to play for and get a ring with us, in the middle of possibly what is going to be the best season this organization has EVER had, I would lose ALL respect for Herb Simon and Bird .. and how they conduct business... And that is saying ALOT, considering I look up to Larry Bird as a basketball god in all facets of the game.. Plus he was my favorite player of all time...

    You just don't do someone like that....Business or not.....

    Now after this season is done, if a very reasonable contract can't be agreed upon when DG33 becomes a free agent, or if either/both parties decided to part ways..... then so be it... I would be sad to see him go ...
    The Pacers will have paid him more than $60 million over the last 5 years. They owe him nothing more.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    I personally hope we keep Danny, I think he will get better he was off for two years and he keeps looking better game by game.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by Frostwolf View Post
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    just curious, where are you getting your bench stats from? how are you comparing our bench with that of other teams?

    i can compare our most-played bench lineup (watson-stephenson-granger-scola-mahinmi), with say, OKC's most-played bench (jackson-fisher-lamb-collison-adams), which would be considered an above average bench in the nba. (if you disagree, please feel free to substitute that of another team here.)

    all stats from 82games.

    http://www.82games.com/1314/1314IND2.HTM
    http://www.82games.com/1314/1314OKC2.HTM

    IND: 117 min, 1.03 off rating, 0.97 def rating, +10, 0.448 eFG, 0.458 eFGa, -2 FT differential, 54.5% reb rate, +1% T/O differential
    OKC: 110 min, 1.03 off rating, 1.00 def rating, +8, 0.386 eFG, 0.409 eFGa, -13 FT differential, 52.5% reb rate, +3 T/O differential

    the stats seem to show at the very least our bench is just as good or better than OKC's in quite a few areas.
    Here is a bench stat that supports his claim.

    http://www.hoopsstats.com/basketball.../7/diffeff/1-1

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by Kemo View Post
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    I think it would be a pretty low and crappy backhanded move for the Pacer's FO to do Danny like that....
    As much as DG33 has been loyal and stuck with us through thick and thin, and been given all assurances he's been given by the organization that they would stick by him......... IF they jettisoned him out before he got a chance to play for and get a ring with us, in the middle of possibly what is going to be the best season this organization has EVER had, I would lose ALL respect for Herb Simon and Bird .. and how they conduct business... And that is saying ALOT, considering I look up to Larry Bird as a basketball god in all facets of the game.. Plus he was my favorite player of all time...

    You just don't do someone like that....Business or not.....

    Now after this season is done, if a very reasonable contract can't be agreed upon when DG33 becomes a free agent, or if either/both parties decided to part ways..... then so be it... I would be sad to see him go ...
    With Birds comments about Danny not working hard in the off season I wonder how much the FO feels obligated to keep him. We see the model NBA player and they may see more of a JO behind the scenes.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    Quote Originally Posted by KingGeorge_24 View Post
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    Why don't the Pacer try and go for a trade with the Wizards for Ariza? They are worried that they can't afford him anyways. Maybe add a third team in the deal that could get Wizards a back up PG.
    Ariza's got a knee issue he's been battling all season. No thanks. Also, I heard last night during Kings/Cavs Deng has a tender achillies he's been dealing with. Not sure if I wanna trade for him now either. Even though Loul still dropped 22 on Sac.

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    Default Re: Zach Lowe - Pacers actively shopping Granger

    How did this get to 7 pages and why people take this seriously is beyond me. We've been "actively shopping Granger" since 08-09. These threads come and go...
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    Bobcat fans telling us to cheer up = epic fail season
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