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Thread: Super Bowl Thread

  1. #276

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    I don't understand how missing a 49 yard field goal is "the biggest choke job in history". It would be like I just flipped a coin and it came up heads, so I conclude that tails just made the biggest choke ever. It was a 50-50 play!

    I, and I guarantee many others, consider the Scott Norwood field goal miss one of the biggest choke jobs in Super bowl history!
    Last edited by Slick Pinkham; 02-03-2014 at 08:37 AM.
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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    I think the Colts helped give teams a great blueprint of how to beat this Denver team. We hit Manning, flustered him, and our healthy defensive backs jammed Denver's receivers and limited their YAC's, which is how they succeed against other teams. This is why I have a lot of faith in Pags as a head coach. Seattle did a lot of what we did, just with a more talented team.

    Still, there is just no excuse for a 43-8 whooping. None. Not on this level. Peyton's body language after the safety made it seem like the safety was worth 20 points instead of 2. That team just immediately looked flustered. I've never seen such pathetic execution. I guarantee that the Colts would have put up way more of a fight last night, as would about any other team.

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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord Helmet View Post
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    I just hope Peyton can get another ring before it's all said and done. Obviously as long as it doesn't affect the Indianapolis "football" Colts
    I don't see it happening. I honestly think that this was his last great opportunity to get one. Not saying it's impossible or anything, but I'd certainly bet against it at this point. He'll be another year older next year and I think that team has some personnel decisions it has to make. They might not be as stacked next year.

    Denver has had the one seed and HFA for two straight years. How often does a team get it for three straight years? I look for the Colts or Pats to seize it next year.

  4. #279
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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    That was an embarrassment for the Broncos bottom line
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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    I don't understand how missing a 49 yard field goal is "the biggest choke job in history". It would be like I just flipped a coin and it came up heads, so I conclude that tails just made the biggest choke ever. It was a 50-50 play!
    Are you sure? I haven't checked or looked back, but I was thinking it was more like a 36 yard. If I'm wrong, I apologize.

  7. #281
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    The defense did keep Seattle out of the endzone for a while last night.
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  8. #282

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
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    I think the Colts helped give teams a great blueprint of how to beat this Denver team. We hit Manning, flustered him, and our healthy defensive backs jammed Denver's receivers and limited their YAC's, which is how they succeed against other teams. This is why I have a lot of faith in Pags as a head coach. Seattle did a lot of what we did, just with a more talented team.
    I think the credit should probably go to the old patriots teams. Manning has had a blueprint out on his for years. The problem is actually having the players to jam receivers and get pressure on Manning.

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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by righteouscool View Post
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    I think the credit should probably go to the old patriots teams. Manning has had a blueprint out on his for years. The problem is actually having the players to jam receivers and get pressure on Manning.
    That's certainly true. I just meant that as far as this current Broncos team is concerned, the Colts gave everyone a nice blueprint and I'm sure Seattle watched plenty of that tape. But you're right, it certainly goes back a decade to the Pats losses.

  10. #284
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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    Seattle played great football this year... but they need a lesson in being good sports. Some of their post-game antics this year were just arrogant. I feel like we'll have to listen to Sherman forever now, bein' a jackass, but he's a SB champ. I just don't like ********.
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  11. #285

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    Quote Originally Posted by pogi View Post
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    Are you sure? I haven't checked or looked back, but I was thinking it was more like a 36 yard. If I'm wrong, I apologize.
    I was a little off too: It was a 47-yarder.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wide_Right_(Buffalo_Bills)

    47 yards was considered near the limit of Norwood's kicking range, particularly on a grass field, according to comments during the original game broadcast.[1] Bills head coach Marv Levy also noted that fewer than 50% of such attempts succeeded.[2] In fact, during that season, Norwood was 1 of 5 for field goal attempts of more than 40 yards on grass, with his longest field goal being 41 yards (which is unusually short by modern NFL standards).
    The kick, although it had sufficient distance, passed about a foot to the right of the righthand goalpost and the field goal attempt failed.
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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    The fact that the Colts actually beat this Seattle team has me so hyped about how future. T.Y. Hilton abused Sherman.

    We are very very very close. If we can just stay more healthy next year then I think we will have a very legitimate chance at getting to the Super Bowl.

    Anyway you slice it, the future is bright. Peyton and Brady will be long retired when Luck is in the prime of his career and I just don't see many big up and coming teams in the AFC. Thank God we wouldn't have to face the likes of Seattle and San Francisco until the Super Bowl.

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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    Irsay has got to be feeling pretty vindicated right now.
    Pinball numbers led to nothing but a crushing big game defeat to a team that plays defense and more balanced.
    Passing on Luck to keep Manning would have only been worth it if we actually won another Super Bowl with Manning. Getting to the Super Bowl wouldn't have even been enough to justify it. It's obviously impossible to have a crystal ball, but Irsay made the gamble that we wouldn't win another one with Manning. So far it obviously looks like the correct gamble. Even with the draft picks that we could have gotten for Luck, it's hard to believe that we could have built a better team than the loaded Broncos. So yeah, it's pretty safe to say that we wouldn't have won the Super Bowl in either of the last two years if we had kept Manning.

    There's no doubt that many Colts fans would have wondered "what if" if the Broncos won this game last night, but him just getting to the Super Bowl isn't enough for me to regret getting rid of him. I wasn't going to regret it unless he won it, which I thought would happen going into yesterday. I'm shocked at how pathetic the Broncos were.

  14. #288

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    Quote Originally Posted by pogi View Post
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    Are you kidding me?!? I, and I guarantee many others, consider the Scott Norwood field goal miss one of the biggest choke jobs in Super bowl history!



    That's cause Marino didn't go into the playoffs always having the #1 offense. Peyton did, numerous times...and then would get out-played. Sometimes by scrub QBs. Also, what's the one thing that Peyton is known for in big games....he easily gets rattled and will throw an interception, usually, at the most critical times.
    Jim Kelly was never blamed for the loss(or any of the others) though Manning would've been. Hell he was when Vanderjagt missed the FG against the Dolphins years ago.

    Marino wasn't trashed as much and he only made the SB once

    Manning made it 3 times and won 1 that's more than Marino and Kelly have yet they don't get the "choking" label. I mean when you win a championship shouldn't that title not be attached to you?

    At least with LeBron he had it till he left Cleveland and went to Miami and won a couple of titles nobody is saying he's a "choker" now but Manning still is?

    Not to say he hasn't played badly because he has but people act as if some of the teams he's been up against weren't legitimately talented and were the better team(Pats, Seahawks)

    If you haven't noticed offenses don't won't championships regular season games sure but that's about it.

    Defense matters it always has that's what the Colts need more than anything.
    Last edited by Basketball Fan; 02-03-2014 at 10:36 AM.

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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Basketball Fan View Post
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    Jim Kelly was never blamed for the loss(or any of the others) though Manning would've been. Hell he was when Vanderjagt missed the FG against the Dolphins years ago.

    Marino wasn't trashed as much and he only made the SB once

    Manning made it 3 times and won 1 that's more than Marino and Kelly have yet they don't get the "choking" label. I mean when you win a championship shouldn't that title not be attached to you?

    At least with LeBron he had it till he left Cleveland and went to Miami and won a couple of titles nobody is saying he's a "choker" now but Manning still is?

    Not to say he hasn't played badly because he has but people act as if some of the teams he's been up against weren't legitimately talented and were the better team(Pats, Seahawks)

    But I'd say that most people have Manning above Marino at this point, and he's obviously way above Jim Kelly. People are analyzing Peyton through the prism of being the very very very best because of his historic talent and incredible career longevity. He just hasn't quite lived up to being considered the very best in the game's history. He's had plenty of opportunities by now.

    Was Seattle a better team than Denver? Sure, but they should not have been better on a 43-8 margin.

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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    If Seattle wasn't in the NFC West they would have had the best record in NFL and be considered one of the greatest teams of all time. With the Cardinals and 49ers it is hard to be dominant.

    Ugliest Super Bowl game ever. Worse than the Cowboys and Bills.

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  19. #291

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
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    But I'd say that most people have Manning above Marino at this point, and he's obviously way above Jim Kelly. People are analyzing Peyton through the prism of being the very very very best because of his historic talent and incredible career longevity. He just hasn't quite lived up to being considered the very best in the game's history. He's had plenty of opportunities by now.

    Was Seattle a better team than Denver? Sure, but they should not have been better on a 43-8 margin.
    I guess my point is if people don't think Manning is the GOAT that's fine but stop putting him in that conversation to begin with but people/media don't. They claimed that was going to happen in the last SB loss except it didn't. They have to keep this narrative going because you know they actually have to talk sports on a logical level and we can't have that.

    Yes the score was the only surprise I expected it to be closer but that's about it. However when the #1 offense goes against the #1 defense it usually ends badly the only real close one was the Giants/Bills which ended with a missed FG.

    The Raiders had the #1 offense, MVP Rich Gannon played the worst game of the season against the Bucs and it was a disaster the Raiders never really recovered after that.

    Then again neither did Tampa Bay. This game was a lot like that.

  20. #292
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    I have never liked the word choke in a team game. I think its a terrible way to treat an individual in a team game, unless it is so obvious, which is rare in pro sports.

    Manning had a good game, it just didn't translate to points. The O-line didn't protect. The Denver defense couldn't stop anything. The special teams done the worst thing that could have happened starting the second half. The center done the worst thing that could have happened on the first snap of the game. To think that Manning done it again is crap. Was he truthfully suppose to bail out his whole team. The team blew up for whatever reason and if Manning would have scored 4 TD's it wouldn't had been enough to overcome the Denver mistakes.

    I personally think the Seahawks was just to fast for the Broncos. They are young and was blitzin to the ball wherever it was going.
    Last edited by Pacer Fan; 02-03-2014 at 05:47 PM.
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  22. #293
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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Cold View Post
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    If Seattle wasn't in the NFC West they would have had the best record in NFL and be considered one of the greatest teams of all time. With the Cardinals and 49ers it is hard to be dominant.

    Ugliest Super Bowl game ever. Worse than the Cowboys and Bills.

    I feel kind of sorry for Bruce Arians and the Cardinals. He did a phenomenal job of coaching there this season and got great results, but it's just going to be so damn hard to get into the playoffs when you have to play four games against Seattle and San Francisco. They went 1-3 against them this year.

  23. #294

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    I guess my point is if people don't think Manning is the GOAT that's fine but stop putting him in that conversation to begin with but people/media don't. They claimed that was going to happen in the last SB loss except it didn't. They have to keep this narrative going because you know they actually have to talk sports on a logical level and we can't have that.

    Yes the score was the only surprise I expected it to be closer but that's about it. However when the #1 offense goes against the #1 defense it usually ends badly the only real close one was the Giants/Bills which ended with a missed FG.

    The Raiders had the #1 offense, MVP Rich Gannon played the worst game of the season against the Bucs and it was a disaster the Raiders never really recovered after that.

    Then again neither did Tampa Bay. This game was a lot like that.

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Cold View Post
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    If Seattle wasn't in the NFC West they would have had the best record in NFL and be considered one of the greatest teams of all time. With the Cardinals and 49ers it is hard to be dominant.

    Ugliest Super Bowl game ever. Worse than the Cowboys and Bills.
    No that would be Super Bowl between the Niners/Broncos that was 55-10 and the worst I've ever seen. Not sure I consider Seattle one of the more historic teams in NFL history they might very well be when all is said and done. Its weird that the best team in the league all season actually won the whole thing that hasn't happened since the 2003 Patriots. Of course that SB was way better even if it got upstaged by Janet's boob.

  24. #295

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    Mike and Mike sort of summarized the relevance of the criticism of Manning.

    Imagine the football hall of fame, packed with great players. Imagine a much smaller room there, just for the greatest of the great players. Manning is in that room. Criticism of his postseason issues really amount to where to arrange his plaque in that room of only the best of the best. Who has the higher pedestal, of the few QBs on a pedestal in that room.

    You say that Jim Kelly maybe escapes blame in the analysis? Maybe it is because he is nowhere near that room.

    I keep hearing a few people say that since he is being heavily scrutinized that he must suck. That he's Dilfer. Brad Johnson. But... those guys are not in the room, not in the building, not on the grounds, and not even in the same zip code.
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  26. #296

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    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    Mike and Mike sort of summarized the relevance of the criticism of Manning.

    Imagine the football hall of fame, packed with great players. Imagine a much smaller room there, just for the greatest of the great players. Manning is in that room. Criticism of his postseason issues really amount to where to arrange his plaque in that room of only the best of the best. Who has the higher pedestal, of the few QBs on a pedestal in that room.

    You say that Jim Kelly maybe escapes blame in the analysis? Maybe it is because he is nowhere near that room.

    I keep hearing a few people say that since he is being heavily scrutinized that he must suck. That he's Dilfer. Brad Johnson. But... those guys are not in the room, not in the building, not on the grounds, and not even in the same zip code.
    Except it reeks of hypocrisy rings matter but they only matter if you are an elite QB but if you are Dilfer and Johnson they don't? So how important are rings? I mean Namath having a ring IMO is why he's even in the HOF even though he's beyond overrated. Bradshaw has 4 rings but he's not considered the GOAT but Montana is?

    Jim Kelly was a great QB not as great as Marino but he wasn't a scrub either I mean the Bills still haven't recovered. Its one thing to criticize its the inconsistency of it all that bothers me.

    If people don't think Manning is a great QB fine just say so and don't talk about him amongst the greats and then complain when he doesn't play well I mean if he's not great why is it an issue now? He's not the "GOAT" he wasn't even going to be even if the Broncos won last night. You can make the argument he's not even the best QB in either of those franchises.

    All it would've meant is that he'd be the first QB to win rings on two different teams as the starter nothing more nothing less.

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    Default Re: Super Bowl Thread

    Quote Originally Posted by Basketball Fan View Post
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    Except it reeks of hypocrisy rings matter but they only matter if you are an elite QB but if you are Dilfer and Johnson they don't? So how important are rings? I mean Namath having a ring IMO is why he's even in the HOF even though he's beyond overrated. Bradshaw has 4 rings but he's not considered the GOAT but Montana is?

    Jim Kelly was a great QB not as great as Marino but he wasn't a scrub either I mean the Bills still haven't recovered. Its one thing to criticize its the inconsistency of it all that bothers me.

    If people don't think Manning is a great QB fine just say so and don't talk about him amongst the greats and then complain when he doesn't play well I mean if he's not great why is it an issue now? He's not the "GOAT" he wasn't even going to be even if the Broncos won last night. You can make the argument he's not even the best QB in either of those franchises.

    All it would've meant is that he'd be the first QB to win rings on two different teams as the starter nothing more nothing less.
    As far as Bradshaw vs. Montana is concerned: Montana with 4 Super Bowls and great career stats > Bradshaw with 4 Super Bowls and ugly career stats. That's why there is no debate there.

    The reason that people talk about Peyton's place among the greats is because 1) He is one of the all time greats, and 2) He has had multiple opportunities to substantially elevate his achievements and historical place amongst the all-time greats.

    It was impossible for talking heads to ignore what winning this Super Bowl would have met for Manning's legacy. Had he won last night, even the biggest Manning hater on the planet would have had to re-evaluate where they placed him amongst the greats. He would have won two Super Bowls 7 years apart, would have been the second oldest SB wining QB in NFL history, would have won a ring with two different franchises, and would have a victory against a super elite defense. Most importantly, he would have completed the greatest QB season of all time with the 55 TD's, single season yards record, 5th MVP, AFC title over the Pats, and Super Bowl Championship.

    He had a golden opportunity to really pad his resume and deliver some major ammo in any best of the best debate. Even those who don't like Manning would have had to give him some major props if he won last night. There was just too much at stake here for talking heads to ignore it. The best are judged by how they play in the biggest moments. Since winning his first ring, Peyton has had two big opportunities to get that second ring and really elevate his place amongst the all time greats. He just hasn't delivered. This isn't just goofy talking heads babbling. This is real concrete stuff that you really can't ignore at this point.
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  29. #298

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    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
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    As far as Bradshaw vs. Montana is concerned: Montana with 4 Super Bowls and great career stats > Bradshaw with 4 Super Bowls and ugly career stats. That's why there is no debate there.

    The reason that people talk about Peyton's place among the greats is because 1) He is one of the all time greats, and 2) He has had multiple opportunities to substantially elevate his achievements and historical place amongst the all-time greats.

    It was impossible for talking heads to ignore what winning this Super Bowl would have met for Manning's legacy. Had he won last night, even the biggest Manning hater on the planet would have had to re-evaluate where they placed him amongst the greats. He would have won two Super Bowls in his career 7 years apart, would have been the second oldest SB wining QB in NFL history, would have won a ring with two different franchises, would have a victory against a super elite defense. Most importantly, he would have completed the greatest QB season of all time with the 55 TD's, single season yards record, 5th MVP, AFC title over the Pats, and Super Bowl Championship.

    He had a golden opportunity to really pad his resume and deliver some major ammo in any best of the best debate. Even those who don't like Manning would have had to give him some major props if he won last night. There was just too much at stake here for talking heads to ignore it. The best are judged by how they play in the biggest moments. Since winning his first ring, Peyton has had two big opportunities to get that second ring and really elevate his place amongst the all time greats. He just hasn't delivered. This isn't just goofy talking heads babbling. This is real concrete stuff that you really can't ignore at this point.

    Except they wouldn't because they don't like Manning and that's fine but my point is there's no objectivity to these GOAT discussions because everyone has different opinions as to who is the GOAT vs who isn't.

    Are you basing it on pure passing ability? Marino or Unitas would be the GOAT

    Rings? Montana or Bradshaw

    Rings and Stats? Montana or Brady


    Winning another ring wouldn't have changed anything they would've come up with some other narrative of how he needs a third ring to be in the Montana conversation. I mean we thought him getting a ring at all would've stopped this talk but instead it gets worse.

    People can think what they want but I just find it rather inconsistent to put him in the conversation as the GOAT even though they see him as nothing but a "great regular season QB" (which is a worthless label).

    Here's a thought: Don't even talk about him as a possible GOAT if that's what you think and then get upset when he doesn't win the SB. After all he's just a great regular season QB so why say he's so great when you don't think he really is?!

    Surely there are other QB's one can talk about in his place right?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Basketball Fan View Post
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    Jim Kelly was never blamed for the loss(or any of the others) though Manning would've been. Hell he was when Vanderjagt missed the FG against the Dolphins years ago.

    Marino wasn't trashed as much and he only made the SB once

    Manning made it 3 times and won 1 that's more than Marino and Kelly have yet they don't get the "choking" label. I mean when you win a championship shouldn't that title not be attached to you?

    At least with LeBron he had it till he left Cleveland and went to Miami and won a couple of titles nobody is saying he's a "choker" now but Manning still is?

    Not to say he hasn't played badly because he has but people act as if some of the teams he's been up against weren't legitimately talented and were the better team(Pats, Seahawks)

    If you haven't noticed offenses don't won't championships regular season games sure but that's about it.

    Defense matters it always has that's what the Colts need more than anything.
    I understand what you're saying; but, like Sollozo, many people have Peyton above alot of these QBs. And like LeBron was put on a pedestal the minute he set foot in the league. He wasn't hyped from day 1 to just be good, he was hyped from day 1 to be one of the greatest ever.

    Try looking at it through the eyes of an average fan, a Peyton-hater, or just some shlub that knows a little about NFL. Now, unlike most of us that live in Indy, there are alot of people that only see Peyton play when he plays their team, or during playoffs and superbowl, which are broadcasted nationally. Now think about how much hype he's gotten with the commercials, the sports networks, being one of the highest paid player ever, ets..ets.. They maybe didn't see one regular season game, or possibly only one, then it's the playoffs and here is this, supposedly, football god that alot of people are hyping up so much, finally get to watch him and in one year he's getting blown out 41-0, another year some backup QB is putting up better stats then him and winning on top of it. He's gotten beat by inferior teams and was one and done on numerous occasions. All three super bowls he's looked average or subpar, yet, because of the running game and the opponents having a QB that looked even worse than he did....he at least won one. I can honestly see why alot of people have him a choker.

    Also, if you noticed that after Labron won that second title, more of the talk was about him leaving for Cleveland than he being a choker. I mean, you're still going to have people talk smack...that happens with just about any player.

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  32. #300

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    Quote Originally Posted by pogi View Post
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    I understand what you're saying; but, like Sollozo, many people have Peyton above alot of these QBs. And like LeBron was put on a pedestal the minute he set foot in the league. He wasn't hyped from day 1 to just be good, he was hyped from day 1 to be one of the greatest ever.

    Try looking at it through the eyes of an average fan, a Peyton-hater, or just some shlub that knows a little about NFL. Now, unlike most of us that live in Indy, there are alot of people that only see Peyton play when he plays their team, or during playoffs and superbowl, which are broadcasted nationally. Now think about how much hype he's gotten with the commercials, the sports networks, being one of the highest paid player ever, ets..ets.. They maybe didn't see one regular season game, or possibly only one, then it's the playoffs and here is this, supposedly, football god that alot of people are hyping up so much, finally get to watch him and in one year he's getting blown out 41-0, another year some backup QB is putting up better stats then him and winning on top of it. He's gotten beat by inferior teams and was one and done on numerous occasions. All three super bowls he's looked average or subpar, yet, because of the running game and the opponents having a QB that looked even worse than he did....he at least won one. I can honestly see why alot of people have him a choker.

    Also, if you noticed that after Labron won that second title, more of the talk was about him leaving for Cleveland than he being a choker. I mean, you're still going to have people talk smack...that happens with just about any player.

    They hyped up Dan Marino as well along with various other athletes but again if Manning isn't as great as they think he is because he comes up short why mention he's great to begin with? I mean he's not that great after all now is he? Mention those who are.

    But then there's no story because its all about the drama. People flock to tragedy rather than a storybook ending. Its like the Red Sox and their 86 years of futility that they were able to milk for decades until they won a title (and two more after that) now they're just like every other team.

    The Cubs are still a never ending tragedy.

    And yes people think LeBron was a choker yeah they thought he was a douche for how he left Cleveland and he was criticized for joining a stacked team. He had to do it on his own(even though teams actually win championships)

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