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Thread: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

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    Default Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    I think if Peyton and the Broncos pull this off, he will go down as the best QB of all time. He has broken almost every passing record in the NFL, 2 SB titles, and just his legacy for his mental approach to the game will make him go down as #1
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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Obviously this is huge for his legacy. If he wins this game, he will unquestionably have completed the greatest QB season ever. 55 TD's, single season passing record, AFC Title game over Pats, and Super Bowl championship......just two years after a career threatening injury. 2-1 in Super Bowls would be pretty impressive too. The guy who "only" had one would all of the sudden have two championships with two different franchises. He would be the second oldest Super Bowl winning QB in NFL history (behind Elway). It would be pretty hard for anyone to criticize his career if he pulls this off. A lot of people will have them as their GOAT if he pulls this off, or maybe number 2 behind Montana.

  3. #3

    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Greatest regular season QB ever - yes.

    Post-season - mediocre. Look at the numbers. Look at them ........

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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    I think he will simply cement himself as one of the best of all time, but really he's already done that. I don't really think there is a ranking that will ever be valid. You could make a case for so many players. I will say this about Manning --- he might be the best preparer of all time. He might be the best dissector of defenses of all time. He might have the quickest release of all time. Those are the qualities that make him an all-time great. What keeps him from being THE best of all time (and just like every other "great" out there who had areas of their game that were "lacking"), he was never the most mobile, never the best improviser, never the hardest thrower, never the most clutch. He wasn't bad in these areas, but he wasn't "great".

    He is what he is --- one of the greatest players of all time.
    Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 01-29-2014 at 09:35 AM.
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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerDude View Post
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    Greatest regular season QB ever - yes.

    Post-season - mediocre. Look at the numbers. Look at them ........
    Look at most QBs in the postseason. Even the Elite ones. Especially considering i think Fox might be the first decent coach hes had.

  7. #6

    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    It won't change anything

    Manning’s detractors have already decided his legacy; he can’t be considered the GOAT because: (1) he doesn’t have as many SB rings as Montana, Bradshaw, Aikman and Brady; (2) unlike Montana and Brady, he has a history of “choking” in big playoff games; and (3) his unbelievable offensive statistics and record (soon to be) 5 MVP awards are the result of his putting himself above the team and also being lucky to play with great talent around him his entire career.

    If Manning loses on Sunday, no matter how well he plays, his detractors will view it as further confirmation that he can’t win the big games. If he plays poorly but the Broncos win because Seattle doesn’t play well, his detractors will say Manning only won because he was fortunate that Seattle didn’t play well. If he plays well and the Broncos win, his detractors will say that of course Manning played well; how could he not, given the talent around him?

    Another SB win, another lame narrative will follow because they have to find something "wrong"

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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad-Mad-Mario View Post
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    Look at most QBs in the postseason. Even the Elite ones. Especially considering i think Fox might be the first decent coach hes had.
    Now that makes too much sense(not Fox being a decent coach I mean he's okay he did get to the SB with Delhomme as QB and a playoff win with Tebow) QB's numbers would drop in the postseason its not as if the level of competition is higher or anything.

    That can't be it. People act as if there aren't any good teams in the playoffs. Its not about numbers as it is about wins.

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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerDude View Post
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    Greatest regular season QB ever - yes.

    Post-season - mediocre. Look at the numbers. Look at them ........
    Player A (22 games): 64.05comp% 286.6yds/gm 36TDs (1.63 TD/gm) 22INTs (1INT/gm) QBR 90.1
    Player B (26games): 62.11comp% 247.1yds/gm 43TDs (1.65TD/gm) 22INTs (0.85INT/gm) QBR 87.5

    One player is the greatest postseason QB of all time, while the other is "mediocre".

    EDIT: To give it a little more perspective.

    Player C (23games): 62.67comp% 251yds/gm 45TDs (1.95TD/gm) 21INT (0.91INT/gm) QBR 95.6
    Player D (16games): 63.75comp% 240.6yds/gm 23TDS (1.43TD/gm) 17INT (1.1INT/gm) QBR 88.3

    Please, tell me more about how Peyton is "mediocre" in the playoffs.
    Last edited by Since86; 01-29-2014 at 11:42 AM.
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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Raise your hand if in the past couple of weeks you've allowed your mind to wonder over whether the Colts would be in the Super Bowl right now if they had traded the first round pick for an obscene amount of assets and kept Manning.....


    Raises hand.....
    Last edited by Sollozzo; 01-29-2014 at 11:53 AM.

  12. #10

    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    I can safely say no we wouldn't have. I don't think we'd be as terrible as Irsay claims we would've been(because you know we wouldn't be able to afford everyone else like he claims even though cutting Freeney along with others he dumped along with Manning would've worked) but I think we'd be in the same spot we are now just now we have a QB we can think about for more than 3-5 years.

  13. #11

    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    Please, tell me more about how Peyton is "mediocre" in the playoffs.
    11-11. THAT'S mediocre. Considering his regular season record is 167-73.

    Wins. That's the standard.

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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
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    Raise your hand if in the past couple of weeks you've allowed your mind to wonder over whether the Colts would be in the Super Bowl right now if they had traded the first round pick for an obscene amount of assets and kept Manning.....


    Raises hand.....
    I would raise my hand. However, I'll take the Luck era's potential for more Super Bowl's than Manning's potential for maybe one more. Also don't forget that we owed Manning an obscene amount of money when we didn't even know if he could throw again... so factor that in.
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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerDude View Post
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    11-11. THAT'S mediocre. Considering his regular season record is 167-73.

    Wins. That's the standard.
    Except you were talking about his numbers....

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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerDude View Post
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    11-11. THAT'S mediocre. Considering his regular season record is 167-73.

    Wins. That's the standard.

    It's fair to look at the playoff record and it's fair to criticize Peyton for the numerous one and dones. However, it's a bit short-sighted to simply say "11-11, that's mediocre". For example, Eli Manning is 8-3 in the playoffs. That's a great playoff winning percentage of 72%. But he has MISSED THE PLAYOFFS in 4 of the last 5 seasons, which allows that playoff winning percentage to stay nice and shinny. It would be way better if Eli would have gone one and done in each of the last two seasons since winning the Super Bowl to lower that record to 8-5, as opposed to completely whiffing on the playoffs, which has allowed that winning percentage to stay so high.

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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by Basketball Fan View Post
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    Except you were talking about his numbers....
    Last time I looked, 11 is a number. So is 11.

    People will pull stats to make their case that he is. 8 one and dones is pretty poor too for the 'greatest'.

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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by Basketball Fan View Post
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    I can safely say no we wouldn't have. I don't think we'd be as terrible as Irsay claims we would've been(because you know we wouldn't be able to afford everyone else like he claims even though cutting Freeney along with others he dumped along with Manning would've worked) but I think we'd be in the same spot we are now just now we have a QB we can think about for more than 3-5 years.
    Yeah, people often forget that cutting Freeney before 2012 would have really helped out our salary situation for that season.

    The 2006 team that won the Super Bowl was a stacked team, especially once Sanders was healthy. But I don't think that 2009 team that went 14-2 and made the Super Bowl was anything super special. It was mostly Manning. We absolutely could have built a team at least that good with all of the assets that we could have got for the number 1 pick.

    In no way shape or form is this meant to be anti-Luck. I'm a huuuuuuge Luck fan. But Peyton did just throw 55 touchdowns and is in the Super Bowl right now. It's hard not to let the mind wander....

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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerDude View Post
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    11-11. THAT'S mediocre. Considering his regular season record is 167-73.

    Wins. That's the standard.
    So to judge a players performance, we shouldn't look at their statistical production but rather the final score? Gotcha.

    Next time the Pacers win, and you criticize a player for their play, I'm going to point out that the team won and then your judgement about their play will be irrelevant, deal?
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right.” ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

    Larry Bird: Yeah, patience.

  22. #18

    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    ^^ You do whatever you want. I don't have time for this petty-ness.

    You have your opinion. I have mine. They differ. Is that worth stalking my comments for ??

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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Someone who actually believes what their peddling wouldn't have an issue with it, because their standard would be evenly applied. I'm just trying to figure out whether you're a hypocrite and just say things in order to say things, or if that's what you actually believe.
    Last edited by Since86; 01-29-2014 at 12:20 PM.
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right.” ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

    Larry Bird: Yeah, patience.

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  25. #20

    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    ^^ Last call ........ i lived thru 8 freakin' seasons of regular season excellence followed by a flop in the playoffs. I firmly believe that Manning is a mediocre postseason QB.

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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    To hang a team record on one player is just completely short-sided about the depth of a team sport. It's the exact same argument I had with Kstat just a few weeks ago when he tried saying that the greatest defense ever would automatically win a championship because they'd play great enough defense to overcome any offensive production that they've given.

    When you argue such a rigid standard, that gives no ability to have the rest of the game have an impact, it sounds a whole lot like ********.
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right.” ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

    Larry Bird: Yeah, patience.

  27. #22

    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by PacerDude View Post
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    Last time I looked, 11 is a number. So is 11.

    People will pull stats to make their case that he is. 8 one and dones is pretty poor too for the 'greatest'.

    What can I say when people talk about a players numbers they usually mean their stats not a win and loss record.

    I mean if you think he sucks that's fine but no need to be defensive about it.

  28. #23

    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    So to judge a players performance, we shouldn't look at their statistical production but rather the final score? Gotcha.
    Yeah, if the Pacers are swept 4-0 in the first round of the NBA playoffs 8 times, some as the #1 seed and others as the #2 seed, and their best player & league MVP doubles his rate of turnovers in the eight years, I think that some could question his play and not be far out of line.
    The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!)

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    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by Slick Pinkham View Post
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    Yeah, if the team is swept 4-0 in the first round of the NBA playoffs 8 times, some as the #1 seed and others as the #2 seed, and their best player & league MVP doubles his rate of turnovers in the eight years, I think that some could question his play.
    I get the point that you are trying to make, but some of those losses aren't on par with a 4-0 sweep. They are more comparable to the 8 seeded Nuggets winning a deciding game 5 in Seattle, or the 8 seeded Knicks winning a deciding Game 5 in Miami. Games like 08 against San Diego or that screwy 2010 loss to the Jets were close games that could have gone either way. They weren't comparable to a 4-0 NBA sweep.

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  32. #25

    Default Re: Peyton Manning's legacy if Denver wins SB XLVIII

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    To hang a team record on one player is just completely short-sided about the depth of a team sport.
    I agree completely.

    Completely absolving any MVP-level player of any blame whatsoever in a long string of disappointing team losses is just as completely short-sided.

    He was neither 100% responsible nor 0% responsible.
    The poster "pacertom" since this forum began (and before!). I changed my name here to "Slick Pinkham" in honor of the imaginary player That Bobby "Slick" Leonard picked late in the 1971 ABA draft (true story!)

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