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Thread: How do we keep Lance?

  1. #151
    Jimmy did what Jimmy did Bball's Avatar
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Bird is not Donnie Walsh and I don't think he'll just open the checkbook for any player the way Walsh would when he preferred to keep a player. So there very well could be a balance of how much Lance wants to stay here, and can be convinced it's a better place for him, versus what the team is willing to spend.
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  3. #152

    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by wintermute View Post
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    I was laughed at for suggesting that Lance can get $10m per year last summer. Now that number seems to be everyone's baseline

    FWIW, shags brings up a good point about the 5th year we can offer. I would absolutely take Lance at a Hill-type 5 year $40m deal. But I think he'll end up costing more than that.

    Bottomline though, I don't think there's any GM who's a bigger fan of Lance than Larry Bird, so ultimately I think we'll match any bid another team is willing to make. Not looking forward to what that's going to do to the bench though.
    Didn't Bird say in that interview something like he wanted to keep Lance, but he wasn't going overboard to do it?

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  5. #153
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Aw Heck View Post
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    Granger won't be re-signed, obviously. So that helps. Scola's contract isn't guaranteed, so that's ~$4 million that can come off the books. Not ideal, but I'd rather say goodbye to Scola than Lance.

    Lance isn't going anywhere. Hill being here doesn't make it harder to keep him. Though it would be nice if Simon would be willing to pay a smidgen of the luxury tax.
    Just shy of 1 mil (941k) is guaranteed to Scola next year. Don't think throwing a mil away is good to shed his salary. Better off shedding Copeland's 3.1mil even if it takes a draft pick to rid of him.
    .

    Frank Vogel says "Killer instinct, start strong, build a lead and then step on their throats."

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  7. #154
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eleazar View Post
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    The thing is, if for some reason we can't keep Lance, Granger most likely will be back. So everything isn't going to fall apart if we lose him.
    Granger right now is an EA 68, Lance is an EA 87. Substantial drop off
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacer Fan View Post
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    Just shy of 1 mil (941k) is guaranteed to Scola next year. Don't think throwing a mil away is good to shed his salary. Better off shedding Copeland's 3.1mil even if it takes a draft pick to rid of him.
    A second rounder maybe, but I doubt it would take a draft pick to trade Copeland unless you are trying to bring back a better player or a 1st rounder. I am sure there are many teams out there that would trade a 2nd rounder for a relatively proven commodity in Copeland. Bird has a great history of finding gems in the second round (Jones, Price, Stephenson, and Orlando still has potential).

  9. #156
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Eleazar View Post
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    A second rounder maybe, but I doubt it would take a draft pick to trade Copeland unless you are trying to bring back a better player or a 1st rounder. I am sure there are many teams out there that would trade a 2nd rounder for a relatively proven commodity in Copeland. Bird has a great history of finding gems in the second round (Jones, Price, Stephenson, and Orlando still has potential).
    You could be right, I would love to get a 2nd rounder for Copeland and free up 3 million to help resign Lance.
    .

    Frank Vogel says "Killer instinct, start strong, build a lead and then step on their throats."

  10. #157

    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    I think the fans love watching Lance play. And I'm sure Herb has noticed that. Lance will sell tickets and merchandise. Those are intangibles that make him worth keeping.

    My guess is that we match whatever offer he gets. Then it's up to Lance to decide where he wants to play.

    If Lance stays with the Pacers and they're over the luxury tax then the front office will have to make a decision at the 2015 trade deadline. Either pay the tax or trade a core player to get back under. Plenty of time to see how that plays out.

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  12. #158
    Grumpy Old Man (PD host) able's Avatar
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacergeek View Post
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    Granger right now is an EA 68, Lance is an EA 87. Substantial drop off
    Are you serious, i mean is this for real ?? is that your bases for a discussion of a player ?? their EA rating???

    I just am baffled, no idea what to do with that, i must be getting terribly old, but before i let any game influence my decision or opinion, i probaly have killed a few people like in some games.
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  14. #159
    Grumpy Old Man (PD host) able's Avatar
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    to go to the question on Lance; we can keep him iof no more then 6 million p/a we will not trade ANY player to keep him, that is not Bird's style and it will not bring us anythign, shedding cope means we shed one contract but have to take another back to stay on player numbers.
    there are two options here, Lance signs for a max of 6 p/a and we sign DG to a near min contract (provding both want to) or we lose Lance and keep DG.

    No idea why this needs to be another pro v against discussion that is absolutely turning this place in a horrible board just because 4 or 5 people want to give Lance a PG like status and contract, despite what you want, it is not going to happen.

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  16. #160
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    I will lose every shred of respect I have for herbie if he lets lance walk.
    That would say to me he is more in for a quick buck here and there than succeeding as a franchise.
    When you are that rich, what the hell difference Is a couple million dollars, seriously.
    Last edited by khaos01207; 12-24-2013 at 07:49 PM.
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  17. #161
    Bring Back Bender bballpacen's Avatar
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Donnie has no real say in if Lance walks or not...

  18. #162
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by bballpacen View Post
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    Donnie has no real say in if Lance walks or not...
    I think he meant Herb...
    Nuntius was right. I was wrong. Frank Vogel has retained his job.

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  20. #163
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bball View Post
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    I think he meant Herb...
    Everytime I try to make a point.
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  22. #164
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strummer View Post
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    I think the fans love watching Lance play. And I'm sure Herb has noticed that. Lance will sell tickets and merchandise. Those are intangibles that make him worth keeping.

    My guess is that we match whatever offer he gets. Then it's up to Lance to decide where he wants to play.

    If Lance stays with the Pacers and they're over the luxury tax then the front office will have to make a decision at the 2015 trade deadline. Either pay the tax or trade a core player to get back under. Plenty of time to see how that plays out.
    So the exact opposite of what Larry said just one week ago.

  23. #165
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
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    So the exact opposite of what Larry said just one week ago.
    ?
    .

    Frank Vogel says "Killer instinct, start strong, build a lead and then step on their throats."

  24. #166
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacer Fan View Post
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    ?

    The part about matching whatever offer Lance gets. That's close to the opposite of what Larry said last week. He'll make Lance a fair offer but he has no problem in going another direction. Larry is not going to match any offer that Lance gets, we don't even have the right to match an offer.

  25. #167

    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
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    So the exact opposite of what Larry said just one week ago.
    I think Larry will make a fair offer, just like he said. And if Lance gets a better offer I think Larry will probably match it or at least come close. And if Lance decides to walk, Larry will get someone else, just like he said. The ball will be in Lance's court not Larry's. I'm not sure what else you expect Larry to say.

    Don't know how it's the opposite. Larry has said before that tough decisions will need to be made in the future regarding the cap situation. And I think we all understand that. I just think the Pacers will prefer to sign Lance and delay the tough decisions until the trade deadline if they can.

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  27. #168
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
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    The part about matching whatever offer Lance gets. That's close to the opposite of what Larry said last week. He'll make Lance a fair offer but he has no problem in going another direction. Larry is not going to match any offer that Lance gets, we don't even have the right to match an offer.
    I never heard him say that, somewhere I can view that? Why you say we don't have the right to match?
    .

    Frank Vogel says "Killer instinct, start strong, build a lead and then step on their throats."

  28. #169

    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacer Fan View Post
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    I never heard him say that, somewhere I can view that? Why you say we don't have the right to match?
    He's using "match" in the restricted free agency sense. Not really relevant to the discussion.

    Larry said he wants Lance to be a Pacer and that Lance wants to be here. That's why I'd expect Lance to give the Pacers a chance to match a better offer. But there's no way for anyone to know if that will happen or not.

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  30. #170

    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Ok so what teams are even going to have the cap room after resigning their own players to sign Lance? Can't be that many. Plus in a draft this deep alot of teams may draft SGs that will be much cheaper than Lance.

  31. #171
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Strummer View Post
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    I think Larry will make a fair offer, just like he said. And if Lance gets a better offer I think Larry will probably match it or at least come close. And if Lance decides to walk, Larry will get someone else, just like he said. The ball will be in Lance's court not Larry's. I'm not sure what else you expect Larry to say.

    Don't know how it's the opposite. Larry has said before that tough decisions will need to be made in the future regarding the cap situation. And I think we all understand that. I just think the Pacers will prefer to sign Lance and delay the tough decisions until the trade deadline if they can.
    I think what Larry is saying is that he'll make a fair offer within our salary limitations and not any more. He won't be able to match anything else and he won't go over the LT. The fair offer will have to be take it or leave it if you want to play elsewhere for more. In his saying that he knows we'll be fine if we have to go another direction and let Lance walk he's preparing the fanbase for that possibility.
    Secondly Lance is not restricted so we don't have the right to match another offer.

  32. #172
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacer Fan View Post
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    I never heard him say that, somewhere I can view that? Why you say we don't have the right to match?
    http://www.nba.com/pacers/news/q-and-larry-bird-2013

    I never worry about that. If Lance isn't here, we'll plug somebody else in. I don't know what's going to happen this summer. We want to keep him and he wants to be here. This is the best environment for him. We will make him a great offer, an offer that I think is very fair. If you look at our books, how does anyone know what's going to happen in the summer. How do they know we're not going to make trades or have more money or less money. We will try to sign Lance, but I don't worry about it. If Lance is not here, we'll get somebody else.

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  34. #173

    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by Pacerized View Post
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    I think what Larry is saying is that he'll make a fair offer within our salary limitations and not any more. He won't be able to match anything else and he won't go over the LT. The fair offer will have to be take it or leave it if you want to play elsewhere for more. In his saying that he knows we'll be fine if we have to go another direction and let Lance walk he's preparing the fanbase for that possibility.
    Secondly Lance is not restricted so we don't have the right to match another offer.
    Nah, he didn't say all that. There's no reason to say all that. It's waaaaaaay to early to be drawing lines in the sand.

    And that's not the kind of "matching" that's being discussed. If Lance wants to be a Pacer then his agent will bring the best offer to the Pacers to see if they're willing to come up on their offer. That's how negotiations work, there's no reason to expect Lance's case to be any different.

  35. #174
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Quote Originally Posted by able View Post
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    Are you serious, i mean is this for real ?? is that your bases for a discussion of a player ?? their EA rating???

    I just am baffled, no idea what to do with that, i must be getting terribly old, but before i let any game influence my decision or opinion, i probaly have killed a few people like in some games.
    Those are my own EA scores Lol
    David "And One" West

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  37. #175
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    Default Re: How do we keep Lance?

    Remember the day I compared Lances impact on the game to that of LeBron and then Donnie said the same thing the next day?!?

    I also, said to mark my word this board would one day wish we had ponied up and gave Lance a 4-6 mil per contract! You guys balked at me and said he ain't gettin more than 2...

    GOOD TIMES!!!

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