Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 25 of 64

Thread: Probably Kravitz most sensible column yet

  1. #1
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,762

    Default Probably Kravitz most sensible column yet

    http://www.indystar.com/story/sports...night/3949629/

    Kravitz: Pacers-Heat is a good talking point, but there's no statement to be made tonight



    There will be the obvious and understandable temptation to turn Tuesday night's Pacers-Heat clash of the titans into some kind of "statement game'' for whoever wins the game.

    If the Pacers win, it will be a statement that they are very much for real, that they're not going anywhere, that they still have Miami's number (to the extent anybody has Miami's number), that they are the new bullies on the block.

    If the Heat win, it will be a statement that they are still the big dogs in the East and throughout the NBA, that they are sick and tired of hearing how great these Pacers are and want to restore the natural order of the basketball universe.

    That would certainly make for the better column, because we're all about "grand statements'' in my biz.

    But no.

    While this is certainly more than one game out of 82, while this is the most intriguing game in the moribund Eastern Conference, there are no statements to be made here.

    First of all, the Pacers have already shown they're very much for real, having just gone a very respectable 3-2 on the Road Trip From Hell, knocking off the Clippers and Spurs in the process. Eighteen-and-3 is no fluke. This team will win more than 60 games, as long as they can avoid injuries.

    Second, this is the first game back from a long Western road trip, and history shows us that teams often fumble and stumble during their first game back from tough roadies, especially when they have to play two straight back-to-backs.

    And let's be honest about the Heat: They're coasting at 16-5. They'll turn it on when they have to turn it on, just as they did during their long winning streak last year, just as they did in the playoffs. As great as the Pacers are playing, they don't have that fifth (or is it sixth?) gear the Heat possess. For all of the Pacers' excellence, they don't have a LeBron James, and when James and even Dwyane Wade are at the top of their games, nobody in the league can touch them.

    A couple of months from now, these two teams will meet in the Eastern Conference Finals, and what happens here Tuesday night, and what happens when they play again in the regular season, won't mean squat.

    This game will come down to the same things that Pacers-Heat games always come down to: If the Pacers can dominate the paint, as they always did in their victories over the Heat, they will win. If the Heat can compete in the paint and not get worn out on the offensive glass, they will win. There's not much mystery to this rivalry, never has been.

    My guess is LeBron and Wade have heard just about enough about the Pacers' grand ascension and the whispers that there's a new sheriff in town, and my guess is the Heat will find a way to win this game.

    And in the long run, it won't mean much.

    As long as the Pacers can eventually earn homecourt advantage, get a potential Game 7 on their home floor, that's what matters.

    I like Big Statements.

    I don't see one being made Tuesday night.
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 12-10-2013 at 09:31 AM.

  2. The Following 10 Users Say Thank You to Unclebuck For This Useful Post:


  3. #2
    Member Sollozzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    16,607

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    It won't matter in five months, but it matters now. Both of these teams really want to win this game and will be playing as hard as you can in the regular season. It's a huge game and the loser will be disappointed. You move on afterwords, but tonight it matters a lot.

  4. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Sollozzo For This Useful Post:


  5. #3
    Member
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Lifelong Indy-area resident
    Age
    62
    Posts
    4,654

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    I don't buy into Kravitz viewpoint at all. The Pacers are putting everything they have into being the #1 seed, so it only figures that each game against your primary competitor is twice as important as any other game. We need the best record and we need to own the tie breaker against Miami to be in the best possible position.

    Just another game? Hardly. Tonight's game will be played like a playoff game, as will each game against Miami this season. To think otherwise is only a failed attempt to fool one's self.

  6. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to beast23 For This Useful Post:


  7. #4
    Pacer Junky Will Galen's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    10,045

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    It won't matter in five months, but it matters now. Both of these teams really want to win this game and will be playing as hard as you can in the regular season. It's a huge game and the loser will be disappointed. You move on afterwords, but tonight it matters a lot.
    Disclaimer. No it doesn't really matter now either, and never did in the larger picture of life. It's just something that matters to those of us that have chosen to let it matter to us. Even today our life could change so much that we could care less who wins this game or any game.

    If any one on this board has a life altering moment like that today I hope it's because your tests come back negative, or she says yes, she will marry you, or yes she will go out with you, or your wife just had a healthy baby that the two of you have been wanting for years. ETC.

    However, if no one has such a moment today, "Go Pacers!"

  8. The Following User Says Thank You to Will Galen For This Useful Post:


  9. #5
    Member Sollozzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    16,607

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Quote Originally Posted by Will Galen View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Disclaimer. No it doesn't really matter now either, and never did in the larger picture of life. It's just something that matters to those of us that have chosen to let it matter to us. Even today our life could change so much that we could care less who wins this game or any game.

    If any one on this board has a life altering moment like that today I hope it's because your tests come back negative, or she says yes, she will marry you, or yes she will go out with you, or your wife just had a healthy baby that the two of you have been wanting for years. ETC.

    However, if no one has such a moment today, "Go Pacers!"
    I'm not trying to say that this game tonight is more important than family, health, well-being, or life itself. If you have a baby being born tonight, then yes you need to be with your wife and family instead of watching this game.

    But this is an Indiana Pacers forum. For the Indiana Pacers and their fans who follow the team as a fun hobby to take their mind off of real life for a bit, it does matter. It's not going to matter much in May, but it matters now. The Heat very much want to come in here and shut us up, while the Pacers obviously want to make an early season statement in front of their home fans.

    Also, any match-up against the Heat could be important at the end of the season when looking at seeding. We want that home court advantage over them and every game counts.

  10. #6
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,762

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Quote Originally Posted by beast23 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I don't buy into Kravitz viewpoint at all. The Pacers are putting everything they have into being the #1 seed, so it only figures that each game against your primary competitor is twice as important as any other game. We need the best record and we need to own the tie breaker against Miami to be in the best possible position.

    Just another game? Hardly. Tonight's game will be played like a playoff game, as will each game against Miami this season. To think otherwise is only a failed attempt to fool one's self.

    Well we could lose every game we play to the Heat this regular season and still end up with the number 1 seed, or we could beat them every time by 35 points and the Heat could still get the number 1 seed.

    So while on a pure math basis these games mean a little more, I tend to agree with Kravitz point. Having home court is important especially to the Pacers. But what happens in the regular season between these two teams won't impact directly what happens in the playoffs.

    Kravitz does say home court advantage is important.

    Having said that I am really looking forward to tonights game, should be a fun and intense game. (wiish it was being played tomorrow night instead of tonight, because I worry a little about the Pacers being a little hungover from the road trip) But we'll see. Should be a fun game. But what ever happens tonight as far as the outcome either way won't change my opinion of what will happen in the playoffs
    Last edited by Unclebuck; 12-10-2013 at 08:59 AM.

  11. #7
    Member Pacergeek's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2009
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    3,454

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Tonight's game is a "must win". We have to distance ourselves from Miami in order to secure the #1 seed
    David "And One" West

  12. #8
    Get well PG! DGPR's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Whiteland, IN
    Age
    28
    Posts
    2,034

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    We can talk about how unimportant this game is going to be in the grand scheme of things, but we know for certain that both of these teams are going to come to play hard in order to make a statement. Both fanbases are going to be fired up because it's only natural to be proud of your team. It might not be a significant game but that's not going to stop the fans and players from thinking different.
    "I've got an idea--an idea so smart that my head would explode if I even began to know what I'm talking about." - Peter Griffin

  13. #9
    Member owl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    4,201

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    In a couple of months????? Try 4 months. It is a long season.
    {o,o}
    |)__)
    -"-"-

  14. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to owl For This Useful Post:


  15. #10

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    While I agree with the premise that this game is just one game of 82, the column reeks of sour grapes.

  16. #11
    DIET COKE! Trader Joe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Troll Hunting
    Age
    26
    Posts
    30,871

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probably Kravitz most sensible column yet

    When was the last time Wade was at the top of his game? I swear that guy is an evil genius, getting Lebron to come to Miami has extended his "greatness" an extra two years already.

    “WE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKING”- Frank Vogel
    momentarygodsblog.com https://twitter.com/momentarygods

  17. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Trader Joe For This Useful Post:


  18. #12

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Sounds like he's making excuses for why he thinks the Pacers will lose. If I got this right...

    "We're going to lose at home to the team that's been our biggest rival for the past couple years, but don't worry it doesn't mean anything!"



    Personally, I'm bummed I won't be able to watch the game. Would love to see Paul George vs Lebron and Lance vs whoever gets in his way again. And Hibbert should have his best game of the season so far, their interior defense and rebounding are abysmal.

  19. #13

    Default Re: Probably Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Three cheers to Kravitz for ignoring the temptation to drive clicks with mindless hyperbole. Sports media is overflowing with drivel to satiate the hyped-up fan.

    I hope there is room in the world for sports coverage that caters to a specific hometown fan base that still has perspective, content, and analysis.

    Good on you, Kravitz.

  20. #14
    Administrator Unclebuck's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Posts
    32,762

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Quote Originally Posted by DGPR View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    We can talk about how unimportant this game is going to be in the grand scheme of things, but we know for certain that both of these teams are going to come to play hard in order to make a statement. Both fanbases are going to be fired up because it's only natural to be proud of your team. It might not be a significant game but that's not going to stop the fans and players from thinking different.
    I guess I don't believe any statement can be made tonight. (but then I don't really believe in statements to begin with) But if I were to play along, what possible statement could be made tonight. Both teams know the other is really good. If the Heat win by 35, what does that tell us? If the pacers win by 35, what does that tell us? I don't think anything that relates to the playoffs. We know these are the two best teams in the east, each team knows what they must do to beat the other.

    Or let me ask it this way. During 1994 - through 2000 does anyone remember any regular season games between the Knicks and the Pacers? I don't.

    Let me be clear though I am not saying tonights game is meaningless, as regular season games go this is big. I want to see the strategy, matchups so see what if anything has changed from last season. And certainly I want the pacers to win, because next week we play at Miami, and I want to have home court against the heat in the ECF, so tonights game is important for those seasons.

    But what statement could possibly be made?

  21. The Following User Says Thank You to Unclebuck For This Useful Post:


  22. #15
    Member owl's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    4,201

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    But what statement could possibly be made?

    19-3 is what this is all about.
    {o,o}
    |)__)
    -"-"-

  23. #16
    It is ka Thankee sai Major Cold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Garrett, IN
    Posts
    9,079
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probably Kravitz most sensible column yet

    I agree with this article. If we lose it doesn't mean we have no shot of beating the Heat in the playoffs. And if we win it doesn't mean we are a shoe-in to beat them. I understand playing for the number one seed. But I don't want us to put too much stock in power rankings and storylines. As fans I guess if you want to go ahead. But players shouldn't.

    This games is as important as the next. Simple as that.

  24. #17
    Member circlecitysportsfan's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Noblesville, IN
    Age
    33
    Posts
    579
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probably Kravitz most sensible column yet

    It's more important than any other game this season. A win gives us a better record and 1-0 in a tie breaker situation. They are the only threat to the Pacers getting the one seed. It's like a division game in the NFL. To say it is no more important than anyother game is a lie.

  25. The Following User Says Thank You to circlecitysportsfan For This Useful Post:


  26. #18

    Default Re: Probably Kravitz most sensible column yet

    I hated this article. We as fans don't want to read how these games don't mean much. This is the biggest game of the year up to this point. I know Kravitz is trying to curb some enthusiasm and soften the blow if we lose, but c'mon.. this is the best Pacer team in 30+ years. Let's get hyped up for the game!

  27. The Following User Says Thank You to PaceBalls For This Useful Post:


  28. #19
    Member Sollozzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    16,607

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Quote Originally Posted by Unclebuck View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I guess I don't believe any statement can be made tonight. (but then I don't really believe in statements to begin with) But if I were to play along, what possible statement could be made tonight. Both teams know the other is really good. If the Heat win by 35, what does that tell us? If the pacers win by 35, what does that tell us? I don't think anything that relates to the playoffs. We know these are the two best teams in the east, each team knows what they must do to beat the other.

    Or let me ask it this way. During 1994 - through 2000 does anyone remember any regular season games between the Knicks and the Pacers? I don't.

    Let me be clear though I am not saying tonights game is meaningless, as regular season games go this is big. I want to see the strategy, matchups so see what if anything has changed from last season. And certainly I want the pacers to win, because next week we play at Miami, and I want to have home court against the heat in the ECF, so tonights game is important for those seasons.

    But what statement could possibly be made?

    Yes, I remember the intense Christmas Day game in 1999 when the Fieldhouse was in its first season. That was the game when Rose and Kurt Thomas got ejected. Coming off that disastrous 1999 ECF series, that Christmas Day game was no doubt a big game for both teams, especially the Pacers. The Pacers, who had been humiliated in that 1999 series, no doubt needed the boost from that big win on National TV in their brand new stadium. Don't forget that the 1999-00 team actually started out a mediocre 6-6. Do teams get big boosts from big regular season wins against rival opponents? Absolutely.

    No one is going to be able to give you some deep philosophical meaning as to what "statement" could be made. But this is a far bigger game for both teams than a game in Milwaukee. Now will the loser rebound tomorrow and go on to win a lot more games this season? Of course they will. But for tonight, this game matters as much as a December regular season game possibly can. That's the best way I can define "statement". These teams met in the ECF's last year, know each other well, and very much want to beat each other tonight so that they are the main NBA story on ESPN tomorrow. Life will go on afterwords, but for tonight it matters. And it does potentially have real meaning as far as seeding down the line is concerned.

  29. The Following User Says Thank You to Sollozzo For This Useful Post:


  30. #20
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    It won't matter in five months, but it matters now. Both of these teams really want to win this game and will be playing as hard as you can in the regular season. It's a huge game and the loser will be disappointed. You move on afterwords, but tonight it matters a lot.
    That, and it matters in that you can look to see how the matchups could play out in the postseason.

  31. The Following User Says Thank You to Hicks For This Useful Post:


  32. #21
    DIET COKE! Trader Joe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Troll Hunting
    Age
    26
    Posts
    30,871

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probably Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Yeah, I mean it doesn't look huge now, but home court could be decided by one or two games between us and Miami. These head to head matchups are basically the best way to guarantee yourself a leg up on them. I normally understand what Kravitz is saying, but if we lose homecourt by a game, Bobbo will probably be the first one two write a column saying how we missed out on chances to beat Miami at home if we lose tonight, and with the trip to Miami next week it seems important to me to get the early leg up. If you lose tonight and then you lose next week in Miami even if you win your other games between then the Heat can still catch you just from those two games.

    So I argue these games since we know Indy and Miami are the top two in the conference and are battling for home court in the ECF, that these games are important right now and in 5 months.

    “WE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKING”- Frank Vogel
    momentarygodsblog.com https://twitter.com/momentarygods

  33. The Following User Says Thank You to Trader Joe For This Useful Post:


  34. #22
    It is ka Thankee sai Major Cold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Garrett, IN
    Posts
    9,079
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probably Kravitz most sensible column yet

    I would buy the whole tie breaker thing if we played 16 games. Tie breakers are not as important in the NBA as they are in the NFL. If it was close in March I would agree. I just don't see this game as important than the OKC or Spurs game.

    Sure a game against a playoff team is different than one against the Bucks. But to say that it is a must-win statement game is short sided.

  35. The Following User Says Thank You to Major Cold For This Useful Post:

    RWB

  36. #23
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: Probablly Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Quote Originally Posted by xIndyFan View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    While I agree with the premise that this game is just one game of 82, the column reeks of sour grapes.
    I didn't sense sour grapes so much as I sensed nonchalance.

  37. #24
    I'm on a MAC! graphic-er's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    7,412

    Default Re: Probably Kravitz most sensible column yet

    You're all wrong! Kravitz is Wrong! This is a huge game. This could be the potential Tiebreaker for the #1 seed. The homecourt winning streak is on the line. These 2 teams are only 2 losses apart, so any head to head match up is huge.

    There is definitely a statement to be made by the Pacers if we win this game. It says that we are going to own this conference, and that the Miami's of the world will be chasing us this year. Also this is a statement game internally for the team's confidence. You just got embarrassed on the road against the best team in the West. You haven't lost 2 games in a row yet. If you drop this game, all the sudden you have some chinks in your armor so to speak. You gotta beat the elite teams of his league to win the championship. So far they are playing about .500 ball against elite competition. Wins against Bulls, Clippers, Wolves, Spurs. Losses to Bulls, Blazers, Thunder.
    You can't get champagne from a garden hose.

  38. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to graphic-er For This Useful Post:


  39. #25
    DIET COKE! Trader Joe's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Troll Hunting
    Age
    26
    Posts
    30,871

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: Probably Kravitz most sensible column yet

    Quote Originally Posted by Major Cold View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I would buy the whole tie breaker thing if we played 16 games. Tie breakers are not as important in the NBA as they are in the NFL. If it was close in March I would agree. I just don't see this game as important than the OKC or Spurs game.

    Sure a game against a playoff team is different than one against the Bucks. But to say that it is a must-win statement game is short sided.
    Forget tiebreaks, if we lose tonight and Miami wins they cut a whole game off of our lead. This home court advantage is going to be decided by a game or two. We are not going to check out on this Miami team, they won't let us get anything more than a 3 game lead IMO so we need to take advantage of these head to head matchups. It's the only way to guarantee a loss for your competition. It would be different if the East was a 3 or 4 team race, but this is it. Anything other than a Miami-Indy ECF at this point would be a huge upset. These games mean a lot. Are they must wins? No, they aren't, but they are huge, huge games.

    “WE NEVER SURRENDER, WE NEVER GIVE UP, WE KEEP ATTACKING”- Frank Vogel
    momentarygodsblog.com https://twitter.com/momentarygods

  40. The Following 7 Users Say Thank You to Trader Joe For This Useful Post:


Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •