Page 11 of 15 FirstFirst ... 789101112131415 LastLast
Results 251 to 275 of 375

Thread: The bench still isn't good enough

  1. #251
    bleed Blue & Gold PacersPride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,217

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I've stated how I feel Bird has done a great job NUMEROUS TIME! I said when Walsh was in control I wanted Bird back, so just drop it. Find something else to try and start an argument.

    I feel Mahinmi game of late has been poor. That's my opinion, and you are more than welcome to disagree with it.



    No, this isn't going to spiral that way.


  2. #252

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Which would mean the Pacers would have 7,283,522 to re-sign Lance, and two other players. Unless there's a straight up swap of Ian for another player, or Ian/XX for YY/ZZ it doesn't make financial sense.

    Maybe I'm missing something, but if you use Mahinmi and Copeland's salary which are on the books next year to get Varejao, how is that salary going to affect re-signing Stephenson? You have to either pay the salary to Ian and Copeland or to Varejao if you traded for him. The salary is there, it can't go away unless you workout a deal and take back a TE. Getting a TE is slim and next to none.

    Granger is an expiring, so some of that salary is available to re-sign either Stephenson or Granger unless Herb is willing to go into LT Land which he's been adamant about not doing.

  3. The Following User Says Thank You to Justin Tyme For This Useful Post:


  4. #253
    Member CableKC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Jose, CA ( 1123, 6536, 5321 )
    Age
    41
    Posts
    24,364

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Maybe I'm missing something, but if you use Mahinmi and Copeland's salary which are on the books next year to get Varejao, how is that salary going to affect re-signing Stephenson? You have to either pay the salary to Ian and Copeland or to Varejao if you traded for him. The salary is there, it can't go away unless you workout a deal and take back a TE. Getting a TE is slim and next to none.

    Granger is an expiring, so some of that salary is available to re-sign either Stephenson or Granger unless Herb is willing to go into LT Land which he's been adamant about not doing.
    Ignoring that I doubt that the Cavs would trade Varajeo to the Pacers for that package .....there is a difference in how much you can offer Lance when it comes to having Mahinmi+Copeland ( both owed a total $7.1 mil in 2014-2015 ) or Varajeo ( owed $9.7 mil in 2014-2015 ) on the books. Add in that with Mahinmi+Copeland, you will only have to add 2 Players ( Lance + 13th Player ) compared to adding 3 Players ( Lance + 12th + 13th Player ) if you have Varajeo on the books.

    The Pacers will likely have rougly $7 to 8 mil to sign 2 Players ( Lance and the 13th Player to fill the roster ) next season before hitting the LT if Mahinmi+Copeland are still on the books at a combined $7.1 mil in salary. Assuming that the Pacers sign some Vet at the minimum at $800k to fill that 13th spot on the roster...that would mean that the best offer that the Pacers can offer Lance is something starting at $6.2 to 7.2 mil a year.

    If Varajeo is on the Pacers ( which would make someone here very happy << cough cough vnzla81 >> ), he would add $9.7 mil to the books ( compared to the $7.1 mil that Mahinmi and Copeland are owed ). By doing a "2 for 1" trade....the roster would now be at 10 Players instead of 11 Players....adding a 12th and 13th Player at a Vet minimum price at $800k a piece, that would mean that the Pacers could ( at most...without going over the LT ) offer Lance a contract starting at $3 to 4 mil a year before hitting the LT.
    Last edited by CableKC; 12-11-2013 at 06:43 PM.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

  5. #254
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Danberry
    Age
    54
    Posts
    11,463

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Varajao on the Pacers would make ME very happy, I just think we can't afford it and that's why we didn't get him already.
    BillS

    "Every time I pitched it was like throwing gasoline on a fire. Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw!"
    - Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh

  6. #255
    bleed Blue & Gold PacersPride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,217

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I've stated how I feel Bird has done a great job NUMEROUS TIME! I said when Walsh was in control I wanted Bird back, so just drop it.

    NUMEROUS times I read you wanted Bird gone. I cant believe you would boldface deny it.
    Last edited by PacersPride; 12-11-2013 at 06:53 PM.

  7. #256
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Age
    33
    Posts
    28,142

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Varajao on the Pacers would make ME very happy, I just think we can't afford it and that's why we didn't get him already.
    Varejao makes 9mil this year but his contract next year is non guaranteed meaning that the Pacers could cut him if they wanted to.


    Ian+OJ+Cope+pick for Varejao+Miles works.

    Watson,Miles,DG,Scola and Varejao

  8. #257

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Trading Copeland is a bad move. Doesn't make sense, Indy invested in wooing him in the off-season. Trading him would be weird. It would also reflect badly on the front office. We can't say he didn't work out, because we never really played him ya know? I am fine with trading the rest though. EDIT out Miles, don't need him.

  9. #258
    bleed Blue & Gold PacersPride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,217

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Varejao makes 9mil this year but his contract next year is non guaranteed meaning that the Pacers could cut him if they wanted to.


    Ian+OJ+Cope+pick for Varejao+Miles works.

    Watson,Miles,DG,Scola and Varejao

    Now please go to Cavs board and see if you can convince them of this. Then please post the thread to see if this trade idea has merit.

    If it does, then I would say it fits the reasonableness clause.

  10. #259
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Danberry
    Age
    54
    Posts
    11,463

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Varejao makes 9mil this year but his contract next year is non guaranteed meaning that the Pacers could cut him if they wanted to.


    Ian+OJ+Cope+pick for Varejao+Miles works.

    Watson,Miles,DG,Scola and Varejao
    Seriously, though, why would Cleveland do that deal? If Ian, OJ, and Cope are as bad as everyone thinks, why would they make a trade for a late second round pick or first rounder from 2015 or later? If I'm Cleveland, I run screaming from that - and I suspect tanking yet again isn't really an option, not if they want to keep Kyrie down the road.
    BillS

    "Every time I pitched it was like throwing gasoline on a fire. Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw!"
    - Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh

  11. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to BillS For This Useful Post:


  12. #260
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Age
    33
    Posts
    28,142

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Seriously, though, why would Cleveland do that deal? If Ian, OJ, and Cope are as bad as everyone thinks, why would they make a trade for a late second round pick or first rounder from 2015 or later? If I'm Cleveland, I run screaming from that - and I suspect tanking yet again isn't really an option, not if they want to keep Kyrie down the road.
    I have to admit it that is my dream trade but as always you never know, maybe Cleveland wants more picks? I think OJ has some value, same with Ian, Cope has not value and he is garbage (smilie means that I'm joking).

    By the way think about it Scola and Varejao together? (it means that I'm drooling at the thought of watching those two players together).

  13. #261
    Member Sollozzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    16,473

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    My eyes are starting to hurt from all the red.

  14. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Sollozzo For This Useful Post:


  15. #262

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I have to admit it that is my dream trade but as always you never know, maybe Cleveland wants more picks? I think OJ has some value, same with Ian, Cope has not value and he is garbage (smilie means that I'm joking).

    By the way think about it Scola and Varejao together? (it means that I'm drooling at the thought of watching those two players together).
    I can, they would be slow, Varejao has lost a step after coming back, he used to be the Jokhim Noah for Cavs, now he is just a overpaid backup.

  16. #263
    Wasting Light Hicks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583
    Mood

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    My eyes are starting to hurt from all the red.
    You may want to see an optometrist for that!

  17. #264
    Member CableKC's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2005
    Location
    San Jose, CA ( 1123, 6536, 5321 )
    Age
    41
    Posts
    24,364

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimp View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Trading Copeland is a bad move. Doesn't make sense, Indy invested in wooing him in the off-season. Trading him would be weird. It would also reflect badly on the front office. We can't say he didn't work out, because we never really played him ya know? I am fine with trading the rest though. EDIT out Miles, don't need him.
    I agree with you on Copeland and think that he would have served a bigger role in the line up if Scola wasn't acquired....but he ( unfortunately ) is a luxury that I do not think the Pacers can afford given that OJ and Solo on the roster. Unless the Pacers think that they can re-sign Lance for $6 to 7 mil a year ( which I think is borderline at this point...cuz I REALLY think that some team will OVERPAY him at $8 mil a year...which the Pacers cannot pay without going over the LT ), then trading Copeland or Mahinmi ( which I don't think is sensible ) is the only realistic option that we have.

    I'm in favor of trading Copeland not because he's good or bad ( to me, he is solid 3pt shooting role Player ) but because he adds $3+ mil to the 2014-2015 Salary Cap. IMHO...I think that we need as much CapSpace as possible to re-sign Lance.
    Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

    This is David West, he is the Honey Badger, West just doesn't give a *****....he's pretty bad *ss cuz he has no regard for any other Player or Team whatsoever.

  18. The Following User Says Thank You to CableKC For This Useful Post:


  19. #265
    All Hail CJ Watson! Nuntius's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Location
    Somewhere in Southern Europe
    Posts
    18,878

    Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by FlavaDave View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Here are the four Mahinmi fouls from last night:

    Mahinmi P.FOUL (P1.T4)
    Mahinmi S.FOUL (P2.PN) @
    Mahinmi L.B.FOUL (P3.PN) @
    Mahinmi S.FOUL (P4.PN)

    Here are all of the shots within 10' when Mahinmi was on the court:

    Wade 1' Layup (4 PTS)
    MISS Andersen 3' Layup *
    Cole 2' Driving Reverse Layup (4 PTS) (Wade 3 AST)
    MISS Andersen 5' Jump Shot *
    Stephenson S.FOUL (P2.T3)
    MISS Wade 6' Jump Shot
    Cole 4' Driving Layup (7 PTS)
    MISS James 1' Layup


    A * denotes a couple of particularly good Mahinmi plays, and a @ denotes a couple of especially bad Ian plays.

    Thoughts?
    Thanks for posting them.

    Ian had those two bad plays that you mentioned (biting on Wade's pump fake and losing that rebound) but he also had some good plays as well.
    Tonight, all flags must burn, in place of steeples.
    Autonomy must return into the hands of the people.

    Panopticon

    -------------

    CJ Watson - 20 points on 6/10 shooting!

    13/4/2014

  20. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to Nuntius For This Useful Post:


  21. #266
    bleed Blue & Gold PacersPride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,217

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    For those crucifying Mahinmi,, after watching the 2nd qtr tonite other than the bad fouls Mahinmi gave us solid minutes.

    he had a block on birdman to start the 2nd spurring a fast break. nice offensive rebound on missed FT, kicked out to OJ for a 3 that was missed. had some solid rebounds and made smart fundamental passes. only took one bad shot,,, but to be fair anyshot not 2 feet at the rim is a bad shot for Ian. lol. I don't get the hate.

    he fumbled one ball away. that's Ian. but at 4M.... what do we expect from a backup center.

    are we expecting Dikembe D. Rik Smits scoring. Dale Davis rebounding and D. those are all 8+M players.


    This is based purely upon watching the pacers 2nd qtr for the 2nd time and some plays way more than once. this is not based on previous games etc.


    I don't care so much about Ians fouls. Except that maybe he should foul them harder.

  22. #267

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by PacersPride View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote

    NUMEROUS times I read you wanted Bird gone. I cant believe you would boldface deny it.

    I'm not going to dignify that with and answer anymore than I will read the PM you sent me.

    Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you and yours!

  23. #268
    bleed Blue & Gold PacersPride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,217

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I'm not going to dignify that with and answer anymore than I will read the PM you sent me.

    Merry Christmas and Happy New Year to you and yours!
    Can you diginify it. I rescind the honorable comment.

    Merry Christmas to you as well.

    Go Pacers!

  24. #269
    Member Since86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Muncie
    Posts
    20,908

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Justin Tyme View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Maybe I'm missing something, but if you use Mahinmi and Copeland's salary which are on the books next year to get Varejao, how is that salary going to affect re-signing Stephenson? You have to either pay the salary to Ian and Copeland or to Varejao if you traded for him. The salary is there, it can't go away unless you workout a deal and take back a TE. Getting a TE is slim and next to none.

    Granger is an expiring, so some of that salary is available to re-sign either Stephenson or Granger unless Herb is willing to go into LT Land which he's been adamant about not doing.
    Because the NBA has a minimum roster size. If you take salary from two players, and give it to one, you still have to replace that one player and a little bit of salary which makes it even more difficult to re-sign Lance. Splitting 8mil two ways is easier than splitting it three ways, especially when Lance is going to eat pretty much all of it. You give Lance, say, 7M and sign someone else for the minimum you can get in under the LT line. If you have to sign Lance at 7M, and then have to sign two players, they won't be able to stay under the LT.
    Last edited by Since86; 12-12-2013 at 09:15 AM.
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right. ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

    Larry Bird: Yeah, patience.

  25. #270
    bleed Blue & Gold PacersPride's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Posts
    3,217

    Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by PacersPride View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    more and more I like what butler has brought,,, if his defense is solid than he may deserve minutes.

    okay whose reading my posts and submitting them to Coach Vogel.lol. in all earnestness, I liked what Butler brought in the OKC game and nice to see him get playing time. His offense is what we are missing on the wing with the second unit. below are Butler career stats. He was a primarily a starter for the clippers as recent as 2010.

    http://espn.go.com/nba/player/stats/.../rasual-butler


    If Butler plays consistently Cope becomes very expendable.

  26. #271

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by PacersPride View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    okay whose reading my posts and submitting them to Coach Vogel.lol. in all earnestness, I liked what Butler brought in the OKC game and nice to see him get playing time. His offense is what we are missing on the wing with the second unit. below are Butler career stats. He was a primarily a starter for the clippers as recent as 2010.

    http://espn.go.com/nba/player/stats/.../rasual-butler

    If Butler plays consistently Cope becomes very expendable.
    Cope has been expendable for quite a while. Really would like to try and trade him to the Kings for Fredette. SImply because he is expiring after the year

  27. #272
    Member Sollozzo's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jan 2004
    Location
    Indianapolis, IN
    Posts
    16,473

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Mad-Mad-Mario View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Cope has been expendable for quite a while.

    Yeah, since the moment he put pen to paper on that contract.

  28. The Following User Says Thank You to Sollozzo For This Useful Post:


  29. #273
    Wasting Light Hicks's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583
    Mood

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Yeah, since the moment he put pen to paper on that contract.
    Since the Scola trade.

  30. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Hicks For This Useful Post:


  31. #274
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Age
    33
    Posts
    28,142

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Since the Pacers were in the process of printing the fake ESPN magazine lol I still can't believe they did that for a player like him haha

  32. #275
    The Last Great Pacer BlueNGold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Posts
    14,996

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Hicks View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Since the Scola trade.
    Thank goodness we got Scola. I really think we under utilize him in the post.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •