Page 9 of 15 FirstFirst ... 5678910111213 ... LastLast
Results 201 to 225 of 375

Thread: The bench still isn't good enough

  1. #201
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Danberry
    Age
    55
    Posts
    11,650

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by P_George View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Sorry apparently an acronym of WTF is a offensive on these boards.
    And, to be clear, the part of the post that was admin edited wasn't because of WTF, it was because of "what game did you watch". The new guidelines are being posted soon, and part of what will be cracked down on is the implications that someone isn't intelligent or didn't watch the game (or watch the game "properly"), especially when standalone without anything to indicate WHAT a poster thinks might have been missed.

    Not everyone sees the same things in a game, and there's also a huge difference between live/broadcast/DVR with constant rewind. Calling someone out like they didn't have a basis for their opinion is going to have to stop because it shows a marked disrespect for posters.

    And that's all there will be to this in this thread (it's only here to make an explanation of a specific move). Please take any response to the feedback forum.
    BillS

    "Every time I pitched it was like throwing gasoline on a fire. Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw!"
    - Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh

  2. The Following User Says Thank You to BillS For This Useful Post:


  3. #202

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Hey thanks for the video I didn't know you could get those.

    On the play I think Ian is overplaying Cole there is not need for him to almost block Watson, as soon as he did that the defense got out of position and the AND1 happened, Ian kind of reminds me of David Harrison his excitement a lot of times when on his way.
    First, I put "asses" instead of "assess". Guess PD doesn't filter that out. Huh.

    Second, on that play I would say Watson made a big mistake, letting Cole get past him clean without a screen. I would say Ian had no choice but to cut Cole off, and did his best to try and contain Birdman as well. This difference in opinion might partially explain our different assessments of his defensive abilities.

    Now, offensively Ian is a flaming pile of garbage. No argument here. I also don't think Mahinmi had an outstanding game.

    But his rim defense was a (big) factor in this game. I think that this rim defense in this game could be replicated with (off your list) Varejao, Splitter, JO, Asik, or Collison. Not sure how realistic those guys are for trade targets/free agents 4 mil per.

    But replacements aside, I think a "solid offense, solid rebounding, average-to-weak" defensive big would a) put up a better stat line, b) make fewer "drop the rebound off the free throw miss & foul" epic blunders that Ian made in this game, and c) would be a net negative vs. the Heat because of Miami's ability to get to the rim (and this strawman's inability to defend the rim at the level of Mahinmi).
    Last edited by FlavaDave; 12-11-2013 at 12:01 PM.

  4. #203

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Really? WHO said he was "awesome"? In fact the very post you seem to be referring to specifically stated it said nothing about how Ian did individually, just that it wasn't as much of a problem for the team as people seem to be thinking.

    There is a lot of area between "sucks and should never see the floor" and "is awesome a #1 center in the league", and some of that includes things like "below average", "ok in some areas and horrible in others", and "not the worst". It grinds my gears that anyone trying to make a reasonable assessment gets accused of being a jocker or hater, like the only opinions allowed are that someone is the best or that they are the worst.

    Can we please stop labeling people with differing opinions as blind idiots or extrapolating a "wait, this part wasn't so bad" into "OMFG HE'S AMAZING I WANT TO HAVE HIS BABIES"?

    I mean, really, the part of the discussion between vnzla81 and FlavaDave is the ABSOLUTE RIGHT WAY TO DO THIS. Example and counter example without anyone (so far) calling anyone names.
    The irony in your post is amazing. You're trying to act like we're overreacting to another poor performance by Mahimi when in reality, you're overreacting to the discussion at hand. From what I've read, no one has called anyone an idiot. Questioning someone's interpretation of a game they watched when Person A says Player A played a good game(particularly defensively) and the vast majority of people that saw Player A said that he stunk up the joint, defense included. How's that offensive to question what game he watched? I'd love to know how he came to the conclusion that Player A did anything well, because shooting %'s dropped when he was in? That's a poor argument at best.

    And the person I quoted originally specifically said, "We must look for different things in Centers. Ian was really good tonight IMO his defense was huge." Sorry, that is not referencing a "team" thing that's referencing Mahimi specifically. Would you argue that Mahimi was good defensively, or "huge" defensively(his words)? That comment is baffling to me.

  5. The Following User Says Thank You to P_George For This Useful Post:


  6. #204

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Has anybody taken a look around the league at other current backup Centers? I can see where the general consensus would be Ian isn't in the Top 5, but he's certainly in the Top 10. It would be nice to have the money for Asik or Hakeem in his prime coming off the bench, but unfortunately for us all of our money is tied up in the best starting unit around. Wait... is that unfortunate?

    When you have George Hill, Lance Stephenson, Paul George, David West, Roy Hibbert, Danny Granger, and Luis Scola in a small market... you can't really supplement them with Mike Conley, Kevin Martin, and Marc Gasol off the bench. In my opinion, if a backup center who only needs to give us 15-17 minutes a game is our biggest problem, we must be doing something right.

    Larry Bird.

  7. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to dgranger17 For This Useful Post:


  8. #205
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Indy
    Posts
    8,061

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    I think it comes down to expectations. I don't expect Ian to be as good as Roy, so when he isn't as good as Roy I am not disappointed. There is a reason why Ian is a backup and not a starter. So I don't expect him to produce like a starter, and don't get upset when he doesn't produce like a starter.
    Last edited by Eleazar; 12-11-2013 at 12:55 PM.

  9. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Eleazar For This Useful Post:


  10. #206

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Eleazar View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I think it comes down to expectations. I don't expect Ian to be as good as Roy, so when he isn't as good as Roy I am not disappointed.
    I don't think anybody expects that, at all.

    We expect more then 2.5PPG(35% shooting), 2.8 RPG, .9 BPG, 1.0 TOPG, 2.7 FPG in 15.0 MPG.

    These are the numbers that are scary. 15MPG is pretty high for a back-up big. The fact he's shooting so poorly, turning it over, and fouling at such an incredibly high rate in those 15 minutes is scary. When you continue to factor in that he's regressing defensively the last several games, what's the justification for keeping him? No better options? I'd contest that all day. There's a lot of better(IMO) back-up bigs that aren't on huge prices tags.

    FWIW - his PER36 are scary bad. He's being completely inefficient this year.

  11. #207
    It is ka Thankee sai Major Cold's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2006
    Location
    Garrett, IN
    Posts
    9,115
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    How would you asses Ian's defense in the play? Should he have done something differently?
    Hey thanks for the video I didn't know you could get those.

    On the play I think Ian is overplaying Cole there is not need for him to almost block Watson, as soon as he did that the defense got out of position and the AND1 happened, Ian kind of reminds me of David Harrison his excitement a lot of times when on his way.[/QUOTE]


    This was part of the system. If a defender is incapable of keeping the player out of the paint, the paint will be protected by a rotating big. If anything the second rotation was not there. I am not suggesting leaving Ray Allen open (which I believe this was the intent of the play). Both Paul George and West we too tight on their man. It was a broken assignment and a blown assignment. I don't fault Ian as much as you. And I am willing to bet that when the team saw the film they weren't tearing Ian a new one.

    The defensive rotations are off when the bench comes in. Most teams are not exploiting it, but good teams are. THe Thunder and Spurs did it to us time and time again. Ian's fouls are not all because Ian is trash. It is because we are lacking the chemistry. I suspect his fouls will go down. Ian is a good screener and a above average rebounder. He had a decent first half:
    http://stats.nba.com/cvp.html?GameID...ameEventID=121
    http://stats.nba.com/cvp.html?GameID...ameEventID=153

    The second half was horrid for Ian on the offensive end. In fact that is the biggest complaint I have on him. He is missing shots and FTs. He does turnover the ball too frequently. And if he had not been called for that stupid foul on Wade and had not sent Turdman for an AND1 he would have given us what we needed. That is why I don't think he was useless.

    Offensively we need OJ to hit the three more than Ian to not turn the ball over.

  12. #208
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Age
    33
    Posts
    28,142

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by FlavaDave View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    First, I put "asses" instead of "assess". Guess PD doesn't filter that out. Huh.

    Second, on that play I would say Watson made a big mistake, letting Cole get past him clean without a screen. I would say Ian had no choice but to cut Cole off, and did his best to try and contain Birdman as well. This difference in opinion might partially explain our different assessments of his defensive abilities.

    Now, offensively Ian is a flaming pile of garbage. No argument here. I also don't think Mahinmi had a particularly good game.

    But his rim defense was a factor in this game. I think that this rim defense in this game could be replicated with (off your list) Varejao, Splitter, JO, Asik, or Collison. Not sure how realistic those guys are for trade targets/free agents 4 mil per.

    But replacements aside, I think a "solid offense, solid rebounding, average-to-weak" defensive big would a) put up a better stat line, b) make fewer "drop the rebound off the free throw miss & foul" epic blunders that Ian made in this game, and c) would be a net negative vs. the Heat because of Miami's ability to get to the rim (and this strawman's inability to defend the rim at the level of Mahinmi).
    I think the "rim protector" term around here is a bit overrated, you can be a "rim protector" without been able to jump on a phone book, there are many ways to protect the rim without jumping, to me Varejao comes to mind he protects the rim by taking charges and staying in the right position, Reggie Evan is also good at this, again just because somebody is able to jump really high and is 7 feet tall doesn't mean that person is a so call "rim protector".

    By the way I've been saying forever that I don't mind Ian as the 3rd center of my team at less than 2mil a year but as the immediate backup to Roy? meh.

  13. #209
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Danberry
    Age
    55
    Posts
    11,650

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    By the way I've been saying forever that I don't mind Ian as the 3rd center of my team at less than 2mil a year but as the immediate backup to Roy? meh.
    Hmm. I'd predict that if we were paying Ian $1.9M to sit on the bench as the emergency big guy you'd probably still think that was too much, but that's because I know you place a lot of emphasis on what someone makes compared to their contribution. It would be worse because if he had a couple of bad games with teeny-tiny minutes he'd look even worse than he is.
    BillS

    "Every time I pitched it was like throwing gasoline on a fire. Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw!"
    - Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh

  14. #210
    Member
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    Evansville
    Posts
    529

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Why all the talk about salary? That toothpaste is already out of the tube, you can't unring that bell. He is getting paid what he is getting paid. He is a guaranteed contract. Just look at him as our backup center. If he can be replaced by a better player, then we will do that. If he can't, then he will be our guy in May and June. To say that he is getting paid x amount of dollars so he should be doing this, this, and this, is a pointless idea at this point of the season.

  15. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to kent beckley For This Useful Post:


  16. #211
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jul 2008
    Location
    Indianapolis
    Age
    33
    Posts
    28,142

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Hmm. I'd predict that if we were paying Ian $1.9M to sit on the bench as the emergency big guy you'd probably still think that was too much, but that's because I know you place a lot of emphasis on what someone makes compared to their contribution. It would be worse because if he had a couple of bad games with teeny-tiny minutes he'd look even worse than he is.
    I'm pretty sure we were paying close to that amount to Lou and then Pendergraph and I was OK with it, Solo was like 2mil and I was OK with that too, your prediction is wrong.

  17. #212
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Danberry
    Age
    55
    Posts
    11,650

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by P_George View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Questioning someone's interpretation of a game they watched when Person A says Player A played a good game(particularly defensively) and the vast majority of people that saw Player A said that he stunk up the joint, defense included. How's that offensive to question what game he watched? I'd love to know how he came to the conclusion that Player A did anything well, because shooting %'s dropped when he was in? That's a poor argument at best.
    Trying not to go down the rathole, adding "[H]ow [did you come] to the conclusion that Player A did anything well, because shooting %'s dropped when he was in?" makes a huge (positive) difference. We're trying to stop the posts that just question other people's observation rather than asking specific questions.

    And laughing at someone's conclusion without providing a rebuttal, or asking what game they watched without asking what they saw, or extrapolating someone saying "not as bad" into saying they were excellent, is a passive aggressive way of calling people incapable of holding rational conversations - stupid, idiot, troll, homer, hater, whatever you want to use as the term for it. Disrespectful implications abound around here, they make people uncomfortable, and they need to stop.

    Quote Originally Posted by P_George View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    And the person I quoted originally specifically said, "We must look for different things in Centers. Ian was really good tonight IMO his defense was huge." Sorry, that is not referencing a "team" thing that's referencing Mahimi specifically. Would you argue that Mahimi was good defensively, or "huge" defensively(his words)? That comment is baffling to me.
    That's as maybe, but first "very good" is not "awesome", second it was used in referring to a specific part of the game, and third no matter how "baffling" it is there's no reason to get snide in a response. Just stop responding to a person whose opinion you so completely disagree with you can'ty think of a way to get the point across. People can disagree without slamming each other.
    BillS

    "Every time I pitched it was like throwing gasoline on a fire. Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw!"
    - Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh

  18. The Following 2 Users Say Thank You to BillS For This Useful Post:


  19. #213
    Member WhoLovesYaBaby?'s Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    Indy
    Posts
    616
    Mood

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    I wish the bench was better. Then maybe we would have the best record in the league.

    Seriously, though, we could use DG's shooting off the bench or Copeland to find his touch. I Don't know if it would win more games, but it would provide more solid options.

  20. #214
    Member Since86's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Muncie
    Posts
    21,129

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    I really hope the Pacers can swap Ian out for a good defensive backup center. Instead of giving up 72pts per 48mins against the best offense in the world, maybe they'll hold them to 50pts per 48mins
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right. ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

    Larry Bird: Yeah, patience.

  21. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to Since86 For This Useful Post:


  22. #215
    Running with the Big Boys BillS's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Location
    Danberry
    Age
    55
    Posts
    11,650

    Sports Logo Sports Logo Sports Logo

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by vnzla81 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I'm pretty sure we were paying close to that amount to Lou and then Pendergraph and I was OK with it, Solo was like 2mil and I was OK with that too, your prediction is wrong.
    I can remember you not being particularly happy with Pendy, though, and I also think I remember you actually liking Lou's skills in some areas. But fair enough, it was just a thought.
    BillS

    "Every time I pitched it was like throwing gasoline on a fire. Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw! Pkkw!"
    - Ebby Calvin "Nuke" LaLoosh

  23. #216

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by dgranger17 View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Has anybody taken a look around the league at other current backup Centers? I can see where the general consensus would be Ian isn't in the Top 5, but he's certainly in the Top 10. It would be nice to have the money for Asik or Hakeem in his prime coming off the bench, but unfortunately for us all of our money is tied up in the best starting unit around. Wait... is that unfortunate?

    When you have George Hill, Lance Stephenson, Paul George, David West, Roy Hibbert, Danny Granger, and Luis Scola in a small market... you can't really supplement them with Mike Conley, Kevin Martin, and Marc Gasol off the bench. In my opinion, if a backup center who only needs to give us 15-17 minutes a game is our biggest problem, we must be doing something right.

    Larry Bird.



    But even as a backup Ian sucks. He turns the ball over, commits foolish fouls, can't even shoot a lick. It would be different if he was a rebounding beast. And got like 12 points off tap ins and put backs, but he can't even o that right. Management agrees with me obviously, because they pursued Robin Lopez in off season. They didn't do that just to pass the time.

  24. #217
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by P_George View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Sorry apparently an acronym of WTF is a offensive on these boards.
    To clarify on this, the problem isn't the use of 'WTF', the problem is the implication that those who disagree with you must not watch the game.

  25. #218
    Member
    Join Date
    Jun 2010
    Location
    Indy
    Posts
    8,061

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by P_George View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I don't think anybody expects that, at all.

    We expect more then 2.5PPG(35% shooting), 2.8 RPG, .9 BPG, 1.0 TOPG, 2.7 FPG in 15.0 MPG.

    These are the numbers that are scary. 15MPG is pretty high for a back-up big. The fact he's shooting so poorly, turning it over, and fouling at such an incredibly high rate in those 15 minutes is scary. When you continue to factor in that he's regressing defensively the last several games, what's the justification for keeping him? No better options? I'd contest that all day. There's a lot of better(IMO) back-up bigs that aren't on huge prices tags.

    FWIW - his PER36 are scary bad. He's being completely inefficient this year.
    Exactly he is a back-up C who is a defensively specialist. Very few back-up big men are good both defensively and offensively, and if they are they are not a back-up. If you are expect Ian to do anything offensively you are expecting too much, and if they team looks for him to do anything offensively that is a Vogel problem not an Ian problem. If he was decent offensively he would probably be starting somewhere right now and be making $9 million+ instead of being a back-up.

    Having a bad game or two is not regressing. It is just having a bad game. He had bad games last year too, then came back and had good games. It won't be any different this year. He will have bad games and good games. The facts are we are a better team because we have Ian. He plays an important role, and helps this team win. Defensively he is huge for this team, and his abilities are a huge reason why this team has only lost 3 games this season. I highly doubt you can find more than 2 or 3 back-up Cs who are better rim protectors than Ian.

  26. The Following User Says Thank You to Eleazar For This Useful Post:


  27. #219
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Really? WHO said he was "awesome"? In fact the very post you seem to be referring to specifically stated it said nothing about how Ian did individually, just that it wasn't as much of a problem for the team as people seem to be thinking.

    There is a lot of area between "sucks and should never see the floor" and "is awesome a #1 center in the league", and some of that includes things like "below average", "ok in some areas and horrible in others", and "not the worst". It grinds my gears that anyone trying to make a reasonable assessment gets accused of being a jocker or hater, like the only opinions allowed are that someone is the best or that they are the worst.

    Can we please stop labeling people with differing opinions as blind idiots or extrapolating a "wait, this part wasn't so bad" into "OMFG HE'S AMAZING I WANT TO HAVE HIS BABIES"?

    I mean, really, the part of the discussion between vnzla81 and FlavaDave is the ABSOLUTE RIGHT WAY TO DO THIS. Example and counter example without anyone (so far) calling anyone names.


    This needs to be kept in mind by everybody, so I'm highlighting it again.


  28. #220
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    The new guidelines are being posted soon, and part of what will be cracked down on is the implications that someone isn't intelligent or didn't watch the game (or watch the game "properly")

    ...

    Calling someone out like they didn't have a basis for their opinion is going to have to stop because it shows a marked disrespect for posters.


    This as well


  29. #221

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Eleazar View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Exactly he is a back-up C who is a defensively specialist. Very few back-up big men are good both defensively and offensively, and if they are they are not a back-up. If you are expect Ian to do anything offensively you are expecting too much, and if they team looks for him to do anything offensively that is a Vogel problem not an Ian problem. If he was decent offensively he would probably be starting somewhere right now and be making $9 million+ instead of being a back-up.

    Having a bad game or two is not regressing. It is just having a bad game. He had bad games last year too, then came back and had good games. It won't be any different this year. He will have bad games and good games. The facts are we are a better team because we have Ian. He plays an important role, and helps this team win. Defensively he is huge for this team, and his abilities are a huge reason why this team has only lost 3 games this season. I highly doubt you can find more than 2 or 3 back-up Cs who are better rim protectors than Ian.

    You're missing the point. He's not that good defensively. At all. And he's not just bad offensively, he's horrid. He used to have a mid range shot, where'd that go? The only good thing defensively he does is occasionally challenge shots, that's it. He's bad at playing defense without fouling and he's often late on rotations. What has he done this year to make you think he's good defensively? Some "rim protector efficiency" stats that are very skewed by his lack of PT that do not account for the other weaknesses he has on D? We'll agree to disagree, but your mind is made up on how good he is defensively when it doesn't match reality.

  30. The Following User Says Thank You to P_George For This Useful Post:


  31. #222

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by Grimp View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    But even as a backup Ian sucks. He turns the ball over, commits foolish fouls, can't even shoot a lick. It would be different if he was a rebounding beast. And got like 12 points off tap ins and put backs, but he can't even o that right. Management agrees with me obviously, because they pursued Robin Lopez in off season. They didn't do that just to pass the time.
    This. And, I suspect we'll see them snoop around a bit more before the deadline. Copeland + Mahimi is around 7.9M in cap - we can easily find a good replacement big with that sort of money. Or even a younger guy like Solomon Hill + Mahimi. Either way, I think Bird is smart enough to realize that Mahimi isn't 1) living up to his contract and 2) giving us good minutes right now.

    What's going to happen to this team when Hibbert's in foul trouble early? Scary thought. Especially if we roll out Scola and West at the same time. Who's going to shotblock and rebound then?

  32. #223
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by P_George View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    The irony in your post is amazing. You're trying to act like we're overreacting to another poor performance by Mahimi when in reality, you're overreacting to the discussion at hand. From what I've read, no one has called anyone an idiot. Questioning someone's interpretation of a game they watched when Person A says Player A played a good game(particularly defensively) and the vast majority of people that saw Player A said that he stunk up the joint, defense included. How's that offensive to question what game he watched? I'd love to know how he came to the conclusion that Player A did anything well, because shooting %'s dropped when he was in? That's a poor argument at best.

    And the person I quoted originally specifically said, "We must look for different things in Centers. Ian was really good tonight IMO his defense was huge." Sorry, that is not referencing a "team" thing that's referencing Mahimi specifically. Would you argue that Mahimi was good defensively, or "huge" defensively(his words)? That comment is baffling to me.
    The opinion is fine, the delivery method was not fine. You can share your opinions respectfully, that's what we want.

    Also, he had already told you this wasn't the place to argue about it, and you ignored him, so that post received an infraction. I mention that so others get an idea of how we're going to be handling things moving forward.

  33. #224
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by P_George View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    I don't think anybody expects that, at all.

    We expect more then 2.5PPG(35% shooting), 2.8 RPG, .9 BPG, 1.0 TOPG, 2.7 FPG in 15.0 MPG.

    These are the numbers that are scary. 15MPG is pretty high for a back-up big. The fact he's shooting so poorly, turning it over, and fouling at such an incredibly high rate in those 15 minutes is scary. When you continue to factor in that he's regressing defensively the last several games, what's the justification for keeping him? No better options? I'd contest that all day. There's a lot of better(IMO) back-up bigs that aren't on huge prices tags.

    FWIW - his PER36 are scary bad. He's being completely inefficient this year.
    In contrast, a post like this is absolutely fine, by the way. Just to try to clarify the POV of the admins.

  34. #225
    .
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    52,583

    Default Re: The bench still isn't good enough

    Quote Originally Posted by BillS View Post
    This quote is hidden because you are ignoring this member. Show Quote
    Hmm. I'd predict that if we were paying Ian $1.9M to sit on the bench as the emergency big guy you'd probably still think that was too much, but that's because I know you place a lot of emphasis on what someone makes compared to their contribution. It would be worse because if he had a couple of bad games with teeny-tiny minutes he'd look even worse than he is.
    I would imagine Bird would be criticized for wasting money if he paid someone $2m to be the third string. After all, there are complaints about Copeland being paid $3m at the moment.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •