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Thread: Colts bench Trent Richardson

  1. #151
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    See, we blame the offensive line for part of it. You guys blame the offensive line for all of it. That's the gulf we cannot bridge.
    I challenge you to find one post where I've said I put all the blame on the oline. When you find it, I will then cite proof of people dismissing the oline excuse. Deal?
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right. ― Ricky Gervais.

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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    He's been doing that for two years. I really think it goes back to his Alabama days when stuttering at the line made football sense--he knew his o-line was otherwordly (seriously, that Bama line he ran behind was one of the best in the past 20 years of college football) so he would patiently wait for the hole to open up and attack it. He hasn't altered his behavior in the NFL enough and the results have been vastly different. That's something that can be fixed--can be coached, which is frustrating from him and our coaching staff that it hasn't.
    And going back a few posts, I agree with much of this but not at the angle you're going for. That's why he looks slow, it has nothing to do with his burst ability. But that's not the reason why he's getting touched in the backfield.
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right. ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    We all can agree that Pep is awful, but if this monstrosity continues for another week, then it's time to seriously start questioning the head coaching. Pep simply serves at the privilege of Pagano. He was brought here because he runs the type of offense that Pagano wants. Pagano should have been concerned about the lack of creativity in the offense WEEKS AGO. Judging by the continued lack of creativity and refusal to try new things, Pagano clearly isn't doing much to hold Pep's feet to the fire.

    I've reached about the max of how much blame I can put on Pep (a lot). It's time for the head coach to take control of this team and hold his coordinator's feet to the fire. If we try the same old tired crap against Cincy and don't attempt the numerous changes that have been mentioned on this forum, then it's time to recognize that we have head coaching issues in addition to coordinating issues.

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  5. #154
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by Sollozzo View Post
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    I've reached about the max of how much blame I can put on Pep (a lot). It's time for the head coach to take control of this team and hold his coordinator's feet to the fire. If we try the same old tired crap against Cincy and don't attempt the numerous changes that have been mentioned on this forum, then it's time to recognize that we have head coaching issues in addition to coordinating issues.
    That's pretty much how I am with Pep/Pagano too. Hell, it's no different than IU with Wilson/Mallory, although that is a more extreme example.

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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    I challenge you to find one post where I've said I put all the blame on the oline. When you find it, I will then cite proof of people dismissing the oline excuse. Deal?
    It's more of KM than you I see that with, but I certainly don't see you placing any blame on Richardson. Maybe you have, I don't know, but from your arguments, it sure doesn't seem like he is at fault for his lack of production.

  8. #156
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    I never said Trent wasn't at fault. But it's really hard to get an accurate gauge when the two factors that are most important to his success (his line and playcalling) are absolutely horrid.
    Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 12-05-2013 at 03:14 PM.
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  10. #157
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
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    I never said Trent wasn't at fault. But it's really hard to get an accurate gauge when the two factors that are most important in his success (his line and playcalling) are absolutely horrid.
    Again, maybe you have said it, but this is the first time I have seen you mention or even insinuate that Trent accepts some responsibility here. That's all I wanted to see.

  11. #158
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    I don't know how much I put on Pagano in terms of offensive philosophy... he certainly at some point needs to say enough is enough, though. He's had two different coordinators, both polar opposites, and Pagano always let the coordinators do what they prefer. Arians was obviously a pass-first guy. It's pretty obvious what Pep likes. I'd say in terms of just straight philosophy and execution, Pep is culprit numero uno. Chuck needs to sack up and get him straightened out.
    There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Again, maybe you have said it, but this is the first time I have seen you mention or even insinuate that Trent accepts some responsibility here. That's all I wanted to see.
    I think the blame on Trent is small. He's certainly not been awesome... but I recognize your favorite word, context, and I don't mostly blame him for his production. Sure he's not ran with much confidence, he's missed a hole or two. But he also was traded mid-season (never happens), was starting 4 days later (never happens), has a terrible line and playcalling --- voila. There's your recipe for disaster. Most of it is out of his control. Sure he's a small part of it, but I still think, given a normal situation where he had a full off-season to ingest the offense and get familiar with his teammates... and his line was at least mediocre... and he didn't have Pep back there doing God knows what... we'd have a very different story.

    I think Trent represents the least (and therefore, most easily fixable) chunk of the overall problem. The rest of the stuff is way more important to the overall success of this offense. I think if our line got their heads out of their asses and so did Pep, Trent doesn't have to change much to see a fairly huge increase in effectiveness and production.
    Last edited by Kid Minneapolis; 12-05-2013 at 04:00 PM.
    There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    It's more of KM than you I see that with, but I certainly don't see you placing any blame on Richardson. Maybe you have, I don't know, but from your arguments, it sure doesn't seem like he is at fault for his lack of production.
    This accusation has been lobbed at me a couple different times, and I usually respond with a post criticizing Trent. I didn't this time, because what's the point? Not like it's doing any good.
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right. ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

    Larry Bird: Yeah, patience.

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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    This accusation has been lobbed at me a couple different times, and I usually respond with a post criticizing Trent. I didn't this time, because what's the point? Not like it's doing any good.
    Well pull one up. Just because I haven't seen them doesn't mean they don't exist. With as many posts that have been made on this subject in as many different threads, it's difficult to keep up with all of them.

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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Pulled this from the Bengals thread.

    Quote Originally Posted by Suaveness View Post
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    There's a gif in the "Some things I saw on tape" which is about Jurrell Casey. He sheds Cherilus, sheds a pulling Thornton, and still makes the tackle right at the LOS.
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right. ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

    Larry Bird: Yeah, patience.

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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by cdash View Post
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    Well pull one up. Just because I haven't seen them doesn't mean they don't exist. With as many posts that have been made on this subject in as many different threads, it's difficult to keep up with all of them.
    .
    Quote Originally Posted by Since86 View Post
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    I've placed blame towards Trent, from the beginning. You only need to go back one page for a post by me clarifying that position, for about the 1001st time during these discussions.

    He does lack vision, and ability to cut back, but that's not why their running game is so dreadful. I just think it will be funny watching others dig up those excuses, after having mocked them for the past two months.
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right. ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

    Larry Bird: Yeah, patience.

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  18. #164

    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
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    I don't know how much I put on Pagano in terms of offensive philosophy... he certainly at some point needs to say enough is enough, though. He's had two different coordinators, both polar opposites, and Pagano always let the coordinators do what they prefer. Arians was obviously a pass-first guy. It's pretty obvious what Pep likes. I'd say in terms of just straight philosophy and execution, Pep is culprit numero uno. Chuck needs to sack up and get him straightened out.
    It helps that Pep would probably be running something very similar to this offense anyway, but it's Pagano's call.



  19. #165
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Eh, it's sort of a general statement, he never said "don't throw the ball"... think was more of just a "let's actually start establishing a run game, and let's keep Luck off his keister." Neither of which they've achieved.
    There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    There was a lot of criticism towards Pep at Stanford for running too much and handcuffing Luck. I just see this as an extension of that.
    Just because you're offended, doesn't mean you're right. ― Ricky Gervais.

    What if someone from a school of business or management school were to ask, How did you do this? How did you get the Pacers turned around? Is there a general approach you've taken that can be summarized?

    Larry Bird: Yeah, patience.

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  22. #167
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Yea, Luck likely lost his Heisman because of the playcalling at Stanford. I had read that in his last year, the playcalls were like 60/40 in favor of the run. He still had a monster stat year, but then RG3 rolled in with the hype and stole it. Just like the RotY.
    There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

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  24. #168

    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    So we have a consensus? Trent sucks just a little less than the OL. It would have been nice to see what Bradshaw could have done with this same OL. i doubt that losing our LG would have made that significant a difference.

  25. #169
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Um no, Trent isn't near as bad as our line, which is playing at a much worse level than when Bradshaw was active. Our line dominated San Fran.
    There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

  26. #170
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    ESPN NFL Scout Matt Williamson does a pretty good job of hitting on both sides of the argument and I think we all can agree there is a lot of truth in his breakdown of Trent so far:

    http://espn.go.com/blog/indianapolis...ely?src=mobile

    INDIANAPOLIS -- Indianapolis Colts running back Trent Richardson stood at his locker on Thursday afternoon and answered every question thrown his way about being benched and how the past week has been for him.


    Richardson
    He called the experience humbling because it was the first time since his sophomore year at the University of Alabama that he wasn’t his team’s starting running back. Richardson said Donald Brown deserves to be the starter and they'll continue to push each other.

    I caught up with ESPN.com NFL scout Matt Williamson on Thursday to talk about Richardson’s struggles this season:

    Williamson on the trade:
    “First of all, when the trade happened I thought the Colts made a great move. I liked him out of Alabama and what he did as a rookie with the Cleveland Browns. Every defense was keying on him and he was able to be productive, especially as a receiver. I thought he was going to be -- not Adrian Peterson -- but I thought he would be a Pro Bowl back and was worth what I expected to be a late first-round pick. Of course it hasn’t worked out. I think there have been a lot of reasons. Some of it is bad luck, some of it is coaching. But a lot of it is on him.”

    Williamson on why Richardson has struggled:
    “Just looking at him, I think he’s been tentative since he’s been here. I feel like he’s uncomfortable knowing when to hit the holes and what their scheme is. He’s lost mentally. It doesn’t mean he’s not smart. I think he’s not tuned in to exactly what they’re doing. It’s not natural for him, not knowing exactly where to go, thinking too much. That shouldn’t be a shock, though. He joined a new system in midseason. Running back is one of the hardest positions to learn. He hasn’t been through minicamp or training camp. He also deserves some blame, too. He isn’t running with that aggression. He doesn’t look like he has that burst that he had at Alabama or last year. He is tentative when there are holes there. He doesn’t attack them like he should.”

    Williamson on other reasons behind Richardson’s problems:
    “I don’t think most people realize how bad the interior of that line is for the Colts. Those guards [Mike McGlynn and Hugh Thornton] are terrible. The interior of that offensive line, I think is as bad as any in the league. That’s hard to overcome when you’re an interior rusher. That’s impacting Trent quite a bit. The Colts don’t utilize his pass-catching ability very well. He is a very good receiver and even in space he can run over safeties and cornerbacks. It shocks me because he had 50-something catches last year."
    So to recap: We see what the scout sees. Horrible offensive line. Tentative running from Richardson. Very suspect play calling. Not utilizing him in the passing game or in space. Pretty good assessment of the situation, I'd say.

  27. #171
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Yea I had seen that, I concur. His main knock on Trent is tentativeness, to which I attribute mostly to his mid-season transition and his terrible line. That's why I think it's a very fixable situation.
    There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

  28. #172
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
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    Yea I had seen that, I concur. His main knock on Trent is tentativeness, to which I attribute mostly to his mid-season transition and his terrible line. That's why I think it's a very fixable situation.
    I will say, I love the way Richardson has handled the demotion, at least publicly. He's saying the right things at least. None of us here are rooting against the guy. Like I said, I would love nothing more than for Trent to come out and go gangbusters and make me look like an ***. Let's hope he turns things around. But my god whatever you do Grigson, you had better fix that ****ing line this offseason.

  29. #173
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    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    It is rather sad that if either or both of McGlynn and Satele start next season, I will not be surprised in the slightest.
    You **** up once, you lose two teeth

  30. #174

    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by Johanvil View Post
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    It is rather sad that if either or both of McGlynn and Satele start next season, I will not be surprised in the slightest.
    I believe both contracts are up so I can't imagine they are back. I could stomach McGynn at center but Satele just doesn't fit this scheme.

  31. #175

    Default Re: Colts bench Trent Richardson

    Quote Originally Posted by Johanvil View Post
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    It is rather sad that if either or both of McGlynn and Satele start next season, I will not be surprised in the slightest.
    I believe most people thought that the backup center who was traded in the preseason was better than Satele

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