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Rule #1

Pacers Digest is intended to be a place to discuss basketball without having to deal with the kinds of behaviors or attitudes that distract people from sticking with the discussion of the topics at hand. These unwanted distractions can come in many forms, and admittedly it can sometimes be tricky to pin down each and every kind that can rear its ugly head, but we feel that the following examples and explanations cover at least a good portion of that ground and should at least give people a pretty good idea of the kinds of things we actively discourage:

"Anyone who __________ is a liar / a fool / an idiot / a blind homer / has their head buried in the sand / a blind hater / doesn't know basketball / doesn't watch the games"

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"Only stupid people think / believe / do ___________"

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"Remember when PosterX said OldCommentY that no longer looks good? "

In general, if a comment goes from purely on topic to something 'ad hominem' (personal jabs, personal shots, attacks, flames, however you want to call it, towards a person, or a group of people, or a given city/state/country of people), those are most likely going to be found intolerable.

We also dissuade passive aggressive behavior. This can be various things, but common examples include statements that are basically meant to imply someone is either stupid or otherwise incapable of holding a rational conversation. This can include (but is not limited to) laughing at someone's conclusions rather than offering an honest rebuttal, asking people what game they were watching, or another common problem is Poster X will say "that player isn't that bad" and then Poster Y will say something akin to "LOL you think that player is good". We're not going to tolerate those kinds of comments out of respect for the community at large and for the sake of trying to just have an honest conversation.

Now, does the above cover absolutely every single kind of distraction that is unwanted? Probably not, but you should by now have a good idea of the general types of things we will be discouraging. The above examples are meant to give you a good feel for / idea of what we're looking for. If something new or different than the above happens to come along and results in the same problem (that being, any other attitude or behavior that ultimately distracts from actually just discussing the topic at hand, or that is otherwise disrespectful to other posters), we can and we will take action to curb this as well, so please don't take this to mean that if you managed to technically avoid saying something exactly like one of the above examples that you are then somehow off the hook.

That all having been said, our goal is to do so in a generally kind and respectful way, and that doesn't mean the moment we see something we don't like that somebody is going to be suspended or banned, either. It just means that at the very least we will probably say something about it, quite possibly snipping out the distracting parts of the post in question while leaving alone the parts that are actually just discussing the topics, and in the event of a repeating or excessive problem, then we will start issuing infractions to try to further discourage further repeat problems, and if it just never seems to improve, then finally suspensions or bans will come into play. We would prefer it never went that far, and most of the time for most of our posters, it won't ever have to.

A slip up every once and a while is pretty normal, but, again, when it becomes repetitive or excessive, something will be done. Something occasional is probably going to be let go (within reason), but when it starts to become habitual or otherwise a pattern, odds are very good that we will step in.

There's always a small minority that like to push people's buttons and/or test their own boundaries with regards to the administrators, and in the case of someone acting like that, please be aware that this is not a court of law, but a private website run by people who are simply trying to do the right thing as they see it. If we feel that you are a special case that needs to be dealt with in an exceptional way because your behavior isn't explicitly mirroring one of our above examples of what we generally discourage, we can and we will take atypical action to prevent this from continuing if you are not cooperative with us.

Also please be aware that you will not be given a pass simply by claiming that you were 'only joking,' because quite honestly, when someone really is just joking, for one thing most people tend to pick up on the joke, including the person or group that is the target of the joke, and for another thing, in the event where an honest joke gets taken seriously and it upsets or angers someone, the person who is truly 'only joking' will quite commonly go out of his / her way to apologize and will try to mend fences. People who are dishonest about their statements being 'jokes' do not do so, and in turn that becomes a clear sign of what is really going on. It's nothing new.

In any case, quite frankly, the overall quality and health of the entire forum's community is more important than any one troublesome user will ever be, regardless of exactly how a problem is exhibiting itself, and if it comes down to us having to make a choice between you versus the greater health and happiness of the entire community, the community of this forum will win every time.

Lastly, there are also some posters, who are generally great contributors and do not otherwise cause any problems, who sometimes feel it's their place to provoke or to otherwise 'mess with' that small minority of people described in the last paragraph, and while we possibly might understand why you might feel you WANT to do something like that, the truth is we can't actually tolerate that kind of behavior from you any more than we can tolerate the behavior from them. So if we feel that you are trying to provoke those other posters into doing or saying something that will get themselves into trouble, then we will start to view you as a problem as well, because of the same reason as before: The overall health of the forum comes first, and trying to stir the pot with someone like that doesn't help, it just makes it worse. Some will simply disagree with this philosophy, but if so, then so be it because ultimately we have to do what we think is best so long as it's up to us.

If you see a problem that we haven't addressed, the best and most appropriate course for a forum member to take here is to look over to the left of the post in question. See underneath that poster's name, avatar, and other info, down where there's a little triangle with an exclamation point (!) in it? Click that. That allows you to report the post to the admins so we can definitely notice it and give it a look to see what we feel we should do about it. Beyond that, obviously it's human nature sometimes to want to speak up to the poster in question who has bothered you, but we would ask that you try to refrain from doing so because quite often what happens is two or more posters all start going back and forth about the original offending post, and suddenly the entire thread is off topic or otherwise derailed. So while the urge to police it yourself is understandable, it's best to just report it to us and let us handle it. Thank you!

All of the above is going to be subject to a case by case basis, but generally and broadly speaking, this should give everyone a pretty good idea of how things will typically / most often be handled.

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If this is done the wrong way, those comments will be deleted, and if it's a repeating problem then it may also receive an infraction as well.

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Regarding infractions, currently they carry a value of one point each, and that point will expire in 31 days. If at any point a poster is carrying three points at the same time, that poster will be suspended until the oldest of the three points expires.

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Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

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  • #16
    Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

    It was the end of a back to back, on the road, against a very good team who just so happens to lie through their teeth when they say we're not a rival and we just beat them down bad. I saw this as a probable loss, but was hoping against it. PG hasn't looked as good lately and looks tired.

    DRose shot nothing but 3s. That was odd to me.
    There are two types of quarterbacks in the league: Those whom over time, the league figures out ... and those who figure out the league.

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    • #17
      Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

      Originally posted by Kid Minneapolis View Post
      It was the end of a back to back, on the road, against a very good team who just so happens to lie through their teeth when they say we're not a rival and we just beat them down bad. I saw this as a probable loss, but was hoping against it. PG hasn't looked as good lately and looks tired.

      DRose shot nothing but 3s. That was odd to me.
      I'm not buying that PG hasn't looked good lately when he was on Superstar mode Friday night. If he wants to be a Superstar he has to stop having this on again/off again moods..if you can't score thr night, defend and facilitate through assists. We need to give Cope minutes btw

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      • #18
        Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

        A lot of posters have commented on the fact that Lance and Paul couldn't "flip the switch" and get into the game, and I agree completely. I think a lot of tonight had to do with the fact that we haven't really played a team that could "take it to us" since we played the Bulls at BLF. Sure we played Brooklyn, and that was a highly competitive game, but that team is still figuring itself out with all the new additions. The Bulls know exactly who they are, and they knew how they needed to play if they wanted to beat us.

        IOW, this isn't the Bucks or the Raptors. We can't try and decide to flip a switch, and think we will beat good teams. Paul has to quit looking for calls, because he won't get it against the other good to elite teams. Lance will learn that the driving lanes are a lot smaller, and the wide open 3s are less frequent against the good teams. He's cooled a bit offensively (which is fine) but he needs to maintain that high level of effort and attention on defense.

        Other notes and takeaways:

        tonight is a night where I want D West more involved earlier in the game.

        No more Solomon hill against good teams. If you want to develop him then give him his 8 mins against the lottery teams. He literally provides nothing out there and we have capable vets sitting behind him.

        Edit: As good as Scola had been, he struggles mightily against athletic 4s. Obviously Taj "the pacer killer" Gibson is a top 15 PF in the league. But Scola was just completely out played. Got to find a way to neutralize his deficiency against athletic 4s

        We've gotta stop crying to the refs. We dispute every call it seems, and it only makes things worse as the game wears on. We are looking like the Hear out there, minus the flopping (Cept Lance lol)

        All in all we are 9-1 and looking great against the teams we are supposed to beat. I bet we come out sharp and focused against NY.
        Last edited by Ace E.Anderson; 11-17-2013, 12:26 PM.

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        • #19
          Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

          I'ts just a fact of sports life the better and more successful your team gets the more each loss hurts.
          "Just look at the flowers ........ BANG" - Carol "The Walking Dead"

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          • #20
            Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

            Originally posted by 31Since1990 View Post
            I'm not buying that PG hasn't looked good lately when he was on Superstar mode Friday night. If he wants to be a Superstar he has to stop having this on again/off again moods..if you can't score thr night, defend and facilitate through assists. We need to give Cope minutes btw
            I think that Copeland did fairly poorly yesterday night when he got minutes....but I also feel that he was a victim of a poor rotation. In a small ball lineup where he is the "stretch 4", he has to be paired up with a defensive presense in the paint. He was paired up with Scola for the majority of his minutes.....not Mahinmi or Hibbert. As a result....I know that he's used as a stretch 4 and not known for his defense....but Gibson was able to abuse Copeland in the paint

            I'm okay with him being used in certain situations....but having him not be on the floor with the right combination of Players, where he is on the floor with some 4 Man combination of Hibbert ( or Mahinmi ), PG24, GH or Lance.....is important. Having him on the floor with most of the 2nd unit where the defense is not focusing on someone that can kick it out to him won't work.

            Also...what happened to Mahinmi with getting only 7 minutes in the game? Was he injured?
            Ash from Army of Darkness: Good...Bad...I'm the guy with the gun.

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            • #21
              Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

              Last night was one of those "everything looks like a disaster while the game is going on" nights for me, followed by a "pick it up and move on" morning.

              I will say that I knew we were in trouble when the first series of shots all came short with almost no lift, from Lance and Paul in particular.
              BillS

              A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush.
              Or throw in a first-round pick and flip it for a max-level point guard...

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              • #22
                Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

                Onward and upward!
                Go Pacers!

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                • #23
                  Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

                  Fluke offensive game from the Bulls. They won't shoot that well against us again.

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                  • #24
                    Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

                    It happens. We weren't going 82-0. We were at the end of a back-to-back yet again playing a rival in their place. Beat New York on Wednesday and begin a new winning streak.

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                    • #25
                      Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

                      Originally posted by Dr. Hibbert View Post
                      I'm not sure you can ever take too much out of a night where the Bulls are THAT hot on offense (that is a statistical anomaly) and the Pacers are THAT bad on defense (that is an even greater statistical anomaly).

                      Rather than isolate performances in a game where everything went out the window, I'll just speak to some trends:

                      1. Paul George has to learn that he can't just take quarters off. I mean, yeah, he'll have off quarters here and there. But even in the Pacers' 9-game win streak, we've seen plenty of games where Paul George didn't really opt to insert himself into the equation until the 3rd quarter. It's a thin line between teamwork/sharing the ball/establishing the low post game, and being aggressive on your own right. But I'd just like to see PG24 establishing himself earlier, and getting to the foul line more often than he is.

                      2. 10 games in, and it's clear that we're in for a wild ride with Lance Stephenson. I think it will be more good than bad, but when it's bad, it's BAD. I'll throw offense out the window -- that's just gonna be what it's gonna be. What I'd like to see from Lance is a more concerted effort to concentrate on defense. Simply put, Lance is falling asleep and making mistakes on defense far more often than anyone else in the lineup. And it's just that, a concentration issue. Not an ability issue. He really needs to work on understanding that it's not just about driving into the teeth of the defense and shooting threes...every step on the defensive end counts too.

                      3. What a turnaround it's been in a year's time. A year ago, I would have been deathly concerned for the confidence of Roy Hibbert in a game like this. Now, it looked like Hibbert was one of the few players playing with confidence in this game. What a rock to have! Hibbert's consistency is one reason the odd blowout or two will never alarm me.

                      4. This was a good moment to remind Vogel that the robotic lineup/minute calculations may work for 90% of teams, but he'll have to get creative with the other 10%. Some games, you just can't have Solomon Hill out there like Vogel did tonight. He's not ready. I don't see wholesale adjustments along the lines of what some folks suggested -- having Copeland take Hill's minutes. But I do think Vogel needs to approach every game as a different beast, and given how the Pacers have handled business in the first 9 games (and Vogel's track record before), I think he just defaults to his pre-determined rotations a bit too often and leans on some concepts that just aren't ideally tailored to specific matchups.

                      5. Luis Scola still needs someone who can consistently help him score in that 2nd unit, because he is going to have off nights. Asking him to be automatic from midrange every single night is unfair. This was a bad matchup from the start -- credit the Bulls, because Taj Gibson is freaking awesome, would love to have him in a Pacers uni. But this is where either Vogel needs to get creative with rotations, or someone like CJ Watson or Orlando Johnson (pending Danny Granger's return) really has to step up.

                      6. Honestly, if I'm Vogel, I burn most of this tape in terms of "teaching moments". But clips I do save? Body language. PG24 is whining at refs way too much this year. It's annoying, and he's losing out on calls because of it. Some bad moments between PG24 and Lance in particular in terms of pointing at each other, blaming etc. on defense. You can attribute a lot of this game to "one of those nights", which is fine, because Pacers will have that both GOOD and BAD over 82 games. But the Pacers allowed things to snowball, and did themselves no favor, in large part because their heads weren't where they needed to be. That's the kind of stuff Vogel can and should focus on coming out of this game. Now that we've seen what a nightmare scenario looks like, how do we recover from it the next time it starts to build?
                      Agree with all of this! To me it says things get better when a healthy Granger is back
                      Peck is basically omniscient when it comes to understanding how the minds of Herb Simon and Kevin Pritchard work. I was a fool to ever question him and now feel deep shame for not understanding that this team believes in continuity above talent.

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                      • #26
                        Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

                        If I can quote the great Rachel: "Hey, just so you know: it's not that common, it doesn't happen to every guy, and it is a big deal!

                        A team with title hopes just not showing up ?? And not fighting to get back into the game ?? Against a division rival that also has title hopes ??

                        Sorry - I can't join the Sunshine Sally brigade that's brushing this game off. Roy was the only one that seemed to know there was a game last nite. And if it wasn't for Copeland showing a little fire, this is a 30 point loss. I would have felt better with a close loss. Maybe the guys got a little full of themselves, watched SportsCenter, listened to the radio and heard all the talk about them.

                        Some folks say it's OK. I'll just disagree. Even if it was only momentary, a loss like that shows a lack of focus. And while the first 9 games showed what this group is capable of, so did the 10th.

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                        • #27
                          Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

                          Originally posted by PacerDude View Post
                          If I can quote the great Rachel: "Hey, just so you know: it's not that common, it doesn't happen to every guy, and it is a big deal!

                          A team with title hopes just not showing up ?? And not fighting to get back into the game ?? Against a division rival that also has title hopes ??

                          Sorry - I can't join the Sunshine Sally brigade that's brushing this game off. Roy was the only one that seemed to know there was a game last nite. And if it wasn't for Copeland showing a little fire, this is a 30 point loss. I would have felt better with a close loss. Maybe the guys got a little full of themselves, watched SportsCenter, listened to the radio and heard all the talk about them.

                          Some folks say it's OK. I'll just disagree. Even if it was only momentary, a loss like that shows a lack of focus. And while the first 9 games showed what this group is capable of, so did the 10th.
                          Hmm I'm not sure I agree with us now showing up - I think that the Bulls happened to have a very very good shooting night where there wasn't much we could do about it. We could throw all the bodies we wanted at their players and they were still gonna put up shots. I think that as a result our young players got flustered and began forcing, but I think thats very different from not showing up. I'm not saying that that makes it acceptable, but its important to not get too high or low after a win (unless its championship game...or something like that) I'm just saying take it for what it is and move on. The Bulls will not do that consistently although they are a good team.
                          Peck is basically omniscient when it comes to understanding how the minds of Herb Simon and Kevin Pritchard work. I was a fool to ever question him and now feel deep shame for not understanding that this team believes in continuity above talent.

                          Comment


                          • #28
                            Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

                            We weren't going to go 82-0, so I wouldn't read too much into this one. It would've been a very tough game had we been undefeated or not. Let's start another win streak!

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                            • #29
                              Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

                              We won at our place they won are their place. That's all you can ask for. Time to move on to NYC
                              Larry Bird and Ryan Grigson- wasting the talents of Paul George and Andrew Luck

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                              • #30
                                Re: Postgame against bulls. 11/16/2013. Its just the first lost in a regular season 82 games

                                Pacers needed this reality check.

                                I also hate all the complaining for fouls. Just play the game. Expect no calls!

                                Need more hustle. Bulls are over zealous and just beat the Pacers to loose balls cause the Pacers just stand around and watch the ball.

                                More Cope, less Hill.
                                First time in a long time, I've been happy with the team that was constructed, and now they struggle. I blame the coach.

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